FRIDAY, 6 OCTOBER 2000
                                ____

                PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
                                ____

The House met at 09:00.

The Chairperson of Committees took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.

ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS - see col 000.

                          ABSENCE OF QUORUM

Mr D H M GIBSON: Chairperson, on a point of order: It seems to me that there is no quorum in the House, so I ask that you do a count and then, if there is no quorum, please adjourn the House until there is one.

The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Chairperson, we have been alerted to the fact that there has been a pile-up on the N1 on the way into town, and most hon members have been held up there.

Mr M J ELLIS: Did you cause it?

The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: I was caught in it earlier, but I am here now.

Mr M J ELLIS: But did you cause the pile-up?

The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Hon Gibson, I was also held up in the traffic for about an hour. Can I request that, with the permission of the House, we continue with the motions while members are coming in? Does the House agree? [Interjections.]

Mr D H M GIBSON: Chairperson, I am sorry. I really do not wish to be unco- operative, but I think that would be improper and not in accordance with the Rules. [Interjections.]

The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Very well. In that case, let us first count and see whether we have a quorum. We will ring the bells in the meantime, and do the counting to see whether we have a quorum.

The attention of the Chairperson of Committees having been drawn to the absence of a quorum, the bells were rung.

The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Order! We have counted the members in the House, and we do not have a quorum. I therefore rule that we suspend proceedings while the bells continue to be rung. I request those members already in the House to remain where they are so that as soon as sufficient members arrive to form a quorum, we can continue with the business of the House.

Business suspended at 09:04.

A quorum being present,

Business resumed at 09:24.

The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Hon members, I would like to apologise for the delay because of the traffic jam on the road. I have also been told that there has been an accident on the N2. We can start now.

                          NOTICES OF MOTION

The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the ANC:

That the House -

(1) notes that -

   (a)  the ANC and its allies will be launching the local government
       elections manifesto over the weekend in the Karoo town of
       Beaufort West; and

   (b)  the Karoo was chosen as an appropriate venue for the launch in
       the context of the importance that the ANC attaches to fighting
       poverty and the integrated rural development strategy ...

[Interjections.]

(2) calls on the people of Beaufort West and neighbouring towns to come and listen to the message from the leaders of our glorious movement, the African National Congress.

[Interjections.] [Applause.]

Mr N S BRUCE: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the DP:

That the House -

(1) notes with dismay that the Department of Foreign Affairs does not regard expanding trade representation in our major trading partners as its first priority;

(2) is of the opinion that removing experienced diplomats and replacing them with inexperienced ones merely for the sake of racial representivity is missing the point about transformation; and

(3) believes that transformation is necessary, but it needs to be used to appoint and promote resourceful, intelligent and innovative people as effective trade and commercial envoys of the highest calibre, without the colour coding with which this department is obsessed.

Mr M RAMGOBIN: Mr Chairperson, I give notice of a countermotion. [Interjections.]

The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Hon member, there is a standard procedure that needs to be followed for a countermotion. Please follow that procedure. You can finish reading your notice of motion, hon Mr Bruce. Have you finished reading your notice of motion?

Mr N S BRUCE: Chairperson, do you want me to read it again? [Interjections.]

The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: No. [Interjections.] If you have finished reading it, it is fine. I interrupted you because there was a point of order. Have you finished reading your notice of motion?

Mr N S BRUCE: I would like to read the last paragraph again. I think it was not heard … [Interjections.]   The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Order, hon members! Mr N S BRUCE: … because of the noise that the opposition made.

The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Just finish reading that last paragraph.

Mr N S BRUCE: That the House -

(3) believes that transformation is necessary, but it needs to be used to appoint and promote resourceful, intelligent and innovative people as effective trade and commercial envoys of the highest calibre, without the colour coding with which this department is obsessed.

HON MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

Inkosi M W HLENGWA: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I will move on behalf of the IFP:

That the House -

(1) gives recognition to the fact that after years of apartheid when our country was regarded as a pariah and our leaders were unwelcome in the capitals of the world;

(2) now has cause to celebrate the fact that the hon President of the Republic will be addressing the Parliament of Ghana today and helping to establish trade and cultural links with the rest of the world; and

(3) congratulates the President and hopes that South Africa will gain economically and politically from his trailblazing.

[Applause.]

Mr J H MOMBERG: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the ANC:

That the House -

(1) notes the appointment of Mr Gerald Majola as the chief executive officer of the United Cricket Board; (2) further notes that this is the first time in the history of cricket in South Africa that a black person has been appointed to this senior position;

(3) believes that this is a positive indication of the commitment of the United Cricket Board to the transformation of sport and making cricket more representative;

(4) hopes that this will send a powerful signal to other sports codes to follow suit;

(5) commends the United Cricket Board for this bold move; and

(6) wishes Mr Gerald Majola good luck in his new position.

[Applause.]

Mr A Z A VAN JAARSVELD: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I will move:

That the House notes -

(1) that the New NP commends the chairperson and Director-General of the Public Service Commission on their willingness to bring to the attention of the ANC Government that the commission found that -

   (a)  corruption is rife in all Government departments;

   (b)  some senior managers were inappropriately qualified for their
       positions;

   (c)  Government departments were suffering from good policies and bad
       implementation; and

   (d)  due to the supernumary situation, some employees are paid for
       just sitting under trees day after day; and

(2) that that people of South Africa are no longer prepared to accept empty promises and, therefore, under the experienced guidance of the Democratic Alliance, they will start taking their country back at the polls during the forthcoming local government elections.

[Interjections.]

Mr S ABRAM: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move:

That the House -

(1) notes the latest figures released by the United Nations Conference on Trade and Industry;

(2) further notes with dismay that Africa as a whole attracted a miniscule 1,2% of global foreign direct investment last year which, ironically, translates into a 28% increase from the year before;

(3) expresses its concern that Africa remains the most unattractive investment destination and, consequently, the revival of the continent will remain a dream; and

(4) acknowledges that afro-pessimism can only be overturned if we as a country and as a continent zealously strive for democracy, clean governance and fair trade practices.

Ms S C VAN DER MERWE: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the ANC:

That the House -

(1) notes with pride and pleasure the nomination of Dr Mongane Wally Serote for the Pan African Broadcasting Heritage and Achievement Award (PABHA) in the category: culture, sport and literacy;

(2) acknowledges that the Pan African Broadcasting Heritage and Achievement Award is the first of its kind, and that this event was created to recognise achievement and excellence on the African continent, and particularly to encourage future generations to excel in their chosen endeavours; and

(3) congratulates our colleague Dr Mongane Wally Serote on his nomination for this prestigious award.

[Applause.]

Mr S N SWART: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I will move on behalf of the ACDP:

That the House -

(1) notes with alarm that the incidence of pulmonary tuberculosis in South Africa has risen from 41 340 cases in 1994 to 129 487 cases in 1999; and

(2) requests the Minister of Health urgently to take note and effective action to turn the tide of TB-related cases and deaths.

Mr G P MNGOMEZULU: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the ANC:

That the House -

(1) notes that the Setai Commission of Inquiry set up by the Minister of Defence submitted its report on the problems afflicting the Defence Force;

(2) further notes that the report raises the prevalence of racism and administrative problems in the Defence Force;

(3) also notes that this report raises these issues in a frank and open manner;

(4) welcomes the content of the interim report and urges the Ministry and the department to develop a comprehensive plan to combat racism in the army; and

(5) calls on the members of the SANDF to expose all racist tendencies and practises, and to be in the forefront in combating these tendencies.

[Applause.]

Ms R TALJAARD: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the DP:

That the House - (1) notes that Zimbabwe -

   (a)  is moving ever closer to the brink of an economic abyss;

   (b)  is one of Eskom's biggest creditors; and

   (c)  has joined the ranks of the world's economic pariahs in being
       awarded nonaccrual status by the World Bank for failure to make
       debt payments for more than six months;

(2) notes that President Mugabe’s ZANU-PF government’s actions are exacerbating negative investor sentiment and lowering foreign direct investment prospects;

(3) also notes that Finance Minister Trevor Manual has agreed to help Zimbabwe resolve its current foreign exchange crisis; and

(4) calls on the South African Government to convey to President Mugabe the minimum conditions required for political stability and respectability before approaching the Bretton Woods institutions as Zimbabwe’s interlocutor.

HON MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

Mr M F CASSIM: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the IFP:

That the House, noting that whereas -

(1) Codesa and the multiparty talks opened the way for our divided society to find a peaceful path to the future;

(2) the world expressed its wonderment that we were able to achieve this rarest of feats in human history; and

(3) for a while we ourselves, as people of this land, believed in this power of negotiation,

nevertheless believes that we should not abandon this unique tool that we perfected and that, furthermore, we should seek to continue active intersectoral dialoguing so that we succeed in overcoming the remaining areas of contention and finally become a united nation, diverse though it might be in its component parts.

Mr N P NHLEKO: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the ANC:

That the House -

(1) notes that -

   (a)  the majority of public sector unions have settled a wage
       agreement with the Government;

   (b)  the wage agreement signifies a critical step in the right
       direction and a milestone in the wage negotiations; and

   (c)  the agreement must be seen within the context of restructuring
       broader Public Service employment conditions and in the context
       of Public Service transformation and ongoing commitment towards
       sound labour relations;

(2) congratulates the Minister for the Public Service and Administration and the department and unions for making this agreement possible and reaching settlement; and

(3) calls on the Minister, the unions and the Department of Public Service and Administration to work towards a speedy resolution of outstanding matters.

[Applause.]

