National Council of Provinces - 02 August 2002
FRIDAY, 2 AUGUST 2002 __
PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
____
The Council met at 10:17.
The Chairperson took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.
ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS - see col 000.
NOTICES OF MOTION
Mr A E VAN NIEKERK: Chairperson, I give notice that I shall move at the next sitting of the House:
That the Council -
(1) notes that the New NP was shocked and cannot accept the violation of the SA Constitution by Transnet through the adoption of a language policy that ignores the language realities of South Africa, as was reported in Die Burger of 26 July;
(2) notes that by the adoption of this policy, the language rights of the speakers of isiXhosa, Afrikaans, Xitsonga, Tshivenda, isiZulu, Setswana and all the other indigenous languages are ignored, and this cannot be tolerated by any of these language communities;
(3) also notes that the New NP expresses its gratitude for the efforts that presiding officers of the NCOP took to ensure that our meetings here in Umtata are conducted in isiXhosa, with the professional interpretation services of Hansard, in the person of Mr Hector Tshabalala. It would have been totally out of rhythm and ineffective if the meetings had been conducted in English only, while we are in the heart of the Xhosa community of South Africa; and (4) further notes that people must be empowered in and through the languages they know best, and we salute the Chairperson for demonstrating the NCOP’s commitment to multilingualism.
Mr V V Z WINDVOëL: Chairperson, I give notice that I shall move at the next sitting of the House:
That the Council -
(1) once more notes the political opportunism of the Leader of the Opposition, the hon Mr Tony Leon, in encouraging the Whittaker family, a member of which was murdered by one of the former prisoners given amnesty by the President, to sue the state for the individual action of the former prisoner;
(2) believes that actions such as these do not contribute to nation- building and reconciliation, but instead enhance racial polarisation;
(3) calls upon Mr Leon to stop this political opportunism and embrace principles of nation-building and reconciliation.
Mr N M RAJU: Madam Chair, I move without notice …
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Order! We are dealing with notices of motion.
Mr N M RAJU: I thought I heard you say ``motions without notice’’.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: No. [Interjections.] I am glad you said ``I thought’’, Mr Raju. I see the hon Lubidla.
Mrs E N LUBIDLA: Chairperson, mine is also a motion without notice.
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Perhaps we need to develop different terminology. Members often have difficulty with these terms. We are dealing with notices of motion.
Ms C BOTHA: Madam Chair, I give notice that I shall move at the next sitting of the House:
That the Council -
(1) sitting in the province which produced Steve Biko, regrets the approach of the Minister for Justice and Constitutional Development in its resemblance to the statement by the then Minister, Mr Jimmy Kruger, that the death of Biko left him cold;
(2) notes that the utterances of the Minister seem very much in line with this when he says that they cannot foresee, and therefore seem not to care about, what happens when people are released on parole; and
(3) asks that the Ministry reconsider the conditions under which people are pardoned and make them subject to a parole board investigation.
PERFORMANCE OF SOUTH AFRICAN ATHLETES AT COMMONWEALTH GAMES
(Draft Resolution)
Mr N M RAJU: Madam Chair, I move without notice:
That the Council-
(1) notes -
(a) with immense joy and intense national pride the sparkling
performance of our athletes at the Commonwealth Games 2002,
currently being held in Manchester, England; and
(b) that at the latest count, South Africa's medals tally stands at
26 medals, of which 10 are bronze, 10 are silver and 6 are gold;
(2) further notes that among the gold recipients were - (a) Mbulaeni Mulaudzi, who became South Africa’s first gold medal winner on the track in 44 years, in winning the 800 metres;
(b) Shaun Bownes, winner of the men's 110 metres hurdles;
(c) Hestrie Cloete, winner of the women's high jump; and
(d) Ockert Brits, winner of the men's pole vault; and
(3) congratulates our athletes and Athletics South Africa for bringing such joy and pride to South Africans.
Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.
DEATHS IN NORTHERN CAPE FIRE
(Draft Resolution) Mrs E N LUBIDLA: Chairperson, I move without notice:
That the Council -
(1) takes note of the great catastrophe that took place in Phuthanang, Northern Cape, where a mother and child were caught up in a fire in their shanty and burnt to death;
(2) expresses its condolences to the family and friends of the deceased; and
(3) urges Government, legislatures and civil society to unite in order to eliminate tragedies such as this.
Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.
PEACE ACCORD BETWEEN RWANDA AND THE DRC
(Draft Resolution) Mr M A SULLIMAN: Chairperson, I move without notice:
That the Council -
(1) notes -
(a) the achievements reached in the signing of the peace accord
between Rwanda and the DRC; and
(b) that these achievements are in line with the principles of the
newly established African Union;
(2) expresses its appreciation for the work done by African leaders; and
(3) resolves to support all initiatives directed towards the peaceful resolution of all Africa’s problems.
Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution. APPRECIATION OF EFFORTS TO DIVERT FUEL OIL POLLUTION FROM NIÑO
(Draft Resolution)
Dr E A CONROY: Madam Chair, I move without notice:
That the Council, together with its Select Committee on Land and Environmental Affairs -
(1) commends the relevant authorities and entities and expresses its appreciation more specifically to the masters and crews of the tugs Wolraad Woltemade and Pacific Brigand for their dedicated and successful efforts over the past few days to divert fuel oil pollution from the vessel Niño, which ran aground off the Wild Coast; and
(2) notes that if the Niño had been left unattended, it would have caused incalculably serious environmental damage.
Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.
VICTORY OF ERNIE ELS IN BRITISH OPEN GOLF TOURNAMENT
(Draft Resolution)
Mr J L THERON: Chairperson, I move without notice:
That the Council-
(1) wishes to congratulate Ernie Els on winning the most prestigious golf tournament in the world, the British Open;
(2) notes that Els is the third South African to win the British Open, as Bobby Locke and Gary Player have also won this tournament - Player has won the tournament three times;
(3) is of the opinion that sport is one of the biggest uniting factors of the rainbow nation; (4) notes that many South Africans nearly suffered heart attacks when Ernie lost three shots on the 16th hole to draw even with three other players - it was only after five play-off holes that Ernie won the tournament;
(5) notes that South Africans are very proud of our golfers who are doing us proud internationally; and
(6) trusts that Ernie Els and the other South African golf players will keep on winning the great golf tournaments of the world.
Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.
CONDOLENCES TO DLULANE FAMILY
(Draft Resolution)
Nksz P C P MAJODINA: Mhlalingaphambili, ndenza isi phakamiso ngaphandle kwesilumkiso:
Le Ndlu ihloniphekileyo, yeBhunga leSizwe laMaphondo, ivakalisa uvelwano nosizi olunzulu kuBeauty Dlulane, olilungu leeKomiti eziliqela kule Ndlu yeBhunga leSizwe laMaphondo, ngokuswelekelwa kwakhe ngumninawa wakhe, ogama linguZilungelo Kaizer Dlulane.
Umfi lo uhlwayelwe ngemvula yeembumbulu, waza waswelekela kwindawo yexhwayelo apha eMtata, eCircus Triangle. (Translation of isiXhosa draft resolution follows.)
[Ms P C P MAJODINA: Chairperson, I would like to move a motion without notice:
That this respectable House, the National Council of Provinces, extends its condolences to Ms Beauty Dlulane who is a member of some Select Committees in the NCOP for the loss of her younger brother, Zilungelo Kaizer Dlulane she suffered. The deceased was shot dead and died on the scene at Circus Triangle, Umtata.]
Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.
NATURAL DISASTERS IN EASTERN CAPE
(Subject for Discussion)
The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Order! Hon members, I have been informed that there will be a short debate on the natural disaster that affected the Eastern Cape recently. I call on the Chief Whip to address the House.
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE COUNCIL: Chairperson, the Council arrived in the Eastern Cape in the aftermath of a devastating snowstorm and rainstorm, which were followed, shortly thereafter, by devastating fires. The Council, as did the President and the Premier and Cabinet of this province, extends its sincere and heartfelt condolences to the families of the people who lost their lives in these disasters.
We are aware that the extent of the disasters was so grave that many schools - more than six schools - more than 1 000 homes and more than 50 businesses were destroyed. We also know that many people lost their businesses and, as a result thereof, their livelihood.
The extent of the damage to the infrastructure in these areas, particularly Cala, Indwe, Elliot and Ugie, was quite bad. A few days ago we also witnessed, to an extent, the devastation of the fires in Ntabankulu and part of Umzimkhulu.
It is interesting that approximately two and a half years ago the National Council of Provinces hosted a conference, a national and international conference, which dealt specifically with natural disasters and disaster management. It was also the launching pad for the legislation which is currently in the National Council of Provinces. The conference, or workshop, resulted in particular attention being paid to prevention, to mitigation, to reaction and to rehabilitation and reconstruction in the event of disasters. The Council notes the very swift and prompt response by the national Government, through its Ministers who visited the sites shortly after the devastation, and the provincial government, whose representatives, I know, have previously visited sites. Yesterday and today the entire Cabinet, including the Premier, visited the far-flung areas. Local government, through the district municipality as well as councillors, was involved.
In other words, when this region was afflicted by this disaster, all three spheres of government got together, co-ordinated their efforts and ensured that they dealt, in a very significant and drastic way, with the difficulties that the people of the Eastern Cape were confronted with.
We also note that it is important that we recognise the efforts of the SA National Defence Force, which has done sterling work in the past and continues to do so; the SA Police Service; all other emergency units; the disaster management units; the municipalities; the district councils; other organs of state; and civil society, with various corporate bodies assisting.
In terms of donations, thousands of rands’ worth of food and sustenance was provided by companies and private individuals. There are many stories of untold sacrifices that were made by individuals in ensuring that they assisted the people who were afflicted by this disaster.
We would like to urge the legislature and the local government structures to pay careful attention to this legislation. From 9 to 13 September will be a provincial week, and part of the programme of that provincial week involves the Disaster Management Bill. We do believe that it would be very useful and helpful if public hearings were held in the provincial legislatures and possibly in district councils, where the thoughts of people could be taken into account to shape the legislation.
We also believe that as we extend our condolences to the people of the Eastern Cape, we should not forget those who were affected in KwaZulu- Natal, the Western Cape, the Free State and Mpumalanga, and we note with pride that these areas are going to be visited. Just yesterday the Minister for Provincial and Local Government, the Minister for Agriculture and Land Affairs and the MEC visited the areas that had been devastated by the fires. The response of the people of the Eastern Cape has been a very positive one of hope and contentment. We believe that they have the resilience, as they have shown in the past, to deal with this disaster, and we wish them well. [Laughter.]
Mr A E VAN NIEKERK: Chairperson, at the time when I moved from the city to
the rural areas of the Northern Cape some years ago, the temperature there
was about 43 degrees Celsius. A wise old man came up to me and asked, How
are you doing?'' and I immediately complained about the temperature in the
Northern Cape. The wise old man asked me if I could change it, and I said,
No, I cannot’’. And he said, ``You cannot change the weather, so don’t
complain about it’’.
We cannot change the fact that natural disasters will happen, but we can make a difference to the effects of the disasters. We can also change or prevent disasters caused by human error, such as carelessness or criminal actions, and this must be done. Let me give a few examples.
When people build houses in areas that are known for heavy rainfall, such as the Cape Flats in the Western Cape, it is important that those houses be built above the water or flood line.
Secondly, farmers must take preventative measures during the dry seasons so that if a fire breaks out, it is limited to a specific area.
Thirdly, the general public and workers must be informed about the dangers of open fires, of being reckless with cigarette butts - if we still have smokers amongst us. They must be informed especially about the hardships caused by runaway fires, as happened in the Free State, KZN and here in this province in Ntabankulu and Umzimkhulu.
On behalf of my party, I also want to thank Minister Mufamadi and his Deputy, as well as Minister Thoko Didiza, for visiting these areas yesterday to assess the damage and the hardship suffered by the people.
I also want to convey on behalf of my party condolences to the people who are suffering as a result of these fires. However, we as civil society must not just wait for the national Government or provincial legislatures either to assist after a disaster or to train or inform the public at large, since more should be done from these quarters.
My party feels very strongly that the authorities have a responsibility and must get involved and must assist. However, we as representatives of the people and members of civil society must also get involved by educating our children and communities, and talking to our families and friends, thereby minimising the effects of disasters.
We must take responsibility for managing disasters. United we can make a difference. [Applause.] Mr L G LEVER: Chairperson, there is very little to add to the sentiments expressed by Mr Surty, which we fully subscribe to. I wish to add, however, that the DP condemns the reports of callous looting that took place when ice and snow marooned many villages and towns in the Eastern Cape. We wish to contrast this with the selfless attitude of many South Africans who did more than was expected of them to provide food, clothing and relief for those afflicted by the natural disaster.
We also wish to extend our condolences to all victims of any natural or man- made disaster. My constituency in the North West, around Mafikeng, Zeerust and Lichtenburg, was badly afflicted by runaway veld fires, and many communities from all walks of life and all ethnic groups were badly affected by this. We as South Africans must learn to rally around and help all, regardless of who has been afflicted by any natural disaster. [Applause.]
Mr M J BHENGU: Sihlalo, njengoba bethi nginguMahlangu nje namhlanje, ngikholwa ukuthi nezinyanya zakwaBhengu zixakekile nazo ukuthi sengijike nini ngaba uMahlangu ngoba ngicabanga ukuthi abakwaBhengu nabakwaMahlangu akukho lapho behlangana khona.
Ngisukumela ukusho ukuthi thina beNkatha Freedom Party sidabuka kakhulu ukubona izimo lezi ezehlele isiFundazwe sase-Eastern Cape njengoba siwubonile umlilo, izimvula kanye neqhwa. Sibonile nendlela izilwane ezife ngayo njengezinkomo, izimbuzi kanye nezimvu, okuyinto-ke thina Abenguni ikakhulukazi nabanye nje base-Afrika esiziqhenyayo ngayo ngoba nxa uyindoda ungenankomo futhi ungenambuzi kuyaye kube sengathi awusiyo indoda ephelele.
Sidabuka kakhulu, ikakhulukazi ngalaba bakithi abamnyama abangabalimi, ngento esiyibonile. Siyakholwa-ke nokho ukuthi bakwethu uHulumeni omkhulu kukhona azokwenza njengoba sibonile izolo kumabonakude ukuthi oNgqongqoshe sebefikile lapha eMtata ukuzobona le nhlekelele futhi kukhona abazokwenza. Sithi-ke akwehlanga lungehli. Sengathi uNkulunkulu angaba nabo abantu balapha e-Eastern Cape, kulunge konke lokhu okonakele. [Ihlombe.] (Translation of Zulu speech follows.) [Mr M J BHENGU: Chairperson, as they call me Mahlangu today, I believe my ancestors are being confused by the fact that I have changed to Mahlangu. I think there is no relationship between the Bhengu and the Mahlangu clans.
