THURSDAY, 29 MAY 2002 __

                PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL ASSEMBLY
                                ____

The House met at 14:02

The Speaker took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.

ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS - see col 000.

QUESTIONS AND REPLIES - see that book.

                          NOTICES OF MOTION

Mr D A A OLIFANT: Madam Speaker, I shall move on behalf of the ANC:

That the House -

(1) notes that the German fugitive, Jurgen Harksen, alleged that -

   (a)  the Mayor of Cape Town, Mr Gerald Morkel, solicited R100 000
       from him to assist with building purposes;


   (b)  he funded Morkel's rental house in Higgovale to the tune of R45
       000;


   (c)  he paid former finance MEC, Mr Leon Markovitz, R500 000 in cash
       as part of the payment of R750 000 for the purchase of the
       Sports Café in the Waterfront for tax reasons; and


   (d)  Markovitz was paid a few million rands by Arabella Country
       Estate in Kleinmond to ensure smooth development;

(2) believes that -

   (a)  the allegations made by Harksen against key leaders of the DA
       warrant an investigation that is open and transparent; and
   (b)  the response of the DA to these allegations demonstrates
       hypocrisy as they claim to be crusaders against corruption and
       yet drag their feet in dealing with this problem within their
       own ranks; and

(3) calls on Mr Tony Leon and the DA to -

   (a)  embark on transparent investigations into the allegations of
       corruption within their own ranks; and


   (b)  act decisively against those members. [Applause.]

Mr R S NTULI: Madam Speaker, I hereby give notice that I shall move:

That the House -

(1) notes that the controversial march on 24 May 2002 in Johannesburg by the Congress of South African Students was marked by looting, theft and general chaos; (2) further notes that no official permit was granted for the march, making it illegal;

(3) supports the Gauteng MEC for Education in his efforts to restore order by instituting a disciplinary hearing and other related measures;

(4) condemns Cosas for its threats to disrupt education; and

(5) appeals to Cosas to abandon its destructive struggle tactics and to help build a positive environment for learning.

Mr J H SLABBERT: Madam Speaker, I hereby give notice that on the next sitting day of the House I shall move on behalf of the IFP:

That the House -

(1) notes that the device named the ``Drager Alcotester’’, used for testing alcoholic content on motorists, has on several occasions been disputed as inaccurate by motorists; (2) further notes that such disputes cause many offending motorists to escape being prosecuted, which is tantamount to getting away with murder, as they might injure or kill themselves or other road users during drunken driving;

(3) regrets that this state of affairs is going to continue over a long period of time, given that the only two experts on the device are in Durban and Pretoria; and

(4) appeals to the Department of Transport to extend knowledge on the device to all towns and provinces.

Mr G D SCHNEEMAN: Madam Speaker, I shall move on behalf of the ANC:

That the House -

(1) notes that -

   (a)  taxi services on the Alexandra, Rosebank and Randburg routes in
       Gauteng have been disrupted during the past week, leaving
       thousands of commuters stranded without transport due to
       disputes between taxi drivers and taxi owners; and


   (b)  the dispute is about where the pick-up points should be;

(2) condemns the actions of the taxi drivers and owners concerned and reminds them that thousands of commuters rely on taxis on a daily basis as their only means of transport;

(3) calls on the taxi associations concerned to resolve their internal disputes and to use the taxi rank facilities that are provided, and further calls on the traffic officials to enforce the law; and

(4) commends the speedy intervention of the Gauteng department of transport in assisting to resolve the internal disputes of the taxi associations concerned. [Applause.]

Dr W A ODENDAAL: Mev die Speaker, ek sal namens die Nuwe NP voorstel: Dat die Huis -

(1) die klaarblyklike voornemens van die Regering entoesiasties steun om sowel Suid-Afrika se pad- as sy spoornetwerk oor die volgende aantal jare uit die opbrengs van privatisering en die herskedulering van die begroting dramaties op te gradeer;

(2) meen dat so ‘n stap deurslaggewend sal bydra tot ekonomiese groei, werkskepping en die uitroei van armoede; en

 3) besef dat 'n goeie vervoer-infrastruktuur ook 'n voorwaarde is vir
    die suksesvolle sosio-ekonomiese herlewing van Afrika. (Translation of Afrikaans notice of motion follows.)