Mrs A VAN WYK: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the New NP and the Democratic Alliance:

That the House, noting that the theft of two items from the Mandela Museum in Umtata is but the latest incident in a long series of shameful thefts of irreplaceable heritage objects from museums and other institutions, and that Mr Mandela himself had to call for the closure of the museum until security is adequate, calls on the Government to -

(1) protect the patrimony of the South African nation by forthwith installing surveillance equipment in all important museums;

(2) provide adequate funding and resources to train existing staff;

(3) increase all categories of personnel at sorely understaffed heritage institutions;

(4) expand the understaffed endangered species protection unit currently also dealing with heritage thefts; and

(5) initiate proceedings to institute a dedicated heritage theft unit.

Dr G W KOORNHOF: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I will move on behalf of the UDM:

That the House -

(1) notes with concern that women hold less than 6% of the more than 3 000 directorships in the top 300 publicly-listed and government-owned companies; (2) agrees that there is huge room for improvement for women to acquire management positions;

(3) urges women on all fronts to step forward and prove themselves capable of being as successful as their male counterparts; and

(4) appeals to such companies -

   (a)  not to discriminate against women for top positions; and

   (b)  to assist women to compete on an equal footing with male
       competitors and be rewarded accordingly.

Mr M R BALOYI: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the ANC:

That the House -

(1) notes -

   (a)  the confession by convicted killer Ferdi Barnard that he
       assassinated anti-apartheid lawyer Dr David Webster in 1989 on
       instruction from his superiors; and

   (b)  that Barnard claims to have personally recruited and paid
       criminals with state funds to disrupt the general elections of
       1994;

(2) acknowledges that all this happened under the Democratic Alliance partner, the then NP government of the day; and

(3) concurs that Barnard’s claim confirms that the NP was behind the attempts to disrupt the 1994 elections and to assassinate key anti- apartheid activists.

[Applause.]

Mrs J A SEMPLE: Mr Chairperson, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the DP and the Democratic Alliance:

That the House - (1) notes that the British Airways Travel Clinics are advising women travelling to South Africa and to the rest of the continent to pack anti-Aids drugs in their baggage because of the high incidence of disease and rape;

(2) deplores the fact that it should be felt necessary to provide this warning because of the high rate of HIV and the high risk of rape;

(3) demands that AZT must be made available to all rape victims; and

(4) further demands that safety measures be implemented to protect tourists, especially women, and that these measures be widely publicised in the interests of promoting our tourism industry.

HON MEMBERS: Hear, hear!

                       GOOD WISHES FOR DIWALI

                         (Draft Resolution)

Miss S RAJBALLY: Chair, I move without notice:

That the House -

(1) notes that -

   (a)  on 26 October 2000 Hindus throughout the world will celebrate
       the auspicious occasion of Diwali;

   (b)  this universal spiritual event symbolises the triumph of good
       over evil and is derived from the holy Ramayana which teaches us
       that social justice is imperative for peace;

   (c)  through purity of thought, word and deed, leaders, society and
       individuals must execute their share of the responsibility to
       protect the welfare of the country;

   (d)  this holy event is celebrated with fireworks and the lighting of
       clay lamps, which symbolises hope, harmony, peace and God in the
       hearts of the people; and

   (e)  the celebration of Diwali encourages us to practise the religion
       of love and live as the caste of humanity; and

(2) wishes all Hindus a happy Diwali and invites the rest of South Africa to participate in the celebration.

May the symbol of light shine on all of us.

Agreed to.

EXTENSION OF DATE BY WHICH AD HOC COMMITTEE ON PAN-AFRICAN PARLIAMENT MUST COMPLETE ITS TASK

                         (Draft Resolution)

The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Chairperson, I move the motion printed in my name on the Order Paper, as follows:

That paragraph (4) of the resolution adopted by the House on 14 September 2000 whereby the Ad hoc Committee on Pan-African Parliament was established, be amended by extending the date by when the committee has to complete its task from 6 October 2000 to 30 October 2000.

Agreed to.

                HOME LOAN AND MORTAGE DISCLOSURE BILL

                       (Second Reading debate)

The MINISTER OF HOUSING: Ninjani? [How are you?] Good morning to the hon members in the House. Finally, we are able to start.

Chairperson, the banking industry is one of the sectors in the country that operates without a regulatory framework with respect to their lending practices in the home loan market. They opt for a self-policing system that has up to now failed to address effectively the release of mortgage finance to the lower end of the market.

We have seen the massive exodus of financial institution branches from the townships, a move that is incongruent with the basic tenets of the service, the ethos that advocates that people should be provided with service at places that are convenient to them. People have been refused loans on the basis of their gender, their social class, their race and their location. Quite clearly, the banking sector’s self-regulatory methods have failed to address the infringement of the fundamental and constitutional rights of our people.

Section 9(1) of the Constitution states:

Everyone is equal before the law and has the right to equal protection and benefit of the law.

Furthermore, section 9(2) states:

Equality includes the full and equal enjoyment of all rights and freedoms. To promote the achievement of equality, legislative and other measures designed to protect or advance persons, or categories of persons, disadvantaged by unfair discrimination may be taken.

In spite of the far-reaching implications of the Constitution, the financial institutions have been breaking the law of the land with impunity. Countless people have been denied access to housing finance based on a spurious litany of reasons. These have had a negative impact on the functioning of the housing market.

Section 26(1) of the Constitution clearly stipulates that everyone has the right to have access to adequate housing, and section 26(2) stipulates that the state must take reasonable legislative and other measures, within its available resources, to achieve the progressive realisation of this right. But compounding this, is the fact that most people have for years been denied access to financial support without their being informed of the reasons why their applications have been rejected.

We are introducing this Bill to further implement the spirit and the letter of the Constitution, which further states, in section 32(1), that everyone has the right to access to any information held by the state and/or a person which is required for the exercise or protection of any rights. We are demanding full disclosure of the banks’ operations, particularly in the mortgage finance lending market, to facilitate housing development at the lower end of the market.

We put in place practical measures to try to solve the problem. On 20 October 1994 the department signed a record of understanding with the Association of Mortgage Lenders in which the latter pledged to resume increased lending at scale in the low-income housing market. The Mortgage Indemnity Fund was formed by Government to further implement the contents of the agreement.

In terms of the record of understanding, the Association of Mortgage Lenders was supposed to resume lending in areas from which they had withdrawn their services. They were supposed to aim at providing 50 000 loans in the first year to eligible borrowers, following the Government subsidy grant, with a yearly increment for a period of three years. However, this has not happened.

The Mortgage Indemnity Fund, in its three years of operation, covered 543 areas with only 17 financial institutions nationwide on their list of accredited organisations. By 1998 the Mortgage Indemnity Fund had facilitated the approval of a total of 139 985 loans to householders with a value of approximately R10 billion. Of these loans 78 000 fell within the Government subsidy market, with a total value of R4 billion.

In 1994 a total of 84% of housing development was subsidy-only funded, with 16% being credit-linked. Clearly, this did not reach the initial target agreed upon. Instead it violated the terms of the agreement. The figure remained constant, thus maintaining a snail’s pace in housing development and access to affordable housing. This year 98% of home loans belong to the subsidy-only market, while a negligible 2% are credit-linked - quite clearly a dramatic decrease that has maintained the downward spiral and is sending ominous signals.

In the next few years, if this is left to the markets, we will see the banks failing to perform their social responsibility role in our community. We dismiss outright the Banking Council’s false statement, issued this morning, that they refuse to enter the market without the Government’s guarantee. For three years the Government has provided them with a risk- free environment in the form of the Mortgage Indemnity Fund, and they have failed to respond as pledged.

We are introducing the Home Loan Mortgage Finance Disclosure Bill of 2000 to correct the trend, as well as to fill the void left by the Mortgage Indemnity Fund. But, more specifically, it is Government’s way of intervening and fulfilling our constitutional mandate to provide access to shelter by making sure that people’s applications for mortgage funding are not rejected simply because they belong to a specific class or gender or lack family status.

With this Bill we are saying that banks should be encouraged to serve the communities that invest their money in their institutions by reciprocating in the form of mortgage lending. This is not meant to disrupt the market but to promote and foster social responsibility on the part of the financial institutions.

The formulation of this legislation is informed by a similar legislative framework to one that has been successfully implemented in the United States for the past 25 years. This Bill seeks, firstly, to promote increased lending and disclosure by financial institutions, specifically in the housing sector. Secondly, it encourages reinvestment of financial resources by way of mortgage lending by financial institutions in the communities they serve, particularly poor communities. Lastly, it seeks to accelerate the elimination of distortions in lending practices significantly and level the playing fields.

The Bill provides for the establishment of a Fair Lending Practices Board to mediate in cases where clients are denied credit as a result of discrimination on the basis of gender, family or any other category. It is aimed at discouraging discrimination on the basis of the abovementioned criteria, namely gender, family and status. It mandates the Minister, therefore, to establish the Office of Disclosure.

This office will monitor the reporting methods of the banks. It will deal with disclosure of certain information by companies engaged in the provision of housing finance. This will be applicable to banks and deposit- taking institutions. On the basis of this information, we will be able to see where financial support is flowing, as well as detect where the blockages are, and therefore effect the remedial strategies.

The Bill will, without a doubt, help the banks to join us all in transforming the social and economic landscape of our country. It will significantly change trends in the South African financial system and its operations at the lower end of the market, because the current system serves only a fraction of the South African population. Government intervention is therefore not only necessary, but also supported by all financial institutions polled in an informal survey. We hope not only to eradicate the imbalances that have been entrenched for years, but also to improve what has been, so far, a dismal failure by financial institutions to penetrate the lower end of the market.