I have risen to say that we, as the Inkatha Freedom Party, are very sorry about the natural disasters that took place in the Eastern Cape province, as we have seen fire, rain and snow. We have seen how the livestock such as cattle, goats and sheep died. The Nguni and other African people derive a sense of pride from their livestock, and if a man does not have cattle or goats, it seems as if his manhood is incomplete.
We are very sorry, especially as far as the black farmers are concerned, about what we witnessed. We believe that the national Government is going to assist in whatever way it can, as we have seen on television that the Ministers have arrived in Umtata to see this disaster for themselves. May God be with the people of the Eastern Cape province, and may they be able to fix everything that has been damaged. [Applause.]]
Mr R M NYAKANE: Madam Chair, I rise on behalf of the UDM to join other political parties in their condolences for people affected by disasters. There is no need for me to repeat the incidents of disasters already cited by the Chief Whip. It is against this background that the need for the establishment of disaster management committees at regional and district levels cannot be overemphasised.
The recent cold-related disaster has further signalled the need to equip municipalities with adequate skills and equipment to manage effectively the consequences of whatever natural disaster may occur.
Briefly, the UDM wishes to express its condolences and would like to associate itself with those families, especially the survivors who are left traumatised by this particular winter disaster. We hope that the Almighty will support the spirits of these families and that, at the end of the day, people will forget this disaster and continue with life as normal. [Applause.]
Mr J O TLHAGALE: Madam Chairperson, hon members of the House and our hon countrymen of the Eastern Cape, on behalf of the UCDP I hereby wish to express our greatest sympathy with our Eastern Cape countrymen who have recently been affected by natural disasters. We are aware that some people have lost their loved ones, and others have lost their possessions which are their means of livelihood. However, we hope that after the necessary investigations and assessments of the extent of the damage and loss, the Government will do something to meet those who suffered losses halfway. Above all, we can only commend those who have been afflicted to the mercy of the Almighty Father above. [Applause.]
NATURAL DISASTER IN EASTERN CAPE
(Draft Resolution)
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE COUNCIL: Chairperson, the parties and the provincial Whips have got together and drafted a resolution after this short debate. With your permission, may I read the resolution for adoption by this House? I am sorry it was not clearly indicated. It is indicated in the speakers’ list, but not clearly enough.
Thank you for indulgence, Chairperson. Before I proceed to read the motion, may I also mention that yesterday the President declared the areas of Cala, Indwe, Elliot, Ugie and Barkely West disaster areas. We thought that we would let the people know.
I move without notice a resolution that has been agreed to by all political parties and all provinces, as follows:
That the Council -
(1) takes into account the fact that natural disasters affect the health and well-being of human beings, in particular those who are vulnerable due to socio-economic factors such as poverty;
(2) notes -
(a) with concern the very large number of lives that have been
lost, the great extent of material damage to agricultural
livestock and crops and the adverse impact on the environment
left in the wake of the recent snows, storms and devastating
fires;
(b) the inherent danger of floods as a result of the melting
snow, the impact of this on social infrastructure such as
transport, housing and education and the fact that it could
potentially affect everybody from commercial to emerging
farmers and workers; and
(c) the devastation to life, property and stock caused by the
recent veld fires;
(3) commends local provincial and national governments for their swift response and intervention in dealing with natural disasters and for the work they accomplished in helping to mitigate the consequences of the disaster for the people living in these areas;
(4) expresses its deep appreciation for the efforts of non-governmental organisations, individuals, companies and others that have generously provided financial, technical and other support, as well as substantial contributions in raising awareness of the plight of victims;
(5) believes that -
(a) in order to achieve sustainable human development, it is
critical to adopt policies and strategies aimed at reducing
vulnerability as an integral part of developmental planning;
and
(b) the challenge of reducing the impact of all kinds of
disaster is permanent and requires a consistent institutional
framework at the local, provincial and national levels;
(6) recalls that -
(a) pertinent issues were raised and discussed at the
international workshop on disaster management hosted by the
National Council of Provinces; and
(b) the National Council of Provinces dedicated part of its
provincial visit to briefings and discussions on the new
Disaster Management Bill;
(7) acknowledges that national institutions responsible for prevention and mitigation, as well as those in charge of preparedness and emergency management, need further strengthening and must also be guaranteed functional continuity through adequate human resource development;
(8) urges Government to ensure that the rehabilitative aspect of disaster management, which includes compensation, is timeously executed;
(9) recognises that -
(a) the Disaster Management Bill, which will bring about
qualitative improvements in the country by increasing
awareness of the importance of reducing vulnerability and
mitigating the effects of natural disasters, is currently
before the NCOP; and
(b) it is critical for civil society to be involved
effectively in this process of shaping the legislation and
participating in the envisaged mechanisms reflected in the
Bill; and (10) therefore supports the calls for the development of a national
culture of prevention and mitigation, education, training and
dissemination of information at all levels and the effective
participation of civil society in such programmes.
Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.
REINSTATEMENT OF ENROLMENT OF CERTAIN DECEASED LEGAL PRACTITIONERS BILL
(Consideration of Bill and of Report of Select Committee on Security and Constitutional Affairs thereon)
The DEPUTY MINISTER FOR JUSTICE AND CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT: Madam Chair, before I commence with the formal part of my address, may I take this opportunity to congratulate the presiding officers, the Chief Whip, the hon members and the officials of the NCOP on this important initiative. As hon members might recall, I was deployed in the Senate in 1994, and from the first day we struggled with our role and how to make it real to the people who had given us this important work to do. Hon members have crystallised this in a meaningful and substantive way. I believe this is an initiative that should be applauded and encouraged.
I know how difficult it must have been to get the NCOP’s infrastructure and members down here, and I suspect that there are going to be provinces that will be even more difficult to visit. The endurance and enthusiasm of hon members are to be applauded, and to all of them I say a great big ``Wow!’’ [Applause.]
Madam Chair, colleagues, ladies and gentlemen, while this is a short Bill, I believe that we must not lose sight of the profound implications of passing this historic legislation. The Bill came about as a result of the need to honour the memory of those legal practitioners who made a contribution to the opposition of apartheid, or who assisted persons who were opposed, and were struck off the roll because of such opposition or assistance.
The Bill, in a symbolic manner, attempts to redress the injustices of the past suffered by these and other anti-apartheid lawyers who have since passed away. The integrity and bravery demonstrated by these icons should serve as an inspiration to all existing and aspiring legal practitioners. This Bill acknowledges their efforts and honours their legacy.
The Bill provides that the name of any deceased person who was removed from either the roll of advocates or the roll of attorneys prior to April 1994 may, by way of application to the High Court, be reinstated on the roll in question. The Bill will set the record straight by restoring the professional status of those legal practitioners who were removed from the roll during the apartheid era.
It is about time that we gave recognition to those people who played this particularly significant role in our history. The names of these activists and what they represent should inspire all of us to try harder in our efforts to improve the lives of all in South Africa, particularly the poor, the marginalised, the disabled and the weak.
In 1997, former President Mandela said:
The names of only very few people are remembered beyond their lives. And some of those are remembered with revulsion for the harm they have done. But there are those who are remembered for their good deeds and the contribution they have made to the society in which they live.
The question must be asked, ``Who precisely is this Bill aimed at?’’ My department is aware of the following activists, who have since passed away, who were struck off the roll: Bram Fischer, who was struck off the roll of advocates, while Lewis Baker and Shun Chetty were struck off the roll of attorneys. As a matter of interest, hon members will remember that an attempt was made to strike the names of Joe Slovo and Duma Nokwe off the roll, but they had gone into exile.
An application was even brought against our former President Nelson Mandela in 1954 by the then Transvaal Law Society to strike his name off the roll of attorneys, but he successfully defended the application. Judge Ramsbottom, in his judgment, stated that nothing Mandela had done reflected upon his character or showed him to be unworthy to remain in the ranks of an honourable profession.
The Reinstatement of Enrolment of Certain Deceased Legal Practitioners Bill will attempt to ensure that the reinstatement of those lawyers who took a stand against apartheid, from which we are now all reaping the benefits, in some measure redeems the honour of the legal profession whose reputation was immeasurably tarnished by these events.
I propose this Bill with an absolute sense of pleasure and the certainty that it will be unanimously supported. [Applause.]
Kgoshi M L MOKOENA: Chairperson, at one of the meetings I addressed in my constituency, I posed this question to people in attendance: Is there anything nicer than democracy? The answer was an unanimous no. Many people contributed to making sure that we achieved democracy. Some of these people were attorneys or advocates. They were more than ready and prepared to put their professions at stake, rather than compromise their beliefs.
Indeed, it happened. They were suspended, expelled, struck off the roll and denied the opportunity to make a living. They could no longer represent their clients in courts. They could not use their profession, at which they toiled like the proverbial miner, while their companions were still asleep.
I am referring to those individuals who inspired many people of all races who had identified themselves with our struggle. Amongst them were none other than these esteemed patriots: Bram Fischer, Shun Chetty, Oliver Tambo and Bantu Steve Biko. This Bill provides for the reinstatement of the enrolment of legal practitioners, since deceased, who were struck off the roll of advocates or attorneys as a result of their opposition to apartheid or who legally assisted persons who were so opposed.
Bram Fischer, after whom this Bill is sometimes named, was born in 1908 and was the son of a judge president of the Orange Free State and grandson of a prime minister of the Orange River Colony. He became a Rhodes scholar at Oxford. On qualifying as a barrister, he practised in Johannesburg where he was elected to the bar council and for some years was its chairperson. As queen’s counsel, he led the defence in a number of political trials, including the treason trial from 1956-1960 and the Rivonia trial from 1963- 1964.
In September 1964, he was arrested and charged under the Suppression of Communism Act. Having been briefly granted bail to argue a case before the Privy Council in London, he returned to South Africa to stand trial.
On 25 January 1965 he went underground to continue the struggle and did not attend his trial. Instead, he sent a letter to his counsel, Herold Hanson, which was read out in court. For the benefit of our country as a whole, for those who did not have an opportunity to read that letter or to follow what transpired that day, let me quote what he wrote:
By the time this reaches you I shall be a long way from Johannesburg and shall absent myself from the remainder of the trial. But I shall still be in the country to which I said I would return when I was granted bail.
I wish you to inform the court that my absence, though deliberate, is not intended in any way to be disrespectful. Nor is it prompted by any fear of the punishment which might be inflicted on me. Indeed I realise fully that my eventual punishment may be increased by my present conduct.
The letter continues:
My decision was made only because I believe that it is the duty of every true opponent of this government to remain in this country and oppose its monstrous policy of apartheid with every means in his power. That is what I shall do for as long as I can.
The letter goes on:
There are already over 2 500 political prisoners in our prisons. These men and women are not criminals but the staunchest opponents of apartheid.
If by my fight I can encourage even some people to think about, to understand and to abandon the policy they now so blindly follow, I shall not regret any punishment I may incur.
I can no longer serve justice in the way I have attempted to do during the past 30 years. I can do it only in the way I have now chosen.
For saying what he said in that letter, Bram Fischer was declared an enemy of the state. For saying what he said, he was struck off the roll. The contribution of Bram Fischer and other officers of the courts who were opposed in the same way will live on. Bram Fischer wanted a better South Africa for all South Africans. He compromised and sacrificed his profession so that you and I could enjoy the democracy which we are enjoying today.
Let us restore that dignity. Let us pass this Bill. Family members of these people who were struck off the roll because of their political beliefs cannot wait to celebrate this day.
The committee members demonstrated once more that when it comes to serious issues, they are able to rise above party politics and play the ball and not the man. When the going gets tough, the tough get going. I support the Bill. [Applause.]
Mr L G LEVER: Chairperson, a few people might say that there is little purpose in reinstating the name of a deceased person to the roll of practitioners. To those people I would say that this Bill provides for a gesture that is important in a number of respects.
Firstly, for the family and memory of the deceased practitioner, it allows the deceased’s name and professional status to be restored. Secondly, it is an acknowledgement of the role that the deceased may have played in securing a democratic future for all South Africans. It is important to acknowledge this role in order to advance the process of reconciliation, nation-building and healing the wounds of the past.
Thirdly, the professional body may, after consultation with the deceased’s family, apply to have the deceased’s name reinstated to the roll of practitioners. This would allow the professional body concerned to examine the role it played in having the deceased’s name struck off the roll and, in appropriate cases, seek to make amends by engaging the family of the deceased and initiating the process of having the deceased’s name reinstated. Despite the fact that there are names that I am burning to mention, I have refrained from naming potential candidates to be reinstated because I believe that for a gesture of this sort to have greater meaning and value, it should be spontaneous and unprompted. The deceased persons to whom the Bill may apply are not so far removed from living memory that any professional body would need prompting.
I would urge the professional bodies concerned to draw their records on the relevant cases and to reflect on the role that their professional body may have played in having the deceased’s name struck from the roll of practitioners. An application to reinstate the deceased legal practitioner to the roll of advocates or attorneys is not confined to the professional body concerned, but I hope that the organisations concerned will do the right thing where the circumstances and facts of a particular case warrant it.
Mr A E VAN NIEKERK: Agb Voorsitter, ek lewer vandag hierdie toespraak namens kollega Piet Matthee wat siek is. Hy is deur sy dokter aanbeveel om nie hier te wees nie. Dit is vir my ‘n voorreg om dit te doen. [Chairperson, I deliver this speech today on behalf of colleague Piet Matthee who is ill. His doctor advised him not to be here. It is a privilege for me to do it.]
This Bill came about, as we have heard, as a result of the need to recognise the important contributions made by deceased anti-apartheid lawyers who were struck off the roll for their anti-apartheid activities.
The Bill, in a symbolic manner, attempts to redress the injustices of the past suffered by these and other lawyers who have since passed away. [Interjections.] Maybe members should listen and then become really democratic.
In an article in The Star dated 30 November 2001, the national director of Lawyers for Human Rights is quoted as saying that the Bill sets the record straight and gives recognition where it is long overdue. He goes on to say that idealistic and brave indidivuals like these need to be remembered in order that we set new yardsticks, new standards for the young aspiring public interest lawyers. Mr Raju has listened, I presume.
The article goes on to quote political analyst Jakkie Potgieter, who says that a lot of pre-1994 history has been engineered to such an extent that few people know what people have done to unite us and to make relationships between different races normal. It is time to give recognition to these people who played an important role in our history.
The question may be asked: At precisely whom is this Bill aimed? The department has informed us, as has the Deputy Minister, that it is aware of Bram Fischer, who was struck off the roll of advocates, and of Lewis Baker and Shun Chetty, who were struck off the roll of attorneys.