[Dr W A ODENDAAL: Madam Speaker, I shall move on behalf of the NNP:

That the House -

(1) enthusiastically supports the apparent intentions of the Government to dramatically upgrade South Africa’s road and rail networks over the coming few years from the proceeds of privatisation and the rescheduling of the budget;

(2) is of the opinion that such a step will contribute decisively towards economic growth, job creation and the eradication of poverty; and

(3) realises that a sound transport infrastructure is also a prerequisite for the successful socioeconomic revival of Africa.]

Mr M N RAMODIKE: Madam Speaker, I give notice that I shall move on behalf of the UDM during the next sitting of the House:

That the House -

(1) appreciates and supports the research by the Stellenboch University- based Maritime Education and Research Institute, which has found that the Coega industrial development zone and deep water port at Port Elizabeth are vital to the economic growth of South Africa, Southern Africa, and the whole of the African continent;

(2) is delighted that this industrial development zone will create employment opportunities of about 22 000 direct and indirect permanent posts, and some 54 000 construction-related posts;

(3) welcomes the Coega Development Corporation’s innovative plan to ensure that unskilled people are trained to meet the needs and expectations of investors; and

(4) congratulates the Stellenbosch University, Coega Development Corporation and the Ministry of Trade and Industry on their plans to swing the economic and industrial pendulum from the one time world famous great Egyptian port of Alexandria … [Time expired.]

Mr A MLANGENI: Madam Speaker, I shall move on behalf of the ANC:

That the House - (1) notes with sadness the passing on of Ronald Mkhandawire,a former coach of Orlando Pirates;

(2) further notes that yet another South African artist, a great sportsman in his lifetime, died a lonely and reclusive death;

(3) recalls that the late Ronald Mkhandawire was the coach of the mercurial Buccaneers, which won the 1995 African Cup of Nations;

(4) recognises that the late Ronald played a pivotal role in the Buccaneers’ historic championship victory, a first by a South African team at a continental level competition;

(5) acknowledges that this Zambian-born coach made a significant contribution to South African football;

(6) mourns the loss of this great sportsman and sends condolences to his family; and

(7) calls on the South African public and sport authorities to honour our sporting greats accordingly.

[Applause.]

Mrs C DUDLEY: Madam Speaker, I shall move on behalf of the ACDP:

That the House -

(1) notes with concern that Israel is facing an intense onslaught from many directions, in that -

   (a)  in excess of 400 Israelis, from babies to the elderly, have died
       and many others have been maimed for life, as attacks taking
       various forms have indiscriminately been unleashed throughout
       the country; and


   (b)  blatantly biased and sensational reporting in the media has
       fomented hatred and prejudice against Israel and Jewish people,
       which has led to unprecedented levels of anti-Semitism in most
       countries around the world;

(2) congratulates ``Bridges for Peace’’ on the rally held on 19 May 2002, which was addressed by Rev Kenneth Meshoe, President of the ACDP, to express solidarity with Israel and express the earnest desire of Christians for peace in the Middle East that will benefit all people; and

(3) calls on the Government and all South Africans to play a peace-making role in the Middle East situation by not taking sides, but by offering assistance in bridging the divide between the peoples of this region.

Mr J P I BLANCHÉ: Madam Speaker, I hereby give notice that I shall move:

That the House -

(1) notes that -

   (a)  DA member Kenneth Dayi was shot and killed at a community
       meeting in Crossroads informal settlement on 21 April this year;


   (b)  other residents were injured in the shooting; and


   (c)  ANC councillor De Pouche Elese was seen firing his gun;

(2) further notes that more than a month has passed and still no arrest has been made in connection with the death of Mr Dayi;

(3) concludes that ANC members appear to be above the law and the lives of opposition supporters are treated as cheap by the Government; and

(4) calls on the ANC to uphold the rule of law and to ensure that justice takes its course.

Mrs D M MOROBI: Madam Speaker, I shall move on behalf of the ANC:

That the House - (1) notes the recent appointment of officials for the new Boxing Board of South Africa;

(2) congratulates the new Boxing South Africa Chairman, Mr Mthobi Tyamzashe, and his fellow members on their appointments;

(3) also acknowledges the appointment of a woman member, Ms Violet Magwaca, to the Board as commendable; and

(4) commends the Minister of Sport and Recreation on the announcement of these appointments. [Applause.]