By introducing a strong and effective regulatory tool, we are shutting the door to discriminatory practices and ensuring a philosophy and a way of life that is in sync with our national agenda. I am advising the banking sector to welcome this Bill because it is one thing to stand on the world’s elevated stages, pronouncing about the negative effects of globalisation, but it is quite another to ignore the need to clean up the cobwebs obscuring the transparent, equitable and fair distribution of resources.

We need to see the banking sector walk the talk. Failure to do so is not only immoral, but dishonest in the extreme. It is immoral to take money from the low-income earners for years on end, but refuse to grant them loans when they need them. We are not asking the banks to lend badly, but we are expecting them to respond fairly and in a transparent manner to their obligations towards their clients, without unduly discriminating against them. [Applause.]

Ms N E HANGANA: Chairperson and hon members, section 26 of the Constitution clearly states that everyone has the right to housing, and therefore the Government is obliged to create a situation conducive to the realisation of the Constitution.

This piece of legislation is a direct result of banks not being committed to helping the poor of our country. In 1994, the Department of Housing entered into an agreement with the banks in what we knew as the Botshabelo agreement. The agreement was that banks would clear all the areas which they had unilaterally redlined and called risk areas. The banks also agreed to make 50 000 loans for the first year after that agreement, meaning that after three years, banks would then be expected to have made 150 000 loans.

The banks have failed to honour that agreement, hence the intervention by the department with this Bill before us today. In showing their noncommitment to helping the poor, they are misleading the public by saying that this Bill promotes unsound lending and Government interference in the market. They define risk in terms of the perception that people living in certain areas, which they do not like, will not be able to pay back the loans. Nothing influences that decision but mere arrogance spiced with racism.

The banks’ argument is that they owe it to their depositors to lend on good security and at minimal risk. Much as I do not dispute that, it is equally true that banks owe it to their depositors to plough money back into their communities by means of social obligations. Having heard that the Department of Housing was going to introduce this Bill, some banks quickly went to close their branches in the townships. The intention is perfectly clear. They want to build a society characterised by two different kinds of people: those who are socioeconomic giants and those who are socioeconomic dwarfs.

Depite guarantees from the state, South African banks’ record in providing home loans to low-income earners is dismal. By requiring all lending insitutions to report annually on their patterns of lending, in terms of applicants’ geographic location and income level, the Bill will help Government agencies and civil society organisations to identify neighbourhoods or categories of people whose access to credit is unfairly restricted.

On behalf of the portfolio committee, we wish to thank the Minister, the Director-General, Ms Nxumalo, and the staff for their sound relationship with us, and wish them all the best for the future. It is, in fact, typical of the nature of women to be responsible, and the chairperson of the portfolio committee, the director-general and the Minister are all women. [Applause.]

Mnr T D LEE: Mnr die Voorsitter, die DP en die DA steun alle stappe wat die verwydering van diskriminasie op grond van geslag, ras of kleur tot gevolg sal hê. [Tussenwerpsels.] So glo ons ook dat geleenthede geskep moet word om behuising en vaste eiendom vir almal moontlik te maak. Verder glo ons dat die proses wat gevolg sal word om inligting te bekom om diskriminasie vas te vat vir die banke bekostigbaar sal wees. As die verkryging van inligting sal help om bostaande doeleindes te bereik steun die DA dit heelhartig solank as die proses wat gevolg word deursigtig is. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)

[Mr T D LEE: Mr Chairperson, the DP and the DA support all steps which will lead to the elimination of discrimination based on gender, race or colour. [Interjections.] We also believe that opportunities must be created to enable everyone to acquire housing and immovable property. Furthermore, we believe that the process that will be followed to obtain information to clamp down on discrimination will be affordable for the banks. If the obtaining of information will help to achieve the abovementioned goals, the DA supports it wholeheartedly as long as the process followed is transparent.]

However, the poorest of the poor, the unemployed, the disabled and the aged cannot be assisted by the private sector, as this category of homeless people simply cannot afford monthly repayments on loans. The responsibility for housing the very poor rests with the state. The Government should provide structures and programmes to fulfil this role rather than pointing a finger at the private sector.

Surely it makes no economic sense to lend money to someone with a bad credit history? But, it is unacceptable for a group of people to be denied home loans simply because they live in a particular geographical area. In that instance, it amounts to a form of discrimination, which the DA simply cannot support. Government should rather intervene and establish the sort of environment in these areas which would make it possible and easier for banks to grant loans to the citizens of that area.

However, the DP will not support this Bill for the following reasons: Firstly, it would impose an obligation on financial institutions to lend money to borrowers who may not be good credit risks. Secondly, an obligation will be placed on financial institutions to maintain and disclose information which has nothing to do with good and fair banking practice. The Home Loan and Mortgage Disclosure Bill should focus on ensuring that the information is available to determine whether unfair discrimination has occurred.

Thirdly, it could place an extra financial burden, not only on the financial institutions, but also on the borrowers. Fourthly, the Bill calls for the applicant’s race to be indicated, which is a problematic point of disclosure. If an individual refuses to declare his or her race, will that person’s application be deemed incomplete, and will it therefore be refused? It would be meaningless to ask for one applicant’s race to be disclosed unless this is done with each and every application.

How is the race of an individual defined? Or is it what the applicant regards himself or herself to be? How is the race of a mixed-race marriage where both parties own the home defined? How is the race or gender of a body corporate or a partnership defined? What happens where the applicant refuses to define himself or herself by race? These are big problems. Fifthly …

The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Hon Chairperson, some members have been shouting that this member is a bobbejaanspanner [monkey-wrench.] Now, I wonder what a bobbejaanspanner is; I suspect it is unparliamentary. [Laughter.]

The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Order! I have not come across that word in our list of words which are unparliamentary. I do not wish to rule now, but I will consult and rule in the next sitting. Continue, member.

Mr T D LEE: Mnr die Voorsitter, ‘n bobbejaanspanner is ‘n monkey-wrench'' in Engels, en dit is 'n stuk gereedskap wat baie goed aangewend kan word, eerder as die mense aan my regterkant. [Mr Chairperson, a bobbejaanspanner’’ is a monkey-wrench in English, and is a very useful piece of equipment, unlike the people to my right.]

Fifthly, financial institutions could be concerned about the breaching of confidentiality, not only with respect to the applicant, but also with respect to a financial institution’s marketing assets and strategic information. Sixthly, another bureaucratic structure, the Office of Disclosure, with wide-ranging powers is envisaged. This will cost the taxpayer R4,98 million in the first year. This money could have been put to better use such as providing housing to the poorest of the poor. Seventhly, the Minister has sweeping powers to make regulations. It will mean an all- powerful Minister. Lastly, the free market system could be undermined.

The Government’s kneejerk reaction to the problem is, however, unlikely to solve the housing problem or to build meaningful partnerships with the private sector. Before implementing this autocratic and punitive Bill, the Government should rather gather a team of experts in the field of housing and finance to establish a shorter-term commission. The mandate for such … [Time expired.] [Applause.]

The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Order! Hon Nel, I am requesting you to come to order. Hon members, before we continue, I wish to recognise the Dominican School for the Deaf from Wittebome who are in the Gallery. [Applause.] The following member will be delivering his maiden speech. [Applause.]

Mr B W DHLAMINI: Chairperson and hon members, the financial institutions that are supposed to assist the people of South Africa with finances when they want to acquire ownership of property have, for a very long time, been enjoying the exclusive privilege of using their discretion as to who gets assistance and who does not. They have also used their discretion when evaluating an individual’s application and when deciding on the reasons for giving or not giving assistance.

Not surprisingly, those who were worse affected by this situation were the black majority of South Africa, especially the poor. The legacy of apartheid also had a great influence on the situation. During the apartheid regime, we witnessed the establishment of black townships where residents had no ownership of the property that they occupied. Furthermore, the creation of hostels for black migrant workers made every position in our society clear.

The conditions were not of their own choice. Instead, the law enforced them. For example, legislation such as the Group Areas Act of 1950 ensured that blacks remained in areas designated for them and that they did not enjoy any privileges that were enjoyed by their white counterparts.

In view of the background and the fact that we are living in a democratic dispensation where people have a right to choose where they want to live, it is encumbent upon this House to ensure that all imbalances of the past are addressed. Moreover, the Government has to ensure that the majority of South Africans who are on the lower rungs of the social ladder also benefit from this dispensation and that they are able to enjoy the fruits of democracy to the fullest.

The Bill which is tabled here before us seeks to do just that. We believe that, once it has become an Act of Parliament, it will be an important mechanism to expose and combat unfair discrimination in lending practices. It will achieve and ensure that transparency and fairness prevail. In other words, the purpose of the Bill is not to tie the institutions down to legislative and technical matters. Rather, it is to ensure that they play a meaningful role in the development and upliftment of the majority of South Africans who are in need, because most institutions benefit from the savings that are made by the people, especially black and poor people.

Another thorny issue with regard to the lending procedures of these institutions is that of people living with HIV/Aids. It is common knowledge that no financial institution will enter into a long-term investment agreement with anybody who is known to be HIV-positive. This is discrimination, and it is also unconstitutional. We also hope that this piece of legislation will assist Parliament in revealing how these institutions deal with people who find themselves in these conditions.

In conclusion, it should be emphasised that this legislation marks a major step in the right direction. It has to be supported so that we put an end to even the very last little remnants of the apartheid legacy that still lurk within some of the major institutions of our country. The objective of this Bill is not to kill the goose which lays the golden egg, but to ask the goose why the egg does not reach us. [Applause.]