As I know more about the late Adv Bram Fischer, QC, than the other lawyers mentioned earlier, I will say something more about him only. He had a distinguished law career in which he worked closely with Nelson Mandela and others in the pursuit of social justice. From 1956 to 1961 he participated in the defence of 156 individuals accused of treason. In 1964, at great personal risk, he led the defence of Nelson Mandela and his co-accused in the infamous Rivonia Trial. By 1965 Fischer was himself a fugitive from the law, evading the police for 10 months underground and in disguise. Eventually he was captured and sentenced to life imprisonment. He was released from jail in 1975, only because he was dying of cancer.
After Fischer had announced on 21 January 1965 that he had chosen to forfeit his bail and leave his home in order to continue the liberation struggle from underground, he sent an open message from somewhere in South Africa in which he stated, inter alia:
As we know from history - including the history of South Africa - if the struggle for freedom is smothered in one place or for the time being, it flares up again before long.
The message continued:
But, most important, is the extension of human rights to all citizens. Democracy will eventually be won, of that there can be no doubt. The question is whether it can be achieved peacefully or only by violence.
He went on to say:
A peaceful transition can be brought about if the Government agrees to negotiation with all sections of the people …
Although he then stated that the ``prospects of such negotiations seem desperately remote’’, he carried on:
If the combination of predictable and unpredictable forces leads to large- scale violence or war, the consequences would be so disastrous in loss of life, in suffering, in economic disruption, in a legacy of bitter hatred and in the threat to world peace, that I believe that white South Africans must at some stage be brought to realise that their own long- term interests lie not in maintaining race supremacy but in extending human rights to all.
And fortunately this did happen under the leadership of F W de Klerk.
He concluded with a wish and a dream about the future of our country, in the following words:
With all South Africa free, at long last our country will fulfil its great potential - economic, political, cultural and educational - internally and in African and world affairs.
Let us honour the memory of the late Adv Bram Fischer and the other deceased lawyers like him, not only by unanimously supporting this Bill, but also by doing our utmost to ensure that the wish and dream of Bram Fischer for our country - which for me is representative of the dreams and wishes of so many South Africans - truly becomes and remains a reality, so that, now that all South Africa is free, our country does indeed fulfil its great potential, internally and in African and world affairs. [Applause.]
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE COUNCIL: Chairperson, yesterday, when Ms Majodina and I were speaking to each other, she indicated to me that this district, the O R Tambo district, had delivered. It had delivered to this nation not only Nelson Mandela, but also O R Tambo. They constituted the first black firm of attorneys established in South Africa: two lawyers committed to the transformation of society, aspiring to social justice and committed to equality, non-racialism and non-sexism. Those were the aspirations and ideals cherished by these men.
As Mandela himself indicated, as the first firm of black lawyers, they were the firm of first choice and last resort. Unfortunately these two academics and lawyers were unable to ply their trade because of their beliefs and unwavering convictions and their commitment to social transformation, change, equality and non-racialism. However, the question that one must ask, the question that they have answered through their lives and dedication is: Is it worthwhile to cherish such ideals of democracy and non-racialism, notwithstanding the odds? The answer to that has to be in the affirmative, and it is a wonderful coincidence that we gather here today in the O R Tambo district, a district which provided the ANC with two presidents, one towards the end of the millennium and the other at the very end of the millennium. This province has now also provided us with a president in the new millennium: three successive presidents presented to us by this region and this province - a wonderful achievement.
It also indicates that as we speak to each other in this university institution, we should let this area, its geography and its political history be the incubators of social and political consciousness.
Yes, Nelson Mandela, Oliver Tambo, Govan Mbeki and Thabo Mbeki have succeeded in providing us with the rights that we aspired to - they and thousands and thousands of others who were committed to the liberation of this country. It is now the responsibility of the youth of our people to ensure that we promote and fulfil those rights. Those rights, which we have now achieved, must be promoted and fulfilled.
The responsibility therefore lies with our youth and academics to ensure that the judiciary that was so biased and partisan is now transformed, becomes representative and democratic, and embraces the ideals that our leaders fought so hard for. That is the message and, in fact, it is with great pride that I speak here today.
We have spoken about Bram Fischer and heard about him, and I am not going to repeat that. He was in the era of Nelson Mandela. Shun Chetty was there when the United Democratic Front and its leaders were being persecuted and prosecuted throughout the country. Those two lawyers and others like them committed themselves to the struggle.
I believe what we are doing here is not only giving solace and comfort to their families, but also reaffirming and restoring their dignity. It is an affirmation of their integrity and the noble ideals for which they lived and struggled. That is the message, the principle and the aspiration that we reflect here.
Nelson Mandela said:
During my lifetime I have dedicated myself to the struggle of the African people. I have fought against white domination, and I have fought against black domination. I have cherished the ideal of a democratic and free society in which all persons live together in harmony and with equal opportunities. It is an ideal which I hope to live for and to achieve. But, if needs be, it is an ideal for which I am prepared to die.
Before I conclude, I must say that there was a deafening silence by the organised legal profession during the time of the struggle. In the past, for many decades, the dean of the faculty of law of Unitra, for example, was not allowed to attend the University of Natal because of a quota system which prohibited the admission of more than five attorneys. These were the difficulties. Black attorneys had no access to corporate and civil work or to institutional support. They were deliberately excluded from the mainstream of the legal profession.
As for my personal experience as a lawyer, at my first meeting with the
president of the Law Society of South Africa in Rustenburg, I was told,
You are too young to practise as an attorney. We should amend the rules
to allow people who are older to practise.'' The second thing he said to me
was,You cannot practise in the city centre. You have to practise in the
group area that has been set aside for you.’’ That was my introduction to
the law. My introduction to a court of law was, ``Hierdie hof praat nie
Engels nie - this court does not speak English.’’
These were the kinds of manipulative tactics that were used by the people in the judiciary, people who represented the organised legal profession, to ensure that they excluded the blacks.
I refused to associate with people in those circles. After many, many years, when I had been embraced once they realised that they could not wish me away and felt that it was better to have me as a friend than a foe, they asked me why I did not join their circle. I said, ``How can I join a profession that refuses to acknowledge that this council refuses to allow the public, the blacks, to attend its public amenities, and I am black?’’
They decided to call a meeting to take a decision as to whether they had a right to write to the council protesting about it. This was in 1988. I am saying that during the period 1977 to 1994, no single white attorney in the region that I came from articled a black person. That happened only after 1994.
The silence was deafening. The ability to change did not come from the general body of white practitioners. I believe now is the opportunity to restore their dignity and to ensure that they make their contribution to transforming our society into a non-racial and non-sexist society where we can live in harmony and where it does not matter whether we are black or white. [Applause.]
The DEPUTY MINISTER FOR JUSTICE AND CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT: Madam Chair, thank you for this opportunity to reply. All has been said. I think we are all elated by the passage of this Bill. It can only make us feel better about the past, if that is possible, but it gives us an opportunity to look forward in unity and in recognition of the diversity which is so much a part of us.
I think that the other thing I should say, is that there was an input by - I think it was - the hon member Lever, who exhorted the associations and legal societies not to wait for applications, but to respond out of a sense of decency and integrity and a wish to change the appalling records that taint their past. I fully endorse this and I congratulate the hon member on putting that suggestion forward. I thank all hon members very much for participating in this debate. It is a joyous occasion; it is a celebration of our freedom and democracy and it honours those who made it all possible. [Applause.]
Debate concluded.
Bill agreed to in accordance with section 75 of the Constitution.
INSOLVENCY AMENDMENT BILL
(Consideration of Bill and of Report of Select Committee on Security and Constitutional Affairs thereon)
The DEPUTY MINISTER FOR JUSTICE AND CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT: Madam Chair, colleagues, ladies and gentlemen, the Bill that lies before this House is the product of a joint effort by the Department of Labour and my department. The House will forgive me for a rather technical input; they are technical amendments, but they are exceedingly important amendments. So I will exhort hon members not to sleep and to listen with both ears while we go through the items.
In 1999 the Minister of Labour initiated an intensive review of the labour laws, aimed at eliminating the abuse of workers, and of their impact on stimulating job creation. After extensive consultations with various stakeholders, those involved in the review process concluded that the policy fundamentals that shaped the laws were sound, but that adjustment and refinements were required to, firstly, improve our legal framework to stimulate the creation of jobs; secondly, address unintended consequences of some provisions of our laws; and thirdly, to ensure the effective alignment of our laws with the changing labour market environment.
In order to give effect to the requirements, the Department of Labour prepared draft amending Bills in respect of the Labour Relations Act and the Basic Conditions of Employment Act. My department’s role in this important initiative was to prepare a draft amendment to the Insolvency Act. It is in the interests of the economy and society as a whole that insolvency matters should be resolved fairly, efficiently and without delay.
The relevant draft amending Bills were published in the Gazette on 27 July 2000 in order to solicit comment from interested parties. Fifty-four responses were received, of which 10 dealt with the draft Insolvency Amendment Bill. The negotiations at Nedlac began in September 2000, but were subsequently suspended. A process of bilateral engagement was initiated between organised business and labour in the Millennium Labour Council, or MLC. Negotiations were resumed in Nedlac in June 2001 after the MLC had concluded discussions on key principles in respect of certain aspects of the amending Bills. At the end of July agreement was reached at Nedlac on the provisions of the draft Insolvency Amendment Bill.
Turning to the provisions of the Bill before the House today, it should be noted that the Bill contains two substantive clauses that deal with sections 38 and 98A of the Insolvency Act. These sections apply both to the insolvency of individual employers who trade in their personal names and to companies and close corporations that are wound up because of insolvency.
Section 38 of the Insolvency Act at present provides that the sequestration of the estate of an employer terminates all contracts of employment between the employer and the employees. In contrast, section 37 of the Insolvency Act provides that the leases entered into by the employer continue in force for three months from the date of sequestration unless they are terminated by the trustee.
The termination of a contract of employment in terms of section 38 does not constitute a dismissal for purposes of the labour law. It is classified as a termination of a contract by operation of the law. Employees are consequently deprived of a range of protections, such as the right not to be unfairly dismissed in terms of the Labour Relations Act, and the right to severance pay in terms of the Basic Conditions of Employment Act. Clearly the present legal position does not strike a fair balance between the interests of creditors of an insolvent debtor and those of the employees of an insolvent debtor. Consider this: Someone who has worked for the same firm for 15 years is told without any consultation that the company has been liquidated. It is a fait accompli. As a result of the insolvency, all contracts of employment are terminated.
Clearly there is something wrong with that situation. One of the main purposes of the Bill under consideration is to afford employees or their representatives an opportunity to consult with the liquidator of a company in liquidation, or the trustee, to save or rescue the whole or part of the business of an insolvent employer in order to save the jobs of employees.
Under the present law, claims for severance and retrenchment pay are limited to claims in terms of a contract or wage-regulating measure which existed at the time of the liquidation. In cases where liquidation occurs without prior notice, there will probably not be any claims for severance and retrenchment pay in existence at the time of the liquidation, except perhaps of course for some people in the know, like a managing director of the business. The Bill affords a preferent claim for severance or retrenchment pay if employment contracts are terminated as a result of the liquidation of a company because of insolvency. The severance pay is for at least one week’s remuneration for each completed year of continuous service, limited to a maximum of R15 000 per employee. It is clear, therefore, that the Bill before us aims to correct fundamentally what is essentially an unfair imbalance.
Clause 1 of the Bill therefore substitutes section 38 of the Insolvency Act. The new subsection (1) provides that the insolvency of an employer should only suspend obligations between employers and employees in terms of their contract of employment. Subsection (2) deals with the implications of such suspension, namely that employees would not be required to render their services in terms of their contracts and employers would not be obliged to remunerate them. Despite the fact that contracts of employees are suspended, employees will, in terms of the new subsection (3), be entitled to unemployment benefits in terms of the Unemployment Insurance Act, subject to the conditions of that Act, and will therefore be entitled to register for unemployment benefits as if they had been dismissed.
In terms of existing law, a trustee may engage the services of some of the employees of the insolvent employer to continue running the business. Subsection (4) empowers the final trustee to terminate the contracts of service of the employees. The trustee may, however, in term of subsection (5), not exercise this power unless the trustee has entered into consultations regarding measures that could be adopted to save the whole or part of the business with the employees, their trade unions or any other representatives of the employees. In terms of subsection (8), a creditor of the insolvent employer may also participate in these consultations with the consent of the trustee. Unless a trustee and an employee have agreed on continued employment, all contracts of service will, as a result of the operation of the proposed new section 38(9), terminate 45 days after the appointment of the final trustee or the equivalent time in the case of a close corporation.
It is generally accepted that employees whose services are terminated as a result of insolvency are currently not entitled to the statutory severance benefits provided for in section 41 of the Basic Conditions of Employment Act. The proposed new section 38(11) provides that for purposes of severance benefits these employees will be treated as employees who have been dismissed because of the employer’s operational requirements.
Clause 2 of the Bill effects a consequential amendment to section 98A of the Insolvency Act, which was enacted in 1998 to improve the position of employees of an insolvent debtor. The claims for severance benefits would be against the estate of the insolvent employer, which is regulated in terms of the new section 98A. Before I conclude my input, Madam Chair … I beg your pardon, Sir. Before I conclude my input, Chairperson, I would like to address one outstanding matter. Nedlac agreed to amendments of sections 4 and 9 of the Insolvency Act obliging a petitioner to give notice of a provisional sequestration of a debtor’s estate to trade unions and employees. These amendments were not included in Bill 14B of 2002 as approved by the National Assembly, and were also not considered by Cabinet. I believe that a request to include these amendments in the Bill has been submitted by the National Council of Provinces.
These amendments entail policy issues that require the deliberation of Cabinet before they come before Parliament. Indeed, Cabinet anticipates that it could well consider additional and broader amendments to the Act. We thus believe that it would be more appropriate to deal with these and other possible amendments in a separate Bill. The Minister will introduce this separate Bill as a matter of urgency after the policy implications have been thoroughly considered. As hon members know, there is also a process in the SA Law Commission currently under way that could impact on this, and we feel that we could come out with something far more holistic and with a policy integrity that reflects our new labour law environment. I would prevail upon the members to convey this message to the interested parties.
This is not an attempt to delay or waylay efforts by employees and unions. It is an attempt to retain the integrity of the legislation that we pass. We hate to amend legislation so soon after it is introduced. I think I heard a lawyer say the acid test of good legislation is how soon or how late it is amended and how frequently. The less we do this, the better. We would then like to introduce a separate Bill as soon as we can, and the Minister has placed a note of urgency on the matter with the department and has registered the same sense of urgency with the Department of Labour.
In conclusion, I would like to extend my sincere appreciation to the chairperson of the select committee, the hon Kgoshi Mokoena, and the members of that committee for the hard work they have put into the consideration of this Bill.
Thank you once again, Chairperson, for giving me the opportunity to present this Bill to the House, and in this very special location. [Applause.]
