WEDNESDAY, 21 AUGUST 2002 __

          PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
                                ____

The Council met at 14:03.

The Deputy Chairperson took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.

ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS - see col 000.

                          NOTICES OF MOTION

Mrs A M VERSFELD: Chairperson, I hereby give notice that at the next sitting of the House I shall move on behalf of the Democratic Party:

That the Council -

(1) notes that the Democratic Party has received confirmation from Marine and Coastal Management (MCM) that the Rights Verification Unit (RVU) did not verify quota applications to the extent that it was advertised and published, and that the enormous amount of R4,3 million was spent on the setting up of the application forms and database for intensive verifications in future;

(2) takes cognisance of the fact that the DP has noted with concern that -

   (a)  verification has effectively come to  a  halt  although  it  was
       promised that the verification process would last  the  term  of
       the quota rights;


   (b)  real verification will only start in about two months' time; and


   (c)  many communities and companies  were  prejudiced  because  their
       documentation was not verified properly and  consequently  their
       applications and appeals were rejected; and

(3) further notes that because of the devastating impoverishing effect of the high quota application, coupled with the removal of the subsistence right of these communities and companies, the DP calls on the Minister of Environmental Affairs and Tourism -

   (a)  to verify and re-evaluate all applications and appeals; and


   (b)  to set up a list of  deserving  companies  in  their  respective
       demarcated areas, as well as a list of the various species.

Mrs E N LUBIDLA: Chairperson, I give notice that I shall move at the next sitting of the House:

That the Council -

(1) notes that -

   (a)  the African National Congress Women's League organised  a  rally
       of local women and women  refugees  from  the  DRC,  Angola  and
       Mozambique, on Sunday, 18 August 2002; and


   (b)  this rally highlighted the human rights  abuse  of  refugees  in
       general and women refugees in particular in our communities;

(2) believes that -

   (a)  the abuse of the rights of refugees is  a  manifestation  of  an
       endemic problem of racism, xenophobia and  related  intolerances
       in our communities; and


   (b)  this rally represents a conscious attempt  to  build  solidarity
       amongst African  people,  and  women  in  particular,  to  fight
       xenophobia;

(3) commends the Women’s League in the Western Cape for embarking on this initiative; and

(4) calls on community organisations, church groups and labour unions to emulate this shining example and to fight xenophobia, racism and related intolerances.

Prince B Z ZULU: Chairperson, I give notice that I shall move at the next sitting of the House:

That the Council -

(1) expresses its concern at the rising political instability between ANC and IFP supporters in Nongoma, KwaZulu-Natal;

(2) notes with astonishment the shooting of the daughter of the ANC member, widow Phumzile Zitha, and the bombing of her homestead where she lost everything she possessed in the house;

(3) expresses its shock and horror at the killings of the ANC branch secretary Zama Mkhonza and ANC members Mqwayi Qwabe and Khulekani Mthembu in Nongoma;

(4) notes that these occurred in the months of July and August;

(5) extends its heartfelt sympathy and condolences to the families and friends of these comrades;

(6) further notes that this instability is escalating in the province and that innocent people are dying every day;

(7) appreciates the manner in which the police have handled the situation, in particular Senior Superintendent Zondo and his unit, who with their quick response ensured that two arrests were made;

(8) calls for unity amongst our people; and

(9) further calls for the ANC and IFP to -

   (a)  resolve their differences in order to  bring  an  end  to  these
       senseless and merciless killing of our people; and


   (b)  assist in doing away with criminals who commit gruesome criminal
       acts while hiding behind their political banners.

Rev P MOATSHE: Chairperson, I give notice that I shall move on behalf of the ANC at the next sitting of the House:

That the Council -

(1) notes that -

   (a)  a white woman business entrepreneur  and  an  ANC  activist,  Ms
       Wanda Stoffberg, was physically and verbally abused by  a  group
       of  white  right-wingers  for  having  black  customers  in  her
       butchery in George; and


   (b)  the Democratic Alliance-controlled municipality  of  George  has
       now instructed her to close down her butchery;

(2) believes that -

   (a)  the actions of the DA-controlled municipality of  George  served
       to fuel racial tensions and  divisions  amongst  the  people  of
       George; and


   (b)  in so doing, undermined the efforts of our Government and people
       to build national unity; and

(3) calls on -

   (a)  the police to expedite investigation of this case and  to  bring
       the perpetrators to book; and


   (b)  the DA to desist from actions  that  fuels  tension  and  racial
       divisions amongst the people.
                 ATTACKS ON FREE STATE FARM DWELLERS


                         (Draft Resolution)

Dr P J C NEL: Voorsitter, ek stel hiermee sonder kennis voor: [Chairperson, I move without notice:]

That the Council -

(1) takes note that -

   (a)  a wave of senseless, cruel attacks  on  defenceless  people  has
          occurred during the past few weeks in the rural parts  of  the
          Free State, namely Zastron, Smithfield, Ficksburg  and  Reitz,
          and that the New NP wishes to express  its  concern  regarding
          this;


   (b)  exceptionally good  relations  exist  between  farm  owners  and
          farmworkers and that they come to one another's aid  in  times
          of need;


   (c)  the SA  Police  Service  deserves  praise  for  their  efficient
          response, which in most cases leads to the  prompt  arrest  of
          criminals; and


   (d)  something should be done drastically  to  bring  criminals,  who
          have no  feeling  for  human  life  and  are  apparently  not
          deterred by imprisonment, to their senses; and

(2) expresses its sincere sympathy to the next of kin of the victims and to the farmowners and workers who survived these barbaric attacks.

Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.

                  MACHAKOS PROTOCOL SIGNED IN SUDAN

                         (Draft Resolution)

Mr K D S DURR: Chairperson, I move without notice:

That the Council -

(1) notes the Machakos Protocol signed in July between the government of the Republic of Sudan and the Sudan Peoples’ Liberation Army/Sudan Peoples’ Liberation Movement in an attempt to end the civil war between the Muslim north and the Christian and animist South Sudan, which has been raging for over 20 years and during which over 1 million people were killed or maimed; and

(2) calls upon the South African Government to help and encourage the warring parties in Sudan to adhere to the agreement and to the process towards peace, constitutional government and respect for human rights that the agreement spells out, including the right to self-determination for the people of South Sudan.

Motion agreed to in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.

   EXPORT CREDIT AND FOREIGN INVESTMENTS INSURANCE AMENDMENT BILL

  (Consideration of Bill and of Report of Select Committee thereon)

The MINISTER OF TRADE AND INDUSTRY: Chairperson, it is a very smart machine. It turns on by itself. It is excellent. Could I also thank the NCOP and the committees very sincerely for expediting this amendment. I know it was relatively difficult for them, but I would like to thank them for doing it.

The export credit insurance corporation as members know was introduced relatively recently starting in 2001. Most of the members I think are also familiar with the fact that this was previously a function that was carried out by a private sector structure in partnership with Government. But for a range of reasons that were consulted on widely, we established the new export credit insurance corporation.

Very briefly, and I think hon member Mohseen will go into more detail, this is a function that reinsures or ensures exports and capital goods projects. Those are construction projects, engineering projects and other projects that takes place outside of South Africa. Accordingly, it plays a very important role in the ability of South African companies both to export and to undertake projects in other countries and other countries in Africa.

What we found after operating the new Act for a period of time was that there was some degree of uncertainty around the precise levels that would be ensured. That has always been our intention and it is our practice to ensure 90% of the project. But it was argued by certain of the legal advisers in the financial sector that the Bill could be interpreted to mean that it was 90% of what was previously ensured which was 90% that would have been 81%. And it was felt advisable that we clarify this, we could not have that kind of uncertainty in the Act. We also felt that in order to establish the legal basis for these contracts, because they are long contracts generally speaking, that that certainty should be provided from the time of operation of the export credit insurance corporation.

So the purpose here is to provide absolute certainty for the current operations of the export credit insurance corporation. The other amendments are relatively technical in nature and are designed to clean up the Act where we picked up that in the movement from the old to the new certain terms had not been changed. Certainly it was not like much of the old legislation gender sensitive. And it was also felt that the role of the Minister needed to be very precisely stated. Since the previous structure was a partnership between public and private the Ministers had certain powers. It could have been interpreted that the Minister would have to deal with each and every one of the very numerous applications and that is not the intention of the Act. The Minister deals with certain defined areas that are now I think set out more clearly in the legislation.

Very briefly, the reason for the request to the Chair to process this Bill quickly was to allow us to proceed with a number of major projects in an atmosphere of complete certainty. And this is why our target has been to try and get the Bill through by the end of this month. This coincides with the dates of some of the larger projects and the closure of some of these larger projects.

Chairperson and members, once again my thanks for moving to process this Bill. I am sure members are familiar with the quite large amounts of money involved. We are currently looking at the export credit insurance corporation that has approved 32 projects in 28 countries on five continents to the value of R7,5 billion. We are looking at very significant, large amounts of money and it is for us a very important agency. We are one of a group of about 15 to 20 of these export credit insurance corporations that are members of Berne Union, which is an international agency that brings the credit agencies together and is a very competitive arena I must tell members. Everyone seeks this business. From our point of view, as an exporter of manufactured products, as a developer of major industrial projects, we need to be within this competitive domain and the export credit insurance corporation is designed to do that.

I have tried, in the interest of the programme, to take much less than the 15 minutes allowed. I am hoping that you would allow me to bank what I have saved now with the export credit insurance corporation for a later time. [Laughter.] [Applause.]

Mr M V MOOSA: Chairperson I would like to take the precedent that the Minister has set, except that I am not in charge of an export credit agency, so I do not have a bank in which to put my minutes. But, thank you very much hon Minister for those kind words to the committee. I thought that what is important for us to do is to explain very briefly how these things work, because I think a lot of people see these things in the newspapers and things, and it is important for us who are passing these laws, who are making these amendments, to understand what kind of a transaction is taking place here.

Now, for example, if we look at the Mozal project, it involves very large sums of money, much more than the $250 million being lent to Mozal through the export credit agency project. A whole lot of financiers from all over have come together and have taken bits and pieces of the Mozal project and have funded this project. Each one of those people who put money into the project wants to make sure that the risk that they embark upon in investing this money in the Mozal-type project is safe. In the same way, for example, if one of us were to go to a bank to lend money to buy a house or start a business. The bank would say: Where is your collateral? They would say: Tata Kgware, where is your collateral? Because we do not lend you money to start a business if you do not have the collateral.

Well, with these big projects, when you go to banks and you say to them: We need $250 million - that is more than R2,5 billion- to invest in Mozal, they ask the same question. They say to you: Where is your collateral? Now, in an instance like that Government has to play a role. For a bank to be able to put its money into Mozal, Government has to be the collateral. And in the Southern African region the government that is usually the collateral is the South African Government. Of course, the Mozambican government and other governments do provide this kind of sovereign risk management, but the South African Government more often than not takes the risk and provides this collateral. And what the export credit guarantee agency does is, it facilitates this process in terms of which Government takes the risk.

Now, when this Mozal project was started and negotiations were taking place there were things that foreign bankers were worried about. They were saying: If we put our $250 million into the Mozal project, we have two concerns: Firstly, we want to be clear that the South African Government is taking the sovereign risk, and we are not so sure if we look at the Act that this is, in fact, the case - the Minister dealt with that. There were certain clauses in the Bill that required that the Minister must look at the terms and conditions of every single contract when this kind of risk is taken by Government. And, of course, Ministers do not work like that, not in this country, and nowhere in the world.

What Government usually does to an agency like the export credit agency is that Government gives a broad mandate, and Government will say to the export credit agency: We give you the broad mandate to go out and provide the export credit guarantees on behalf of Government. But, the Minister does not look at every term and every bit of detail, and what these bankers from overseas will say is: Well, if the Minister has not looked at everything, then someone could come at a later stage and take the whole matter to court and say that the Minister did not apply his mind, and, of course, then the collateral is in jeopardy - the sovereign risk is no longer there. They wanted us to clear this thing up. So, one of the amendments we had to bring about is an amendment that said that the Minister would give one broad mandate to the export credit and foreign guarantee agency - that is the full name. Of course, after the Minister gives that mandate the agency has the power to do the honourable one-on-one deals and day-to-day business; they have a broad mandate to do that. We had to clear that up, it was very important.

It is a standard thing all over the world that governments give this kind of broad mandate to agencies. It is a very serious mandate for Parliament to understand, because we are putting Government at risk. If Mozal goes down we are going to be in debt, as Government, for R2,5 billion. That is what this means. In other words, we, in some way or another, are bringing liabilities onto the taxpayer, the South African taxpayer, because if something happens to Mozal, of course, the South African taxpayer has to fork out. But this is the case in all the contracts. The Minister mentioned that there are 32 contracts all over the world. There are some in Qatar, in Doha and South America, and all sorts of places there - it totals about R35 billion. We, as taxpayers in this country, are the guarantors for that money and if those projects do not happen we, as taxpayers, will have to fork out and take the risk that the banks took. So, that is the one thing that was needed do be done with regard to this Bill.

The second issue was, if we do provide a guarantee, how much of a guarantee do we provide? If Mozal says that they want to lend R1 billion, are they allowed to lend all of the R1 billion, or will we be taking collateral for that full R1 billion, or will we be taking collateral for less? The law says that we will only provide a guarantee for 90% of that. In other words, if R1 billion is being borrowed by any of these projects, Government will only take the risk for 90% of that. When Government goes out and gets the money in and the premium structures are worked out, those people who put money into the processes must also take some risk - this was the old law - and, in terms of that, there would be a nine percent risk that they will take as well. This was an innovative thing in our old law, but the banks who came to the party on Mozal were very unhappy about that, and they said that they are not prepared to take any risk at all. As far as they are concerned we must divide political risk from commercial risk. Where it is political risk they want 100% sovereign risk to be taken by Government. Where there is commercial risk they are prepared to talk about it.

And so, at the end of the day, we had to even change that clause to ensure that when we do take sovereign risk as the state we take 100% of the sovereign risk, in other words, 100% of the 90% of the risk, if you understand what I am saying. We had to do this, it is not very fair - it is not very just, actually - because if banks are going to earn premiums when they put money down, and they are all making money here - everybody is making money here - they should be prepared to take some risk. But, of course, because it is a political risk, because it is Southern Africa, because we may need them more than they need us, because we have Nepad, because we have infrastructural needs, I think, we had to back down and say: Look, you know, we will allow this for now. We will take the risk because we believe in our region, we believe in our country, we believe in our subregion, and we are prepared to take this risk. But it is a little bit unfair because if they make money out of it they should take some of the risk. So, in any case, that is one of the amendments that we accept as well.

The third amendment that came about was an amendment which required that we make this law retrospective to July 2001. Now, as my hon colleagues would know, that is a serious thing. We are passing a law today that came into effect a year before. You remember this law, I am sure many of the ANC people remember this law. In the days of apartheid when Government wanted to nail you on something they would pass a law today, but make it effective from five years ago or last year. Then if you were doing something last week - at the time it was not a crime - but today after they pass the law, suddenly, it is a crime. So, it becomes a crime after you do it. And that is how the old regime used to get around the rule of law. As you know the ANC Government never liked retrospective laws. Fortunately these days … [Interjections.]

Sandra is again lost, as usual she is lost in these discussions. We do not like retrospective law, and, I think, everybody knows that. We do not like to make laws today … [Interjections.] Retrospective is the right word. We do not like these things, because what they do is they bring the rule of law into question. It means it is a government that can do anything.

But in some instances it is very legitimate. This time around we had a very long discussion, hon Minister, with your advisers at the department and also with the banks, and we wanted to send out a clear message that says: This is not something we do every day. It is a very extraordinary thing we are doing, and we really want to understand why we need this. And we were convinced, as a select committee, after all the discussions we had with the advisers, that it was, in fact, necessary for us to make this law retrospective because what that would do is it would allow for the nine contracts that were signed from July last year to also be treated in this way. And if we allow them to be treated in this way we will make sure that nobody loses out if any of those matters go to court, because of the terms and conditions and the way that they may have been structured in those agreements.