Dr R T RHODA: Chairperson, the hon the Minister and hon members, South Africa is a complex mix of poverty and prosperity, of unrest and tranquility, a mixture of First World and Third World, developing and not developing at the same time.

I see this Bill as a ``big stick Bill’’ in preparation for the community reinvestment Bill, which will follow shortly, and which will be introduced to encourage banks to reinvest in the low-income communities.

This Bill comes at a time when the country’s housing shortage has reached alarming proportions. With an estimated three million people being homeless and the huge influx of people to urban areas, the situation can only become worse. We certainly have something to panic about, and we are panicking at the moment. In fact, I detect an atmosphere of desperation in the Department of Housing.

The housing delivery process, which is clearly a responsibility of the state, has clearly failed to provide housing to the people, particularly the poor. It is the responsibility of the state, and in their desperation, they are looking for a scapegoat. They found the banks and the private sector. [Interjections.]

It is widely reported that the private sector is more than willing to play a significant role, but the Government needs to create an enabling environment, law and order and support structures against corruption and similar problems. Banks have been accused of ducking and diving. This is the nature of business.

We all agree that the underlying principle of the Bill is that discrimination has to be uncovered. Unfair discriminatory practices must be eradicated and outlawed. That we agree on. In fact, the Banking Council of SA supports the aim of disclosure as laid out in the Bill, and has expressed the desire to work co-operatively with the Government to eradicate any problem in this area.

If it is the plan of the Government to force business to carry out a social service, then we have another think coming because banks will continue to refuse loans in areas they perceive as high risk areas. After all, it is not the banks’ money. It is the depositors’ and investors’ money. Banks use three criteria to judge a home loan application - the person, the property and the location of the property.

No matter how many thousands of reports and applications or rejections are turned out and provided to the Office of Disclosure, private financial institutions will understandably remain cautious to provide loans to people in high risk areas and those in low risk areas which are in the so-called redlined areas.

After all, institutions also have a duty to protect potential borrowers against bad financial investments. This is indeed unfortunate and, I am afraid, will remain the case until Government rehabilitates these areas and restores law and order to the communities. [Time expired]

Chief N Z MTIRARA: Mhlali-ngaphambili, izikhakhamela zombuso kazwelonke, amalungu eNdlu yoWiso-Mthetho, ndiza kuthetha ngesiNgesi ke ngoku. [Chairperson, hon members of the National Assembly, I am now going to switch over to English.]

The provision of funds by financial institutions in South Africa has always been subject to the laws of apartheid, prohibiting blacks from being placed in a position that would enable them to graze in greener pastures. The granting of home loans to blacks was a great luxury that was granted to a very few select blacks who were regarded as being docile and trustworthy. It would appear, therefore, that this perception still persists in the minds of the present commercial banks’ officials and in their management policy.

Until 1994, the commercial banks in South Africa conducted a discriminatory programme against blacks, preventing them from accessing finance, except for a few blacks who were given huge hand-outs to act as fronts for some big business houses. With the attainment of democracy in South Africa in 1994, one would have expected that commercial banks in South Africa would stop their discriminatory racist attitudes.

The commercial banks accelerated their obnoxious racist programme. From 1994 until today, they have mounted a vigorous destabilising programme of disempowerment, extending their action of deprivation and have been blatant in their refusal to finance black housing loans, claiming blacks are poor and are therefore high-risk individuals. The few that are ever granted mortgage bonds are burdened with extremely high interest rates, and it is alleged that they belong to a high-risk group and live in high-risk areas in townships where, it is claimed, they are residing in violence-infested areas where firefighting facilities are not available.

After 1994, black businesses and individuals were subjected to severe and brutal deprivation by the commercial banks. Statistics reveal that, between 1994 and 1999, many black businesses had their overdraft facilities abruptly stopped, the balance of overdrafts recalled mercilessly, collateral securities sold by public auction and businesses closed. Most black businesses had to fold and stop trading. They lost their properties, their houses were repossessed and, therefore, they lost their lifetime investments.

In fact, it has now become very risky today for black people to go into business using finance from commercial banks. Even houses purchased through financial institutions by banks are subjected to such very high interest rates that the balance of the loans is not reduced by payments. Instead, after payments, the interest that has added up increases the loan balance. Sooner or later, the house is repossessed and the black man loses both the house and the money that has already been paid. This is just a ruse to defraud blacks.

Instead of this low-intensity warfare waged by commercial banks against blacks levelling off after 1994, it accelerated considerably and was intensified significantly in areas such as the granting of business loans and, in fact, in every area of financing today. The reasons given for the refusal to grant finance to blacks are absolutely racist and discriminatory, and include allegations that blacks are not creditworthy, that they are lazy and cannot be entrusted with running their own businesses, that they have no experience, that they do not have collateral security and a host of other derogatory and abusive allegations.

The black people of South Africa cannot be blamed for the precarious situation that has been brought about by political manipulation and the greed of the previous apartheid government, which allocated the country’s resources to itself, to the exclusion of the majority of the black people of this country.

The activities and actions of the commercial banks in adopting measures against the granting of loans to blacks are not in the interests of democracy in South Africa and should be stopped forthwith. It would appear that such actions are an extension of the policies and programmes of the obnoxious apartheid regime and should therefore be obliterated completely in whatever guise they manifest themselves.

The Home Loan and Mortgage Disclosure Bill is therefore an appropriate instrument that will afford protection to millions of disadvantaged people in South Africa who have been unjustly deprived of the opportunity to enjoy the fruits of democracy and have a roof over their heads. The UDM therefore accepts the Bill unreservedly, and wishes to see similar Bills being piloted through Parliament in order to cover the other areas of operation of financial institutions where people are still subjected to severe discriminatory measures.

A strong monitoring and verification mechanism should be in place, and its effectiveness tested regularly in order to ensure that the objectives of the Home Loan and Mortgage Disclosure Bill are attained and the efficiency of its operation maintained. It must be stressed that the Bill should seek to outlaw discrimination of whatever nature and be clearly seen as a means of accommodating the interests of all the people of South Africa, whether they be in the rural areas, the townships or the affluent residential areas. [Applause.]

Mrs R M SOUTHGATE: Mr Chairperson and hon Minister, in the past we had an apartheid system which, as a model of government, must never again be adopted in this country. It is equally important that legislation introduced in this House is consistent with the principles of equality and fairness and contributes to economic and social deliverables.

It is a fact that discriminatory practices carried out under apartheid left many disadvantaged communities with poor housing and/or without access to equal opportunities. As a matter of constitutional policy, this Bill is correct to redress areas of discrimination pertaining to the manner in which home loans must be granted.

Whether this Bill will deliver on sound and fair economic expectations is not clear. The Bill makes provision for an Office of Disclosure, the procedure in applying for a home loan and the process involved in ensuring that the granting or refusal of a home loan has met certain bona fide constitutional or legislative requirements.

We must realise that the requirements for home loans and whether or not there are discriminatory practices are generally far removed from the Office of Disclosure. A person who is unemployed or who lacks the adequate financial capacity to apply for a home loan should not qualify, and this should be clearly indicated in the regulations. Unsound lending practices should be avoided as this will not promote stability in the housing market.

Although there may be a need to maintain a constitutional balance in the finance sector, economic realities do play a major factor in the provision of housing. Yes, we must have checks and balances against institutions that discriminate, but it is unnecessary to establish another glorified bureaucratic body of ten people costing the department R4, 9 million, and this is only for the first year. I wonder what the future budget for this body will be like. I believe that under the management of the director- general, the department can easily perform this function at a far lower cost to the taxpayer. [Time expired]

Mr G D SCHNEEMAN: Mr Chairperson, Comrade Minister and hon members, there is an old saying: Money makes the world go round. However, for the vast majority of the people of our land, the world had stopped.

In 1994, after the first democratic elections, the world started going round for our people and gained momentum with each passing day. For some of our people, the world is not going round as fast as it should. This is because we still face problems in that a large section of our society does not have access to finances to build, buy, extend or improve their own homes, let alone access to loans in general.

Those who have access to finance are the rich and not the poor, those who have brick houses, not those whose homes are made of wood and iron, and those who are employed, not those who are unemployed. The question we ask is: How will those who are poor, whose homes are made of wood and iron, and who are unemployed ever be able to build, extend or improve their own homes if they are never given the opportunity to achieve a better life?

Millions of South Africans just want to be given a chance so that they too can succeed. Houses built for those who earn less than R3 000 indicate that there is indeed a disparity in the lending practices of financial institutions. [Interjections.] The current housing delivery figures indicate that Government delivers 96% of these houses while only 6% are delivered by financial institutions. Many of these people are financially secure and would be able to repay their home loans.

It is because of these inequalities in the lending practices of financial institutions that we have before us today the Home Loan and Mortgage Disclosure Bill. This Bill seeks to level the playing field and ensure that the peoples of our land have an equal opportunity. The Bill provides for the establishment of an Office of Disclosure whose functions will play a pivotal role in ensuring the success of this Bill.

These functions include, amongst others: Ensuring that the required information is received, analysed and interpreted; receiving and investigating public comments; assisting in identifying any possible discriminatory lending patterns so that compliance with antidiscriminatory legislation can be enforced; and the rating of financial institutions in accordance with information received.

The office will not be part of the Department of Housing, as specifically experienced people are required. Furthermore, by being a separate entity, it will ensure a degree of independence and will also ensure that it is not biased in its work.

The DP opposed the establisment of the office, saying that it should just be dumped somewhere in the department, and also proposed amendments to the functions of the office. With this proposal, the DP has made it very clear that they do not attach any importance whatsoever to the vast majority of our people gaining fair access to home loans. [Applause.]