Mr L G LEVER: Chairperson, I find myself in a difficult position having to deal with a technical Bill after the hon the Deputy Minister has discussed it in so much detail and so comprehensively. However, I hope my colleagues and friends in this Council and the hon the Deputy Minister will forgive me if I merely make some very brief comments and, if there is duplication, will regard it simply as highlighting and summarising.
When a commercial undertaking goes insolvent, there is usually a web of conflicting and competing claims or rights to the proceeds of the assets of that insolvent organisation. Apart from a relatively small group of so- called secured creditors, usually nearly everybody involved loses something when an organisation goes insolvent. The amendments to the law of insolvency in this Bill went through a process of negotiation in Nedlac. In essence, the amendments proposed in this Bill seek to provide greater equity to employees of the insolvent business concerned. They also seek, in the interests of retaining jobs and not losing jobs, which are a precious commodity in our economy at the moment, to allow for efforts to save a business where a business or parts of a business may be saved.
I just wish to point out as well, regarding the amendments which the hon the Deputy Minister referred to, that to the best of my knowledge, these amendments were proposed by Nedlac after the committee had considered the Bill and must still be referred to Cabinet, in which event they will be referred back to us.
With those words, I wish to indicate that the DP supports this Bill. [Applause.]
Dr E A CONROY: Chairperson, Deputy Minister for Justice and Constitutional Development, colleagues and people of the Eastern Cape, please allow me to say in the first instance …
… egameni lombutho we-New NP sibulela ububele esamkelwe ngabo apha eMpuma Koloni. Sibulela ubuntu benu, sisithi nangamso. [Kwaqhwatywa.] [… on behalf of the New NP we are grateful for the kindness with which we have been received here in the Eastern Cape. Your kindness is greatly appreciated.] [Applause.]
In the second instance, allow me to express our appreciation to the office bearers and staff of the NCOP for making possible this historic occasion on which we can meet the people who have placed us in office. I am sure that this is only the first occasion of this nature and that the other provinces will follow in the not too distant future.
After a review of the labour law in 1999, it was concluded that although nothing was wrong with the policy fundamentals, some adjustments and refinements were necessary to render it, inter alia, more sensitive to employment creation.
As the Deputy Minister stated, this is a highly technical but necessary Bill. She has also very eloquently taken us through the various intricate clauses of the Bill, to the extent that if I went on, I would run the risk of repeating what she has already said and boring hon members with details they have already heard. I therefore conclude by stating that the Bill does not have any financial implications for the state, and that it is supported by the New NP. [Applause.]
Mntw B Z ZULU: Sihlalo, amalunga ahloniphekileyo, nani nonke beSilo, sekukuningi osekuchaziwe kuleli phuzu lalo mThethosisekelo kulo Mthethosivivinywa. Sekungaba kufishane kakhulu umuntu angahle aphawule ngakho njengoba umuntu engabe esephindaphinda lokhu osekushiwo yiSekela likaNgqongqoshe wezoBulungiswa.
Inhloso enkulu yalo Mthethosivivinywa bekungukuvikela abasebenzi kanye naye umqashi. Abasebenzi balahlekelwe kakhulu esikhathini esiphambili ngesizathu sokuthi uma bedilizwa laphaya ezimayini noma emafemini bebenganikezwa ngisho okuncane ukuba bona baye nakho emakhaya. Bekuthathwa ngokuthi inkampani leyo isiwile. Kodwa lo Mthethosivivinywa ukubeka kucace ukuthi njengamanje uma inkampani leyo iphelelwa izimali, kuyofanele ukuba nabasebenzi babe nayo ingxenyana ethile abanikezwa yona okufanele bahambe nayo beye emakhaya.
Ngalawa mazwi amafishane i-ANC uwesekela ngawo wonke amandla lo Mthethosivivinywa. [Ihlombe.] (Translation of Zulu speech follows.)
[Prince B Z ZULU: Chairperson, hon members, Your Majesties, a lot has already been explained about the relevance of the role of the Constitution in this Bill. I will be brief and avoid repeating what the Deputy Minister for Justice and Constitutional Development has already said.
The main objective of this Bill was to protect both the employee and the employer. The employees lost a lot previously at the mines, because when they were retrenched, they were not given retrenchment packages to take home. It was understood that the company has closed down. However, now this Bill puts it clearly that when a company is closing down, employees should also get a share to take home.
In short, the ANC supports this Bill wholeheartedly.]
The DEPUTY MINISTER FOR JUSTICE AND CONSTITUTIONAL DEVELOPMENT: Chairperson, thank you very much to all the members and to all the parties for supporting this important piece of legislation. Of course, at the heart of this Bill lies an attempt to give the workers of this country the dignity they deserve, the dignity accorded to them in our incredibly wonderful document, the Constitution. Maybe it is through this kind of legislation that we turn that Constitution into a living, breathing document that affords people protection where required.
After a very technical discussion of this Bill, let me say that it is, in fact, possibly a celebration of the coming to life of our Constitution for the workers and employees of our South African world. [Applause.]
Debate concluded.
Bill agreed to in accordance with section 75 of the Constitution.
CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF RULES COMMITTEE OF NCOP
The CHIEF WHIP OF THE COUNCIL: Chairperson, I am standing in for Mr Moosa who had to leave because he is going to receive an achiever’s award. He had to be there in time and so, unfortunately, he is not here.
The statement that I would like to make relates specifically to the amendment of the Rules of the National Council of Provinces. I am indeed grateful to see that the Speaker of the legislature is present. One of the amendments that we dealt with concerned the issuing of mandates where mandates could either be conveyed in writing or electronically, as is the practice right now. I thought it important that we raise the issue of mandates quite critically because we have been in existence, as the National Council of Provinces, for five years. We have developed a best practice in terms of how to deal with mandates. Therefore we urge the Council to look very seriously at the legislation which will deal with the issuing of mandates.
As members are, no doubt, aware - the provincial Whips in particular will recognise this fact - the issuing of mandates differs from province to province. KwaZulu-Natal has its own method in terms of its own rules, and the Eastern Cape’s differs from that of KwaZulu-Natal and Gauteng. We believe that over the period, a particular practice has crystallised which points provinces to a particular mandating approach that seems to capture all the essential elements.
We believe that this can only be achieved if the National Council of Provinces gets together with its counterparts in the provincial legislatures. That is the statement that I would like to make in regard to mandates.
I would also like to say that the importance of what I am raising has relevance in the case that has been instituted by the UDM regarding the crossing-over legislation, in which the procedure has been challenged, notwithstanding the fact that we had complied, in my opinion, substantively and materially with all the requirements in law. I thought that that was an important aspect to raise.
One final area to which we should, perhaps, pay attention is the importance of the participation of provincial legislatures in the two joint committees, those dealing with programming and Rules. Regarding Rules, I am referring to both the NCOP Rules Committee and the Joint Rules Committee. We do believe that the National Council of Provinces represents provincial interests, and therefore a more active participation by provinces would really enhance the value of the institution. [Applause.]
Debate concluded.
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Order! I shall now put the question. The question is that the report be adopted. As the decision is dealt with in terms of section 65 of the Constitution, I have to ascertain whether delegation heads are within the House.
I have just checked and I am satisfied that delegation heads are present. In accordance with Rule 71, I shall first allow the provinces the opportunity to make their declarations of vote if they so wish. Is there any province that would like to make a declaration of vote? I take it that there is none.
We shall now proceed to the voting on the question. I shall do this in alphabetical order per province. Delegation heads must please indicate to the Chair whether they vote in favour or against or abstain from voting. Eastern Cape?
Mnu M M MATOMELA (Eastern Cape): IMpuma Koloni iyayixhasa. (Eastern Cape supports it.)
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Free State?
Mr T S SETONA: We vote in favour.
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Gauteng?
Mof J L KGOALI: Gauteng e a tlatsa. (Gauteng supports.)
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): KwaZulu-Natal?
Mnu M J BHENGU: Siyawuxhasa. (We support it.)
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Mpumalanga? Mnu B J MKHALIPHI: IMpumalanga iyawusekela. (Mpumalanga supports it.)
The DEPUTY CHAIPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Northern Cape?
Rre D M KGWARE: Northern Cape e o amogetse. (Northern Cape accepts.)
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Northern Province?
Mna M I MAKOELA: Northern Province e a o thekga. (Northern Province supports.)
The DEPUTY CHAIPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): North West?
Moruti P MOATSHE: North West e a o ananela. (North West supports without reservations.)
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Western Cape?
Mnr F ADAMS: Ons ondersteun. (We support.)
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): All provinces have voted in favour. I therefore declare the question agreed to. The report is accordingly adopted.
SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT: AN INSTRUMENT FOR WOMEN'S EMPOWERMENT
(Subject for Discussion)
Ms L JACOBUS: Chairperson - I see that the hon mayor has left, as has the whole Salga delegation - members and special delegates, it is no coincidence that we are having a debate of this significance in this province at the beginning of the month of August, the month in which we celebrate the achievements of women since our liberation in 1994. Maybe it is also appropriate that one pays tribute to many of those women who passed on before seeing liberation. These are Lilian Ngoyi, Bessie Head, Ruth First, Ida Mntwana and many others - too many to mention. Since then, we have much to pride ourselves on: firstly, the recognition of all women’s rights as human rights, and I refer members to section 9 in our Bill of Rights in the Constitution; secondly, the criminalisation of violence against women - violence against women is now an illegal act punishable by law, and I refer members to the Domestic Violence Act; and thirdly, the right of women to make a choice on their reproductivity and method of contraception, and I refer members to the Choice on Termination of Pregnancy Act.
At the opening of the special session of the General Assembly known as Beijing +5, which was just held in 2000, the secretary-general noted that despite all reported successes and achievements, much still needed to be done around challenges such as poverty and HIV/Aids. My input will therefore focus on these two areas.
The Constitution, in section 27(1), grants everyone the right to health care, food, water and social security. Poverty shows in various different ways: a lack of income and productive resources to ensure a decent living; hunger and malnutrition; ill-health; limited or no access to education and other basic services; homelessness or inadequate housing; unsafe environments; and social discrimination and exclusion.
Women’s poverty is increased by the rigidity of gender roles in our society. This leads to women’s limited access to education and training and productive resources. Women’s poverty is also directly related to the absence of economic opportunities. The bulk of the unemployed, more than 50%, are women. Of course, poverty affects both men and women, but because of gender divisions of labour and women’s responsibility for the household welfare, women bear a greater burden. Women have to manage household needs under conditions of increased scarcity.
At least 35% to 40% of households are headed by women, and these are, more often than not, much poorer than the average household with a much lower per capita income compared to other households. It has also been found that the large number of these impoverished women live in rural areas of our country, and have little or no access to electricity or clean drinking water, education and other social services.
The South African Government committed itself at the Beijing conference in 1999 to develop policies to promote the equitable distribution of food within the household; to formulate and implement policies in support of female-headed households; to develop and implement poverty alleviation programmes and projects; to enable women to obtain affordable housing and access to land by removing obstacles to access; and, with the full participation of women, to promote policies and programmes for women to work towards the eradication of poverty.
Now, one would ask, what of the Eastern Cape? The Department of Social Development has, to date, distributed an amount of R42,6 million to 709 poverty alleviation projects throughout the Eastern Cape. More than 90% of these projects, we are told, have women as the target group. They include, amongst others, food production, income generation and targeting families and households affected by HIV/Aids, which brings me to the next item - women and HIV/Aids.
It is no news that women bear the brunt of the HIV/Aids pandemic. They have to care for their children and partners who are dying, they are the ones who get infected by their unfaithful partners, and they are the ones who get raped and sexually abused because of their vulnerability.
One of the priority areas in the Beijing +5 Platform for Action is the response to the impact of HIV and Aids on women and girls. The South African Government in general, and the Eastern Cape government in particular, have shown their commitment to this priority by having allocated an amount of R4,6 million from the Department of Health and R3 million from the Department of Social Development to home- or community- based care programmes to date. In addition to this, thousands of food parcels are being distributed to affected families and households on a monthly basis. Additional resources will also be allocated to the roll-out of programmes for the prevention of mother-to-child transmission which have already been in operation for some time.
In conclusion, it is clear from the submissions we heard yesterday and the days before that the social and economic upliftment of our people, women in particular, demands an intersectoral or interdepartmental response. Poverty is not just about the lack of financial resources; it is also about the lack of housing, water and sanitation, education, land and so on. We heard the submissions yesterday. So, if we want to respond to poverty and all its manifestations adequately, we need a collective response from these sectors within Government and civil society, as well as the private sector.
Governments are elected to lead, but not in isolation from their people. Governing is everybody’s responsibility. It is only when Government works together with our people that we will succeed in building a better life for everybody. [Applause.]
Nksz P C P MAJODINA: Mhlalingaphambili, kukho into emnandi ethe yakhankanywa apha izolo nayizolo elinye ethi: ``Protocol observed.’’ Nam nditsho.
Eli sebe sithetha ngalo sasisakulibiza njengeSebe lezeNtlalontle. Namhlanje eli sebe silibiza njengeSebe loPhuhliso loLuntu. Asifuni ke ukuba libizwe njengeSebe lezeNtlalontle, kuba loo nto iya kubangela ukuba abantu bakowethu bangakwazi ukuziphuhlisa nokuzenzela nto, bahlale bejonge enkalweni belinde imana eya kuhla eZulwini.
Ewe, umahluko omkhulu wenzekile ngokubhekisele kuphuculo lwempilo yabantu bakowethu. Siyavuma ukuba isekho imiqobo kwaye uphulaphulo lwezimvo zoluntu oluqhubeke apha kwezi ntsuku zimbini zidlulileyo lusifundise ukuba uluntu lunazo izikhalazo, izincomo kwaneemfuno esiza kuziqaphela ze siziphonononge xa sibuyele eKapa.
Mandiphefumle ngokukhankanywe nguMama uLaura, ukuba abanabo oogqirha bezithili bokubaxilonga abantu bakowethu ukuvavanya imeko yabo yezempilo ukuze babe nokufumana izibonelelo. Siza kuba nalo igqugula eliza kubandakanya abongikazi, amagosa ezentlalontle nabameli boluntu ukuze umntu ofanele ukufumana isibonelelo ngaphandle kokubonana nogqirha kuqala, efuna ukuba kuvunyelwane ukuba uyimpula kalujaca, kufuneka ancedwe ngaphandle kokuba sibe sijikeleza ngathi zizinja zifuna ukulala.
Impilo engcono nempucuko azinakubakho ukuba ezi zinto zilandelayo azinakuqwalaselwa nzulu. Okokuqala, ukusetshulwa neengcambu kobuhlwempu nendlala kubantu bakowethu; okwesibini, ukuliwa kwazo zonke izifo esizibona ziqhambuka imihla nezolo; okwesithathu, ingqwalasela engagungqiyo kuphuhliso loomama; okwesine, ingqwalasela ngakumbi kulutsha nakubantu abakhubazekileyo; okwesihlanu, ukuvuselelwa kweedolophu zakowethu.