We do not want a situation where somebody can challenge or attack those agreements because in some of them a lot of money is involved - billions of rands - and we did not want anybody to suffer prejudice. We do not want the banks to suffer prejudice. What convinced us most about the fact that it was necessary to make this law retrospective was that the export credit guarantee agency and the banks had, in fact, already agreed to these terms. So, the fact that we are making it retrospective just solidifies it. The parties that were involved in these nine transactions before this - up to July 2001 - had already been working on the basis of the law that we are passing and we decided that if we do pass the law we are not really going to be causing much of a problem. On that basis we agreed to all the amendments that have been recommended by the department. Deputy Chair, I think that the Bill certainly improves the original Bill and the way in which the export credit agency works. It certainly allows the agency to be able to do more rigorously and in a more flexible way what it does on a day- to-day basis. I want to call on this honourable House to support the Bill. Thank you very much.

Debate concluded.

Declarations of vote:

Mr L G LEVER: These amendments … [Inaudible.] … and service providers, the support they need to export their goods and services. It is also further necessary to allow the large capital projects to go forward to enable the development of our region and the integration of the economies in the region, which is necessary to support the objectives of Nepad. For these reasons the DA supports this Bill. Thank you, Chair.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Can I make the correction? It is the Democratic Party, not the DA. Mr Durr. Mr K D S DURR: Chairman, every deal, of course, ends in the bank and one of the things this Bill does is to roll the contingent liability off the balance sheet of the bank and onto the balance sheet of the insurer, and therefore, obviates notes on the balance sheet of the private company and allows them to observe prudential limits as far as developing countries are concerned and often then also allows them to be in conformity with rules which may be laid down for them by their central bank.

So it gives the financial community and the project community in general much greater flexibility. That is the main point, actually, of this legislation. It is very important; we think it is very necessary. We understand the need for clarity and certainty. We support it. However, Minister, in supporting the Bill we would like to say that co-insurance is the way that we have to be going because there is no way that the objective of Nepad will be met by the resources that even the South African Government can apply.

Therefore, we have to bring other people to the party, and we have to bring them to the party soon because if we bring them to the party once we are already very deep in ourselves, we become less attractive to co-insure with. Co-insurance is vital, and particularly with the private market. Our hon chairman of our committee spoke very well today and he spoke about the role of Government - he did not mention the role of the private insurers and the trend is to go private. Many of these big companies in Bermuda that do this kind of business - Warren Buffet’s companies, ACE in Bermuda, I can name many others - co-operate with national agencies on a co-insurance basis. Also MIGA, the Multilateral Investment Guarantee Agency of the World Bank - we should also be seeking to co-insure with them, so that we get more bank for our buck, so that the Minister, who often uses the word leverage, can leverage-up our capacity to do more by doing things more together, and strengthening the deal in the process by doing it that way and attracting other people. Because as soon as we take the lead risk, then, of course, the whole thing becomes much more possible for everybody to enter, because they know we have leverage over the insured.

So, with those few words, Minister, may I ask you to please attend to that if you have not already. The whole question of co-insurance, I think, is vital, and it is vital that we get in early, and we get in with a private market and with the national insurers and with MIGA, so that we can get as much mileage out of this agency as possible, because otherwise … [Time expired.]

Dr E A CONROY: Voorsitter, hierdie wetsontwerp is daarop gerig om sekere uitdrukkings in die uitvoerkrediet- en buitelandse beleggingsversekeringswet duideliker te omskryf en sekere omskrywings te skrap. Die wysigings is tegnies van aard, maar noodsaaklik om die gladder werking van die uitvoer- en versekeringsaktiwiteite, waarop dié wet betrekking het, te verseker, en hou geen finansiële implikasies vir die staat in nie. Die Nuwe NP ondersteun die wysigingswetsontwerp. Dankie, Voorsitter. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)

[Dr E A CONROY: Chairperson, this Bill is aimed at more clearly defining certain expressions in the Export Credit and Foreign Investment Insurance Act and to abolish certain definitions. The amendments are technical in nature, but essential to ensure the moother operation of the export and insurance activities to which this Act relates, and do not pose any financial implications to the state. The New NP supports the amending Bill. Thank you. [Applause.]]

Bill agreed to in accordance with section 75 of the Constitution.

CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF SELECT COMMITTEE ON LAND AND ENVIRONEMTAL
   AFFAIRS - STOCKHOLM CONVENTION ON PERSISTENT ORGANIC POLLUTANTS

Rev P MOATSHE: Hon Chairperson, hon members, hon special delegates from provinces, ladies and gentlemen, and the House at large, it is perhaps more than fitting that we have the Stockholm Convention before this revered House today.

As I speak, delegates and heads of state from around the globe are arriving in our country in their thousands to attend and be part of the deliberations that will take place at the World Summit on Sustainable Development in Johannesburg four days from today.

It is our conviction that the resolutions adopted at the Stockholm Convention are inextricably linked to some of the issues that will be deliberated upon at the Summit. As some of us would know, the UN Environment Programme initiated a process in 1997 to develop a globally legally-binding instrument to reduce the risks to human health and the environment costs by the release and long range transport of persistent organic pollutants.

The persistent organic pollutants convention is aimed at either eliminating or reducing the production or release of the first 12 identified persistent organic pollutants via an international convention, and also identifies other POP candidates.

Given South Africa’s nonparticipation and isolation from this and similar important international conventions because of its apartheid history, we have through the Department of Environmental Affairs and Tourism participated in the negotiations for the POPs convention.

We have also attended the conference of plenipotentiaries of the POPs convention in Stockholm in May 2001 which finally adopted the convention. Our country signed this convention at this meeting. The Department of Environmental Affairs and Tourism will be the lead agent responsible for co- ordinating the implementation of the persistent organics pollutants convention.

We are estimating that South Africa’s contribution based on past experience with other conventions will be in the range of $30 000 annually to this convention. The calculations of the contributions of individual countries to the convention are normally based on the country’s assessed contribution as per the UN scale.

The essence of the convention which all the parties recognised is that persistent organic pollutants possess toxic properties, resist degradation, bio-accumulate, and are transported through air, water and migratory species across international boundaries and deposited from their place of release where they accumulate in terrestrial and aquatic ecosystems. Moreover, its destructive effects extend to health because of exposure of, especially women, and through them to future generations. Its impact is also particularly felt in developing countries and indigenous communities because of the contamination of their water supply and traditional foods.

The convention is also mindful of the efficacy and efficiency of possible control measures in meeting reduction goals. It therefore prescribed specific technical feasibility studies. Moreover, it is clear about the positive and negative impacts on society’s implementing possible control measures in the following spheres: Health, including public, environmental and occupational health; agriculture, including aqua-culture and forestry; bio-diversity; economic aspects; movement towards sustainable development; and social costs.

As a country we are proud to have signed the Stockholm Convention because its core is about the relationship between human society and its environment. The select committee unanimously agreed to this convention. Therefore we place it before this hon House to accept it. [Applause.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Order! That concludes the debate. I shall now put the question and it is that the report be adopted. I have just ascertained that the delegation heads are present. I shall also first allow provinces the opportunity to make a declaration of vote if they so wish. Any province? There is none.

We shall now proceed to the voting and delegation heads must please indicate whether they are voting in favour, against or abstaining. I do not have the alphabetical order, but I will call upon all provinces. The Eastern Cape?

Ms B N DLULANE: Eastern Cape iyaxhasa. (Eastern Cape supports.)

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): KwaZulu-Natal?

Ms B THOMSON: KwaZulu-Natal iyaxhasa. (KwaZulu-Natal supports.)

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Northern Province?

Mr M I MAKOELA: Northern Province e a e amogela. (Northern Province accepts it.)

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Mpumalanga?

Ms M P THEMBA: Mpumalanga iyawusekela. (Mpumalanga supports.) The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Northern Cape?

Mrs E N LUBIDLA: Northern Cape supports.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Western Cape?

Mr C ACKERMANN: Supports.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): North West?

Mr Z S KOLWENI: North West supports.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Gauteng?

Ms J L KGOALI: Gauteng e a dumela. [Gauteng agrees.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Free State? … [Interjections.] I did not hear? Mr T S SETONA: Free State e a dumela. [Free State agrees.] [Laughter.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Order! All nine provinces voted in favour. I therefore declare the report adopted in terms of section 65 of the Constitution. [Applause.]

CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF SELECT COMMITTEE ON LAND AND ENVIRONMENTAL    AFFAIRS - ROTTERDAM CONVENTIONON ON PIC PROCEDURE FOR CERTAIN HAZARDOUS
           CHEMICALS AND PESTICIDES IN INTERNATIONAL TRADE

Mr V V Z WINDVOëL: Mgcinisihlalo, malunga eMkhandlu lahloniphekile, netivakashi tetfu lapha etulu, ngiyabonga kutfola lelitfuba lekwetfula lombiko. [Chairperson, hon members of this House, our visitors in the gallery, I am happy to have this opportunity to present this report to the House.]

Let me start by apologising for the mishap. I usually keep my credit card safe so I had to take this one back to my wallet. In March 1998, after two years of extensive negotiations, 95 countries, including South Africa, finalised the text of the Rotterdam Convention on the prior-informed consent procedure for certain hazardous chemicals and pesticides in international trade. The text of the convention was adopted and opened for signature at a diplomatic conference in Rotterdam in September 1998. South Africa did not sign the convention then.

This convention represents an important step towards ensuring the protection of cities and the environment in all countries from the possible harm resulting from trade in highly dangerous pesticides and chemicals. It will save lives and protect the environment from the adverse effects of pesticides and toxic chemicals. It will establish a first line of defence against future tragedies by preventing unwanted imports of dangerous chemicals, particularly in the developing countries. By extending to all countries the ability to protect themselves against the risks of toxic substances, it will have levelled the playing fields and raised global standards for protection of human health and the environment.

In short, the convention will enable the world to monitor and control the trade in very dangerous substances. It will give important countries the power to decide which chemicals they want to receive and to exclude those they cannot manage safely. If trade does take place, requirements for labelling and provision of information on potential health and environmental effects will promote the safe use of these chemicals.

We need this convention, because every year thousands of people die or are seriously poisoned by toxic pesticides and other chemicals. Many of theses substances also cause devastating problems when released into the environment where they may poison water resources, animal and plant life, and also people. Unwanted and obsolete stockpiles of such pesticides and toxic chemicals have accumulated in virtually every developing country. Many of these chemicals are persistent organic pollutants. Highly toxic chemicals that persist in an environment for long periods of time accumulate in wildlife and people that are mobile in the environment, possibly travelling thousands of kilometres from where they were released.

The convention will help solve these pressing human health and environmental problems by reducing the use of chemicals to where they are absolutely necessary and can be safely used. In this manner the convention will help to prevent the new chemicals safety problem.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): That concludes the debate. I shall now put the question and the question is that the report be adopted. As the decision is dealt with in terms of section 65 of the Constitution, I have ascertained that delegation heads are present and in accordance with Rule 71, I shall first allow provinces the opportunity to make a declaration of vote, if they so wish. Any province? I take it there is none. We shall now proceed to the voting on the question. I shall do this in alphabetical order this time per province. Delegation heads must please indicate to the Chair whether they vote in favour, or against or abstain from voting.

The Eastern Cape?

Ms B N DLULANE: Sihambisana nayo. [We vote in favour.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Free State?

Mr T S SETONA: We vote in favour.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Gauteng?

Ms J L KGOALI: Gauteng e a go amogela. [Gauteng accepts it.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): KwaZulu-Natal?

Ms B THOMSON: KwaZulu-Natal iyaxhasa. [KwaZulu-Natal supports.] The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Mpumalanga?

Ms M P THEMBA: We vote in favour.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Northern Cape?

Mr D M KGWARE: We vote in favour.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Northern Province?

Kgoshi M L MOKOENA: Re kwama le yona Mohlomphegi. [We vote in favour.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): North West?

Mr Z S KOLWENI: We vote in favour.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Western Cape?

Mr C ACKERMANN: We vote in favour.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): All nine provinces voted in favour. I, therefore, declare the report adopted in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.

  THE PROMOTION OF NEPAD WITHIN THE CONTEXT OF THE WORLD SUMMIT ON
                       SUSTAINABLE DEVELOPMENT

                      (Subject for Discussion)

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Chairperson it is indeed a great pleasure to introduce this very important topic that we are discussing this afternoon.

It is useful to begin by reflecting on what sustainable development is. In a report of the World Commission on Environment and Development in 1987 it was put as ``development that meets the needs of the present without compromising the ability of future generations to meet their own needs’’. Sustainable development, therefore, is development for humanity’s survival.

Ten years ago in Rio the UN Conference on Environment and Development committed itself to the principle of sustainable development as a blueprint for policies that would direct the social and economic progress of humanity. This meeting came to be called the Earth Summit. The meeting adopted the Rio Declaration - or, famously, Agenda 21 - and the Statement of Principles for the Sustainable Management of Forests, as well as two legally binding conventions, namely the UN Framework Convention on Climate Change and the Convention on Biological Diversity.

These agreements integrated the protection of the environment with economic and social issues. They were intended to be a central part of the policy- making process. Agenda 21, therefore, the blueprint for sustainable development, offered a common vision for growth, equity and conservation over the long term.

Today we stand at Rio plus 10. What has been achieved? Implementation of Agenda 21 was largely dependent on support from the developed countries of the North. Support in terms of resources … [Inaudible.] [Interjections.]

The microphone appears to have a mind of its own, Chairperson, because it keeps moving.

An HON MEMBER: It is sabotaging you.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: It is sabotaging the Western Cape, yes. My Whip will protect me. [Laughter.]

A cursory reading of the report on Agenda 21 clearly indicates that developed countries have dragged their feet on their Rio commitments. It is clear they have not fulfilled the promises made at Rio, either to protect their own environments or to help the developing world defeat poverty. Unfortunately, as we look beyond Agenda 21, the harmful practices of the capitalist North have continued to degrade the world’s natural resources and to further disadvantage the South. We know that the ongoing destruction of forests and land poses a threat both to those who have already benefited, as well as to the vast majority of the peoples of the world who continue to live in abject poverty.

The UN World Summit in Johannesburg has been convened in order to seek implementable responses to the ongoing challenges of sustainable development. In particular, the summit must determine the manner in which developing countries will be supported in eradicating poverty, in adopting practicable environmental protection policies and in preventing the developed North from its continued exploitation of the natural resources of the South. The summit will focus on five core areas that are central to ensuring sustainable development.

The first area is water and sanitation. More than one billion people currently live without safe drinking water and twice that number live without adequate sanitation. More than three million people die every year from diseases carried in unsafe water. We have, here in South Africa, made water a priority for development. Since 1994 water has been extended to ten million of the poorest and we have plans to eliminate the apartheid backlog of access to water by 2008. Basic sanitation has been provided to 400 000 of the poorest South Africans.

The second area of focus at the World Summit is the area of energy. Without energy there can be no development, yet today two billion people live without access to sources of sustainable energy. While the world’s poor go without energy, there is an obscene overconsumption in the developed world. The UN has called on all states to ratify the Kyoto Protocol, which addresses not only climate change and therefore a response to energy, but also a host of unsustainable practices. Sadly, it is those countries that consume the largest amounts of energy that have refused to ratify the protocol. Our mass electrification programme in South Africa is our own response to Agenda 21. Without doubt our programme has been one of the most successful mass electrification programmes of all time. Since 1991 more than 3,3 million homes have been provided with electricity.

The third area of focus is agricultural productivity. Land degradation affects perhaps as much as two thirds of the world’s agricultural land. As a result, agricultural productivity is declining sharply while the number of mouths to feed continues to grow. In Africa, especially, millions of people are threatened with famine and starvation. Sadly, on the continent we do not have the research capacity that is able to identify the exact reasons for the present low levels of agricultural productivity and the relation of this to environmental degradation. The current famine in Southern Africa requires much research.