In fact, the DP does not have the interests of the poor at heart, and does not care whether the peoples of our land are uplifted or not. [Interjections.] They simply want to protect the interests of their small constituency. [Interjections.] Furthermore, there was confusion on the part of the New NP as to why the DP had proposed these amendments to the functions of the Office of Disclosure - a case of the left hand not knowing what the right hand is doing. [Laughter.]

It reminds me of an election campaign in 1989. The DP had a leadership of three people. The NP referred to them as the Three Blind Mice''. It is quite ironic that now, ten years later, the New NP has joined the DP, and they have formed a grouping called the DA which can aptly be referred to as theThree Blind Parties’’. [Laughter.] [Applause.]

This Bill clearly indicates that the ANC-led Government is serious about the upliftment of the poor and the transformation of the lending practices of financial institutions. We are on track, we are on course, and nothing will stop us as we continue to deliver and create a better life for all. [Applause.]

Miss S RAJBALLY: Mr Chairperson, hon Minister, I would like, at this point, to take the opportunity to congratulate hon B W Dhlamini on his maiden speech.

Thus far, in South Africa, the commercial banking sector has failed to provide financial empowerment to the mass of our citizens who belong to the lower socioeconomic group. The Government is currently making provision for low-cost housing. In contrast, we have the negative ripple effect where the poorer communities do not qualify for mortgage loans. This existing hypocrisy in a democratic system prevents essential human development.

Therefore, in favour of transparency and accountability and to restore human dignity, the MF supports the Home Loan and Mortgage Disclosure Bill which complements the Promotion of Access to Information Act, Act 2 of 2000 and the Promotion of Equality and Prevention of Unfair Discrimination Act, Act 4 of 2000.

The core objective of the Bill is to request the financial institutions to annually disclose reports on the lending strategies with reference to the applicants’ geographic location and income level, so that the Government and relevant civil organisations can have access to factual information which will reveal the socioeconomic categories of people who are being deprived of financial assistance.

If the Government introduces the community reinvestment legislation, which forces banks to create opportunities by reinvesting in the communities, the Home Loan and Mortgage Disclosure Bill will be the overriding reason for grass-roots communities to secure their shelters. [Applause.]

Mr W M SKHOSANA: Mr Chairperson, hon Minister and members, the announcement of the RDP and subsequent tabling of the document by the Government of National Unity has been widely discussed and received overwhelming support. One of the advantages of the RDP is the historic view it takes of the country and in respect of the upliftment of its people. The basic human need is aimed at addressing a human and friendly environment. The provision of affordable housing remains a core test for the progress towards a better future for the majority of South Africans.

Clause 6 of the Bill provides for the constitution of the Office of Disclosure. The office will consist of not more than 10 members appointed by the Minister by virtue of their experience and expertise in matters related to banking, housing finance, civil rights and other areas of expertise. I think Mr Lee will know that that is the expertise we are asking for. It is there in the Bill and should be considered.

The Minister must designate one of the members of the office as chairperson of the office, and another as deputy chairperson. In the absence of the chairperson and the deputy chairperson, the members of the office must elect another member to act as chairperson. The member acting as the chairperson will have all the powers and will have to perform all the duties of the chairperson.

Regarding the period of office, a member of the office must be appointed for such period, not exceeding three years, as the Minister may determine at the time of appointment. A member of the office ceases to be a member if she or he resigns, or if he or she … [Interjections.] I beg your pardon!

Mr M J ELLIS: Why are you telling us all this?

Mr W M SKHOSANA: I think it is very important for us to explain this Bill to the members of the DP … [Interjections.] … because they seem not to understand it. [Interjections.] We think it is important for us to explain this Bill because a member of the IFP who has only been in this Parliament for three weeks understands the Bill far better than the members of the DP do! [Laughter.] [Applause.]

It is also important for us to note that the first meeting of the office must be held at the time and place determined by the Minister, and thereafter a meeting of the office must be held at the place and time determined by the chairperson. [Interjections.] It is important for us to tell the public exactly what is contained in the Bill … [Interjections] … because it is used deliberately by the DP to ensure that they mislead and misuse this platform not to tell the public the truth. [Applause.]

A quorum for a meeting of the office will consist of more than 50% of its members. [Interjections.] It is important to note that Mr Lee did not actually read the Bill. It is important to note that he did not read the Bill for the benefit of the people who are disadvantaged so that they can know exactly what is contained in the Bill, and can depend on the information that they are going to get from the people who will be addressing the House from this podium.

The Minister must, in consultation with the Minister of Finance and the Governor of the Reserve Bank, make regulations regarding any matter which, in terms of this Act, is required or permitted to be prescribed, and which it is necessary or expedient to prescribe in order to achieve or promote the objective of this Bill. It is also important for us to know that any person who contravenes this Bill or fails to comply with any provision of this Bill, will be convicted of an offence and will be liable to a fine not exceeding R100 000.

It is important for our banks to ensure that we work together and build a nation, and not take advice from people who have houses for their families, and already have plans for their great-grandchildren. We need to house the nation. This Bill seeks to do exactly that. [Applause.]

The MINISTER OF HOUSING: Chairperson, I thank all members of the committee who participated in this Bill, especially those who took the platform to talk sense. [Laughter.] [Interjections.]

I am actually not surprised that Mr Rhoda of the New NP made sure that he took the opportunity to say something that could just as well propel hot air into balloons. He chooses to forget that he is a member of a party which had been in office for no less than 48 to 50 years and made sure that we have informal settlements in this country. I think they succeeded very well in frustrating the lives of our people. He is the last person to talk in protection of people. They have made sure that our people do not get access to shelter. [Interjections.]

I think it is very callous, irresponsible, irrational and heartless of Mr Rhoda to come and espouse that ``don’t-care’’ attitude at this rostrum, especially because his party was responsible for the influx control legislation. It was responsible for the homelands policy and for the Land Acts of 1913 and 1936. [Interjections.] Those are the kinds of things that contributed to informal settlements. Those are the kinds of things that made sure that our people did not attain the same status that other human beings in this country attained. It was Mr Rhoda’s party. [Applause.]

I think another problem with Mr Rhoda is that he thinks that only one section of this population can solve the problems of this country. Government on its own cannot afford, and may not be able, to solve the problems of this country. We have been talking of partnerships since we moved into office. But, I think all of these things are things that the New NP and its friends are not aware of.

I want to tell Mr Rhoda that his party was responsible for building toilets in the veld. They left us with informal settlements. They left us with toilets, and they left us with a backlog that he refers to as if nothing happened. That is the legacy left by his party, but I must tell him that my party has made sure that we redress that situation, and we are dealing with it with dignity.

Let me say to Mr Rhoda that another problem is that he is looking at issues such as the criteria that are being used by the banks, but he is not looking at the general overall problems around the criteria. With this Bill, we say that we would like to make sure that there is no discrimination on the basis of gender, colour or location. We are not against the criteria that the banks are using. They can use whatever criteria they like, but those criteria should not border on discrimination. That is what the Bill is trying to do. But, I think they are actually taking chances pretending that they are not aware of the fact that this Government has actually provided guarantees, through NURCHA, for people coming from these redlined communities to be able to access credit. I am talking about emerging contractors in this instance. So, the issue of guarantees is not legitimate at all.

Mr Lee, as always, made sure that he veered in the wrong direction. He has made sure that he does not understand what the Bill is trying to do. He has made sure that he turns the Bill around and talks as if we are talking of unsound lending. This Bill cannot and will not talk of unsound lending. But, this Bill is trying to address a situation which has been prevailing in this country, including within this period of democracy, where the banking institutions are not seen to be making an effort to change towards moving away from the convention of discriminating against certain sections of the population.

We are not asking the banks to give money to people who are unemployed. We would not do that. I think we have good economic sense. It is a false notion to argue that poor people do not pay and respond to their instalments. They do. [Interjections.] We have co-managed an amount of R10 million with the South African Federation of the Homeless. The majority of their members are in the informal sector and they have been able to borrow and pay back - those are poor people!

So, I think we need to look at the nature of the problem that we are experiencing in this country. I do not think we want to be forming commissions; that will not get us anywhere. We have the Mortgage Indemnity Fund. It has done its work. It has given us a report and we all know what the problems are between communities and the banks. Those are the kinds of problems that we have to solve, and I think the money that we are going to spend in establishing the Office of Disclosure is worth spending, because if we convert the banks and ask them to act in a manner that is transformatory and not discriminatory, we will be contributing towards transformation in this country. [Time expired.] [Applause.]

Debate concluded.

Bill read a second time [Democratic Party and New National Party dissenting].

    AFRICAN RENAISSANCE AND INTERNATIONAL CO-OPERATION FUND BILL

                       (Second Reading debate)

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS: Chairperson and hon members, at the recently held historic UN Millennium Summit President Mbeki said, and I quote:

The question these billions ask is - what are you doing … to end the deliberate and savage violence against us that, every day, sentences many of us to a degrading and unnecessary death!

He continued:

The fundamental challenge that faces this Millennium Summit is that, credibly, we must demonstrate the will to end poverty and underdevelopment.

The Millennium Summit, unlike those making noises to my left, heeded the appeals of the President. In his final declaration he stated:

The central challenge we face today is to ensure that globalisation becomes a positive force for the world’s people. While globalisation offers great opportunities, at present its benefits are very unevenly shared, while its costs are unevenly distributed.

Thus only through broad and sustained efforts to create a shared future based on our common humanity in all its diversities can globalisation be made fully inclusive and equitable.