Iphondo leMpuma Koloni liziqwalasele zonke ezi zinto ndizikhankanyileyo ngasentla apha. Ngokubhekisele kumasipala, siyazi ukuba iZizi elikhulu, okaMbeki umntwana, uthe wazichonga iindawo emaziphuhliswe ngokukhawuleza.
Kukho amaphulo ambaxambini okuphuhlisa ngokupheleleyo abasakhulayo kwanabo sele bekhulile. Apha kwiSithili songasekhoyo uBawo uTambo, sinobungqina obubambekayo bolu hlobo lwamaphulo. Phaya eMbalisweni sineziko elisetyenziselwa imicimbi eyahlukeneyo elijongene neelali ezili-18 eziyingqongileyo, kubandakanywa iindawo ezithile zaseLibode nezakuQumbu. Kweli ziko kubhakwa izonka kuba oomama banaso isakhono, kwaye kuyathungwa. Ndinxibe ndamhle ndanje, ndithungelwe kulo.
Kukwakho nemveliso yezolimo yokondla abantu bakowethu; kunikwa inkxaso kubantu abaphila neNtsholongwane kaGawulayo; kuncedwa abantwana abathi baxhatshazwe ze kuphononongwe zonke izicelo zezibonelelo.
Sinombutho wamafama owaziwa njengeLima Farmers Association phaya eDarhabe, eMqanduli. Olu phuhliso ndithetha ngalo luphuhliso olwenzeka apho sihlala khona. Kukwafuywe iinkuku phaya, kuqhutywa izifundo zomthungo kukwakhutshwa nemveliso yezolimo.
Abona bantu baxhamlayo apha ngoomama abangaphangeliyo, lulutsha olungekho zikolweni neempula zikalujaca jikelele. Uqeqesho luqhutywa liSebe lezeMisebenzi kwanelezoPhuhliso loLuntu.
SineNkqubo yoPhuhliso iMankosi phaya eNgqeleni. Kanti kukwakho nenkqubo yolondolozo lweenyosi. Abantu bale ndawo abathi xa bebona inyosi babone umabonw’ abulawe kuba kufunwa incindi, kodwa bathi ezi nyosi mazihlale zikhona kuba zilulutho kubo. Sithi koomama ze bayibambe njalo, kuba siyazi ukuba ukuba ibanjwe ngabo, umntu othi uthinta umama uthinta imbokotho.
Umntu uthi xa eqhuba isithuthi edlula ngohola wendlela u-N2 athi: Kowu! Olwa sizana lomama luphaya kulaa ntsimi luyahlupheka. Nalu lubeleke umntwana emqolo. Asikokuhlupheka, koko yinkululeko exhanyulwa ngulaa mama, inkululeko eza ngolu hlobo. Amaxa amaninzi ootata bayahamba baye kuphangela, umama ashiyeke eyintloko yelo khaya, imanejala. Uthi eyintloko yelo khaya abe enguMphengululi-zincwadi engakuqeqeshelwanga oko. Uthi engumphengululi-zincwadi abe ngunondyebo, abale yonke le mali ithunyelwa ngutata ukuze enze zonke iimfanelo zekhaya.
Uthi akuba enze ezo zinto aqinisekise ukuba abantwana baya betyile esikolweni, kwanokuba bayabuya esikolweni kwaye bayaphumelela ukuphela konyaka. Kuthi ukuba utata ebeshiye kukho isitulo esinye sodaka abuye izitulo zizihlanu ekhaya. Ngumama ke lowo obonakala engacinezelekanga engqondweni. Xa ubani ebona umama ehlakula emasimini ebeleke umntwana, sukuba ebona umama ofuna ukuqinisekisa ukuba uzuza isivuno esihle engaxhomekekanga mntwini. [Kwaqhwatywa.] (Translation of isiXhosa speech follows.)
[Ms P C P MAJODINA: Chairperson, there is a beautiful phrase that was mentioned here yesterday and the day before yesterday, which goes: ``Protocol observed.’’ I reiterate it.
The department we are talking about used to be known as the Department of Welfare. Today we call it the Department of Social Development. We do not want it to be called the Department of Welfare, because that does not help our people to be able to develop themselves and to do things for themselves, but cause them to wait for manna to fall from heaven.
Yes, there has been a big improvement in the lives of our people. We agree that there are still impediments, and the public hearings that were held here over the past two days have taught us that communities do have complaints, proposals and needs, which we are going to consider and analyse when we are back in Cape Town.
Let me respond to what was mentioned by Mama Laura, that they do not have district surgeons to assess people’s health so that those who are deserving can get grants. We are going to have a core group which will include nurses, social service officials and community representatives so that whoever is supposed to get a grant, and wants to be declared needy without having to see a doctor first, can be helped in that regard without wasting any time.
There can be no better life if the following are not given serious consideration: Firstly, complete eradication of poverty and hunger amongst our people; secondly, combating of all the diseases that break out every day; thirdly, focused development of women; fourthly, particular focus on the youth and disabled people; and fifthly, urban renewal.
The Eastern Cape province has given consideration to all the aspects I have mentioned above. We know that as far as municipalities are concerned, President Mbeki, he of the Zizi clan, has identified the areas that need urgent development.
There are two-pronged projects aimed at complete development of the youth and the elderly. Here in the district of the late Tambo, we have concrete proof of such projects. At Mbalisweni we have a multipurpose centre which services the surrounding 18 villages, including certain areas of Libode and Qumbu. It provides baking and sewing services, because women have these skills. I am well-dressed today because I bought my dress from the centre.
There is also an agricultural scheme to feed our people. It provides support to people living with HIV/Aids, it provides counselling to abused children and it is where applications for grants are considered.
We have a farmers’ association known as the Lima Farmers’ Association at Darhabe, in Mqanduli. I am talking here about development at community level. Chickens are raised there, and sewing lessons and agricultural products are provided.
The beneficiaries of this development are the unemployed women, the youth who have left school and the poor in general. Training is provided by the Department of Social Development.
We have the Mankosi Development Project at Ngqeleni. There is also a bee- keeping project. People from this area do not kill bees for their honey, because they are a source of help for them. We say to the women, keep it up, because if one touches a woman, one touches a rock.
When one drives down the N2 and sees a woman, one might think: Shame! That poor woman in that field is poor. She has a baby strapped on her back. It is not a case of being poor, but it reflects the freedom enjoyed by that woman. In most cases men go to look for work far away, leaving women to head the home, as the manager. In addition to being the head of the home, she has to become an accountant without any training. On top of being all that, she has to become the treasurer, and take care of all the money that is sent by the man so that she can fulfil all the household needs.
On top of all that, she has to make sure that the children go to school with something in their stomachs, that they come back from school and that they pass at the end of the year. If the man left the household with one earthen stool, there will be five when he comes back. That is what a mentally unoppressed woman looks like. When one sees a woman hoeing in the fields, with a child strapped on her back, one sees a woman who wants to make sure that she gets a good harvest, without having to depend on someone else. [Applause.]]
Ms E C GOUWS: Chairperson, colleagues, friends, guests, the hand that rocks the cradle rules the world. This has been true since the early days of mankind, and it will remain true for generations to come.
Women have always been the power behind the throne, but now the challenges are to induce them to take a leading role in the world, a role which is fundamental to the development of a more effective and more humane society. This situation today goes beyond the traditional role of women, and we rightly ask the question: At what price? We are still the nurturers of the next generation. We still need the emotional instinct and the desire to procreate, and we still need the emotional satisfaction of loving, but we also need the intellectual satisfaction of getting to the top of our chosen field. So today it is, on the one hand, required of women to make a contribution to the development of the country. It is the right of women to take part actively in the affairs of the country as equal partners with men. But, on the other hand, the country still needs the women to be the mothers of the families.
What are the requirements for women to be equal partners? There are basically two requirements. Firstly, women must be allowed to be equal and be given the opportunity to play a role. Secondly, women must be equipped to seize the opportunities so that we are ready to compete on equal terms.
Our Constitution provides for equal opportunities. Never in the history of South Africa have the women of the country had the opportunities they have today, or the choices. [Applause.] It depends on the woman herself whether she will grasp an opportunity. Remember these 10 little words: If it is to be, it is up to me. Nothing is impossible. You are the only one who can stand in the way of your dreams. Where shall we start to equip ourselves? By developing our qualities. The qualities of a successful women are reliability, consistency, integrity, loyalty to one’s people, determination, being decisive and fair and well organised; and then planning one’s goals. Setting achievable goals is, in fact, an essential element in developing confidence and self-assurance. We have to identify the skills we need. Everything is possible, so believe it. Firstly, one has to have an idea of what one wants to do. Secondly, one has to have the confidence to stick one’s neck out and do it. Thirdly, one has to have the determination to succeed and to stick with it through the lean times. And, fourthly, one has to have the guts to throw it out and start all over again.
We are all born with tremendous genetic potential. We have so many potential skills that we have never had the time or opportunity to develop. We have so much brain power. Let me tell hon members that we each have three hundred thousand million brain cells that are waiting to be tapped. I know that out in the rural areas, with the few opportunities there, it could feel that it will always remain a dream to be a successful entrepreneur, politician, professional or whatever. Let me tell hon members that there are people out there who strive for the advancement of human rights and the status of women through the education and empowerment of women, socially, economically and politically. Soroptimists in South Africa
- we call it Sisa - is but one organisation waiting to help women who are less privileged. Its members unite in a vision for a better tomorrow. The Sisa theme for the year is, and I quote, ``imagining the impossible but creating the reality’’, and Sisa continuously strives to improve the quality of life of people less privileged than ourselves.
The reason for Sisa’s existence is to focus within its community on social development, economics, education, the environment, health and human rights. Sisa wants to utilise the individual skills, knowledge and expertise of every woman to the benefit of those in need. It wants to become more proactive in shaping the future of women and children in our country.
This society has a strong international voice and access to international funding. We need to make use of such an organisation as an instrument to empower our women. Let us use Sisa, as it has offices all over the country in all the provinces, and I can supply hon members with the names.
There is a well-known saying, and I quote: ``If ever the time should come when women band together for the good of humanity, it will be a power such as the world has never known.’’ Let it be time now for us, the women of South Africa, for our beloved country, to stand together. [Applause.]
Mnu H T SOGONI: Mhlalingaphambili, malungu eBhunga leSizwe lamaPhondo nabemi abahle baseMpuma Koloni, sithethile izolo nezolo elinye ngentlaninge yemithetho equka uMthetho weSondlo (Maintenance Act), uMthetho ngoBundlobongela baseMakhayeni (Domestic Violence Act) kunye noMthetho woLingano kwiNgqesho (Employment Equity Act). Yonke le mithetho ibonakala imihle, ikulungele ukubakhusela abasetyhini kuyo nayiphi na imeko yoxinzelelo nokungcungcutheka entlalweni abazifumana bekuyo.
Noxa kunjalo enye yeengcali zomthetho ekhe yenza udlwabevu lwentetho ayiyicezelanga inyaniso ethi `kusekude engqinibeni’. Ayikabinagalelo libanzi nelivakalayo le mithetho ekugcineni isidima nesithozela soomama nomthinjana ngokubanzi kweli lizwe.
Umxholo wengxoxo yanamhlanje wayame ncakasana ekuqwalaseleni ubugxwayiba bemeko yethu singoomama, ukudlwengulwa kwamalungelo ethu, nokungagcineki kwiwonga nomgangatho wokuphila osifaneleyo esiwabelwe nguMdali, waza waqinisekiswa nguMgaqo-siseko welizwe.
Isihloko sengxoxo yethu sikwaqwalasela inxaxheba yeli Sebe loPhuhliso loLuntu negalelo lalo ekumiliseleni amandla nesidima soomama, intlalo yabo ibe yefanelene neyoomama besizwe esizingcayo ngokulwela nokukhusela amalungelo abo bonke abemi ngokungenamkhethe nakucekisa. Wayihlahla ke ifolo uMphathiswa weli Sebe kwaNdlunkulu, ugqirha Skweyiya, kwintetho yakhe yohlahlo lwabiwo-mali luka-2002 xa wayesithi, ndimcaphule,
We still continue with our efforts to support the social and economic empowerment of women.
Ingxam yentetho kaGqirha Skweyiya iqamele kuphando olunzulu oludize ukuba, ukuze iphumelele nayiphi na imizamo yokuphuhlisa intlalo yoluntu ngokubanzi, kuya kulunga ukuba imizamo leyo iqwalasele kuqala imeko yezona mpula zikalujaca ekuhlaleni, ekubonakala ngokophando ingoomama, nakoomama, ingoomama bomz’ ontsundu, basezilalini nangoko. Ngokuthelekisa amanani eengcali zophando abasetyhini abangekho phantsi kwengqesho bangama-40%, naxa sele kuthelekiswa imivuzo, abasetyhini bamkela ngokungama- 76% ngaphantsi kwabangamadoda. Umnqa ke ngowokuba, abasetyhini baninzi kunabangamadoda ngama-52%.
Yinyaniso engephikiswa bani intetho ethi ubuhlwempu nokuxhatshazwa zisoloko zingumtya nethunga. Ayisothusi ke ngoko le meko igqubayo yokunyathelwa ngeenyawo kwamalungelo oomama, ngakumbi abangamahlwempu. Ayamkelekanga ke phofu, kungoko ke ibekwe ezithebeni ifuna izisombululo ezizizo nezigqibeleleyo.
Xa sisithi le meko icela umngeni kwiSebe loPhuhliso loLuntu, asikuko ukuba sithi eli Sebe linazo zonke iimpendulo ngokusilela kwabasetyhini. Uxanduva lokophula isizwe kwintsila yeminyaka yesiqhelo esibi alunakuze lube yimhemhe yesebe elinye kuphela. Ndiyingqine ke ngoko nembono kaGqirha Skweyiya xa ememelela uwonke-wonke kwiphulo lokuphuhlisa intlalo esithi, ndimcaphula kwakhona,
In achieving the objective of the ambitious programmes, we count on the support of many civil society partners.
Ngenene ke, nomphathiswa weli Sebe kweli phondo leMpuma Koloni uyibethelele naye into ethi yena nesebe lakhe phantse basemsileni kolo nxibelelwano lude lwentsebenziswano yamasebe ngamasebe ngokunjalo nezinye izintlu zolawulo ezinendima ebalulekileyo ekuphumeleliseni idabi lamalungelo oomama.
Esona sizathu sibalaseleyo esenza similisele iingqondo kweli Sebe loPhuhliso loLuntu, xa siphethe umba wamalungelo nokuxhotyiswa koomama, kungenxa yokuba lelona sebe lineziqamangelo eziqatha ngokoMgaqo-siseko, ngakumbi isahluko 2 isigaba 27(1) esinika wonke ubani ilungelo kwizibonelelo nenkxaso kaRhulumente. Zezi zibonelelo ke athi onke amahlwempu abhenele kuzo ukuze agxothe indlala ebomvu, ngakumbi kwicala loomama abaphantsi kwembophelelo yomthetho ongabhalwe ndawo othi ``isisu somntwana saziwa ngunina’’.