Mr R JANKIELSOHN: Madam Speaker, I hereby give notice that I shall move:

That the House -

(1) notes -

   (a)  that beneficiaries of an RDP housing project in Clarens were
       expected to pay between R250 and R10 000 in order to obtain
       houses;
   (b)  that the Free State Housing Department is unable to supply
       reasons for this top-up payment;


   (c)  that a report by the Department mentions that payments were made
       to the then mayor of Clarens and current mayor of Ditlhabeng,
       who was also the developer; and


   (d)  that it appears that the ANC promotes individuals under whose
       authority corrupt practices take place; and

(2) calls on the ANC in the Free State to take Batho Pele seriously by holding their public representatives to account for their corrupt practices and malfeasance.

Dr R RABINOWITZ: Madam Speaker, on behalf of the IFP I shall move:

That the House -

(1) notes the declared commitment of the President and members of the Cabinet -

   (a)  to seek ways of boosting the immunity of persons with HIV and
       Aids;


   (b)  to make immunity-enhancing products accessible to the public;
       and


   (c)  to research the capacity of South African herbs and indigenous
       plants to strengthen the immune system;

(2) also notes the endorsement by the Medical Research Council of a specific herb - Sutherlandia (inqqwele in Zulu) - available in South Africa for more than 100 years and a large body of circumstantial evidence about its efficacy and safety;

(3) views with concern the vacuum that still exists in relation to developing, protecting, licensing, patenting and marketing of traditional medicines; and

(4) calls on the Medical Research Council, the Ministers of Trade and Industry and of Arts, Culture, Science and Technology to -

   (a)  foster development of indigenous plants;


   (b)  put an end to plant piracy; and


   (c)  enable South Africans to add billions to our GDP through a
       flourishing market in medicinal herbs.

Ms N E LAMANI: Madam Speaker, I shall move on behalf of the ANC:

That the House -

(1) notes that the team spirit in the Bafana Bafana camp under the leadership of coach Jomo Sono is at an all-time high;

(2) notes that the Bafana Bafana championship-winning victories over the highly rated Scotland and Turkey sides in the Reunification Cup bear testimony to a new-found confidence and unity of purpose in the team;

(3) congratulates coach Jomo Sono and his technical staff on instilling a spirit to compete in the Bafana Bafana camp;

(4) commends captain Lucas Radebe and the boys for their fine performance during the Reunification Cup Tournament; and

(5) calls on all South Africans to throw their weight behind Bafana Bafana during the World Cup campaign. [Applause.]

Dr B L GELDENHUYS: Mev die Speaker, ek gee hiermee kennis dat ek sal voorstel:

Dat die Huis -

(1) met dank kennis neem van die feit dat belastings op die toelaes van diplomate wat op 1 Maart in werking sou tree, tydelik opgehef is;

(2) die Minister van Buitelandse Sake versoek om so gou as moontlik wetgewing in te dien wat die aangeleentheid permanent sal regstel; en (3) sy dank uitspreek teenoor alle diplomate wat, dikwels onder moeilike omstandighede, Suid-Afrika se belange in die buiteland bevorder. (Translation of Afrikaans notice of motion follows.)

[Dr B L GELDENHUYS: Madam Speaker, I hereby give notice that I shall move:

That the House -

(1) notes with gratitude the fact that taxation of the allowances of diplomats, which was to have come into effect on 1 March, has been temporarily deferred;

(2) requests the Minister of Foreign Affairs to introduce legislation as soon as possible that will put this matter right permanently; and

(3) expresses its gratitude to all diplomats who, often under difficult circumstances, are promoting South Africa’s interests abroad.]

              POLAR MUSIC PRIZE AWARD FOR MIRIAM MAKEBA

                         (Draft Resolution)

Mr M J ELLIS: Madam Speaker, I move without notice:

That the House -

(1) congratulates Mama Africa, Miriam Makeba, on being awarded the Polar Music Prize;

(2) notes that the prize is given to honour exceptional and lifetime achievements which transcend music genres and break down musical boundaries; and

(3) thanks Mama Africa for her efforts to bring world-wide recognition to African music.

Agreed to.

SUSPENSION OF RULE 253(1) TO CONDUCT SECOND READING DEBATE ON HEALTH
                   DONATIONS FUND ACT REPEAL BILL

                         (Draft Resolution)

The CHIEF WHIP OF THE MAJORITY PARTY: Madam Speaker, I move the draft resolution printed in my name on the Order Paper, as follows:

That Rule 253(1) be suspended for the purposes of conducting the Second Reading debate on the Health Donations Fund Act Repeal Bill [B 20 - 2002] (National Assembly - sec 75).