The challenge confronting us is how we achieve this shared future and ensure that globalisation is fully inclusive and equitable. Historically, and especially in the postcolonial period, leaders in Africa spoke of Africa’s contributions to the very evolution of life, and also of ancient times, when Africa was the leading centre of learning, technology and culture.

Today, sadly, we have to grapple with the consequences of the slave trade, colonialism, neocolonialism, ie imperialism and the Cold War. Thus, according to the 1999 UN Human Development Report, more than 80 countries, mainly in Africa, have per capita incomes that are lower than they were a decade ago. Since 1990, 55 countries, mainly in sub-Saharan Africa, have had declining per capita incomes. The richest fifth of the world’s people accounted for 86% of the world’s GDP, while the bottom fifth shared a mere 1%.

Kofi Annan, in his millennium report noted:

Nearly half of the world’s population still has to make do on less than $2 per day. Approximately 1,2 billion people - 500 million in South Asia and 300 million in Africa - struggle to survive on less than $1. People living in Africa south of the Sahara are almost as poor today as they were 20 years ago.

Diseases such as HIV/Aids, malaria and tuberculosis are rampant. Electrical power consumption in Africa is the lowest in the world. Tokyo has more telephones than the whole of Africa, and less than half of 1% of all Africans have used the Internet. Given these stark statistics, a key objective of our foreign policy is to tackle this reality and to ensure that the developmental challenge facing Africa is high on the international agenda.

Today the most important challenges facing South Africa are the consolidation, deepening and strengthening of our nonracial and nonsexist democracy. We must therefore ensure that South Africa achieves sustainable economic development and prosperity which benefit the people and not the few.

We seek to achieve these objectives, fully conscious that South Africa cannot be an island of prosperity and stability in a sea of poverty. Our national interest is therefore inextricably linked to what happens in our subregion, SADC, and the continent of Africa. Therefore the African Renaissance is a vision that must underscore our foreign policy objectives.

The broad objectives of the African Renaissance are, firstly, the establishment of democratic political systems in our continent; secondly, the establishment of institutions and procedures which will enable the continent to deal collectively with questions of democracy, peace and stability; thirdly, achieving sustainable economic development that results in the continuous improvement of the quality of life of the masses of people; fourthly, qualitatively changing Africa’s place in the world economy, so that it is free of the yoke of the international debt burden and no longer a supplier of raw materials and an importer of manufactured goods; fifthly, ensuring the emancipation of the women of Africa; sixthly, successfully confronting the scourge of diseases such as HIV/Aids, tuberculosis and malaria; and, lastly, ensuring the protection of our environment. This is the challenge that our foreign policy has to face in the coming millennium.

We must, in South Africa, accept that South Africa is not a European outpost on the African continent, and that the success of the African Renaissance will also be South Africa’s success. The African Renaissance is not an event but a process. We have no illusions about the immense difficulties we face in meeting this challenge.

Conflicts are inextricably linked to underdevelopment. Therefore, the African developmental agenda cannot be achieved if there is no peace and stability on our continent. The United Nations Secretary-General said:

In intrastate conflicts in Africa, the main aim increasingly is the destruction, not only of armies, but of civilians and entire ethnic groups. Preventing such wars is no longer a matter of defending states or protecting allies; it is a matter of defending humanity itself. So we believe we will make an important contribution to peace, stability and the African Renaissance through the African Renaissance and International Co-operation Fund Bill. This fund will provide for the establishment of the African Renaissance and International Co-operation Fund, for the purpose of the enhancement of international co-operation with and on the African continent.

It will allow us to proactively intervene in situations, firstly, for the promotion of democracy, good governance and the prevention and resolution of conflict; secondly, to assist with the socioeconomic development and integration of our continent; thirdly, to ensure that humanitarian and disaster relief in Africa and elsewhere is given; fourthly, it will help with technical assistance projects; fifthly, it will help Africa’s capacity- building, specifically in terms of human resource development, management training and student bursaries; and finally, it will affirm South Africa’s commitment to relations with the rest of Africa. This, we believe, will help consolidate the many positive developments that are already taking place on our continent.

As regards loans under the previous fund, it is estimated that eight countries owe South Africa a total of about R18 million. In the light of our campaign to ensure that the world cancels the debts of the highly indebted countries, I strongly believe that we South Africans should seriously consider the cancellation of these debts.

In conclusion, let me quote from Ben Okri, in his African Elegy:

We are the miracles that God made to taste the bitter fruit of Time. We are precious. And one day our suffering Will turn into the wonders of the earth.

What must we do to make this dream come true? I am reminded of what President Mbeki said at the first ever historic Africa-Europe summit. He said:

The summit will have meaning only to the extent that all of us, without exception, wage the struggle to end human suffering in Africa, with the passionate intensity of the humanists who have given dignity to despised human beings, while others … Like my friends on the left -

… were happy to enclose themselves within the little worlds of selective and false fulfilment.

We must, through concrete action, join the trenches of the humanists. The fund, I believe, is yet another concrete manifestation of our commitment to the African renewal. I urge hon members to wholeheartedly support this Bill, as it will help us make the 21st century the African century. [Applause.]

Mr G P MNGOMEZULU: Chairperson and hon members, since the advent of President Thabo Mbeki’s tenure, the ANC-led Government has promoted the idea of an African Renaissance for our continent. To give effect to this idea, Foreign Affairs will become the leading agent in driving this process. In order to drive this initiative, the African Renaissance and International Co-operation Fund is to be established.

The Bill before us, which is known as the African Renaissance and International Co-operation Fund Bill of 2000, is precisely meant for this purpose. The aim of this Bill is to create a framework and basis for providing funds for projects within the framework of the African Renaissance, with the purpose of enhancing co-operation between South Africa and other countries, in particular countries on the African continent, through the promotion of democracy and good governance.

The good news about this Bill is that it makes provision for funds to give financial assistance to organisations and parties. This, in our view, is a major departure from the previous apartheid government’s funds, which were used for the sole purpose of making friends with some countries in the international community which promoted and advanced the aims and objectives of an evil system which was internationally condemned as a heresy against or cancer within human society.

Furthermore, this Bill serves as a vehicle of transformation towards making the 21st century an African century. The realisation of the African century will bring about peace and stability amongst African states, and eradicate poverty and promote democracy and good governance. The dream of the former apartheid regime of creating banana republics on the African continent through its total-onslaught strategy will be a thing of the past.

Given the fact that the Bill before us seeks to redefine our role in the region in precise ways, it will be good for South Africans to remember that, according to the disclosures made by Ferdi Barnard, it is shocking to note that the Bothas and the De Klerks were responsible for the cross- border raids into Botswana, Lesotho and Zambia by the SA Defence Force. But what is most shocking is the fact that the hon member, Tony Leon, was the propagandist of that very same SA Defence Force through the paper, Paratus, which was a mouthpiece of the SA Defence Force.

After 1994, never again will our neighbours’ territorial integrity be undermined as was the case in apartheid South Africa. Never again will cross-border raids be conducted from South African soil. South Africa is beginning to emerge as a shining example of a country that is promoting peace and stability for the benefit of all the people on the African continent.

The implementation of this Bill will give impetus to South Africa’s leadership position regarding the African Renaissance. To address the developmental challenges facing the African continent, this Bill comes at an opportune time when South Africa needs to consolidate its position on the African continent.

In conclusion, this Bill will go down in the annals of history as a major breakthrough towards international co-operation between African countries. I am convinced that, because of the significance of this progressive piece of legislation, there will be no political party in this august House which will oppose the passing of this Bill, unless the declarations that we have echoed in this very House when our internationally renowned President, Comrade Thabo Mbeki, said ``I am an African’’ were just a smoke screen.

On behalf of the ANC, I, therefore, appeal to all those who genuinely declare themselves to be Africans to live up to expectations by supporting this Bill. [Applause.]

Mr W J SEREMANE: Chairperson, hon Deputy Minister and hon members, despite the crying people on the rivers of Babylon, I would like to say that the Bill before us, namely the African Renaissance and International Co- operation Fund Bill, seeks to enhance co-operation between the Republic, that is, the Republic of South Africa, and other countries, in particular African countries, through the promotion of democracy and good governance, the prevention and resolution of conflict, and socioeconomic development and integration, including the rendering of humanitarian assistance and human resource development. Furthermore, the Bill also seeks to repeal three Acts, namely, Act 68 of 1968, Act 29 of 1986, and Act 16 of 1998, and matters incidental thereto.

Having said that about the intentions of the Bill, the critical factor that follows should be the essence or moral basis of the Bill. The very title, ``African Renaissance’’, betrays, nay suggests, certain imperatives and obligatory attitudes or mind-sets. The foregoing, thus, cancels out the debate about the merits or demerits of the concept of an African Renaissance. Who conceived of it first? Was it George Patmore, Marcus Garvey, Nkrumah, Mzwakhe Limbede, Sobukwe or recently, President Thabo Mbeki, to name just a few, in the long line of torchbearers of the African dream that seeks to be, to assert and sustain itself in close co-operation and co-existence with humanity in our common universe?

The fundamental underlying precepts that need to be taken cognisance of are encapsulated in the very norms and idioms of botho/ubuntu, namely matlo go sa a a mabapi'' [fire usually spreads to nearby houses],umuntu ngumuntu nga bantu’’ [a person is a person through other people], which can be complemented by the fact that charity should begin at home and also that ``dade meer as woorde tel’’ [actions speak louder than words]. Last but not least, the unwavering and tenacious upholding of the tenets of our country’s Constitution and the rule of law should be the undergirding driving forces.