Ngokwezicwangciso zeli Sebe loPhuhliso loLuntu, ezi zibonelelo zenkxaso zinabile, zijoliswe ekubeni zambese, kangangoko zinakho, iimfuno zabo bonke abantu abangathathi ntweni abakumabakala ahlukeneyo entlalo. Kungummiselo nesiseko esingagungqiyo seli sebe ukufaka igxalaba ukwenzela ubomi obukhaphukhaphu nokuqinisa idolo kwabo basindwa ngumthwalo kukunqongaphala kweempiko zokuxhasa ubomi bemihla ngemihla.
Kungothakazelelo kananjalo ukuqwalasela igalelo elisele liqalisiwe liSebe loPhuhliso loLuntu ekuphuhliseni impilo yoomama ngokwentlalo nangoqoqosho. Uhlelo olujongene noomama olubizwa ngelokuba yiWomen Flexi-Programme, sithetha nje, luyagxanya lunabele kuwo onke amaphondo, ngokunjalo nohlelo olubizwa ngelokuba yiVictim Empowerment Programme. I-UDM inethemba lokuba oomama baya kuvuna lutho kule nkxaso.
Senza isilumkiso ke phofu ngelithi: izibonelelo zikaRhulumente, namaphulo okuvusa isizwe anjengala, zidla ngokuba lixhoba labo banyolukileyo, ithi imizamo emihle kaRhulumente kanti iya kugqibela ityebisa iipokotho zabo bangenankathalo ngosizi lomnye umntu. Kwalapha kubo oomama ikho imizekelo esisele siyibonile ekuhlaleni apho ukutyhuthulwa kwezibonelelo zoluntu olulambayo ingumbono wemihla ngemihla. Simelwe ke ngoko sonke ngazwi linye kukuyikhalimela kabukhali le ndlela yababi phakathi kwethu. Ngalo mazwi, nam ndenza igalelo kwisihloko sethu sanamhlanje. Ndithi: Maz’ enethole. [Kwaqhwatywa.] (Translation of Xhosa paragraphs follows.)
[Mr H T SOGONI: Chairperson, hon members of the National Council of Provinces and beautiful citizens of the Eastern Cape, yesterday and the day before we talked a lot about a number of Acts that include the Maintenance Act, the Domestic Violence Act and the Employment Equity Act. All these Acts look good and promising to protect women from any kind of situation that they may find themselves in.
However, one of the experts in law that spoke recently did mention that we are still far from the end. These Acts have still not made their mark in restoring the dignity of women and the youth in general in this country. The debate today aims at looking at the unfavourable situation that women find themselves in, the fact that their rights are infringed and that they are not living under conditions suitable for human beings, as the Lord would want. The topic of our discussion is also focused on the role of the Department of Social Development and its commitment to the empowerment of women and the restoration of their dignity, so that they can live comfortable lives that are suitable and appropriate for women who belong to a nation that is proud of protecting the rights of all its citizens without prejudice and hate.
The hon Minister of the National Department, Dr Skweyiya, in his budget speech for 2002, paved the way when he said:
We still continue with our efforts to support the social and economic empowerment of women.
The theme of Dr Skweyiya’s speech is based on the research that emphasised that in order for any efforts of people’s development to succeed, it would be proper to focus first on the poorest of the poor and, in particular, women, and more so, those who are in rural areas. Statistics show that there are 40% of unemployed women and, when looking at their earnings, one would find that women earn 76% less than men. What is surprising is that women make up 52% of our society. It is a fact that poverty and exploitation are inseparable. We are not surprised when we hear about cases of human rights violations, especially against the poor. It is totally unacceptable. That is the reason it is under discussion. It is because we are seeking proper solutions that could be implemented.
When we say that this situation poses a challenge to the Department of Social Development, we do not mean that this Department has all the answers with regard to discrimination against women. The responsibility to develop a nation can never be solely that of a single department. I, therefore, reiterate Dr Skweyiya’s vision of calling upon everybody when he says:
In achieving the objective of the ambitious programmes, we count on the support of many civil society partners.
The minister of this department in the Eastern Cape Province emphasized the fact that his department was nearly left behind in the integrated programme of departments, and that other administrative sections have a significant role in the fight against the violation of women’s rights.
The reason that caused us to focus mainly on the Department of Social Development when dealing with the issue of empowering women and honouring their rights, is that this department is bound by very strict rules according to the Constitution, especially Chapter 2, section 27(1), that gives everyone the right to Government provisions, service and support. It is these provisions that the poor are looking at in order to drive away the frontiers of poverty, especially on the side of women who struggle and suffer under an unofficial law that says, `It is the mother who knows the stomach of her child’.
According to the programmes of the Department of Social Development these provisions are broad and are meant to satisfy as much as possible the needs of all the have-nots according to their living conditions. It is an official stance of this department to assist people and strengthen those that are struggling due to the scarcity of resources to support their daily lives, so that their everyday lives could be made easier.
It is pleasing also to notice the contribution that has been initiated by this Department of Social Development in developing the life of women socially and economically. The section that deals with women’s needs, called the Women Flexi-Programme, as we speak, is taking long strides and spreading to all other provinces, as well as the one called the Victim Empowerment Programme. The UDM hopes that women will be really empowered by this kind of support.
We would, however, like to give a warning that Government programmes and campaigns like these that aim at developing a nation, often become victims of and are abused by greedy people and, as a result, efforts of the Government end up enriching those who do not care about the plight of another person. Among women there are examples that we have witnessed already in our communities, where it is an every day occurrence that provisions for the poor are abused and misused. Therefore, we are supposed to speak strongly against such activities among us.
With those words I would like to say that I contribute to today’s debate. I say: Thank you. [Applause.]]
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Order! I thought, hon member, you would thank me for giving you an extra two minutes. [Laughter.]
Mr F ADAMS: Chairperson, hon members, the war on poverty will not be won unless we direct more resources to the women of South Africa. When women are educated, empowered and healthy, their families, communities and the nation benefit. Despite the Government’s stated commitment to human rights, gross disparities still exist between the realities of women’s lives and the assurances. In theory, through legislative reforms, the situation of women has improved. Legislation has been enacted in respect of land, housing, employment equity, family law, equality etc. Unfortunately, these rights have not transformed the lives of many women in terms of substantial equality due to a lack of effective implementation thereof.
Factors impeding implementation include budgetary constraints and a lack of knowledge on the part of potential users of the law, such as police and justice workers; a failure to adequately communicate and educate people regarding Government policies, programmes and strategies, and particularly legal reforms; the weakness of implementation mechanisms; and no consistent response to issues surrounding women’s lives across all sectors.
At present the struggle for gender equality is not fully integrated. As part of an overall development perspective, gender equality will not be achieved without addressing inequalities across the prevailing socio- economic conditions. Poverty, employment, housing, welfare, education and training all need to be addressed in order to fully bring about substantive equality for women. Violence against women also continues to be a major stumbling block in the attainment of substantive equality.
We need to look at some issues of upliftment in respect of improving and empowering our women, such as an extensive public awareness campaign in all languages through the use of the electronic and printed media about the right of women to be free of violence. Such a campaign must address both women and men, and must target rural areas in an accessible way. It is also imperative that community organisations, especially religious organisations, are involved in the campaign on an ongoing basis and that influential people in the communities, including politicians, religious leaders, business leaders and youth organisations at national, provincial and local level, make public statements in support of the campaign.
There should be proper education on sex, sexual health, the crime of violence against women and an alternative conflict resolution mechanism other than violence as part of the school curriculum taught at an age- appropriate level from an early age. Such programmes must also focus on the development of self-reliance and self-esteem for both girls and boys. Attention also needs to be given to teacher training to ensure that teachers feel qualified to deliver such education. There should be training for parents, by way of national workshops and seminars on parenting skills, and for men, through employees’ organisations and unions. Changing men’s perceptions should receive high priority as a mainstream issue, and provision should be made for both primary prevention and secondary prevention, such as counselling programmes for abusers, in communities by representatives of the police and of welfare and legal services.
In spite of all the negative things that take place, changes are happening. There are more new spaces and opportunities for women now than ever before. The most significant change is that women have more visibility in society, albeit not always to their benefit. Women acknowledge that the Government has begun to build houses, put in electricity and provide water. These, they said, did relieve some of their burdens and they were appreciative. Some were able to point out new legislation and other Government programmes targeted to benefit women, and still mentioned how proud they were to participate in processes at the level of national, provincial and local government. Many more women’s groups in the form of NGOs and CBOs were visible, giving women the opportunity to develop their leadership skills and engage with the transformation process.
In conclusion, I want to state the following: The South African Government needs to be lauded for the efforts it has made to make things better as far as its policies and programmes are concerned. The recognition of the importance of a society based on the concept of the human rights of its entire people led to the inclusion of issues surrounding the lives of women in the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. The Government must be commended for its achievements and for developing the frameworks for the attainment of formal equality. I want to conclude by quoting:
Sure, God made man first, but you always do a rough draft before the final masterpiece.
Luister mooi, Antoinette! [Listen carefully, Antoinette!]
We should have respect and appreciation for these God-made masterpieces - namely, women. [Applause.]
Mnu M J BHENGU: Sihlalo neNdlu yakho ehloniphekileyo, ngimele lapha uNkk Vilakazi ohambile ngenxa yokuthi ibhanoyi lakhe belizosheshe lihambe. Ngikholwa ukuthi uzongivumela ukuba ngisine ngiqephuze nxa ngilapha kwelaphesheya kweNciba, ikakhulukazi ngoba thina bale phezulu, kwelikaMthaniya, sihlobene nendlunkulu yalapha. Ngakho-ke sisekhaya.
Isihloko okukhulunywa ngaso namuhla sithi: Intuthuko yomphakathi iyindlela noma iyisandla sokuphakamisa nokukhulisa amandla, isithunzi neqhaza elibanjwa ngabantu besimame. Siyazi sonke ukuthi umuntu wesifazane ungumgogodla wekhaya. Abantu besifazane bangumgogodla wesizwe. Alikho ikhaya elifudumala kahle, liqine futhi linothe ngaphandle komuntu wesifazane. Umnotho wekhaya, womphakathi jikelele nowesizwe, uqiniswa futhi uphakanyiswe yiqhaza elibanjwa ngabantu besifazane.
Intuthuko yomphakathi nesizwe iyalikhulisa iqhaza elibanjwa ngabantu besifazane. Ake sibheke nje uHulumeni esinaye namhlanje. Uqikelele kakhulu ukuphakamisa izinga labantu besifazane. Ubani owayecabanga ukuthi singaba namalungu ePhalamende abesifazane amaningi kangaka? Kudinga simshayele ihlombe uHulumeni waseNingizimu Afrika. [Ihlombe.] Sinamalungu ePhalamende abesifazane amaningi ngaphezu kwabo bonke ohulumeni abakhona lapha e- Afrika. Kukhona futhi oNgqongqoshe besifazane abaningi. Intuthuko ekhona ezweni lakithi, ukuze iqine futhi isimame kakhulu, iyamdinga umuntu wesifazane.
Uma sibheka iPhalamende lethu laseNingizimu Afrika, sibona abaholi abaqavile besifazane abaningi abaphethe izikhundla eziphezulu. Kusho ukuthi baphethe omama. USihlalo weNdlu yoMkhandlu kaZwelonke weziFundazwe ngumuntu wesifazane. (Translation of Zulu paragraphs follows.)
[Mr M J BHENGU: Chairperson and august House, I am standing in here for Mrs Vilakazi, who had to leave because her flight was due to depart much earlier than anticipated. I hope that you will allow me to use choice words and skilful language since I am here - across the Kei River. That is particularly so because we from the upper part of the country, Mthaniya’s land, are related to the royalty of this area. Therefore we are at home here.
The topic for discussion today is: Community development is the way or means for enhancing the power and dignity of and the role played by women. We all know that a woman is the backbone of a home. Women are the backbone of a nation. There is no home that can be abuzz with activity, prosper and succeed without a woman. The wealth of a home, the general community and nation is strengthened and reinforced through the role that is played by women.
The development of a community and nation exponentially increases the role of women. The Government that we have today is focused on ensuring the upliftment of women. Who could have foreseen that we would have such a huge number of women members of Parliament? We need to applaud the South African Government. [Applause.] We have more women members of Parliament than any other government in Africa. We also have many Ministers who are women. The development of our country needs women in order to grow stronger and succeed.
When we look at our South African Parliament, we find that there are many prominent leaders who are women and who occupy high positions. That means that women are leading. The Chairperson of the National Council of Provinces is a woman.]
Therefore, when we talk about social development and women empowerment, we mean exactly that - nothing more and nothing less.
Akujiyi kahle engekho umuntu wesifazane, kuyo yonke imikhakha yempilo kusukela emndenini kuze emphakathini esihlala kuwo. Ingani namhlanje sekukhona amakhosi ahola isizwe okungawesifazane. Angikaze ngizwe ukuthi ikhona inkosi yesifazane ehlulwe ukuhola isizwe. Ikakhulukazi ngapha KwaZulu sinawo amakhosi esifazane. Kodwa-ke kuchaza khona ukuthi le nto okuthiwa ukubandlulula ngokobulili asiyazi thina KwaZulu ngoba kade saqala ukwenza abantu balingane.
KwaZulu, umuntu wesifazane ungumuntu omkhulu kakhulu kithina. Nguye owayephatha izwe. Manje sekuqalwe phansi kuthiwa laba bacindizelwe. Angaliphatha kanjani izwe umuntu ecindezelwe? Ezinkonzweni sinabafundisikazi besifazane okuyinto ebingakaze ibe khona. Likhona yini iqhaza elidlula lelo? Angikaze ngizwe kuthiwa behlulekile ukuhola ibandla.
Intuthuko yomphakathi nesithunzi sabesifazane kunamandla okuphatha nokuhola kodwa angikwazi ukubala zonke izindawo lapho behola khona. Ukuze lithuthuke kahle futhi lidlondlobale leli zwekazi, kudingeka amandla neqhaza elibanjwa ngabantu besifazane. [Ihlombe.] (Translation of Zulu paragraphs follows.)
[In all spheres, nothing reaches its full potential without the presence of women - from families to the community in which we live. Indeed, today we have women chiefs who lead the nation. I have never heard of a female chief who failed in her duty of leading the nation. We have quite a number of female chiefs, particularly in KwaZulu. That explains that this gender discrimination is something unknown to those of us from KwaZulu, because we started to make people equal a long time ago.
To those of us from KwaZulu, a woman is someone who is held in very high esteem. She used to run the country. It is now claimed that these people are oppressed. How can an oppressed person run a country? In churches we have women priests and that is something that has never happened before. Is there any role which surpasses that? I have never heard that a woman failed to lead a congregation.