The fourth area of focus is biodiversity and ecosystem management. Biodiversity is declining at an unprecedented rate. Much of this is as a result of the impact of human activity. Half of the tropical rain forests and mangroves of the world have already been lost. About 75% of marine fisheries have been fished to capacity and one can imagine what would happen in Cape Town if we could not get our hake and kabeljou. About 70% of coral reefs are endangered.

Finally, there is the area of health. The links between the environment and human health are powerful links. Toxic chemicals and other hazardous materials are basic elements of development, yet more than one billion people breathe unhealthy air and three million people die each year from air pollution - two thirds of them poor people, mostly women and children, dying from indoor pollution caused by burning wood and dung.

Water, energy, health, agriculture and biodiversity; that is the basic agenda of the United Nations. On 14 May 2002, in a speech entitled ``Towards a Sustainable Future’’, the UN Secretary-General ended by suggesting that the most creative agents of change must be unleashed at the Johannesburg summit and that these have to be partnerships between governments, private businesses and nonprofit organisations.

This is where Nepad comes in. We are all, as parliamentarians in Africa, familiar with Nepad. It is remarkable how this concept has generated African and world interest and support. It is good news out of Africa. A great deal is still to be achieved, but wherever we go people are aware that Africa has its own plan. Nepad has five important pillars.

The first pillar is African ownership. We insist, through this partnership, on African ownership, on African responsibility and African leadership. Nepad is our blueprint for Africa. It is a process owned by the continent and it is supported, presently, by the developed world. At the recent meeting of the G8 in Canada, it was noted by leaders of G8 countries that this is, first and foremost, a pledge by African leaders to the people of Africa to consolidate democracy and sound economic management and to promote peace, security and people-centred development.

The second pillar lies in partnership. The project is about establishing new partnerships with the developed world, about establishing mutual commitments and enforcing new obligations. It provides the framework for a new kind of engagement with the world, a new kind of relationship between Africa and the developed world. It is a relationship based on mutual accountability and mutual respect, an opportunity to move away from the colonial legacy and the donor-recipient mentality.

The third pillar is peace. We as a continent have committed ourselves to minimising conflict and we welcome successes that we have had in this area, particularly in the Democratic Republic of Congo. We also anticipate that we will have success in ending the conflict in Burundi and that the current initiatives in Sudan will bear fruit.

The fourth pillar is good governance. We are committed to maintaining transparency and accountability in institutional support mechanisms for the market. We are committed to taking responsibility, through Nepad, for the development of our continent and its responses to its needs. The fifth pillar is regional integration. We are committed to promoting regional and continental economic integration. This will be a long process to reverse decades of decline in the living standards of the people of Africa and to foster long-term sustainable development. All of us are familiar with the challenges that confront our continent: 46% of the population of sub-Saharan Africa lives on less than US $1 a day; 20% of the population of our continent is affected by conflict - one person in five; 25,3 million Africans are suffering from the Aids pandemic; and 46 million primary-school-aged children are not enrolled in school.

These figures indicate why we must take action towards sustainable development. They illustrate why African leaders have devoted so much time and effort to creating the New Partnership for Africa’s Development. President Mbeki, in partnership with other African leaders, has played a leading role in creating this vision of a new partnership for the continent. We must, then, draw attention to those issues on which we should make some progress and areas that we believe should be addressed at the Johannesburg summit with respect to Nepad.

The first of these areas is that of trade liberalisation. The architects of Nepad recognise in the document that development assistance alone will not deliver the economic growth necessary to lift millions of people out of poverty. Fairer trade and inward investment are the keys to sustained economic growth. Africa’s share of world trade today has dropped from 4% in 1990 to only 2,2% in 2001. If the South African economy is taken out of the equation, the position is even worse. Sub-Saharan Africa’s share of world trade is just 1%. There is growing recognition within the G8 countries that developed markets need to be further opened to African products.

We all know from press reports that agricultural subsidies are an emotive issue in the European Union and the United States. In fact, although it is noteworthy that donor grants annually to Africa equal around US $50 billion, it is also noteworthy that subsidies in the developed world stand at US $360 billion annually. If these subsidy levels were reduced by a mere 40%, the impact on development opportunities in the developing world would be phenomenal.

There is much that can be done within Africa itself to promote trade and regional integration within the continent. Trade barriers between African countries remain a real impediment to growth. It is within Africa’s power, now, to begin the process of reducing these barriers and of pursuing innovative policies to enhance trading opportunities on the continent and to create conditions of economic success that will alleviate poverty and thus contribute to building the conditions for sustainable development.

The second area that must be addressed is that of the massive debt that we have in the developing world. Developed countries have made an undertaking to ensure that poor countries have a sustainable level of debt. The Heavily Indebted Poor Countries Initiative is targeted to reduce the debt burden of 22 African countries by US $19 billion. Combined with other debt relief and bilateral debt-forgiveness, the total debt reduction, if agreements were implemented, would amount to US $30 billion. The problem is, there is little action in this area.

A third area that requires attention is that of education. It is vital that we increase support for basic education in Africa through bilateral aid agencies. In our education programmes we would have to pay attention to knowledge around activities that contribute to sustainable development. Speaking on education, the Secretary-General of the UN has said the following:

Education is the single most vital element in combating poverty, in empowering women, in protecting children from hazardous and exploitative labour and sexual exploitation, in promoting human rights and democracy, in protecting the environment and influencing population growth. Education is a path towards international peace and security.

According to the UN Children’s Fund, 130 million children of school-going- age in the developing world - ie 21% of all school-going-aged children - enjoyed no access to basic education in the year 1999. Nearly two thirds of the children who are denied this right to education are girl-children. Discrimination against girls based on gender perpetuates the educational gap between boys and girls.

Much attention has been directed to barriers girls face in getting to schools, but the obstacles that girls encounter at school merit serious consideration. In particular, gender-based violence continues to require attention. Policy-makers have to place emphasis not only on getting girls to school, but also on keeping them there by keeping them safe at school. Equal access is not enough. We need to do more to ensure stable situations in our school settings. Our Government has made a pledge to ensure that all South African children enjoy access to education. If our governments are to close the gender gap, which they have identified as an urgent priority, they have to confront the problems that confront young women and girls in our schools.

We also have to address the issue of traditional customs and practices that relegate girls and women to subordinate status. We have to look at work and time-consuming chores, issues of early marriage, early pregnancy and poverty that also keep girls out of school. Economic constraints and cultural practices do direct parental choices and we have to therefore, through Government action, ensure that girls enjoy opportunities that will lift them out of poverty and therefore render them citizens who can assist us in addressing the challenges of sustainable development.

The long-term social benefits of education for girls include increased family incomes, later marriages, reduced fertility rates, reduced infant and maternal mortality rates, better-nourished and healthier children and families, greater opportunities and life choices for women, better chances to avoid disease, greater political participation and, finally, improved economic opportunities. The positive effects of education for girls and boys accrue to the whole of a society.

Another area we must give attention to is that of North respect for South sustainability. Africa will not survive if the North continues to view us as an area ripe for exploitation. Some of the developed countries dump waste on our continent, hunt our animals, steal our flora, fish our seas and pay no regard to actions that will sustain our world and that will help us to lift ourselves out of our plight. [Interjections.]

What should we be doing, as parliaments, in order to give effect to the programmes that will be adopted at the summit? Parliaments need to give attention to the outcomes of the summit. Many countries on the continent do not have legislation and policy directed at environmental protection and sustainable development. As we pursue the positive policy areas that we have set out as South Africa’s contribution to reconstruction and development, it is vital for our parliaments to ensure that we also take measures to support the important areas of sustainable development that have been highlighted as necessary for ensuring the survival of humanity.

Many of us would have noted the ship containing nuclear waste that is circling our shores in the South. Not much action in legislative terms exists to deal with such activities and it is important that we support activists engaged in ensuring that the rich North does not further degrade Africa. These activities, if they were successful, would ensure that we do promote Nepad’s objectives in the context of the World Summit’s objectives of an agenda for a sustainable world. [Applause.]

Ms C-S BOTHA: Chairperson, there is still some magic attached to the idea that a United Nations conference can be held in our midst. To me the UN belonged to a remote world in New York where ordinary people did not go and the issues they discussed were not only beyond my understanding, but certainly beyond my influence.

Since South Africa became a democracy in 1994, the international world has literally descended onto our doorstep. On account of our President’s desire to make South Africa a global participant in the world economy and Africa a united force to support our need for development, our whole psyche has undergone an internationalisation, Africanisation and democratisation.

Africa, however, is a continent beset with man-made problems of poverty, hunger, disease and unemployment. The summit is an international effort to address this and Nepad is our own step towards an African solution. Its strategy to propel us into the sphere of developed rather than developing countries, includes the following preconditions as indispensable: A series of commitments by participating countries to create or consolidate basic governance processes and practice; an undertaking by participating countries to take the lead in supporting initiatives that foster good governance; the institutionalisation of commitments through African leadership to ensure that the core values of the initiative are abided by. Neither the summit nor Nepad, however, will deliver if it cannot promise true and deep democracy. This is what the President of the Islamic Republic of Iran said recently:

Democratic principles deserve to become the new norm governing global interactions. The needs of a few power holders should not supersede the interests of humanity through their now familiar practices of not censoring undemocratic governments, being unresponsive to the will and needs of their people and applying double and multiple standards in response to incidents around the globe.

This sentiment was repeated at the recent G8 summit in Canada, previously referred to, where it was agreed that at least R60 billion would go to Africa, but only to those countries who were committed to the Nepad principles. UN Secretary-General Kofi Annan has spelled out other qualifications for success. Africa’s persistent image as a continent in crisis tends to discourage domestic and foreign investors from recognising or taking advantage of the opportunities that Africa offers them. It imposes almost as high a risk premium on countries that are not in conflict as on those that are.

The world summit on sustainable investment is a huge opportunity for the promotion of South Africa and Nepad, but only if we manage to convey to all the powerful leaders who will be there that we are truly committed to those principles we espouse on the world stage and which they set as a prerequisite for co-operation.

The world summit is a wonderful opportunity for illustrating our leaders’ unwavering commitment to these principles. It gives us a world stage for voicing our unambiguous condemnations of the actions of President Mugabe in Zimbabwe. The only real reason for the starvation facing Zimbabwean citizens is the reprehensible destruction of food production which he is selling as land reform. He is not only doing short-term damage to Nepad and the African Union, but he is condemning his own people to long-term hunger and hopelessness. He has robbed farmworkers of a livelihood, he has enriched his cronies with gifts of land and he has created a class of so- called war veterans for whom he has promised land but for whom he gives no means of sustaining production.

This can still be reversed. South Africa can take the lead at the summit to show that we can be trusted with the future of Africa. President Mbeki must convince SADEC and the rest of the world to save Zimbabwe. It is planting time now, reinstitute existing farmers onto the land and within six months Zimbabwe can escape looming disaster. There can be no better way to promote Nepad at the summit. The whole world will see that we are serious about issues of governance and acting on a set of principles and core values that will allow poor people to gain power through participation, while protecting them from the arbitrary, unaccountable actions in their lives by governments, multinational corporations and other forces.

Sustainable development, the need to improve the quality of life without depleting the world’s resources, is a massive challenge to Africa, particularly as it depends not only on how we deal with our resources which will decide our future, but also how the rest of the world acts. By illustrating our commitment to proper governance we will set the tone for the summit. The challenges which Nepad faces are multitudinous, but so are the opportunities, and we should not miss the great chance that the summit offers.

Mr G B BHENGU: Thank you Chairperson and hon members. This World Summit is a declaration of hope to the people of Africa first, and of the world, that the leadership of countries of the world are committed to eradicating poverty and achieving sustainable economic growth and promoting sustainable development as well as advancing to a fully inclusive and equitable global economic system. Our presence here signals unequivocally that together we will act as an important force for global change. We are here to break new ground and to break the frontier of what is possible for attaining a balanced global environment.

What is of great importance is that we must all commit to a partnership of mutual accountability between the North and the South to effect the necessary changes as represented, for instance, by the New Partnership for Africa’s Development. The premise of this partnership must be an unambiguous commitment to solving problems together in a spirit of joint responsibility among governments, the private sector and organs of civil society. We must appeal for greater focus on the objective of defeating poverty and underdevelopment, simplification of procedures and achieving greater transparency in the awarding of grants.

The IFP supports the concept of the promotion of Nepad within the context of the World Summit on Sustainable Development. While it is not the first development plan for Africa, Nepad is new in the sense that for the first time our African leaders have taken the initiative and have actively become involved in the conceptualisation of the programme and in working towards its implementation. Nepad aims at poverty eradication, reversal of the marginalisation of Africa and promoting sustainable development, democracy and good governance on the continent.

Before one can go further with the promotion of Nepad within the context of the World Summit on Sustainable Development, one needs to understand what sustainable development is. Sustainable development is the development that meets the needs of the present without compromising the ability of future generations.

To meet their needs, we need to preserve the earth for future generations as we have found it. When one looks at the theme chosen for the WSSD to be held in Johannesburg next week, which is, People, Planet and Prosperity'', it calls for improving the quality of life of all people in the world without increasing the use of natural resources. The IFP believes that Africa as a developing continent still has a unique opportunity to lead the way. Africa is rich in agricultural, mineral and aquatic raw materials that need to be used to develop the continent's economy and its people. We still have a chance to do it right the first time. We have learned from the mistakes of the developed countries, which have largely destroyed their own natural resource bases and are now looking to developing countries to provide them with such resources. However, as the President of our country said in a speech on Nepad last year: We in Africa need to add value to our natural resources through beneficiation so that the rest of the world receive them as manufactured goods, and not merely as raw materials.’’

Some of Africa’s obstacles to sustainable development have been the devastating results of wars on the environment. Nepad seeks to address this through environmental initiative programmes, which seek to nurture the vast, complex and rich African environment for the benefit of all humanity. The programme deals with combating desertification, wetlands conservation and water management, global warming, transfrontier conservation and environmental governance. The IFP supports the promotion of Nepad within the context of the World Summit on Sustainable Development. [Applause.]

Dr E A CONROY: Chairperson and colleagues, the New Partnership for African Development or Nepad is an action plan based on globalist and Africanist partnerships for African development in the 21st century. It creates obligations for African leaders and nations, but it is also a global partnership with obligations for the G8 countries. While the situation on the African continent calls for action, poverty, as well as uneven access to resources, infectious diseases, persistent undemocratic governance in some states, and too many armed conflicts threaten Africa’s human and state security. Threats to security, development and democracy therefore need to be addressed urgently and Nepad offers such a framework.

Prior to Nepad, co-ordinated co-operation plans were largely lacking. However, the fundamental objective of Nepad is to promote sustainable development on the African continent in a manner which encompasses the burning social, economic and environmental issues, especially the eradication of poverty by meeting the millennium development goals. It is generally understood and accepted that this is a necessary precondition to place the continent, as a whole, on a path of sustainable growth and development. Countries agree that the World Summit on Sustainable Development must focus on the implementation and hence the establishment of concrete actions at all levels to achieve sustainable development including regional initiatives such as Nepad.

It is also agreed that, to achieve sustainable development, it will require, amongst other things, a just and equitable social order based on the eradication of poverty as a developmental obstacle.

Poverty is both the cause and result of economic inefficiency and the underutilisation of our nation’s resources, and results in great suffering amongst our people. It has severe implications for virtually every facet of our national life and reflects a situation where more than 20 million people, numbering over half of our population, have incomes well below the minimum necessary to make ends meet, and are living in abject poverty.

Two thirds of our children live in poor families. The effect on our children growing up under its shadow is significant and lasting. In dealing with domestic poverty on a continent where migration in search of economic opportunity is a general feature, South Africa is confronted with an additional problem of dealing with the consequences of the policies of its neighbours in Southern Africa and further afield.