Agreed to.

                      UNPARLIAMENTARY LANGUAGE

                              (Rulings)

The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order! Hon members, I would like to make some rulings. On 14 May 2002, the hon Mr Landers raised a point of order with regard to a remark made by the hon Mr Groenewald, who had interjected and said ``oubaas se honne’’ when the hon Mr Oosthuizen was delivering his speech. I said that I would rule on the matter later.

I have now had an opportunity to read the unrevised Hansard and to consider the contested remark. I have consulted first-language Afrikaans speakers and am satisfied that the term ``oubaas se honne’’ was used idiomatically in the sense of dutifully carrying out an instruction or performing a duty for or on behalf of one’s senior or boss. In that sense and in that context I do not regard the remark as unparliamentary.

However, we cannot overlook how other members may perceive such a remark and we must be sensitive to the fact that different members, depending on their cultural backgrounds, may respond differently to a particular remark. I, therefore, appeal to hon members generally to moderate their language.

Again on the same day, 14 May 2002, the hon Andrew raised a point of order with regard to a remark made by the hon Oosthuizen that was addressed to the hon Lee. In referring to the hon Lee, the hon Oosthuizen said:

The difference between you and me is that I have no price tag, you have one.

This remark reflects on the integrity of the member, and I therefore ask the hon Oosthuizen to withdraw it. [Laughter.]

Mr G C OOSTHUIZEN: Madam Speaker, out of respect for the Chair, the Rules of this House and this institution, I withdraw that remark unconditionally.

But may I add that I do so, not because Mr Lee … [Interjections.]

The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Order! No, hon member, I do not want an addition.

Mr G C OOSTHUIZEN: I withdraw unconditionally, Madam Speaker.

The DEPUTY SPEAKER: Thank you very much for the withdrawal. [Applause.]

The House adjourned at 16:19. ____

            ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS ANNOUNCEMENTS:

National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:

1. The Speaker and the Chairperson:

 (1)    The Joint Tagging Mechanism (JTM) on 22 May 2002 in terms of
     Joint Rule 160(6), classified the following Bills as section 75
     Bills:


     (i)     Local Government: Municipal Structures Amendment Bill [B
           22 - 2002] (National Assembly - sec 75).


     (ii)    South African Maritime and Aeronautical Search  and  Rescue
           Bill [B 23 - 2002] (National Assembly - sec 75).

TABLINGS:

National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:

Papers:

1. The Minister of Transport:

 The Business Plan of the National Department  of  Transport  for  2002-
 2003.

COMMITTEE REPORTS:

National Assembly:

1. Report of the Portfolio Committee on Justice and Constitutional Development on European Convention on Extradition, dated 22 May 2002:

   The Portfolio Committee on Justice and Constitutional Development, having considered the request for approval by Parliament of the European Convention on Extradition, referred to it, recommends that the House, in terms of section 231(2) of the Constitution, approve the said Protocol, with the declaration that:

   (1) the Republic of South Africa, for the purposes of Article 2 of the Convention, shall not extradite any person unless the punishment awarded for a conviction in respect of which he or she is being sought, is a sentence of imprisonment of at least six months; and

   (2) for the purposes of Article 6 of the Convention, the term “nationals” is defined, in terms of South Africa’s legal system, as persons who have acquired South African citizenship by means of birth, descent or naturalisation. This includes persons with citizenship of South Africa and of another country. These persons will all be liable to be extradited. South Africa’s acceptance of dual citizenship will therefore not bar the extradition of a person where he or she is also in possession of a citizenship of a country which prohibits the extradition of its nationals.

 Report to be considered.

1. Report of the Portfolio Committee on Justice and Constitutional Development on SADC Protocol Against Corruption, dated 22 May 2002: The Portfolio Committee on Justice and Constitutional Development, having considered the request for approval by Parliament of the SADC Protocol Against Corruption, referred to it, recommends that the House, in terms of section 231(2) of the Constitution, approve the said Protocol.

   The Committee is of the opinion that, in accordance with Article 12 of the Protocol, the Director-General of Justice and Constitutional Development should be designated as the authority for purposes of co-operation and assistance under this Protocol.

 Report to be considered.