The development of the community and respect for women could empower women for leadership; however, I cannot name all the areas in which women are in leadership positions. In order for this continent to develop and grow appropriately, the power and role of women are crucial. [Applause.]]
Mr J O TLHAGALE: Chairperson, hon members of the NCOP, hon members of the provincial legislature, hon Deputy Speaker of the North West, Speaker of the Eastern Cape provincial legislature and our beloved countrymen of the Eastern Cape, I wish to reiterate what has already been expressed, especially yesterday: that today is a red-letter day in the history of our young democracy. The NCOP has taken the giant step of taking Parliament not only beyond the precincts of Cape Town, but, most importantly, to the people who matter and are in our hearts. Our congratulations in respect of this innovation go to the hon Chairperson of the NCOP and the entire leadership force.
I stand here to corroborate the statement that social development is an appropriate instrument for women’s empowerment. The Department of Social Development, or DSD, is, in my view, second to none in its commitment to social transformation as embodied in the principle of social justice and the Bill of Rights contained in the Constitution. According to its mission statement, it endeavours to create a better life for the poor, the vulnerable and the excluded people in society.
The department has launched pilot projects in which it targets unemployed women with children under five years old, rural women and women in informal settlements who were previously excluded from services and developmental programmes, as well as economic opportunities. This programme also provides training for the children of participating mothers.
The poverty relief programme of the DSD is targeting the poorest of the poor, female-headed households, those who are caring for HIV/Aids-infected individuals, income-generating activities for the rural women and elderly persons.
The Domestic Violence Act of 1998 requires the DSD to facilitate the establishment of shelters for victims of domestic violence. An assessment of the programme conducted in 2000 found that there were 21 shelters in South Africa, and that 18 more shelters were needed at that time to accommodate women who were in need of shelter as a result of domestic violence.
The DSD also observes National Women’s Day on 9 August, during which an opportunity is given to sensitise and empower women about their constitutional rights. Celebrations are also held to acknowledge the courage of women who fought against the pass laws for women and in honour of other heroines in different communities. [Applause.]
Ms S N NTLABATI: Chairperson …
Ms J L KGOALI: Chairperson, on a point of order: Is it in order for the hon member to address this august House whilst she is seated? [Laughter.]
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Order! I will, for today, allow the hon member to do so. [Laughter.]
Ms S N NTLABATI: Chairperson, is it in order for the hon member to make a joke of a person’s disability, namely their height? [Interjections.]
Chairperson and people of the Eastern Cape, in particular …
… ukuba ngaba bakhona abakuKomani naseHewu emaMfengwini amahle, apho ndiphuma khona. [… if there are any of those beautiful ones from Queenstown and Whittlesea, where I come from.]
Let me say something first, before I get to social development. When hon
members were talking about Bram Fischer, I felt, as a Free Stater, that
there was an example of his softness and humanity that had been left out,
namely his decision to take a black girl from his domestic workers and
bring her up as his own daughter. It brings to mind an incident when, it is
said, he was travelling through the Free State with his family and this
young black girl, and his mother said, But she is not going to sit at
table with us''. Bram Fischer made a decision then and said,Ma, I would
rather not have supper with you. I am pulling out because she is my
family’’. [Applause.]
Again, we are talking on a day in the month of August, which we say is the month when, as women, we reclaim and restore our dignity. I am pleading with our menfolk here to join the bandwagon of the restoration of this dignity.
When we opened with a prayer yesterday morning, we were told that it is a tradition in the Eastern Cape that people pray on all occasions. I now want to ask the Christians in the Eastern Cape the question: What went wrong? The first book of the Bible, which is used by these Christians, has a woman, Eve, who brought wisdom. What went wrong that women were not developed then, if these people say that they are Christians?
If one goes on to the next chapters, one reads about the woman who saved Moses. In the New Testament one reads about Mary, who is the mother of this thing they say they worship in the Eastern Cape. I am challenging them now, and saying that they are bound to social development for women.
Mrs Gouws said that there had never been a time when women had had such opportunities, but now my challenge to all of us here is: How much effort are we making to open the eyes of those who do not know that they have these opportunities, and in particular …
… bona ootata? Bayabavula amehlo na oomama? [… the men themselves? Do they inform the women?]
I then say: Now is the time for those who have not opened the eyes of the womenfolk to do so, particularly because we are now celebrating five years of the Constitution which brought all these things. I say: Join the million man march, so that we can see that you are committed to opening the eyes of women to those opportunities. Again, with regard to the people of the Eastern Cape, baba Bhengu has said that in KwaZulu-Natal they have long been worshipping women. Women have been leading. When I sit at my great-grandparents’ place eZibeleni, looking across I can see a mountain …
… kuthiwa kukwaNonesi. [… known as Nonesi.]
This means that here, in the Eastern Cape, there was a time when a woman ruled, a woman who was called Nonesi. So then …
… kwaphinda kwaphelela phi ke kubantu abahle baseKoloni, sele bade bayilibale into yokuba oomama bayakwazi ukusiphatha isizwe? Ngoba bayayazi into yokuba uNonesi wasiphatha isizwe sakwaXhosa. [So how come beautiful people from the Eastern Cape have forgotten that women can rule the nation? They know that Nonesi ruled the Xhosa nation very well.]
People have spoken about poverty as something that is disempowering, but I will not touch on it. Because I happen to be the last speaker, so much has been said already. The message I will be talking about with regard to social development is particularly from a gender perspective. I will be talking about gender within the context of development. I would like to remind this House and the NGOs …
… nabanye abantu abahleli phayaÿ …[… and other people sitting over there …]
… to remember that we do have the instruments which we developed. There is an instrument which we sometimes forget, the Women’s Charter for Effective Equality, a document which was developed by us, the women of South Africa, during the days of the coalition. As a country, we are signatories to the Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination Against Women, and now, in particular, the Beijing Platform of Action.
I want to put a challenge to the members of standing committees who are here, as well as the NGOs and the electorate out there. When one looks at empowerment and the Beijing Platform of Action, one can see that we requested departments to do certain things. For instance, we said that there should be gender focal points in every department. This is a challenge, whether one is in health or anywhere else or an NGO dealing with whatever matter. Whatever speciality we find ourselves in, we should all check whether there is a gender focal point in that department. If so, where is it situated? What is the level of the official? That is important, because if it is situated at a lower level and there is no access to the DG or whatever, we will be left behind.
The question of education has also been noted. My only comment there would be: Whilst we say yes, all aspects of education are aspects of social development. At a higher level I challenge the NGOs there not to forget to check where exactly women are at higher institutions. Are they still only in the humanities? That will also not take us too far, particularly not technologically.
Ms Jacobus mentioned quite a lot of things about health, but there is one aspect which is usually forgotten, in particular amongst us in the African culture, namely that the time has come when negotiation for sex should not be the duty of only one partner. It should be the duty of both partners who are going to take part in it. Gone are the days when it was only one person who could make the decision; when, if the other person made the decision, her morals would be looked at askance. [Applause.]
Justice has a lot of social aspects too. We also need to look into how costly legal services are. Can we not provide low-cost legal services? Here I am challenging the NGOs, in particular, to teach people just simple things, what we call legal literacy. I appeal to the NGOs here in the Eastern Cape. They are fortunate that they have an office of the Commission for Gender Equality in East London where they will be empowered about this whole dialogue.
The last aspect I am going to talk about, still within the context of the Beijing Platform of Action, is: How do we empower our women so that they are able to live during the times of war and peace? We need to teach our women mediation skills. [Applause.]
Debate concluded.
The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: (Mr M L Mushwana): Before I adjourn the House, allow me in a few words, without making a speech, on behalf of the NCOP, and in particular the presiding officers, to express our most sincere thanks and gratitude to the following people who, in many different ways, assisted us in our quest to try to bring Parliament closer to the people: the University of Transkei, in particular the acting vice-chancellor, the registrar and the SRC. We are grateful for their hospitality.
We also wish to express our thanks and gratitude to the Eastern Cape legislature, in particular the Speaker and the Deputy Speaker, who have been with us since our arrival here. We also appreciate the presence of MPLs from the Eastern Cape. We wish to thank the O R Tambo District Council and, in particular, the lord mayor and councillors, who also participated in the proceedings which we have had since our arrival.
I must also express our gratitude to members of the public who responded to our call and have been with us. It is regrettable that we could not provide all the answers that they wanted, but this is the beginning, and we hope that our interaction will bear more fruit in future.
My attention has been drawn to the fact that there are people who thought that today we were going to interact with them in terms of social services. We apologise for any misunderstanding which might have developed. This is not the end of our meetings. The provincial legislatures, MPLs and members of Parliament deployed in this region will carry on this task.
We thank our traditional leaders who also responded to our invitation. We appreciate their presence. Finally we thank our NCOP staff, the technical staff and Hansard for their work since we started preparing the NCOP for meeting the people. Of course, we also wish to thank the members of the NCOP who travelled all the way to the Eastern Cape.
On that note, the House is adjourned. [Applause.]
The Council adjourned at 12:50. ____
ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS
FRIDAY, 28 JUNE 2002
TABLINGS:
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
Papers:
- The President of the Republic:
Annual Report and Financial Statements of the Commission on Gender
Equality for 1999-2000 and 2000-2001, including the Report of the
Auditor-General on the Financial Statements for 1999-2000 and 2000-2001
[RP 54-2002].
- The Minister of Public Works:
Report and Financial Statements of the Department of Public Works for
2000-2001, including the Report of the Auditor-General on Financial
Statements of Vote 26 - Public Works for 2000-2001.
- The Minister of Safety and Security:
Report of the Independent Complaints Directorate in terms of section
18(5)(c) of the Domestic Violence Act, 1998 (Act No 116 of 1998).
TUESDAY, 2 JULY 2002
ANNOUNCEMENTS: National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
- The Speaker and the Chairperson:
(1) The Minister of Finance on 25 June 2002 submitted drafts of the
following Bills, as well as the memoranda explaining the objects
of the proposed legislation, to the Speaker and the Chairperson in
terms of Joint Rule 159:
(i) South African Revenue Services Amendment Bill, 2002
(ii) Securities Services Bill, 2002
(iii) Special Pensions Amendment Bill, 2002
(iv) Insurance Amendment Bill, 2002
(v) Finance Bill, 2002
The drafts have been referred to the Portfolio Committee on
Finance and the Select Committee on Finance by the Speaker and the
Chairperson, respectively, in accordance with Joint Rule 159(2).
(2) The Minister of Health on 25 June 2002 submitted a draft of the
Medical Schemes Amendment Bill, 2002, as well as the memorandum
explaining the objects of the proposed legislation, to the Speaker
and the Chairperson in terms of Joint Rule 159. The draft has been
referred to the Portfolio Committee on Health and the Select
Committee on Social Services by the Speaker and the Chairperson,
respectively, in accordance with Joint Rule 159(2).
(3) The Minister of Communications on 26 June 2002 submitted a draft
of the Broadcasting Amendment Bill, 2002, as well as the
memorandum explaining the objects of the proposed legislation, to
the Speaker and the Chairperson in terms of Joint Rule 159. The
draft has been referred to the Portfolio Committee on
Communications and the Select Committee on Labour and Public
Enterprises by the Speaker and the Chairperson, respectively, in
accordance with Joint Rule 159(2). National Council of Provinces:
- The Chairperson:
The following papers have been tabled and are now referred to the
relevant committees as mentioned below:
(1) The following paper is referred to the Select Committee on Land
and Environmental Affairs:
Annual Report and Financial Statements of the Bala Farms (Pty) Ltd
for the years ended 31 December 2000 and 31 December 2001,
including the Report of the Auditor-General on the Financial
Statements for the years ended 31 December 2000 and 31 December
2001 [RP 76-2002].
(2) The following papers are referred to the Select Committee on
Economic and Foreign Affairs:
Bilateral Agreement between the governments of the Republic of
South Africa and Germany, tabled in terms of section 231(3) of the
Constitution, 1996, concerning:
(a) Technical Cooperation Agreement for the project "Public
Sector Reform";
(b) Technical Cooperation Agreement for the project "Study and
Expert Fund";
(c) Technical Cooperation Agreement for the project "Urban
Upgrading and Development Programme";
(d) Technical Cooperation Agreement for the project
"Broadening Agricultural Services and Extension Delivery";
(e) Technical Cooperation Agreement for the project
"Reorientation of Protected Areas (TRANSFORM)".
(f) Explanatory Memorandum to the Agreements.
TABLINGS:
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
Papers:
- The Speaker and the Chairperson:
Report of the Office of the Auditor-General on the Budget of Income and
Expenditure for the year 2002-2003 [RP 63-2002].
- The Minister of Finance:
(a) Annual Report of the Registrar of Unit Trust Companies for the
year ended 31 December 2000.
(b) Annual Report of the Public Accountants and Auditors' Board for
the year ended 31 December 2001.
(c) List of Registered Accountants and Auditors as at 31 March 2002,
tabled in terms of section 9(5) of the Public Accountants and
Auditors Act, 1991 (Act No 80 of 1991).
- The Minister of Safety and Security:
Regulation No R 839 published in Government Gazette No 23525 dated 14
June 2002: Regulations made in terms of section 24(1) of the South
African Police Services Act, 1995 (Act No 68 of 1995).
COMMITTEE REPORTS:
National Council of Provinces:
- Chairperson:
The Chairperson of the National Council of Provinces presented the
First Report of the Rules Committee of the National Council of
Provinces, dated 26 June 2002, as follows:
The Rules Committee of the National Council of Provinces, having
considered proposals for the amendment of the Rules of the National
Council of Provinces, recommends the following amendments to the Rules:
Rule 1: Definitions
To amend the definition of the word "sitting day" by the insertion of
the words underlined:
"sitting day", with reference to the Council, means a day on which the
Council sits in plenary and it includes committee meetings;
Rule 5: Public participation
To amend Rule 5(3) by the insertion of the words underlined:
5. (3) The public has access to all official notices to members
and to all documents tabled in the Council, subject to reasonable
measures taken by the Chairperson of the Council to regulate such
access, in a manner consistent with national laws.
Rule 10: Acting Chairperson
To amend Rule 10 by the deletion of the words in bold brackets:
10. (1) ........
(a) ............
(b) ............
[(c) The Chairperson of Committees.]
[(d) The Deputy Chairperson of Committees.]
Rule 17: Absence of permanent members
To amend Rule 17 by the deletion of the words in bold brackets and
insertion of the words underlined:
17. (1) A person ceases to be a permanent member of the Council if
that person is voluntarily and without leave absent from the Council on
each 15 consecutive [sitting days] sittings of the Council or committee
of the Council.
(2) A permanent member seeking leave to be absent from the Council
for a period covering 15 or more consecutive [sitting days] sittings of
the Council or committee of the Council, must apply for such leave to
the Council.