The interconnectedness of many of the causes of poverty and its consequences, however, suggests that the reduction of domestic poverty is also a regional issue. It is evident that South Africa, together with the rest of sub-Saharan Africa, could lose the battle against poverty if a comprehensive regional strategy is not implemented. There is, therefore, a priority needed in our country and indeed on our continent to attack, in a sustainable way, the fundamental roots of poverty. South Africa’s integration into the global economic mainstream and its constructive engagement with its neighbours to help stabilise the Southern African region and the African continent is of vital interest and importance if we are to address and overcome the problem of domestic poverty.

In conclusion, the New NP believes that South Africa must work purposefully through the mechanisms provided by the Nepad initiative and the African Union towards promoting democracy and responsible economic policies necessary for increased confidence, investment and prosperity in the region. We also firmly believe that the 2002 World Summit on Sustainable Development will not only contribute towards the accomplishment of these goals, but that it will leave its beneficial mark on Africa and its children for generations to come.

Mr P D N MALOYI: Chairperson, after listening to Dr Conroy and Ms Botha I thought that it is necessary for me to start from the beginning.

Members will remember that, in July 1979, African heads of states met in Monrovia. What they intended to do in that meeting was to examine the economic problems that faced the African continent. In that meeting they came to a conclusion that concrete steps had to be taken in order to realise national and collective self-reliance in the economic and social domain which faced the continent as a result of the new international economic order.

That meeting further resolved amongst other things, to do the following: promote economic and social integration of the African economies; create national, subregional and regional institutions in pursuit of self- reliance; ensure self-reliance in food production; and guarantee the African people proper and adequate nutrition, together with other basic needs which are necessary for a civilised standard of living.

The OAU Secretary-General and the Executive Secretary of the Economic Commission for Africa were charged with the responsibility of coming up with a sound plan in order to put in place the above-mentioned objectives. That, then resulted in the formation of the Lagos Plan of Action and a Final Act of Lagos for the economic development of Africa. The Final Act of Lagos committed the African governments to establishing an African economic commission by the year 2000. It stated clear steps that had to be taken to that effect.

I thought that I should give that background because other people are under the impression that Africa, before 1994, did nothing to address this question. On 31 October 2001, in the Joint Sitting of the National Assembly and the National Council of Provinces, the President, Comrade Thabo Mbeki, had this to say and I quote:

When, at the end of the century, historians cast their eyes back over this, the 21st and African century, what will they see? They should see that Africa has, at last, emerged from a long period of darkness and fear into one of light and a dream fulfilled. They should see the reality of a new African who, having refused to be conditioned by circumstances imposed by a past of slavery, of colonialism, of neo-colonialism, of racism and apartheid, has succeeded in creating a new world of peace, of democracy, of development and of prosperity. These are Africans who have chosen to define themselves in action. They have grown tired of being told who they are, where they come from, where they ought to go and how they should proceed with their journey. Because they have decided to become the masters and mistresses of their own destiny, to sing their own songs and to dance to their own tune, they have succeeded in claiming the 21st century as their own.

Unlike the earlier initiatives, Nepad, in line with what the President said, tackles the issues of good governance frankly and goes further to set up institutional mechanisms that can put politics at the command of economics in Africa. Nepad is not shy to support democracy. It is very clear on peace, security and human rights as issues which are critical to any prospect of development in Africa. Priority will be given, therefore, to the settlement of internal conflict in Africa and the creation of a political democratic order, wherever such order is wanting.

Since 1992 to date, there have been a number of changes. Amongst others, the creation of the World Trade Organisation, and an increased number of regional trade agreements etc. These changes, therefore, suggest that the programme for sustainable development that was agreed upon at the Rio Summit in 1992, commonly known as Agenda 21, needs to be recontextualised. Hopefully, those who will be attending that summit, on behalf of South Africa, will begin to engage with that question.

Nepad is a document which is conscious of political economy and the role of subjective factors in influencing forces of social transformation. It is fully conscious of the structural constraints that the world economic system places on the potential for development in Africa. It therefore suggests engagement and partnership rather than dependence and subservience.

The engagement that we are talking about is to, amongst others, renegotiate international trade arrangements, improve equity in the WTO rules and regulations, reduce unequal exchange in international commerce, and have better and more rewarding access to foreign markets. This partnership implies a kind of social democracy at a global level whereby those who have been favoured by history, for various reasons, and thus developed, should have some vested interests in investing in the rapid development of the currently underdeveloped Africa. That should be done, provided that it is done with the African leaders taking the initiatives. [Applause.]

Mr R M NYAKANE: Chairperson, I apologise. It seems that there is muti around here, we always miss cards. I do not know why this continues. [Laughter.]

I think the World Summit on Sustainable Development serves as a world forum to underpin the relevance of Nepad. I just want to rally a bit around Nepad. It is currently argued that Africa would not be a continent with more than 80% of its inhabitants still living in varying degrees of poverty. Hence, the 1980 OAU-inspired Lagos Plan of Action succeeded in carrying out its aims and objectives to their logical conclusion.

Nepad is a product of the New Africa Initiative which was adopted during the 37th OAU Summit and has since been recognised in Africa and abroad as the top priority development for our continent.

The catchword ``Nepad’’ has been coined for the sake of convenience and does not suggest to me that it differs substantially from the one called Lagos Plan of Action which my friend and I have already alluded to.

If one were asked to depict what the Nepad mission basically is, one would echo the words of Dr E Links when he said, and I quote:

It contains the seminal seeds for the regeneration of the African continent that has been ravaged for so long by wars, famine and other scourges.

Professor Wiseman Nkuhlu, who is the CEO for Nepad, has aptly depicted Nepad from the social point of view as follows, and I quote:

The initiative [Nepad] serves as a means of consolidating the pride of Africa’s people in their own humanity and as a confirmation of the common humanity of the people of the world.

No state within the African continent can claim to be self-sufficient and adequately equipped to manage its domestic problems single-handed. When HIV/Aids strikes in Ethopia, the A-B-C gospel-A - abstain, B - be faithful, C - condomise - will spread to Kenya, Uganda, Sudan, etc, because the disease knows no boundary. The effects of famine, wars and land matters like we see in Zimbabwe now permeate through our borders and have a negative impact in the neighbouring states. Therefore, the need for the partnership in addressing the African continent’s constraints collectively and jointly, cannot be overemphasised.

Nepad has destined itself to actively participate in the global business such as trade and investment, agricultural development and energy. As has already been indicated by people such as Xabashe, the electricity producers union could help move the continent towards self-reliance in line with Nepad, areas in trade and investment, agricultural development and mining, ICT in Africa as well as in the field of HIV/Aids economics.

Because I am used to three to four minutes, I am obsessed with preparing my speech very briefly. [Laughter.] In conclusion, may I commend this initiative and wish it success. Let not the experiences of the 1980 Lagos Plan of Action and those of the organisation of intergovernmental organisation established on 25 May 1963 repeat themselves. I wonder if I am on the same wavelength with the House when I talk about these particular ventures of this organisation. [Applause.]

Mr J O TLHAGALE: Chairperson and hon members of the House. After listening to the hon Chairperson of the NCOP, I thought of rippling out of this debate. [Laughter.] Two days hence our country would witness the convergence of the largest international crowd that has ever come to our country. Except for sporting events no other event has ever drawn together a crowd in excess of 65 000 people. The purpose of this World Summit on Sustainable Development would be to deliberate on issues of common developmental concern.

However, the emphasis as I see it, would fall on the promotion of Nepad. This programme is about moving away from the continent’s broad reliance on loans and aid, towards self-sustaining development and economic advancement. A Setswana idiom says`` mphemphe o a lapisa motho o kgona ke sa gagwe’’. This means that asking and asking again is tiring. A person is satisfied by his own.

One of the main objectives of Nepad is to get the support of as many industrially advanced outside countries as possible, in return for good and democratic governance without which it would be impossible to engage in meaningful economic activity. Whilst we are wooing the support of the industrially advanced outside countries, we should, as different affiliates of this country, be prepared to provide that co-operation and support to each other even before it is sought from us. Charity begins at home.

This summit, as I understand it, is the first of its kind in our country and it is therefore noncomparable with anything that ever happened here. It is unique. All it needs from us is support and more support. A disturbing feature at this time in our history is our Northern neighbour, who is roaring like a wounded lion in a jungle. He needs our special attention lest he scares away our visitors and other friends. [Laughter.]

His latest way of dealing with the farmers and the opposition is intolerable and I think President Mbeki must act now and take the bull by its horns. Apart from that, we wish all the delegates to the summit good deliberations and that the summit achieves what it is intended to achieve.

Ms J L KGOALI: Modulasetulo, le Motlats’amodulasetulo, maloko a hlomphehileng a ntlo ena. Ke tlotla ho nna kajeno ho nka monyetla ona, hore ke tshwaele ka tseo tse seng di ile tsa bolelwa ke modulasetulo wa Lekgotla lena la Diporofensi. Ho a makatsa ka nako e nngwe ha mekgatlo ya rona e phehisang, ere ha e bua ka dintho tse ntle, e re `Moporesidente wa naha ena’, e re ha e bua ka tse mpe, e mo bitse ka lebitso. Ka hoo ke ne ke rata hore, re nne re ele hloko hore histori ya rona, e ntse e ngolwa, hore ke mora Mbeki, ya ntseng a etsa tse ntle. (Translation of Sotho paragraph follows.)

[Chairperson, Deputy Chairperson, hon members of this House, it is a great honour for me today to have this opportunity to speak about the issues that have been dealt with by the Chairperson of the National Council of Provinces. It is sometimes surprising when the opposition parties refer to the President of the country when they are talking about positive things, and when they talk about negative things they just call him by name. I would therefore like to say, we should be aware that our history is being compiled, and it will mention that Mr Mbeki is the one who did those positive things.]

For far too long Africa has been seen as a problem to be solved, rather than as a challenge presenting a set of interests and values that are shared with the rest of the world, while most of its inhabitants live in abject poverty. To me this is perhaps not a surprising image, for a continent where half of its eight million people exist on less than US $1 a day. It is however, encouraging to note that recent events suggest a more positive future for the African continent.

A plenary session of the 2002 meeting of the World Economic Forum held in New York, was focused on the New Partnership for Africa’s Development (Nepad). A plan that will focus and is focused on Africa’s reconstruction in cooperation with industrialised countries. Ten percent of the world’s population live in sub-Saharan Africa, and yet the region produces only one percent of the global GDP.

The total combined annual economic output of the 48 economies of sub- Saharan Africa is just $300 million roughly, the same as that of Argentina which has approximately 30 million inhabitants. Nepad’s vision, born from former initiatives such as the Millennium Partnership for African Recovery Programme, and later as Nepad, is being spearheaded by the South African President, the honourable Thabo Mbeki. Its aim is to revitalise African economies by promoting intra-African trade, and infrastructure links, to establish conditions of good economic and political governance.

As such, Nepad not only represents a way to bridge growing development divides internationally, but it also means a way by which the industrial world can show their commitment to Africa’s development. Today we have five days to go to the opening of the WSSD to be held on South African shores, which will not necessarily dwell purely on environmental issues, but, more importantly, will focus on the needs of the developing world. It will aim to link poverty with human development.

I believe that sustainability is one of the most important issues of the 21st century, and that the focus on environmental protection solely, is not enough. Hopefully, this summit aims to demonstrate how the people of the developing world have suffered as a result of the disproportionately high consumption of the earth’s natural resources by the rich countries of the developed nations.

I want to say that our concerns, as Africans, are that the reality of the world today is still very much like it was in 1992. A world where poverty and inequality are still prevalent. We still live in a world where the poor are victims of cultural destruction, social injustice, and economic deaths and struggles, for access to the basic human rights, of a clean and healthy environment. These needs also manifest themselves acutely in our country.

It is for these reasons that the WSSD presents us as South Africans, and indeed as Africans, with the unique opportunity to communicate our vision as contained in Nepad, for a just and equitable world. Moreover, it gives us an opportunity to address the Southern African region’s challenge to eradicate poverty, to place our countries on a path of sustainable growth and development.

Modulasetulo, re na le takatso ya ho bona naha ya borona ya Aforika Borwa, hammoho le dinaha tsa Aforika ka kakaretso, ho bona dinaha tsena di hlabollotswe. E le dinaha tseo batho ba ka phelang bophelo bo betere, bo labalabelwang ke mang kapa mang. Ka hoo, re rata ho bontsha hore, rona ba mokgatlo wa ANC, re eme nokeng Moporesidente wa rona Thabo Mbeki, ho ba le Aforika e ntle, ho ba le Aforika e nang le bophelo bo botle, e tle e be le mebuso e metle, e laolehang. [Ditlatse] (Translation of Sotho paragraph follows.)

[Chairperson, we would like to see our country, South Africa, and other African countries in general, being developed. They should be countries where people have a better life, the life that everyone wishes for. Therefore, we want to show that we, as the ANC, will always support our President, Mr Thabo Mbeki, so that we can have a beautiful Africa, an Africa that has a better life, with better governments, ones which are governable. [Applause.]]

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Chairperson, I would like to begin by thanking all the hon members who have participated in this debate. I think their contributions have been most insightful and helpful in elaborating on this important subject.

In commenting on some of the areas that have been raised, I think it is important to stress that we have had action before, but we have not had responses. We have had reviews, but we have not had implementation. A lot of what is required does not depend on the poor developing world. It depends on the rich developed world.

The rich developed world does not want to respond. A large part of our problems stem from the greedy and selfish actions of the Western World …

Hon MEMBERS: Yes.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: … their racism, their uncaring capitalism, and their poor attention to the needs of the developing world. All of these have played a role in environmental degradation. That is the reason. If one has countries whose sole want is energy for themselves only, who take all the oil that is produced in the world and have no regard for the developing parts of the world, then one has a very serious problem, and little attention is paid to addressing sustainable development.

The greatest threats to global sustainable development are poverty and inequality. The most poor in the world, and the most unequal in the world are in Africa. In order to achieve sustainable development, we have to address poverty and inequality. If we look at the plans for Africa that have been referred to - the Lagos Plan and other plans - they did not succeed primarily because they did not enjoy support from the West. The West has never been interested in assisting our continent to succeed. The West has merely, in a rapacious way, made use of our natural resources without wanting to put back, into the continent, support to ensure that we do succeed in developing our people.

In conclusion, I have to repeat what I said earlier, and that is that we as parliaments must pay more attention to issues of sustainable development. As this Parliament and as this House, we must look at the form of legislation that we have which gives attention to matters relating to the environment. We have to ensure that we monitor business practices. A great deal of complaints have been heard, for example, emanating from certain communities here in the Western Cape about pollution. As a House, have we looked at that pollution? Have we looked at what legislation governs those businesses in their practice and the escalation of poisonous gases that have been complained about?

In terms of agricultural practices, what reviews are we carrying out on the use of hazardous pesticides or hazardous fertilisers and other products that can lead to the kind of environmental waste and danger that we are talking about? What have we done, as this House, to monitor the management of waste in our provinces? Are we managing waste? Are we finding waste being dumped in our country? Do we know exactly what is going on? Much of this activity occurs in secrecy. With our powers of oversight and monitoring, we should be playing much more of an active role in order to ensure that we do protect the environment and that we support the development both of the continent and the people who live in Africa. Other areas on which Government has sought support has been the use of biodegradable materials. What are we doing in this area as this House?

In conclusion, it is vital that our parliaments pay attention to issues of sustainable development; take an interest in environmental protection, and take an interest in saving the world, for the people of the world, not for itself, because if we do not develop responses that sustain our world, it is humanity that dies. All our actions are directed at ensuring that people can live safely, that humanity can survive and that, finally, we will eradicate poverty and inequality in our world.

I would like to thank everyone for having participated. I hope we will all contribute to the debates at the World Summit. I would just like to say to the hon Tlhagale that the hon Kolweni sitting here next to me informed me that the ANC, at some of its rallies, has had more than 80 000 people. Therefore, there have been gatherings in South Africa of more than 50 000 persons! [Laughter.] [Applause.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: That concludes the discussion and we take this opportunity to thank the Chairperson for leading us in this important discussion and in preparation for the coming conference. I hope members are properly armed to go and participate actively in this World Summit.

CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF SELECT COMMITTEE ON LAND AND ENVIRONMENTAL  AFFAIRS - EXCLUSION OF TWO PORTIONS OF LAND FROM KALAHARI GEMSBOK NATIONAL
                                PARK

Mr M A SULLIMAN: Chairperson and hon members, it is important that the Ae! Kalahari Heritage Park Agreement is seen in its proper historical context. For generations the San and the Mier communities have used large tracts of land in the Mier and adjacent areas for hunting and food gathering purposes. However, the advent of colonialism, and subsequently apartheid, brought with it the evils of land expropriation and displacement.

The 2002 agreement follows on the 1999 agreement signed between all the stakeholders, namely, the Khomani San community, the Mier community, the SA National Parks Board, the Ministers of Land Affairs and Tourism and the Minister of Public Works respectively, as well as the commission of the restitution of land rights.

In terms of the 2002 agreement, the National Parks and the Minister for Agriculture and Land Affairs will transfer approximately 28 000 ha of land in the parks to the San community. This land is adjacent to the southern boundary of the park adjacent to Twee Rivieren. It is referred to as the San heritage land. The San community will be the owners of this land.

The SA National Parks and the Minister for Agriculture and Land Affairs will transfer approximately 30 000 ha of land in the park to the Mier community. This land is adjacent to the southern boundary of the park adjacent to the Mier game farms between Dabas and Loretto. It is referred to as the Mier heritage land. The Mier community will be the owners of this land. Therefore, the San and the Mier heritage land are jointly referred to as the heritage lands, because the San community has been dispossessed of much more than the Mier community. The 1999 agreement guaranteed additional and special rights to the San community in the remainder of the park.

The communities, mindful of the historical umbilical cord, undertook to utilise this land for conservation, ecotourism and cultural activities. The agreement, however, and importantly so, does not make provision for housing and mining. Also, in this agreement, the San and the Mier heritage land will be subject to separate contract park agreements with the SA National Parks. The key elements of this agreement are as follows: the SA National Parks will be responsible for the conservation of animals, plants and the natural environment; the community parties, by means of the entities that represent them, use the land in terms of the agreement as landowners.

Although the land forms part of the park, the community parties have retained the commercial benefits and rights. The two communities may also use the land for symbolic and cultural purposes. Moreover, the SA Parks and the communities forum form a joint management board. They are, therefore, in terms of the agreement, referred to as the main parties. Matters of communal concern will be discussed in this JMB.

The joint monitoring board will not be a separate legal entity. Each party will act in its own name and will have the right to appoint duly elected members to the joint monitoring board. The parties also reserve the right to launch and manage projects of their own, with each other or with an external party. For example, the agreement does not impose any obligation on the Mier community to run any projects jointly with the San community or the SA National Parks.

Also, each contract has a lifespan of 99 years. However, the Mier community can terminate the agreement regarding the Mier heritage land after 30 years, as can the San community regarding the San heritage land. The SA National Parks may also terminate these contracts after such period. Importantly, though, is that if any party wants to terminate the contract part, it has to give a three-year notice. Although parties are free to undertake projects on their own as earlier mentioned, the main parties committed themselves, as the main project, to jointly establish a lodge. This lodge will be situated in one or both of the parks. In this respect, the SA National Parks has already secured funding. The income that accrues from this lodge will be evenly divided on an annual basis. Because of the San’s wider historical ownership of the area, they have been afforded further rights in the agreement. To settle this claim, the parties have agreed on the following: The SA National Park agreed that the San community also have rights to the San heritage land over the remainder of the claimed area park.

In addition, the Mier community agreed to transfer 7 000 ha of land in the Mier area to the San community as a gesture of good neighbourliness in an exchange for the latter abandonment of its claim in the Mier area. However, this land still needs to identified. Critically, though, this is in terms of the agreement. The Mier community is encouraged to do this speedily and by no later than 27 May 2004. If not, the Mier obligation increases to 8000 ha.

Other exclusive rights to the sale include the following: a preferential right partnership with the SA National Parks regarding ecotourism development, symbolic and cultural rights. It is the San community’s stated intention, with the possible assistance of the Mier community, to acquire additional rights for the community park. We believe the SA National Parks are willing to assist in this regard. Central to the agreement is also the provision of a dispute resolution mechanism.

In conclusion, the agreement took effect on 28 May this year and since then it can only be terminated by mutual agreement between the parties. I think it is important for me to mention that in terms of section 2(3) of the National Parks Act, Act 57 of 1976, the said properties may not be excluded from the Kalahari Gemsbok National Park, except under the authority of a resolution of Parliament, and this is precisely what we are going to do today. We would also like to make use of this opportunity to extend our appreciation to the Ministers of Land Affairs and Environmental Affairs and Tourism and all other stakeholders for this significant achievement. This agreement will go a long way towards contributing to the sustainable development of the land, the environment and the people of the Northern Cape as a whole. [Applause.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Order! That concludes the debate. I shall now put the question. The question is that the Report be adopted. As the decision is dealt with in terms of section 65 of the Constitution, I need to ascertain whether delegation heads are present, because the House is depleted. I have to check on that. Eastern Cape, are you there? Free State’s delegation head? Thank you. Gauteng? KwaZulu-Natal? Mpumalanga? Northern Cape? North West? Northern Province? Western Cape? The backbencher? Thank you.

In accordance with Rule 71, I shall first allow provinces the opportunity to make their declaration of vote if they so wish. Any province? I take it there is none.

We shall now proceed to voting on the question. I shall do this in alphabetical order per province. Delegation heads must please indicate to the Chair whether they vote in favour, against or abstain from voting. Eastern Cape?

Mrs B N DLULANE: Iyayixhasa ingxelo. [We support.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Free State?

Mr T S SETONA: We vote in favour.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Gauteng?

Ms J L KGOALI: Ons ondersteun. [We support.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): KwaZulu-Natal? Mpumalanga?

Ms B THOMSON: We support.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Mpumalanga?

Mrs M P THEMBA: Siyawusekela. [We support.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Northern Cape?

Mrs E N LUBIDLA: We support.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Northern Province?

Mr M I MAKOELA: Thekga. [Support.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): North West?

Rre Z S KOLWENI: Ke a rona. [We support.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M L Mushwana): Western Cape? All nine provinces voted in favour. I therefore declare the Report adopted in terms of section 65 of the Constitution. [Applause.] The Secretary will read the fifth order of the day.

CONSIDERATION OF REPORT OF JOINT MONITORING COMMITTEE ON IMPROVEMENT OF QUALITY OF LIFE AND STATUS OF WOMEN - VIOLENCE AGAINST WOMEN

Ms M P THEMBA: Sihlalo lohlon, malunga lahlon, manene nemanenekati, kuvisana buhlungu kakhulu kukhuluma nakufanele sidzingidze lendzaba yekuhlukunyetwa kwabomake onkhe emalanga kodvwa kutfolakale shangatsi kute inchubekela embili. (Translation of Siswati paragraph follows.)

[Ms M P THEMBA: Chairperson, hon members, ladies and gentlemen, it is very painful when one has to speak about and discuss matters of violence against women which happens every day, whilst, obviously, nothing progressive is done about it.]

It is perhaps fitting to remind ourselves, during this month of women’s emancipation, about the words of our first democratically elected President, Comrade Nelson Mandela, during the opening of South Africa’s first democratically elected Parliament, when he said: ``Freedom cannot be achieved unless women have been emancipated from all forms of oppression.’’

Indeed, the hon comrade was right, for we can never call our country fully liberated if our women are not free from these shackles of oppression. Indeed, violence against women is the worst form of oppression with the most devastating consequences both to women and the society at large.

The UNIFEM document, a Global Campaign on Elimination of Violence Against Women, describes violence against women as an obstacle to the achievement of the objectives of equality, development and peace.

Violence against women both violates and impairs or nullifies the enjoyment by women both of their human rights and fundamental freedoms. The long standing failure to protect and promote those rights and freedoms, in the case of violence against women, is a matter of concern to everyone and should really be addressed.

It is an honour for me today to address this issue that is closest to my heart, an issue that touches the depth of my soul for I am a mother, a woman, I have daughters and I am part of our nation and our democracy. I am referring to violence against women. As the Joint Monitoring Committee on Improvement of Quality of Life and Status of Women, this issue is central to our committee.

As a nation we fought against all forms of abuse, oppression and discrimination. We fought for every South African, black or white, male or female, to claim this land as his or her very own and exercise his or her freedom freely without fear and without being subjected to any form of abuse.

Women were central to that struggle. We fought for a society that is free from violence against women which is, clearly, disrespect and abuse of the individual’s human and constitutional rights. Violence against women is not confined to any race. It knows no economic and social boundaries. It happens to women of all ages and it is present in both urban and rural areas. Today it is happening to someone else’s daughter and tomorrow it could be yours or mine. It is definitely a concern that affects all of us from our diverse walks of life. It is an issue that is never to be taken for granted.

It is a saddening reality of the times that we are living in that women are abused everyday, kuto tonkhe tindzawo, endleleni, emakhaya kanye nasemisebentini, bomake bahlala bahlukunyetwa. [Everywhere, along the way, at their homes and at their workplaces, women are always abused.]

These realities are visible everywhere. In our media, in our communities, in the eyes of children whose innocence has been lost and in the eyes of an abused woman, mother or daughter, whose eyes reflect the loss of hope and self-esteem. They are not only visible in our own country but throughout the world. We have heard of acid cases in India, of forced marriages in Nigeria, of Sharia law.

When I read about baby Tshepang my soul was shattered. When I heard about a women who, after years of physical, emotional and sexual abuse by her husband, was killed by that same husband, I was devastated. I have heard of cases where fathers have fathered their own grandchildren. The list goes on.

These instances makes me wonder about where our democracy is going to. But then I realise that sitting back and wondering never helped solve anything. The important question is, what can be done? What are we doing as Government, as leadership, as a nation, as societies and as communities?

What are we doing as church ministers and as teachers to combat and prevent these immoral, violent acts imposed on our women? What can we do to make sure that this violence comes to an end so that our women feel safe in our country? The same country that they also voted for. What are we doing to extend our support to the victims of these gruesome deeds and inhumane behaviour? Surely, we cannot sit back and do nothing hoping that things will change in their own time, for these acts are destroying our nation, our future, the moral fibre of our society and our children, who are our hope for tomorrow.

Based on the study that was conducted and presented to us by the office on the status of women about three months ago, we, the committee, discovered that violence against women throughout most communities was pervasive. It was apparent through religious, cultural, traditional practices, beliefs and value systems.

Further, there was also very little information about the actual programmes of Government. The whole issue of gender equality is not fully integrated as part of an overall development perspective. It was concluded that we cannot achieve the de facto equality if this is not addressed. The study also looked at the issue of stereotyping. According to this study, most women interviewed felt that they are still portrayed negatively in the media. The issue of violence against women was erroneous throughout the study and the link with HIV came out very strongly. It is no secret that women and children who have been victims of violence, sexual abuse and any violence face special risks of contracting sexually transmitted diseases, particularly HIV/Aids.

In the hearings that we conducted last year, it emerged strongly that sexual assault and domestic violence are more prevalent in South African society than ever recognised and that fear and expectation of violence is a way of life for many South African women. That is a challenge to us as policy-makers and as the representation of the voices of our people and of the abused women who are crying for protection against these monsters.

Clearly, we have passed some laws that protect women against violence and abuse. But more still needs to be done to tighten the laws and also in terms of implementation of those laws, public awareness, education, health and so on. With regards to the existing shelters for abused women, more still needs to be done.

The laws that we put in place alone cannot transform the cultural and social environment that gives rise to and condones the widespread violence against women. Ending this kind of violence requires long-term commitment and strategies involving all parts of society. Masivukeni sizenzele. (Let us wake up and do it for ourselves.)

Community-based strategies can focus on empowering women, reaching out to men and changing the beliefs and attitudes that permit abusive behaviour. Only when women gain their place as equal members of society will violence against women no longer be an invisible norm but a shocking aberration. The media can also play a vital role in this war against violence against women. It can be a powerful instrument that can be used to fight, and create awareness. To conclude, let us join hands and fight against violence against women. And I would further like to congratulate the Government of the people for its efforts and the role it has played in ensuring that, indeed, violence against women must come to an end. [Applause.]

Nkk B THOMSON: Ngiyabonga Mphathisihlalo, ngithe namhlanje ake ngizame ukuthatha iziyalelo zakho ukuthi sikhulume ngendlela ezokwazi ukuthi abantu le ekhaya lapho siphuma khona bazame ukulandela ingxoxo yethu. Ukupheliswa kodlame lwanoma iluphi uhlobo kuyinto ehlala isematheni ethu sonke. Ulimi lwethu selokhu kwaba ongaphansi nongaphezulu sizama ukuqhamuka namakhambi okuqeda lesi sihlava, ikakhulukazi abantwana nabadala sibabona kuyibo abaphezulu emlonyeni walolu dlame. Ngiyacabanga ukuthi mhlawumbe lokhu kwenziwa amandla la amadoda anawo. Nokho-ke siyawacela la madoda ukuthi la mandla awo awawasebenzise ngendlela efanele. Asiboni ukuthi kuyindlela eyiyona ukuthi bawasebenzise kithina njengomame. Uma ngabe befuna ukulwa abaphume udede laphaya namanye amadoda yikhona sizobona kahle. Akuyona into enhle ukushaya umuntu egoqe izandla engaphindeseli. Lolu dlame luyagqama-ke emakhaya, ezikoleni, emisebenzini nasemiphakathini yethu. Kusemandleni ethu-ke njengamalungu ePhalamende ukuthi sizame ukuyixosha le mpethu esiyibona iphithizela kubantu bethu.

Akukade khona kule Ndlu sithole umbiko wekomidi eliholwa ubaba uHwale, ikomidi lezemfundo nezemidlalo. Sonke kulendlu sabamba ongezansi uma sizwa ukuthi laba esibeka kubo amathemba ethu ukuthi basibhekele abantwana bethu, othisha phela, abanye babo yibo kanye abahlukumeza abantwana bethu. Siyazi ukuthi akusibo bonke othisha abenza lokho, kodwa-ke kulabo thisha abaqhubeka nokwenza lokho, singomama sithi balibambe lingashoni.

Siyabancoma-ke labo abawaziyo umsebenzi wabo abawuyela ezikoleni.

Iyadumaza le mibiko ngoba uma sithumela abantwana bethu sisuke singazimisele ukuthi kanti sebeyoba amakhosikazi ezikoleni, sisuke sazi ukuthi bangabafundi. Manje ngizothi ukuthinta futhi olunye uhlobo lodlame engaziyo ukuthi obaba abaluthandisisi kahle, lolu olubizwa ngokuthi i-spause rape or maternal rape. Siyathanda-ke singomama ukuthi obaba bakuqonde kahle ukuthi le mizimba yethu siyisebenzisa uma sithanda, mhla sithi asithandi sinelungelo lokuthi bakuhloniphe lokho ukuthi - cha namhlanje baba akuvumi, bese silindela ukuba ubaba alihloniphe lelo lungelo lethu. [Ihlombe.]

Uma kungubaba wangempela onekhono mhlawumbe engangikhipha nakuleso simo sokuba ngithi namhla cha angithandi. Ngakho-ke ningasebenzisa amakhono enu mhlazane omama bethi abathandi. Hhayi lamakhono odlame. Sithi phansi ngodlame.

Ake sibuyele futhi kulo omunye umthetho kababa uMdladlana we-Labour Relations Act, lapho sibona khona udlame oluqhamuka komama beluqondise kwabanye futhi omama. Sibonile komabonakude uMnyango uphuma ungena emafemini ubheka ukuxhashazwa kwabasebenzi. Njengelungu laleli komidi elibhekele omama, ngithi ngelinye ilanga kuyodingeka siphume umkhankaso siwuqondise kuwo amalungu ePhalamende sibone ukuthi wona ngabe abaholela kanjani abasebenzi laphaya emakhaya. Uma ungathandi ukuziwashela, kusemandleni akho ukuba ufune umuntu ozokuwashela. Kodwa uma ufuna ukuwashelwa, uphekelwe, undlalelwe umbhene uwashelwe ukhaphethi, kufanele isandla sakho sigudle ngasekhukhwini. [Inhlombe.]