We as South Africans are indeed part of the African continent in the ever- shrinking global village. We are faced with daunting challenges and responsibilities. Amongst others, we are faced with the daunting challenge of being in partnership with fellow African states and being our brothers’ or sisters’ keepers. We should not be patronising bullies nor knights in shining armour who have it all and pretend to know it all, but we should be compatriots, labourers and members of the international community on this great and long march to a better country, a better continent and a better world.

If we take account of the foregoing, the intention of this Bill and the sentiments that were espoused by so many in the various stages of the African pilgrimage, then we should be mindful of the responsibilities that are part of this concept of the African Renaissance. If we take this into consideration, then the DP will support this Bill. [Applause.]

Mr M F CASSIM: Chairman, I rise on behalf of the IFP, a party committed and dedicated to nation-building and to supporting the advancement of Africa. Therefore, it is with great pleasure that I support the viewpoints, sentiments and vision expressed by the Deputy Minister in respect of the Bill before us.

The African Renaissance is premised on the understanding that, together, we can do it better. Therefore, clause 6(1) can be improved if the control of this important fund enjoys multiparty supervision. As it exists presently, there is no need for the Minister to be guided by the collective wisdom of the members of this House. Otherwise, the IFP is in full support of this Bill. We are in favour of enhanced co-operation between countries, particularly African countries. In a recent speech to a chamber of commerce, the hon Tony Leon was strenuously criticising South Africa’s departure from what he called the Western way of doing things''. If the assumption is that theWestern way’’ is the only way, and that Asians and Africans have nothing to contribute, or that what they undertake is substandard, below par, backward, deviant and so on, we are then entitled to ask: Are we to be intellectually and culturally colonised forever? Do Western nations really find it uncomfortable to deal with China, India, Malaysia and Africa? Since Australia discovered that it is an Asian country in a sea of Asian cultures and surrounded by Asian people, it has started to make unprecedented progress.

We, too, have to recognise that we are in an African continent surrounded by African people seeking to blend African and Western values. Our Government is not deficient in terms of Western norms, and the way we conduct Government and business is not antagonistic to anything that the Germans or British or French or Americans do. We have incorporated these values and sought to blend the positive things that are rooted in our soil. Therefore, we have a Constitution which is the envy of the world. We enjoy freedom of speech and belief which is on a par with the best practices of the West. We had a president who departed with dignity and grace, and did not have to be pushed as was the case with the Serbian dictator.

As South Africans, we can either contribute to advancing democracy by pushing the frontiers of the African Renaissance or we can take part in constantly denegrating everything we do, constantly condemning, constantly bad-mouthing, constantly creating fears, constantly making the subliminal equation that everything African is third class, that building a future with fellow Africans is impossible, that this House will fail to lead all people, white and black, to the promised land. We know that we have our fair share of problems but we know also that so long as there are at least 300 of us in this House who fervently believe in the African Renaissance, the renewal will take place and South Africa will be the great success it deserves to be. We support this Bill. [Applause.]

Mr N J CLELLAND: Mr Chairperson and hon Deputy Minister, the concept of an African Renaissance is grounded in a vision of this continent embracing and indeed becoming a sanctuary for human rights, enterprise and expanding opportunity for all. Now, recent months have put an incredible strain on this vision and, in particular, on prospects for foreign investments, arguably the driving force of any prospect of an African Renaissance. The violence, bloodshed and mayhem in the Democratic Republic of Congo spilling over to Angola and Namibia have done nothing to improve Africa’s status as an investment destination.

The obliteration of Zimbabwe’s economy, a pointless, irrational act of political expediency by President Robert Mugabe, has brought with it damaging consequences for the regional economy. What is even more distressing is the impression created by SADC leaders, and that includes our very own President, that SADC states agree with land-grabs and state intimidation of opposition parties as an acceptable way to run a country. [Interjections.]

Now, I am convinced that the South African Government does not approve of such destruction and disregard for the rule of law across our borders, but it has not done enough to prove this to the world. South Africa, as one of Africa’s strongest economies and most respected democracies, has an obligation to play a prominent leadership role. I believe that this African Renaissance and International Co-operation Fund Bill is a step in the right direction. The background and objects of the Bill contained in the memorandum thereto state that it seeks, and I quote -

… to reaffirm the Republic’s commitment to Africa.

The fund will provide support to NGOs and CBOs and bodies working to promote democracy and good governance, conflict resolution, socioeconomic development, humanitarian assistance and human resource development in Africa. It will go some way towards revitalising and strengthening civil society on the continent where citizens acting together can express their interests, exchange information and strive for mutual goals and influence government.

For the fund to be a success and for it to live up to the lofty concept of fueling an African Renaissance, the fund will have to target its efforts on strengthening the community-focused non-profit sector and on developing organisations that promote entrepreneurship and SMMEs, the engine room for any potential African economic revival.

The DP and the DA support this Bill, and we hope that it is an indication of a change in attitude by the South African Government towards our important leadership role on the African continent and a solid commitment to an Africa that is indeed a sanctuary for human rights, for enterprise and for expanding opportunity for all. [Applause.]

Mr T ABRAHAMS: Mr Chairperson, we regard this Bill as a sign of our commitment to Africa and we fully support the Bill.

I would like to point out that globalisation and rapid developments in information technology are sweeping the world. Our Deputy Minister has indicated to us and referred to the dire straits in which Africa, sub- Saharan Africa and South Africa, in that context, find themselves. It is a fact that the rich countries are reaping the most benefits from globalisation. The rich are getting richer, and the poorer countries are having difficulty getting on board as regards this worldwide trend.

Africa, sub-Saharan Africa and South Africa are going to have to get their acts together if we want to reap the same benefits that the richer countries have been reaping and are reaping. For us to do so, we have to accept that we can only do this by involving ourselves with our neighbours on this continent. We cannot develop South Africa in isolation on this continent. It is good that the fund created will provide for the enhancement of co-operation in Africa. It is also very good that this Bill will promote democracy and good governance in states in Africa.

South Africa’s involvement, at all times, in Africa must be positive. Reference has been made to South Africa needing to be the engine room of the renaissance in Africa. We fully subscribe to that notion. We must take care, though, that whereas with disaster relief we have to provide assistance wherever such occurrences take place, our assistance to other states in terms of economic aid and conflict resolution must be based on certain clear-cut criteria.

We must not involve ourselves or be associated with countries which do not uphold the principles of democracy. As Africans we must accept that we are indeed our brothers’ keepers. We support the Bill. [Applause.]

Dr B L GELDENHUYS: Mr Chairperson, I find it a bit peculiar that a convicted killer such as Ferdi Barnard is being given credibility in this House. I am referring to the speech made by the hon Mngomezulu. I just want to tell the House that Ferdi Barnard was never a member of the NP. [Interjections.] He never voted for the NP. I will not be surprised if he becomes a member of the ANC soon. [Interjections.]

South Africa’s future is inseparably linked to that of Africa. If Africa goes down, so will we. The New NP and the Democratic Alliance firmly believe that South Africa does have a responsibility to promote democracy, good governance, socioeconomic development and conflict resolution on the continent of Africa and especially in the SADC region and we therefore support the African Renaissance and International Co-operation Fund Bill which provides exactly for the aforesaid.

In sharp contrast to the previous Act, the Economic Co-operation Promotion Loan Fund Act of 1968, which provided financial assistance to governments, the provisions of this Bill will empower organisations to launch projects pertaining, inter alia, to socioeconomic development. And, in our book, this is a huge improvement. One has only to read the famous book of the 80s Fool’s Gold for Africa: The Wasted Millions in Development Aid to realise that money meant for social relief programmes in the past mostly ended up in the Swiss bank accounts of the rulers.

We support this Bill. However, we do want to issue a word of caution in this regard to the Government. The New NP and the Democratic Alliance will ensure, through parliamentary control, that not one cent of the proposed fund lands in the coffers of front organisations of dubious governments. The empowering of civil society to engage in conflict resolution merits special attention.

Afrika het nie soseer te doen met interstaatlike konflikte nie, maar met konflikte binne staatsgrense. Angola, Nigerië en die Soedan is goeie voorbeelde. [Tussenwerpsels.] [Africa does not deal so much with interstate conflicts, but with conflicts within state boundaries. Angola, Nigeria and Sudan are good examples. [Interjections.]]

The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Mr Chairperson, on a point of order: Is it in order for the hon member Geldenhuys to say that the Democratic Alliance supports this Bill when we do not have a Democratic Alliance in this House?

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Order! Hon member, I observed the other day that while the Chair is not compelled to recognise the Democratic Alliance, there is no reason why those who wish to identify themselves as such should not be allowed to do so. Therefore, I think it is within the right of the freedom of speech for individuals to identify themselves as they wish to, and I think that they will be allowed to do so. [Applause.]

Dr B L GELDENHUYS: Mr Chairperson, I really hope that the SACP-Cosatu-ANC alliance will abide by your ruling.

Hierdie wetsontwerp maak voorsiening vir konflikvoorkoming deur organisasies te bemagtig om konflikte te identifiseer en te voorkom.

Ek het reeds gesê dat Afrika nie te doen het met interstaatlike konfliksituasie nie, maar met konflikte binne landsgrense. Dit is ‘n feit dat die burgerlike samelewing veel beter in staat is om konflikte onderling te voorkom as wat regerings dit kan doen mits hulle daartoe bemagtig word. Dit is presies ‘n doelstelling van hierdie wetsontwerp.   Sonder bemagtiging van die burgerlike samelewing kan daar geen sprake van demokrasie wees nie, en sonder demokrasie is die idee van ‘n Afrika- renaissance doodgebore.   Die Demokratiese Alliansie steun die wetsontwerp. [Applous.] (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)

[This Bill makes provision for the prevention of conflict by empowering organisations to identify and prevent conflicts.