Rule 103: General powers of committees
To amend Rule 103(2)(a) and (b) and (3) by the deletion of the words in
bold brackets and insertion of the words underlined:
103. (2) .............
(a) [only with the concurrence of the Chief Whip of the Council;
and] only with the permission of the Chief Whip of the Council
after consultation with provincial whips and whips designated by
parties; and
(b) [after the most senior whips of the parties have been
consulted.] with the approval by the Chairperson of the Council.
(3) [If a committee wants to sit at a venue beyond the seat of
Parliament, or on a day that is not a working day, it must, in
addition, obtain the permission of the Chairperson of the Council.]
Rule 154: Composition
To amend Rule 154(a) by the deletion of the words in bold brackets and
insertion of the words underlined.
154. ..............
(a) Each province is entitled to an equal number of permanent
members [appointed] nominated by its delegation head.
Rule 166: Chairperson's functions when section 76(1) Bills are received
from Assembly
To amend Rule 166(a) by the insertion of the words underlined:
166. ...............
(a) send a copy or electronic transmission of the Bill and the
annexures to the Speaker of each provincial legislature for
purposes of enabling the legislature to confer authority on its
delegation to vote on the Bill; and
Rule 230: Lapsing and resumption of proceedings on Bills
To amend Rule 230(1) in order to bring it in line with the provision of
the Constitution by the deletion of the words in bold brackets and the
addition of the words underlined:
230. (1) [An order of the day in respect of any Bill which is in
the possession of the Council when it rises on the last sitting day in
any annual session, lapses, but may be reinstated on the Order Paper
during the next ensuing session by resolution of the Council.]
230. (1) All Bills introduced in the Council and which have not yet
been passed by the Council in terms of Rule 197, when it rises on the
last sitting day in any annual session, lapses, but may be reinstated
on the Order Paper during the next ensuing session by resolution of the
Council.
Rule 240A: Executive statements
To add Rule 240A by the insertion of the underlined words:
Executive statements
240A. (1) A member of the executive may make a factual or policy
statement relating to government policy, any executive action or other
similar matter of which the Council should be informed.
(2) The time allocated for executive member making an executive
statement in terms of subrule (1) may not exceed 20 minutes, except
with the consent of the Council.
(3) Whenever possible, a copy of an executive statement must be
delivered to the members of the Council at or before the time that the
statement is made in the Council.
(4) After any executive statement has been made, the executive
member concerned may, if applicable, table background information.
(5) Following any executive statement, a member from each provincial
delegation or, where applicable, a member of each of the parties may
comment on the executive statement.
(6) Such comment shall not exceed three minutes per province and
where applicable, per party.
Rule 241: Resolutions affecting the executive
To amend Rule 241 by insertion of the words underlined:
241. Resolutions of the Council affecting the executive must be
communicated to the President by the Secretary, and a response may be
communicated to the member who initiated the resolution.
Rule 243: National interventions in provinces
To amend Rule 243(3) by the deletion of the words in bold brackets and
insertion of the words underlined:
243. (3) The Chairperson of the Council must refer the matter to
the [select committee responsible for constitutional affairs]
appropriate committee of the Council.
Rule 244: Provincial interventions in local government
To amend Rule 244(3) by the deletion of the words in bold brackets and
insertion of the words underlined:
244. (3) The Chairperson of the Council must refer the matter to
the [select committee responsible for constitutional affairs]
appropriate committee of the Council.
Report to be considered.
FRIDAY, 5 JULY 2002
ANNOUNCEMENTS:
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
- The Speaker and the Chairperson:
(1) The Minister for Justice and Constitutional Development on 1
July 2002 submitted drafts of the Constitution of the Republic of
South Africa Third Amendment Bill, 2002 and the Constitution of
the Republic of South Africa Fourth Amendment Bill, 2002, as well
as the memoranda explaining the objects of the proposed
legislation, to the Speaker and the Chairperson in terms of Joint
Rule 159. The drafts have been referred to the Portfolio Committee
on Justice and Constitutional Development and the Select Committee
on Security and Constitutional Affairs by the Speaker and the
Chairperson, respectively, in accordance with Joint Rule 159(2).
(2) The following Bill was introduced by the Minister of Finance in
the National Assembly on 5 July 2002 and referred to the Joint
Tagging Mechanism (JTM) for classification in terms of Joint Rule
160:
(i) Collective Investment Schemes Control Bill [B 28 - 2002]
(National Assembly - sec 75) [Explanatory summary of Bill and
prior notice of its introduction published in Government
Gazette No 23253 of 28 June 2002.]
The Bill has been referred to the Portfolio Committee on Finance
of the National Assembly.
In terms of Joint Rule 154, written views on the classification of
the Bill may be submitted to the JTM within three parliamentary
working days.
TABLINGS:
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
Papers:
- The Minister of Environmental Affairs and Tourism:
(1) United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, 10 December
1982, relating to the Conservation and Management of Straddling
Fish Stocks and Highly Migratory Fish Stocks, tabled in terms of
section 231(2) of the Constitution, 1996.
(2) Explanatory Memorandum to the Convention.
National Council of Provinces:
- The Chairperson:
Report of the IPU-UNICEF Parliamentary Forum on Children, New York, 9
May 2002.
Referred to the Joint Monitoring Committee on Improvement of Quality of
Life and Status of Children, Youth and Disabled Persons.
FRIDAY, 12 JULY 2002 ANNOUNCEMENTS:
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
- The Speaker and the Chairperson:
(1) The Minister of Finance submitted the Wysigingswetsontwerp op
Belastingwette [W 26 - 2002] (National Assembly - sec 77) to the
Speaker and the Chairperson on 12 July 2002. This is the official
translation of the Taxation Laws Amendment Bill [B 26 - 2002]
(National Assembly - sec 77), which was introduced in the National
Assembly by the Minister on 20 June 2002.
TABLINGS:
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
Papers:
- The Minister of Transport:
(a) Bilateral Search and Rescue Agreement between the Government of the
Republic of South Africa and the Government of the Republic of
Mozambique, tabled in terms of section 231(3) of the Constitution,
1996.
(b) Explanatory Memorandum to the Agreement.
FRIDAY, 19 JULY 2002
ANNOUNCEMENTS:
National Council of Provinces:
- The Chairperson:
The following papers have been tabled and are now referred to the
relevant committees as mentioned below:
(1) The following papers are referred to the Select Committee on
Finance:
(a) Report of the Office of the Auditor-General on the Budget
of Income and Expenditure for the year 2002-2003 [RP 63-2002].
(b) Annual Report of the Registrar of Unit Trust Companies for
the year ended 31 December 2000.
(c) Annual Report of the Public Accountants and Auditors'
Board for the year ended 31 December 2001.
(d) List of Registered Accountants and Auditors as at 31 March
2002, tabled in terms of section 9(5) of the Public
Accountants and Auditors Act, 1991 (Act No 80 of 1991).
(2) The following paper is referred to the Select Committee on
Security and Constitutional Affairs:
Regulation No R 839 published in Government Gazette No 23525 dated
14 June 2002: Regulations made in terms of section 24(1) of the
South African Police Services Act, 1995 (Act No 68 of 1995).
(3) The following papers are referred to the Select Committee on
Land and Environmental Affairs for consideration and report:
(a) United Nations Convention on the Law of the Sea, 10
December 1982, relating to the Conservation and Management of
Straddling Fish Stocks and Highly Migratory Fish Stocks,
tabled in terms of section 231(2) of the Constitution, 1996.
(b) Explanatory Memorandum to the Convention.
(4) The following paper is referred to the Select Committee on
Public Services:
(a) Bilateral Search and Rescue Agreement between the
Government of the Republic of South Africa and the Government
of the Republic of Mozambique, tabled in terms of section
231(3) of the Constitution, 1996.
(b) Explanatory Memorandum to the Agreement.
TABLINGS:
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
Papers:
- The President of the Republic:
Annual Review of the Independent Commission for the Remuneration of
Public Office-Bearers, 2002 [First Report].
-
The Speaker and the Chairperson: Management Report and Report of the Auditor-General on the Financial Statements of the Directorate of Special Operations for the period 1 December 2000 to 31 March 2001 [RP 69-2002].
-
The Minister of Trade and Industry:
The Medium Term Strategic Plan for the Department of Trade and Industry
for 2002-2004.
- The Minister of Labour:
Report and Financial Statements of the National Productivity Institute
for 2001-2002.
WEDNESDAY, 24 JULY 2002
ANNOUNCEMENTS:
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
-
The Speaker and the Chairperson: (1) The Minister of Education on 26 June 2002 submitted drafts of the following Bills, as well as the memoranda explaining the objects of the proposed legislation, to the Speaker and the Chairperson in terms of Joint Rule 159:
(i) Education Laws Amendment Bill, 2002 (ii) Higher Education Amendment Bill, 2002
The drafts have been referred to the Portfolio Committee on Education and the Select Committee on Education and Recreation by the Speaker and the Chairperson, respectively, in accordance with Joint Rule 159(2).
National Council of Provinces:
- The Chairperson:
The following changes have been made to the membership of Select
Committees, viz:
Public Services:
Appointed: Raju, N M.
COMMITTEE REPORTS:
National Council of Provinces:
-
Report of the Select Committee on Land and Environmental Affairs on the Planning Profession Bill [B 76B - 2001] (National Assembly - sec 75), dated 26 June 2002:
The Select Committee on Land and Environmental Affairs, having considered the subject of the Planning Profession Bill [B 76B - 2001] (National Assembly - sec 75), referred to it, reports the Bill with a proposed amendment, as follows:
CLAUSE 5
- On page 5, in line 59, to omit “political” and to substitute “public”.
-
Report of the Select Committee on Security and Constitutional Affairs on the Reinstatement of Enrolment of Certain Deceased Legal Practitioners Bill [B 6B - 2002] (National Assembly - sec 75), dated 26 June 2002:
The Select Committee on Security and Constitutional Affairs, having considered the subject of the Reinstatement of Enrolment of Certain Deceased Legal Practitioners Bill [B 6B - 2002] (National Assembly - sec 75), referred to it, reports that it has agreed to the Bill.
MONDAY, 29 JULY 2002
ANNOUNCEMENTS:
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
- The Speaker and the Chairperson:
(1) Assent by the President of the Republic in respect of the
following Bills:
(a) Animal Health Bill [B 64D - 2001] - Act No 7 of 2002
(assented to and signed by President on 24 July 2002);
(b) National Railway Safety Regulator Bill [B 7D - 2002] - Act
No 16 of 2002 (assented to and signed by President on 24
July 2002);
(c) Commission for the Promotion and Protection of the Rights
of Cultural, Religious and Linguistic Communities Bill [B
62B - 2001] - Act No 19 of 2002 (assented to and signed
by President on 24 July 2002);
(d) Private Security Industry Levies Bill [B 11 - 2002] - Act
No 23 of 2002 (assented to and signed by President on 24
July 2002);
(e) Implementation of the Rome Statute of the International
Criminal Court Bill [B 42D - 2001] - Act No 27 of 2002
(assented to and signed by President on 12 July 2002);
(f) Appropriation Bill [B 4 - 2002] - Act No 29 of 2002
(assented to and signed by President on 12 July 2002);
and
(g) Health Donations Fund Act Repeal Bill [B 20 - 2002] - Act
No 31 of 2002 (assented to and signed by President on 24
July 2002).
(2) The Minister of Trade and Industry on 10 June 2002 submitted
drafts of the following Bills, as well as the memoranda explaining
the objects of the proposed legislation, to the Speaker and the
Chairperson in terms of Joint Rule 159:
(i) International Trade Administration Bill, 2002
(ii) Corporate Law Amendment Bill, 2002
(iii) Export Credit and Foreign Investments Insurance Amendment
Bill, 2002
The drafts have been referred to the Portfolio Committee on Trade
and Industry and the Select Committee on Economic and Foreign
Affairs by the Speaker and the Chairperson, respectively, in
accordance with Joint Rule 159(2).
(3) The following Bill was introduced by the Minister of Trade and
Industry in the National Assembly on 26 July 2002 and referred to
the Joint Tagging Mechanism (JTM) for classification in terms of
Joint Rule 160:
(i) Export Credit and Foreign Investments Insurance Amendment
Bill [B 29 - 2002] (National Assembly - sec 75) [Explanatory
summary of Bill and prior notice of its introduction published
in Government Gazette No 23573 of 28 June 2002.]
The Bill has been referred to the Portfolio Committee on Trade and
Industry of the National Assembly.
In terms of Joint Rule 154 written views on the classification of
the Bill may be submitted to the JTM within three parliamentary
working days.
National Council of Provinces:
- The Chairperson:
The following papers have been tabled and are now referred to the
relevant committees as mentioned below:
(1) The following paper is referred to the Select Committee on
Security and Constitutional Affairs:
Management Report and Report of the Auditor-General on the
Financial Statements of the Directorate of Special Operations for
the period 1 December 2000 to 31 March 2001 [RP 69-2002].
(2) The following paper is referred to the Select Committee on
Economic and Foreign Affairs:
The Medium-Term Strategic Plan for the Department of Trade and
Industry for 2002-2004.
(3) The following paper is referred to the Select Committee on
Labour and Public Enterprises:
Report and Financial Statements of the National Productivity
Institute for 2001-2002.
TABLINGS:
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
Papers:
- The Minister of Finance:
Report and Financial Statements of the South African Special Risk
Insurance Association Limited for 2001.
- The Minister of Environmental Affairs and Tourism:
Request to exclude two portions of land from the Kalahari Gemsbok
National Park, tabled in terms of section 2(3) of the National Parks
Act, 1976 (Act No 57 of 1976). COMMITTEE REPORTS:
National Council of Provinces:
-
Report of the Select Committee on Security and Constitutional Affairs on the Insolvency Amendment Bill [B 14B - 2002] (National Assembly - sec 75), dated 29 July 2002:
The Select Committee on Security and Constitutional Affairs, having considered the subject of the Insolvency Amendment Bill [B 14B - 2002] (National Assembly - sec 75), referred to it, reports that it has agreed to the Bill.
WEDNESDAY, 31 JULY 2002
TABLINGS:
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
Papers:
- The Minister of Finance:
Provincial Budgets: 2001 Outcome and 2002 MTEF Budgets.
THURSDAY, 1 AUGUST 2002
ANNOUNCEMENTS:
National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:
- The Speaker and the Chairperson:
The Minister for the Public Service and Administration submitted the
Wysigingswetsontwerp op die Staatsinligtingstegnologie-agentskap [W 24
- 2002] (National Assembly - sec 75) to the Speaker and the Chairperson
on 1 August 2002. This is the official translation of the State
Information Technology Agency Amendment Bill [B 24 - 2002] (National
Assembly - sec 75), which was introduced in the National Assembly by
the Minister on 24 May 2002.