Kuyoba kubi-ke uma sithola ukuthi amalungu akule Ndlu nawo angena kulo mkhakha wabantu abaxhaphaza abanye, ngeke kusijabulise lokho. (Translation of Zulu paragraphs follows.)

[Ms B THOMSON: Chairperson, today I decided to take your advice that we should speak in a way that will enable people at home, where we come from, to understand and follow our debates. The eradication of any form of violence is something that all of us always talk about. We are always talking about a solution to it, to eradicate this disease, as the older people and children are the ones who suffer most because of this disease.

I think that this is caused by the power that these men have. However, we ask these men to use their power in an appropriate manner. We do not think that it is a good thing that they use their power on us as women. If they want to fight they should come out clearly and fight a fair fight with other men so that we can see their power. There is nothing as bad as beating someone who cannot beat you back.

This type of violence is rife in homes, schools, workplaces, even in our communities. The onus is upon us as members of Parliament to try to eradicate this evil thing among our people.

Recently in this House, we read a report of the committee on education and sport, which was led by Hwale. We were all shocked in this House when we heard that the people who were entrusted with the job of looking after our children, the teachers, have among them some who abuse our children. We know that not all of them are doing that. To those who do it, as women we say one day we will catch them. We would like to commend those who know what they are going to school to do.

These reports are saddening, because when we send our children to school, we do not mean that they should be made wives. We send them to be learners.

Now I am going to talk about another type of violence which I know that fathers of our children will not feel comfortable with when we talk about it, the so called spouse rape or maternal rape. As women we would like the fathers of our children to understand that we use our bodies when we are in the mood to do so. When we say no, we have a right to have that respected when we say: No, father of my children, today I do not feel I want to do it. [Applause.]

If he is a real father, one who has skill, he could take me out of that situation of not liking it. Therefore, men can use their skills when women say they do not feel they want to do it. They should not use the skills of violence. Down with violence!

Now let us go back to the Labour Relations Act of father Mdladlana, where we see woman-on-woman violence. We saw on television that the department was up and down in factories looking for those who exploit workers. As a member of the women’s committee, I say, one day we will need to launch a campaign that will go to the homes of the members of Parliament so that we can see how they pay their workers. If you do not want to do your own washing, it is in your power to look for someone to do the washing for you. But if you want someone to do the washing for you, to cook, to make the beds for you and to wash your carpet, you must pay for all these things. [Applause.]

It would be bad if we found that even members of this House are caught in this trap of people who exploit others. We will not be happy with that.]

As Government we require a very strong legislative framework that seeks to harshly punish those who threaten our women. International frameworks such as the UN convention have guided us on the elimination of all forms of discrimination against women. That is the Sida, which we ratified in 1995. We agreed when we ratified this that we would pursue, by all appropriate means and without delay, a policy eliminating discrimination against women by refraining from engaging in any act or practice of discrimination against women. We have been working slowly but surely to ensure that all our public authorities and institutions act in conformity with the obligation not to discriminate against women.

In South Africa women themselves have become increasingly aware that they have rights and most are no longer hesitant to assert themselves. The Domestic Violence Act, notwithstanding its loopholes, has nonetheless put a very powerful weapon into the hands of abused women.

Kungumsebenzi wethu futhi thina esingamalungu ephalamende ukuthi siwudayise lo mthetho laphaya emphakathini ngoba uthola ukuthi kwawona amaphoyisa awazi ukuthi usebenza kanjani. Uthola umama elokhu ehla enyuka egcwele igazi, elimele, omunye engambethe ngasenhla, ngoba abawuqondi kwabona ukuthi usho ukuthini lo mthetho, kanti uyisikhali esinye esingasetshenziswa ekutheni omama abaxhashazwayo bazame ukukhosela ngaphansi kwawo. (Translation of Zulu paragraph follows.)

[It is our responsibility as members of Parliament to market this legislation to our communities, because one finds that even the police have no idea of how this legislation works. One finds a woman who has been injured, full of blood and sometimes naked on the upper parts of the body, walking up and down at the police station, because the police do not know how this legislation works. In fact, this legislation is a weapon that can be used to protect abused women.]

The report also shows the increased co-operation between the various stakeholders, including NGOs and government departments. It also highlights the areas that need more work, not the least of which is an increase in human and financial resources which need to be directed to the implementation agencies such as those dealing with criminal justice, law enforcement, welfare services and shelters. This report is a result of hard work and all those involved should be commended for their dedication to a project that will continue to remain at the forefront of our problems until we see the total eradication of violence.

Amadoda-ke sicela ukuba akuqonde ukuthi thina singomama siyolwa size siyoshona silwela ukuthi amalungelo abesifazane ahlonishwe kanti kuphele nokuxhashazwa komama. Ngiyabonga. [Ihlombe.] (Translation of Zulu paragraph follows.)

[We would like to ask men to clearly understand that we as women will fight until death for the respect of women’s rights and the eradication of the abuse of women. [Applause.]]

Mr F ADAMS: Hon Chairperson, hon members, I was just telling my colleague, Mr Sulliman, one of the members here, that the reason we love women is that our mothers are women and they have taught us right. That is why we love women.

It was after the United Nations General Conference in Mexico in 1975 that gender issues received attention. Prior to this conference, even though women were more educated, more active economically and more successful professionally than they were a few decades before, they continued to be seriously disadvantaged. In no major field of activity, be it economics, education, health or government, have women attained equal status with men.

Violence is not a new phenomenon for South Africans. We have emerged from the apartheid era in which violence was used as a tool to maintain social control, and where violence was used in the struggle to bring about political change in South Africa. Fortunately, South Africans now live in a democracy having achieved liberation from oppression. The Constitution enshrines the motion of equality and seeks to preserve the basic human rights of each citizen, such as the right to be safe from violence, and physical and emotional harm.

Violence against women is perpetuated and reflected by the power imbalances between women and men and the fact that many people struggle to openly condemn this atrocity against women. The cloud of silence surrounding the issue locks women into abusive relationship, provides perpetrators with an excuse for the continuation of violent behaviour and allows communities to deny the existence of violence against women.

Despite the progressive changes of the last eight years, for millions of South African women the realities of their daily lives remain unchanged. Incidents of domestic violence, rape and femicide are escalating.

Firstly, I want to compliment the office of the Status of Women, nationally as well as provincially, the Joint Monitoring Committee on the Improvement of Quality of Life and Status of Women and all the role-players for such an indepth report regarding violence against women.

Ek hoop van harte dat al die betrokke departemente hierdie verslag bestudeer, en werk maak van die voorstelle wat in die verslag vervat word. Die stryd om geslagsgelykheid is nog nie ten volle geïntegreer as deel van ‘n oorkoepelende ontwikkelingsperspektief nie. Geslagsgelykheid sal nie bereik word sonder om aandag te skenk aan ongelykhede oor die spektrum van huidige sosio-ekonomiese toestande nie. Armoede, werkloosheid, behuising, maatskaplike dienste, opleiding en ontwikkeling moet alles aandag geniet om werklik substansiële gelykheid vir vroue teweeg te bring. Geweld teen vroue is ook steeds ‘n groot struikelblok in die weg van werklike gelykheid.

Ons moet kyk na sekere kwessies rakende opheffing om die omstandighede van vroue te verbeter, en om hulle te bemagtig. Ons moet ‘n uitgebreide openbare bewusmakingsveldtog loods in alle tale deur die gebruik van die elektroniese en gedrukte media oor die reg van vroue om vry te wees van geweld. So ‘n veldtog moet gerig word op beide vroue en mans, en moet ook op die landelike gebiede gemik wees. Dit moet ook maklik toeganklik wees.

Dit is noodsaaklik dat gemeenskapsorganisasies, veral kerkorganisasies, deurentyd betrokke sal wees by die veldtog, en dat invloedryke mense in die gemeenskap, insluitende politici, kerkleiers, sakeleiers en jeugorganisasies hulle op nasionale, provinsiale en plaaslike vlak ter ondersteuning van die veldtog sal uitdruk. Daar moet behoorlike opvoeding wees oor seks, seksuele gesondheid, die misdaad van geweld teen vroue en alternatiewe meganismes om konflik op te los. Dit moet deel wees van die skoolleerplan wat van ‘n geskikte jong ouderdom af aangebied word. Sulke programme moet ook fokus op die ontwikkeling van selfstandigheid en ‘n goeie selfbeeld vir seuns en dogters.

Daar moet aandag geskenk word aan die opleiding van onderwysers om seker te maak dat onderwysers voel hulle is toegerus om hierdie soort opleiding te bied. Daar moet ook opleiding wees vir ouers deur middel van nasionale werksessies en opleidingseminare oor ouerskapvaardighede. Die ouerhuis is die belangrikste instrument om die regte klimaat te skep. Opvoeding moet beskikbaar gestel word vir mans deur middel van werknemerorganisasies en vakbonde. Hoë prioriteit moet verleen word aan die verandering van mans se persepsies as een van die belangrikste kwessies.

Voorsiening moet gemaak word vir primêre, sowel as sekondêre voorkoming, byvoorbeeld voorligtingsprogramme vir mishandelaars in gemeenskappe deur verteenwoordigers van die polisie, welsynsdienste en regsdienste wat gebruik maak van die netwerke van soveel gemeenskapsorganisasies moontlik, insluitende vroue organisasies. Sulke programme moet veral gebruik word om vroue te bereik wat reeds die skool verlaat het, asook mans wat werkloos is.

‘n Uitgebreide opleidingsprogram moet deur die Departement van Welsyn vir sy amptenare van stapel gestuur word om hulle toe te rus om met vroue wat geweld teen hulle oorleef het te werk. Die Regering, sowel as die burgerlike samelewing, moet dringend aandag skenk aan die oprigting van skuilings vir vroue wat mishandel is. Dit is ook ‘n projek waarin die private sektor ‘n spesifieke bydrae, wat uiters nodig is, kan lewer, naamlik om vroue te help om hulself en hul kinders uit geweldsituasies te kan verwyder. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)

[I hope with all my heart that all the departments involved will study this report, and put into effect the suggestions that are encapsulated in the report. The struggle for sexual equality has not yet been fully integrated as part of an overarching development perspective. Sexual equality will not be reached without paying attention to inequalities across the spectrum of current socioeconomic conditions. Poverty, unemployment, housing, social services, training and development should all enjoy attention to result in true substantial equality for women. Violence against women also remains an important stumbling block in the way of true equality.

We should look at certain issues relating to upliftment to improve the circumstances of women, and to empower them. We should launch an extended public awareness campaign, in all languages, by using electronic and printed media, on the right of women to be free from violence. Such a campaign should target both men and women, and should also be aimed at rural areas. It should also be easily accessible. It is necessary that community organisations, especially church organisations, should be continually involved in the campaign, and that influential people in the community, including politicians, church leaders, business leaders and youth organisations express themselves to be in favour of the campaign at national, provincial, and local level. There must be proper education about sex, sexual health, the crime of violence against women and alternative mechanisms to resolve conflict. It should be a part of the school curriculum from a suitably young age. Such programmes should also focus on the development of independence and a good self-image for boys and girls.

Attention should be devoted to the training of teachers to ensure that teachers feel they are prepared to present this kind of training. There must also be training for parents through national workshops and training seminars in parenting skills. The parental home is the most important instrument in creating the right climate. Training must be made available for men through employer organisations and trade unions. High priority must be given to changing men’s perceptions as one of the most important issues.

Provision must be made for primary, as well as secondary prevention, for example counselling programmes for abusers in communities by representatives of the police, social services and legal services who use the networks of as many community organisations as possible, including women’s organisations. Such programmes should be used in particular to reach women who have already left school, as well as men who are unemployed.

An extensive training programme must be launched for its officials by the Department of Social Development in order to equip them for dealing with women who have survived violence against them. The Government, as well as civil society, should urgently look into to the establishment of shelters for women who have been abused. It is also a project in which the private sector can make a specific contribution, which is extremely necessary, namely to help women to remove themselves and their children from situations of violence.]

Many more women’s groups in the form of NGOs and CBOs were visibly giving women the opportunity to develop their leadership skills and engage with the transformation process.

History has proven that women have played and will continue to play important roles in society, for example they were the ones who successfully fought against pass laws - the beginning of the struggle against apartheid

• and whose victories in this struggle are now enjoyed by all South Africans, if we take an example like you Chairperson. It is now the time that they, in greater numbers, take their rightful place alongside men. Violence against women needs to be recognised as an issue of great public concern in order to break down people’s tolerance of violence.

In conclusion, I hope that this report will urge everybody to take positive steps to contribute towards the elimination of violence against women. Only by working towards ending violence against women can South Africans ensure that women function as fully equal citizens who can enjoy their rights as guaranteed by the Constitution. [Applause.]

Ms N P NKONYENI: Hon Chairperson and hon members of this Chamber, sanibonani. [Interjections.] When the cadres and freedom fighters of the ANC deliberated in 1956, they came up with a document that we all respect, namely, the Freedom Charter. The very last clause of that document reads: ``There shall be peace and prosperity.’’

The struggle continued, women and men fighting side by side in order to achieve democracy that everyone is enjoying today. Yes, South Africa is free from the apartheid regime. Yes, equality is enshrined in our Constitution. But, unfortunately, the struggle continues for women because some are still experiencing discrimination and gender-related violence. They are still discriminated against in the workplace, in their homes, in decision-making and other areas. The struggle against patriarchy and male chauvinism continues. Firstly, I would like to declare to this House that at last the KwaZulu- Natal provincial legislature has established a committee similar to the JMC which is called The Standing Committee on the Improvement of the Quality of Life and Status of Women. So, the parliamentary women’s caucus of our provincial legislature really deserves a big round of applause for their concerted efforts and enthusiasm to ensure that the provincial gender machinery is in place and is functioning. [Applause.]

Secondly, members of the women’s caucus have successfully eradicated patriarchy by mainstreaming gender equality and equity through the minds of all the male legislators from the Premier to the ordinary member of that legislature. [Applause.]

If one could peruse through the budget statements of all departments, each MEC would make a declaration on how much is set aside for the improvement of the quality of life and status of women. [Applause.] Of course, no woman is deployed to the executive council as yet, but we are still fighting for that.

It is with great regret that in KZN in some areas we still practise ukuhlolwa kwezintombi [virginity testing] on girl children. It is unfortunate that this kind of violence is perpetrated by women on other women. Of course, there are two sides of the coin. Yes, maybe during our times when I was still a teenager, that custom might have been relevant, especially because I was ignorant and it was the order of the day. But, is it not a discriminatory kind of custom?

Khona manje, kunenkoloze ekhona lapha emphakathini ethi uma indoda enegciwane lengculazi idlwengula umntwana wentombazana oyintombi nto, iyaphela ingculazi kuyo. Lokho-ke sekwenze ukuthi izinga lokudlwengulwa kwabantwana lenyuke kakhulu.

Nawo amasiko akufanele abandlulule ngokobulili. Yiziphi izinhlelo ezikhona zokubhekela ukuthi abafana nabo bayaqeqeshwa ngokuziphatha? Nakuba sivumelana ngokuthi kufanele sithuthukise amasiko ethu, mina ngithi nawo amasiko kumele acutshungulwe kahle ukuthi awabandlululi na.

Abantu bayadlwengulwa. Namanje sikhuluma nje kukhona abadlwengulayo. Kubi- ke ngoba kuyaye kuthi noma abadlwenguliwe beyobika emaphoyiseni, babuzwe imibuzo engenasidingo neyehlisa isithunzi somuntu wesifazane, njengokuthi: (Translation of Zulu paragraphs follows.)

[Currently there is this superstition among communities that if an HIV- positive man rapes a virgin, he is cured of HIV. As a result of this, the rate of child rape has increased.