I have already said that Africa does not deal with interstate conflict situations, but conflicts within state boundaries. It is a fact that, if it is empowered in this regard, civil society is far better equipped to prevent internal conflict than governments are. This is precisely an objective of this Bill.

Without the empowerment of civil society there can be no suggestion of democracy, and without democracy the idea of an African Renaissance is stillborn.

The Democratic Alliance supports the Bill. [Applause.]]

Miss S RAJBALLY: Mr Chairperson, central to the issue of the African Renaissance and International Co-operation Fund Bill is the co-existing relationship between democracy, the national economy and globalisation. These variables determine a group’s militant power, access to resources and authority to govern.

The history of colonialism and the blindness of the elite prevents the 45 African countries from emerging and moving forward. The Bill is designed to redress the lack of capacity-building across the African continent and to financially facilitate the restructuring of the economic and social system of targeted regions, so that the merited needs of the international African countries can be served and developed.

The MF supports the African Renaissance and International Co-operation Fund Bill. [Applause.]

Mr D J SITHOLE: Mr Chairperson, whilst I will agree with your ruling that anyone can identify himself as he wishes, I will, however, certainly not agree that people can create confusion by not being able to identify themselves and who they are. South Africa has committed itself to making this century an African century. We have committed ourselves to contributing to the reconstruction and development of this continent. We have committed ourselves to joining hands with fellow Africans to confront and live up to the demands of the continent. We have declared our unconditional allegiance to the continent. We have accepted that unless Africa is at peace with itself, there will be no progress. We have declared to the world that our umbilical cord is attached to this continent. We have no intention of disappointing those who voted for the ANC to pursue these objectives.

This Bill is an indication of the extent of our commitment. Hon Gibson should note that we have fought against corruption in all its manifestations and that we will continue to do so. The apartheid regime sought to create surrogate states by providing moneys, voted through the support of the likes of the hon Gibson, so as to buy their support. Those who refused to be surrogates were subjected to destabilisation and sabotage, and the hon Gibson was among those people who congratulated those who maimed and killed people in Botswana. [Interjections.]

The intention of the Bill is to build, and not to raid and destroy neighbours. Today we can say to our fellow Africans: You can sleep in peace because we are here to build with you, and not to kill you! This Bill demonstrates that the new South Africa, under the leadership of the ANC, seeks to establish not only a new relationship with the continent, but also to play its role as an equal and responsible partner.

It is true that the financial aid that was envisaged by the Acts we are repealing today was intended to fund undemocratic organisations such as Renamo and African despots. That was demonstrated by those who opposed the democratic processes that were taking place on the African continent. The buying of friendship was a priority and central objective of the previous Act. The selling of arms and using our soil as a route for transporting military hardware was a means of buying acceptance. And the DP was quiet for all those years!

These activities did assist in keeping despots in power and in the destabilisation of the continent. Angola, Mozambique and the killing of innocent people in Botswana and other countries are examples of apartheid policies. It is with great joy today that we are passing the African Renaissance and International Co-operation Fund Bill. This is an affirmation of South Africa’s commitment to the rebuilding of the continent.

To us this Bill is a symbol of peace and good neighbourliness, a demonstration that democracy is here to stay and that never again will the continent be destabilised by South Africa. This piece of legislation sets the scene for all leaders on the continent to emulate, and is a practical act on our part to make the 21st century an African century. All patriots will rejoice in the passing of this legislation, because they know that their words were not in vain.

But, of course, there are those who pay lip service to the continent and demonstrate their love for this country and its people by grouping themselves in some formation so as to oppose the majority of South African people. There is no harm in differing with me, but when one starts opposing the creation of a better life for the poor and the destitute on the continent under the guise that it is the role of an opposition, it becomes absurd.

The Bill makes provision for the writing-off of outstanding debts. This issue should be a priority when the advisory committee is formed and is functioning. Clause 8 is important because it is at the heart of our campaign that poor countries’ debts should be written-off.

I must point out that, despite the fact that these moneys were made available to these countries under questionable circumstances, we urge the department to review the situation in line with our current policy and commitments. This appeal is in line with the objectives stated in the Bill.

However, the promotion of democracy and good governance and the protection of human rights should be our guide in reviewing certain debts. Governments that are guilty of oppressing their citizens must be made to commit themselves to change. The good thing about this legislation is that it ensures transparency and accountability.

South African people should be happy to have been the first in setting the example of how we should handle issues as Africans. I am sure that a number of developed countries in the North, who do not accept the fact that Africans have the ability to find solutions to their own problems, will always advocate a dependency syndrome. That is what the hon Gibson is a victim to.

This Bill is one of the foundation stones of the African Renaissance, and the ANC will support it without any reservations. As I was listening to the debate, I noted that the DP’s obsession with Zimbabwe has actually created a situation which has denied the DP and the New NP the ability to grow, the ability to understand the politics of this country, and the ability to understand the continent, because of the fact that they do not like President Mugabe as a person. [Applause.]

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS: Chairperson and hon members, the problem with a debate like this is that sometimes some members of the opposition parties try to have an intellectual debate without having the intellectual capacity. [Laughter.] That gives us a problem. [Interjections.]

We have this ridiculous situation where some elements seem to support the Bill but make so many qualifications that one wonders what they are supporting. What some of them have done, especially the DP - and the positions they take here reflect the positions which they take when their leaders go abroad - is to harp on the negative elements of Africa to reinforce the notion that nothing good can come out of Africa. [Interjections.] In fact, the actions of the DP are such that they make all right-wingers and Afro-sceptics around the world very happy.

It is about time that we begin to ask the DP quite openly: Are they supporting the interests of their country and in that context the continent, or are they becoming unpatriotic and supporting the interests of forces outside our continent? It is ridiculous for them to warn us not to become patronising bullies who know it all. Well, if one listens to them, they are like patronising bullies who believe they know it all without knowing anything. [Interjections.]

The DP has the nerve to tell us that charity begins at home. I think this is a reflection of the naivity and total ignorance of the new world in which we live. The Millennium Summit showed that we are now together, trying to ensure that in the globalised world order we achieve a more caring and equitable world. The question ``am I my brother’s keeper’’ has been answered long ago. Yes, we are one another’s keepers. We live in an interdependent world and we have to support one another.

The very fact that the DP cannot understand that our future in South Africa is inextricably linked to that of SADC and the African continent, I think, reflects the reality that they are like political dinosaurs who continue to believe that South Africa is a European outpost on the African continent. [Interjections.]

They support the Bill with qualifications. Let me tell them that when we talk of the fact that charity begins at home, they must not forget that South Africa is a recipient of more than R3 billion a year in development assistance from other countries, because these countries understand the need to help us consolidate our democracy. So, let me say to the DP that they can continue to articulate their negative positions on South Africa and Africa, but the world out there understands the role that the new Government of South Africa is playing, and is committed to assisting us to make the African century a reality. We will do it without them.

Let me then thank the other members of the opposition parties who have voiced constructive criticism and made suggestions on how the Bill must be used genuinely to achieve the African Renaissance. [Applause.]

Debate concluded.

Bill read a second time (African Christian Democratic Party dissenting).

     CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON FINANCE -
                RSA/NIGERIA DOUBLE TAXATION AGREEMENT

Order disposed of without debate.

Report adopted.

     CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON FINANCE -
                 RSA/CHINA DOUBLE TAXATION AGREEMENT

Order disposed of without debate.

Report adopted.

CONSIDERATION OF TENTH REPORT OF STANDING COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC ACCOUNTS Order disposed of without debate.

Report adopted.

CONSIDERATION OF ELEVENTH REPORT OF STANDING COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC ACCOUNTS

Order disposed of without debate.

Report adopted.

CONSIDERATION OF TWELFTH REPORT OF STANDING COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC ACCOUNTS

Order disposed of without debate.

Report adopted.

CONSIDERATION OF THIRTEENTH REPORT OF STANDING COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC ACCOUNTS

Order disposed of without debate. Report adopted.

CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON TRADE AND INDUSTRY - ABUJA TREATY

Order disposed of without debate.

Report adopted.

CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF PORTFOLIO COMMITTEE ON FOREIGN AFFAIRS - ABUJA TREATY

Order disposed of without debate.

Report adopted.

CONSIDERATION OF EIGHTH REPORT OF STANDING COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC ACCOUNTS

Order disposed of without debate.

Report adopted.

CONSIDERATION OF NINTH REPORT OF STANDING COMMITTEE ON PUBLIC ACCOUNTS

Order disposed of without debate.

Report adopted.

The House adjourned at 11:26. ____

            ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS

TABLINGS:

National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:

Papers:

1. The Speaker and the Chairperson:

 (1)    Report of the Auditor-General on the Financial Statements of
     Vote 1 - President for the period 1 April to 31 May 1999 [RP 110-
     2000].

 (2)    Report of the Auditor-General on the Financial Statements of the
     South African Wool Board for 1996-97 [RP 150-2000].

1. The Minister of Public Enterprises:

 Report and Financial Statements of Denel (Pty) Ltd for 1998-99.

COMMITTEE REPORTS:

National Assembly:

1. Report of the Portfolio Committee on Finance on the South African Reserve Bank Amendment Bill [B 62 - 2000] (National Assembly - sec 75), dated 3 October 2000:

   The Portfolio Committee on Finance, having considered the subject of the South African Reserve Bank Amendment Bill [B 62 - 2000] (National Assembly - sec 75), referred to it and classified by the Joint Tagging Mechanism as a section 75 Bill, reports the Bill without amendment.