Customs should not discriminate in terms of gender. For instance, which programmes are there to provide for the moral training of boys? Although we agree that we need to develop our customs, personally I feel that customs themselves need to be scrutinised as to whether they are discriminatory or not.

People are raped. Even at this very moment there are people committing rape. It is unfortunate that when people who have been raped, when they go and report it to the police, are asked unnecessary and humiliating questions.]

Did you enjoy? Did you ejaculate as well? What was the length of your skirt or dress? This ridicules them and thereafter they fail to bring that perpetrator of sexual violence to book.

We, therefore, call upon the departments responsible for safety and security and our judiciary to ensure that police officials, prosecutors and magistrates undergo extensive training on the collection of evidence, the presentation of DNA evidence and on cross-examination skills and sensitivity in dealing with witnesses, and on the proper framing of age- appropriate questions. When the women’s caucus in KZN decided to visit the women’s shelters in our province, we realised that they are all situated in and around the cities. There are no shelters for abused women in rural areas. We therefore call upon the Department of Social Welfare to establish women’s shelters in rural areas as well, and to provide extensive training to its officials in order to equip them to deal with survivors of gender violence, and also with skills that would eradicate dependency and subordination among survivors of gender violence.

In conclusion, I would like to congratulate the members of the JMC for their efforts to develop this kind of an informative report, and also to say: As long as women and girls are still discriminated against and are still victimised, the struggle continues. [Applause.]

Mnr J L THERON: Voorsitter, toe my medepartygenote gehoor het ek moet oor dié onderwerp praat, het hulle met my gespot en gesê: Jy moet net hierdie vraag beantwoord: Slaan jy nog steeds jou vrou? [Gelag.] Dit is ‘n moeilike vraag, want sê ‘n mens ja'', dan beteken dit jy oortree hierdie wetgewing, jy pleeg geweld teen 'n vrou, maar sê jy nee’’, dan beteken dit jy het dit in die verlede gedoen. Dit is dus ‘n vraag wat moeilik is om te beantwoord en ek wil dit liewer systap en konsentreer op hierdie verslag. Op ‘n ernstiger noot: (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)

[Mr J L THERON: Chairperson, when my fellow party members heard that I had to speak about this subject they made fun of me and said: You just have to answer this question: Are you still hitting your wife? [Laughter.] It is a difficult question, because if one says yes'' it means that one is in contravention of this legislation, one is committing violence against a woman, but if one saysno’’ it means that one used to do it in the past. It is therefore a question that is difficult to answer, and I would rather sidestep it and concentrate on this report. On a more serious note.]

The DP and the DA appreciate the very comprehensive and detailed report by the Joint Monitoring Committee on Violence against Women. In my speech on this report, I will briefly refer to the recent research on violence against women, HIV/Aids and violence against women, legislation that we have regarding violence against women, and the recommendations by the Joint Monitoring Committee on Violence against Women, and then I will conclude.

Unisa’s Institute for Social and Health Sciences recently produced a research report on violence against women. It was based on rape statistics gathered by district surgeons in Johannesburg from January 1996 to December

1. Some of their findings, on an analysis of 1 401 rape cases reported at the Hillbrow, Lenasia South and Chris Hani-Baragwanath medical-legal clinics during the period were the following - it is the Gauteng situation that I am referring to, as it is the province that I represent. Fifty-one percent of survivors were between the ages of 15 and 25, 80% of survivors were African, 10,2% coloured, 8,1% white and 1,8% Asian. Eighty three comma three percent rapes were perpetrated by a person from the same racial group as the survivor. Fifty eight comma two percent of rapes occurred over the weekend, while 44,7% of survivors were acquainted with their attacker in some way. Younger victims were more likely to know their attackers. Thirty one percent of rapes were committed in open fields, 73% of rapes were committed by a single perpetrator, and where a single perpetrator was involved, 51,5% of perpetrators were known to their victims. Where multiple attackers were involved, 75,1% of the perpetrators were strangers to the victims. Weapons were used in 54,9% of the attacks. The statistics are devastating.

A further aggravating circumstance is of course HIV/Aids and the influence that it has on violence against women. Women and children who have been the victims of sexual abuse and violence face special risks of contracting sexually transmitted diseases, in particular HIV/Aids.

The violence and coercion involved in the sexual relationships of so many men and women in South Africa, limit especially the capacities of young women to protect themselves against HIV and Aids. In research conducted among women in three South African provinces, the CERSA reported that many women indicated that their partner openly brought girlfriends home, or boasted about them. Even more women indicated that they did not perceive that they were able to refuse sex with their husbands.

Given the pattern of gender relations described in this research, it is likely that women are not in a position to insist on condom use, even if they wanted to. In a relationship characterised by physical violence they would only face further abuse.

Various perverse myths, connecting sex and certain types of women with a cure for Aids, have arisen during the last decade. This added a new dimension to sexual violence against women. In 1990 a document appeared, calling on African men in the Durban area to acquire the Aids antibody by raping Indian women. Even though the flier was believed to have been the work of a third force, intent on aggravating conflict in and between black communities, it still succeeded in increasing the fears surrounding the disease. There is also the well-circulated myth that sex with a child- virgin will cure a person of the virus.

A further aggravating problem regarding HIV/Aids is the Government policy on the pandemic. The antiretroviral drugs are not available throughout the country as of today. We have two different laws on the elimination of violence against women: the Domestic Violence Act, Act No 116 of 1998, which repeals some sections of the Prevention of Family Violence Act, Act No 133 of 1993; and the Criminal Procedure Act which limits the granting of bail to persons accused of committing serious offences which include rape, and which also makes provision for minimum sentences for murder and rape with aggravating circumstances.

I would like to look at the recommendations made by the joint monitoring committee. The DP strongly subscribes to all these recommendations. They are the following: The availability of access to legal aid to women who are victims of violence must be given urgent consideration by the stakeholders concerned, and urgent attention must be given to increasing staff in key departments that work on gender-based violence.

Both Government and civil society must give urgent attention to the establishment of shelters for abused women. This is also a project in which the private sector can make a specific and greatly needed contribution. Urgent attention must be given to the availability of treatment of STDs, and other health risks, regarding rape survivors. The Department of Health must prioritise establishing the effectiveness of antiretroviral drugs, like AZT, for rape survivors.

An extensive public awareness campaign must be undertaken, in all languages, through the use of electronic and print media, about the rights of women to be free from violence. Such campaigns must address both women and men, and must target rural areas in an accessible way. Proper education on sex, sexual health, crime or violence against women and alternative conflict resolution mechanisms, other than violence, must be initiated at all levels of society. The possibilities of weekend incarceration should be investigated, especially for perpetrators of domestic violence.

The DP and the DA fully agree with these recommendations made by the committee. A further recommendation that we want to propose from our side is that if there are any pamphlets or information brochures on violence against women, it should be made available to political parties. The DP will make these pamphlets available at their constituency offices, and it will be an enormous aid in informing the public on how to cope with violence against women.

Mrs E N LUBIDLA: Honourable Chairperson, hon members, all forms of violence against women, be it physical or mental, whether at domestic or societal levels, including those arising form customs, traditions or accepted practices, must be dealt with effectively with a view to eliminating its incidence. Institutions and mechanisms for assistance are being created so as to strengthen the prevention of such violence, including sexual harassment at work places, and customs like dowry payment, for the rehabilitation of the victims of violence and for taking effective action against the perpetrators of such violence. The Department of Safety and Security together with the Departments of Justice, Correctional Services, Defence and Social Development have come together as part of the National Crime Prevention Strategy to combat violence against women. These departments have since last year identified violence against women as one of the priority crimes. The police have set themselves the following goals in this regard: They want to increase arrests and prosecutions for sexual and violent crimes against women and children; support and encourage victims and witnesses to report such crimes; provide specialised training to police personnel to ensure proper victim support; increase resources allocated to policing crimes against women and children and develop a policy on dealing with domestic violence.

On the issue of domestic violence, the Act sets out the specific duties of a police official at the scene of domestic violence or when a case of domestic violence is reported. A police member must do the following: First, the official must determine if the complainant is in any danger and take all reasonable steps to secure the scene and protect the complainant from further harm. Once the scene has been secured, the official must (a) render such assistance to the complainant as may reasonably be required under the circumstances, and (b) if it is possible to do so, hand a written notice to the complainant and explain his or her rights as set out in the notice such as, (i) the right to lay a criminal charge; (ii) the right to apply for a protection order, or (iii) the right to lay a criminal charge as well as apply for a protection order.

It is very important that we participate and encourage people to participate in Community Police Forums so that we can hold the police accountable to these objectives. Through Community Police Forums we can also develop a partnership with the police in dealing with questions of family violence and sexual abuse of children. Our past has succeeded in creating a culture of racism, inequality and discrimination. In virtually all societies and spheres of activity, women were subjected to inequalities in law and in fact this situation was both caused and exacerbated by the existence of discrimination in the family and in the community which in turn exposed women to violence.

While causes and consequences may vary, violence against women is widespread. It is perpetuated by the survival of stereotypes and traditional practices and beliefs detrimental to women. In order to get rid of violence against women and children, we need conscious efforts from all sectors of society such as government NGOs, religious organisations, civic organisations and traditional leaders. The violence that women and children experience differs from the type of violence experienced by men. For example, women are susceptible to domestic violence and sexual assault in a way that men are not. Violence experienced by women is at the hands of men whom they know; the abuser is in their own homes, in most cases.

The link between violence against women and poverty means that African women, who constitute the poorest sector in South Africa, are at a greater risk of being subjected to violence than any other group in our society. According to research in progress, violence against woman is cited in over a third of divorces as the cause of the breakdown of the relationship. These figures are almost certainly an underestimate of the true extent of wife battery. Divorce lawyers attest to the fact that some of their women clients admit to having been battered but do not want to include this in their papers. Since South Africa has a no-fault divorce system, there is little to be gained in including allegations of battery in the papers.

In conclusion, South African women who undoubtedly bore the brunt of oppression, are at last faced with the prospect of fair treatment and indeed, with the prospect of meaningful corrective action. Our Government has made these possibilities into action. Few women are aware that the rights enshrined in the Constitution are no longer paper guarantees. What we need to do is to educate women about the effective mechanisms of the enforcement of policies and legislation brought about by Government and encourage women to take concerted action and fight for their rights. [Applause.] Nkk J N VILAKAZI: Sihlalo, isihloko esiphezu kwaso namhlanje asimnandi neze kuwo wonke umuntu okhona lapha endlini nolalele le nkulumo.

Ukuhlukunyezwa kwabantu besifazane sizwa ngakho noma sikubone kwenzeka eduze kwethu. Kulichilo nehlazo. Siyethemba ukuthi ukukhuluma ngakho kuyohamba kuhambe kuwenze umehluko. Umuntu ohlukumeza owesifazane, omdala noma omncane, kudingeka athole isigwebo esinzima. Lokho kufanele kumenze esabe ukuqhubeka nodlame analo emndenini. Kanti uma elengiselwa isigwebo, uthola ithuba lokuba aqhubeke nendluzula yakhe.

Indluzula imikhakha miningi, sebekhulumile abanye ngayo ngaphambi kwami. Imvamisa iqala emndenini kumama wekhaya oyaye azithole engukudla kwenduku ekhaya noma engenze lutho olutheni. Omunye uyathethiswa, ehliswe isithunzi phambi kwabantu naphambi kwezingane.

Siyalincoma iqhaza elibanjwe nguHulumeni ekubhekeleni amalungelo nesithunzi somuntu wesifazane njengoba sinamakomiti anjenge-Status of women no- Equality, konke lokho mhlawumbe kuyohamba kuhambe njengoba ngishilo.

Owesifazane ohlukunyezwayo ugcina esegula noma aze alahlekelwe nayimpilo yakhe. Omunye kuyaye kube sengathi nekhanda alisathathi kahle. Sivela esikhathini esihle nokho kakhulu esasimhlonipha umuntu wesifazane, endulo. Owesilisa owayevulela inqindi kumuntu wesifazane, owesifazane wayemshiya amuke aye kwabakubo. Abakubo baphindele naye ekhaya ngoba phela washada kuyoxazululwa inkinga wumndeni. Akusekho lokhu manje. Ukuthi kwaqedwa ngubani, akekho owaziyo.

Owesifazane ohlukunyezwayo emzini wakhe uthi noma eyobika enkantolo kube khona ukuthalalisa nje aze aphele amandla. Kwesinye isikhathi umthetho umbophe umhlukumezi bese kuba ngowesimame ocela akhishwe ejele umhlukumezi. Izinkinga-ke lezi ezibikwa abomthetho uma silandela.

Okubi kakhulu ukuthi udlame luyakhula ngoba manje abahlukumezi sebevele babulale umndeni wonke. Uma kunesivakashi kulowo muzi naso sife noma sithole amachaphazelo. Umthetho kudingeka uqine kakhulu. Abantu besifazane abakwazi ukubhekana nodlame, abadalwanga bezidlakela umthetho wabo. Abahlukumezi abagcini lapho. Basukela noma yimuphi umuntu wesifazane bamphoxe ngokukhuluma kwabo futhi bamehlise isithunzi.

Okubi-ke kunalokho indlela abesifazane abadlwengulwa ngayo. Sekukhulunyiwe kakhulu ngokudlwengula. Badlwengula emndenini nasemphakathini. Kulukhuni kakhulu. Kudlwengulwa umntwana omncane ofaka amanabukeni. Siyizwile indaba eyenzeke ngale ko-Northern Cape, kuye esalukazini esidala esihola impesheni esingasakwazi nokunyakaza. Umhlola ongakaze uzwakale ngisho nasendulo.

Okunye okuqhubela phambili lo mkhuba onyanyekayo wuphuzo oludakisanayo nezidakamizwa. Futhi okubi kakhulu ukuthi umhlukumezi uzala umhlukumezi. Ziyabukela phela izingane. Abantwana bayabukela kwabadala indlela yokuziphatha.

Lolu daba lwendluzula kwabesifazane, kuvele imibono eminingi yokuluqeda. Abanye bathi umdlwenguli akanqunywe isitho sakhe sobulili. Ukhona owake washo nakhona lapha phakathi kwethu. Abanye bathi akafanele ukuphila. Mina ngokwami ngithi umthetho awuthathe indawo yawo, abadlwenguli badonse kakhulu ejele, baphume sebephele amandla ocansi, sebevoveke inkani futhi bengasamcabangi nje umuntu wesifazane.

Abanye abahlolwe ingqondo. Uma begula, bagcinwe ezibhedlela zabagula ngengqondo isikhathi eside nabo kuze kuphele inkanuko yocansi nomuntu wesifazane. Laba abadlwengula abantwana ngoba benemfundiso ze yokuthi kuzophela ingculazi, nabo badinga isigwebo esifanayo. Thina be-IFP sithi umthetho awuqiniswe nxa zonke, imiphakathi yonke ifundiswe ilulekwe ukuze kuqedwe lolu dlame. Ikomiti elibhekela abesifazane lizilandele kakhulu izifundazwe, kwenziwe ucwaningo olunzulu ngalokhu ngoba bakhona omama abathulayo bebona. Masibhukule silwe nalolu dlame.

Omame abanye bayanyamezela noma bazi ukuthi ubaba wekhaya ubuye ahwaphilize izingane. Kukhona indaba esemaphepheni lapho kukhona izingane ezintathu ezizale izingane zizaliswa uyise. Manje seziyagula ngengqondo, ziyakhala ziyachiphiza ngoba izingane uma zibuzwa ukuthi ubaba wengane ubani, izothi ubani ubaba? Zingane zakwethu kulukhuni! Okusho ukuthi kufuneka ngempela sikhulume kuchitheke gula linamasi. (Translation of Zulu speech follows.)

[Mrs J N VILAKAZI: Chairperson, the subject that we are discussing today is not interesting at all to everyone who is present and listening in this House.

We hear about or see the abuse of women abuse around us. It is a disgrace. We hope that talking about it will someday make a difference. A person who abuses women, old or young, should be given a heavy sentence. This sentence should stop his violent behaviour towards his family. But if a person is given parole, he gets an opportunity to continue with his violent behaviour.

Violence comes in various forms, and some members have talked about it. Generally it starts with the family, where the wife finds herself being beaten without any good reason. Some women are shouted at and humiliated in front of people and children.

We commend the Government’s role in protecting the rights of women, for example, restoring the dignity of women as we have committees such as the one on the status of women and their equality. Maybe all this will help, as I have mentioned, to stop the violence against women and children.

An abused woman usually ends up sick, or even loses her life, or looks like someone who has lost her mind. We reminisce about the good times when women were respected. A woman would leave a violent husband and return to her family. The family would take her back to her husband’s family so that both families could try to resolve the problem. This does not happen anymore, and we do not know who stopped it.

When an abused woman reports to a court that she is being abused at home, her case is sometimes not given the attention it deserves, and the woman despairs. In some instances the abuser is arrested, and it will be the woman who asks for the abuser to be released from jail. These are the problems that are reported by law enforcement officers when we follow up on these issues.

The most terrible thing is that violence is increasing, as abusers tend to murder the whole family. If there is a visitor during that period, he or she is also killed or affected by this. The law should be very strict. Women cannot stand violence; they were not made as powerfully as muscular men. Abusers are never satisfied, they insult and humiliate women by the manner in which they speak.

Worse than this is the rate at which women are being abused. This has been discussed intensively. Rapists are raping members of their families and communities. This is a difficult situation. Babies that wear nappies are being raped. We have heard about what happened in the Northern Cape and to an old woman who is a pensioner and can hardly move. This is shocking, and this never used to happen in the olden days.

Drug and alcohol abuse are some of the reasons that lead to such disgusting behaviour. What is bad about this is that the abuser always produces an abuser. Children learn from adults how to behave themselves.

There are so many suggestions that have been made to stop violence against women. Some people suggest that a rapist should be castrated. This was once raised even in this House. Some people say that a rapist does not deserve to live, but I think the law should take its course. Rapists should be heavily sentenced and when they come out of prison, they should not have any desire for sex. They should not even be thinking about a woman.

Some of these rapists need psychological examination. Should they be sick, they need to be institutionalised for a long time so that they lose interest in having sex with women. Those people who rape children with the misconception that having sex with a child cures HIV/Aids require the same sentence.

We as the IFP say that the law should be reinforced in every sense, and communities should be taught and advised so that this violence can stop. The committee that is working with women’s issues is mostly working with the provinces. Research has been conducted on this subject, and it was found that some women keep quiet even when they are aware of what is happening. Let us stand up and fight this violence.

Some women turn a blind eye even when they are aware that their husbands sometimes abuse the children sexually. There is a story that has been in the newspapers recently about girls who were impregnated by their father and gave birth. They are now psychologically disturbed. They are crying, because they do not know who to say is the father of the children. Who can they say is the father of the children? Brothers and sisters, this is a difficult situation! We should talk until this problem is resolved.] Maybe I just want to correct the perception. [Time expired.]

Mr V V Z WINDVOëL: Mgcinisihlalo lohlon, ngiyabonga kutsi nami, njengababe, ngitfole litfuba lekubeka luvo lwami ngaloludlame lolwentiwa bobabe kubomake. Ngibonge futsi nekutsi labanye bobabe nabo bakhonile kutsi babe mdzibimunye kulenkhulumo. Ngibonga nababe Adams ngenkhulumo layibekile nababe Theron ngalenkhulumo layibekile, nome ngingasekamuva kahle ngobe wehlulekile kuwuphendvula kahle lombuto lotsi; ingabe yena usamhlukumeta yini make wakhe ekhaya nome cha? [Luhleko.]

Ngiyetsemba kutsi sonkhe nasingaphendvula lowo mbuto ngekwetsembeka sibobabe, sicale kuleNdlu siye nasemphakatsini, loko kungenta ingucuko lebonakalako. Kuphindze futsi kungitsintse kubona letinye tinhlangano letifanana nabo UCDP, ne-UDM, bobabe Tlhagale nababe Nyakane, babindze base dvu! Ngiyatibuta kutsi bona ngabe batsini ngaloludlame lolwentiwa bobabe kubomake? Ngobe silumbi siyasho kutsi: Kuthula kuvuma. (Silence is concerned.) Kodvwa-ke, ngingaze ngimoshe lamaminithi likhadi lami lelinginikete wona, nginemaminithi lasiphohlongo. Ngako-ke ngitawuhlabela embili. (Translation of Siswati paragraphs follows.)

[Mr V V Z WINDVOëL: Chairperson, I am so grateful to have this opportunity, as a father, to voice my ideas concerning the violence that is perpetrated by husbands against their wives. I am also grateful that some of the other men have also taken part in this debate. I was very impressed by the speeches made by both Mr Adams and Mr Theron, but I nevertheless did not get his reply clearly, because he failed to give a clear answer to the question that was put to him; that was whether he was still abusing his wife at home or not. [Laughter.]

I hope that we as fathers can answer that question honestly, starting at this House and moving to our communities, so that there could be a tangible change in our communities. It also concerns me to see other organisations, like the UCDP and the UDM, and people like Mr Tlhagale and Mr Nyakane, being so quiet about this. I keep on asking myself questions; what do they say regarding this violence by our fathers against our mothers? The saying goes: Silence is concerned.]

What can she do if he comes home drunk, kicking in the door, the children and everything has gone mad? When she is sleeping he turns up the music and comes to her and makes her sleep with him. She only wants to please her husband but she does not like it. He is very aggressive in their bed. She does not believe it is really rape when it is her husband. Neither does he. He says that she is his wife and he can do with her whatever he wants to. Even if she says no, her husband gets cross and hits her and keeps doing what he wants to do to her.

It is very painful, but she cannot scream because her children are also there. That is why he turns on the music. She says her children know what is happening. She can hear them cry. She reports him to his family. His family asks her what is wrong with her that she does not want to please her husband, or what are they supposed to do. She should have sex with her husband.

This is not a fairy tale. This is reality. It is a practical experience which not only hundreds, but thousands of women in this country go through. [Laughter.] It is very disturbing that some members are laughing when we reflect on this, probably because they do not experience the pain those poor women experience. It may be the same attitude which the policeman behind the desk has when a woman comes in crying to report such a case.

What are the results? Is it because women particularly in rural areas have little option but to remain in the homes of their offenders? There are no accessible safe houses or shelters. Women in rural areas remain in abusive relationships because they have little access to economic resources and thus they are dependent on men.

This physical violence often continues even during pregnancy and constitutes an important cause of reproductive morbidity. We may go on and on highlighting some of these things. Some will think it only happens in the squatter camps or in the informal settlements or that it is done by people who are not working or who are unemployed or criminals. If one buys this week’s edition of Drum magazine, one will read about an eighteen year old girl. She was kidnapped by a multimillionaire and kept as a sex slave.

Lebengifuna kukusho, labanyenti sebakubekile lapha emkhatsini wetfu, kutsi kufanele silivume lelivangeli lekutsi indvuku ayiwakhi umuti. Natsi bobabe silishumayele. Nasingase sihlale phansi sibutane, bakhona labangavuma kutsi nabo bakhulela emakhaya lapho khona indvuku yayibhadla kunina. Nasingahlala lapha sitibute kutsi kute yini tihlobo nome bangani babo labasakwenta loku, ungakhandza kutsi yintfo leyentekako.

Loko ngulokunye futsi, ngobe kutsiwa umuntfu ucala ngekuhlumisa likhaya kakubo. (Charity begins at home.) Loku ngiko lokubangela kutsi labantfwana, lesitukulwane lesikhona nyalo, sibe naloludlame lolungaka. Sizatfu kutsi balufundza lapha emakhaya. Kubalulekile kutsi silucedze lapha emakhaya kucala. Kulesinye sikhatsi siyaye sikhohlisane sodvwa tsine sibobabe. Sitsi nasihleli sitikhulumela sicoca, sisemabholeni nome sinatsa tjwala, uve umuntfu atsi: ``Mine umfati ngeke angitjele lutfo, nangifika ngifuna kudla lokufutfumele.’’ Lomake-ke kufuneka ahlale alindzile, kantsi awukamtsengeli ne-microwave. Sekufanele ahlale-ke aphe kuvutsela umlilo kutsi alindze kutsi aze babe afike, nome ufika ekuseni ngabo 2:00, kumele atfole kudla kufutfumele.

Ngaleso sikhatsi babe wakhona unatsile uhlabela ingoma utsi: ``Ngeke ngilale ngingacabulanga,’’ kani usho kutsi uyawubanga ludlame le ekhaya kulabomake. [Luhleko.] Loko yintfo lekufuneka siyicedza ikhawule itsi mfo!

Kunalenye indzaba leyase yenteka ngale ngakitsi leyashiya tintsandzane ekhaya. Lobabe wachamuka ebusuku anatsile, ngekutsi abeshiye atsenge emancina, abelindzele kutsi akhandze lomake asamphekele lamancina akhe. Nakatsi uyefika wakhandza make atiphekele liklabishi. Kwasha sibhakela, ngalokunatsa kwakhe, wagcina asakhiphe sibhamu wabulala lomake.

Watsi kube abone kutsi sewente lowo mhlolo lowo watidubula naye wafa. Bantfwana basala sebahlupheka ngobe sebatintsandzane. Loko ngulokunye lokwentiwa nguloludlame lolwenteka ekhatsi emakhaya. Ngilo lolubangele kutsi kube netinkinga letigcina setitinkinga temphakatsi wonkhe ngobe labo bantfwana nabasele batintsandzane sebasalele bani? (Translation of Siswati paragraphs follows.)

[What I want to say is what many hon members have already alluded to in this House. The fact is that we have to acknowledge the gospel that says a home was not built by a stick. We as fathers should go out and preach that gospel. If we were to sit down and ask one another about our backgrounds, some among us could confess that they also grew up in violent homes where their mothers were beaten by their fathers. If we may ask whether there are friends and relatives of some of us who are still doing that, one would find that this is what is happening. One of the things that is said is that charity begins at home. That is what actually causes the youth, the present generation, to be so violent. The reason is that they learnt that in their homes.

It is very important to uproot it at home base first. Sometimes we fathers deceive one other. When we sit together amongst bottles or are drinking beer, one would hear someone saying: ``My wife would never order me around about anything! When I come home, it does not matter when, I only want warm food!’’ Which means the woman has to wait and the husband has not even bought her a microwave in which to heat up the food. So the wife has to wait and keep on blowing the fire to keep it burning until her husband arrives; even if he comes home at 02:00 in the morning, he still has to get warm food!

At the same time, the husband is drunk and singing the song: ``I will not sleep before I kiss and make love’’, when in actual fact he means he is going to perpetrate violence on his wife. [Laughter.] We must eradicate that kind of behaviour at its fountainhead!

There is another event that took place in my community which left orphans. The husband came home very drunk, and just because he had bought some hooves, he expected the wife to have cooked those hooves. However, he arrived and found that the wife had prepared cabbage. He did not ask any questions, he rained blows on her with his fists and, being so drunk, he then pulled out his gun and shot dead his wife.

When he realised what he had done, he turned the gun on himself and killed himself. The children were left in great despair and a state of starvation because they were then orphaned by their own father. That is one of the things that is caused by the violence which is going on in these homes. Violence is the cause of all these problems that end up being community problems, because once those children were left behind as orphans, they became a community problem, because whose responsibility could they be?] As I said, I will be brief. I have just a few recommendations to make. There is great work which was started … [Time expired.][Applause.]

Mnu H T SOGONI: Sekela-sihlalo namalungu abekekileyo ale Ndlu yowiso- mthetho, ndivumeleni ndiqale ndilungise impazamana encinane nje eyenziwe ngugxa okaWindvoel, xa esithi i-UDM ithe cwaka ayenzi nto. Nam ndiphakamela ukuzeka emzekweni, ndigadlele phantsi kwale ngongoma siohantsi kwayo namhlanje.

Sekela-sihlalo ndivumele ndicaphule kuqala amazwi echule lokuthetha, amazwi enye yeengcali zamasiko nentlalo yabantu abantsundu, uKhaba umfo kaMkhize, xa esithi ikhona imfihlo esingayiqondi kahle ngabafazi emhlabeni thina zizukulwana zanamhlanje. Bakhulu laba bantu kanti nobuntu kubuzwa kubona. Xa eqhubeka nenqaku lakhe phantsi kwengongoma ethi inzala-bantu idinga intlonipho, uphinda asiyale enjenjenje, uma ihloni lisuka endaweni, kuzalela ihlazo. Ndiwacaphula nje la mazwi ale ngqondi, Sekela-sihlalo kungenxa yokuba, nabanina ongowasebuhlanti, ndixela amadoda, othe wawucudisisa umongo wale ngxelo siyivayo namhlanje, uziva esehlazweni. Gxebe isithozela sethu singamadoda sibonakala sisemngciphekweni wokujongelwa phantsi ngenxa yesikizi nenyala okanye ngenxa yempatho- gadalala eyenziwa ngamanye amadoda kwabasetyhini. Ngokwengxelo le siyiphetheyo Sekela-sihlalo, iphuhlile eyokuba amanye amadoda aphelelwa kukuhlonipha ubuntu nesidima sababhinqileyo kuze kulandele izenzo ezilihlazo ezihambisa umzimba. Uphando olwenziweyo luyangqina phofu ngoluvo oluthi likho noko ibathwana lamadoda nalo elingcungcuthekayo phantsi kwesandla esilukhuni sabafazi. Kambe ke elo nani lawo alinakude lithelekiswe nentlungu yabafazi abaphila ubomi bentshontsho phantsi kwesandla samadoda athile.

Ngokwamanani esinawo, mnye kwabane owasetyhini ophethwe kakubi ngumyeni wakhe ngeveki. Amashumi asibhozo ekhulwini empatho-gadalala amakhosikazi athi ayifumane, ayifumana kanye emizini yawo phantsi kwesandla sabayeni ababefungile bathi bayabathanda. Amakhosikazi aliqela ayakwazi ukunyamezela intlalo-mbi ngaphezu kweshumi leminyaka phambi kokuba acinge ngokushiya emzini. Amanye akwaliqela ayakwazi ukunyamezela ukumbokrwa ngabayeni amatyeli angaphezulu kwamashumi amathathu anethoba phambi kokuba acinge ngokucela uncedo. Maxa wambi kude kubekho nemeko-ngqondo yamakhosikazi aphila le mpilo yosizi ebizwa ngokuba yi “battered women sydrome”. Ayakhula amanye amakhosikazi ade ayamkele into yokuba awanakuze abe sayinceda nganto le meko akuyo. Maxa wambi de azixelele ukuba ngawo asisizathu sale meko. Maxa wambi la maxhoba akholelwa ukuba indoda inamandla namagunya phezu kwayo nkqu nomthetho awunakuba salamla nto kwesi sishiqi. Yiloo meko ke ibuhlungu ede ifikelele kwamanye amakhosikazi aphila ngeli xesha.

Umbuzo oyintloko, Sihlalo emasifune impendulo yawo sonke uthi: Konakele phi? Kungani umgangatho wobuntu usiya utshabalala nje, uzimisele ubulwanyana nentswela-lusizi kangakanana esizweni? Zininzi izizathu ezinikwayo ukuzama ukufumana unobangela wale meko igqubayo. Bambi bath’ amadoda afuna ukuzibonakalisa ukuba ngawo anamandla nolawulo emtshatweni okanye kwimeko yokuthandana kwabo bangekatshati. Bambi bakholelwa ukuba udlomdlayo nezinye iziphithikezi ngqondo zinegalelo elivakalayo ekwenzeni amadoda athile angalawuleki. Ikho nenkolelo ethi isikhwele naso sinenxaxheba enkulu, nto leyo eluphawu lokungazithembi ncam kwendoda ukuba uthando luqine kangakanani na uthando. Kanti abanye bakholelwa ekubeni ilufuzo into yokuphatha kakubi umfazi. Asiyishiyi ngaphandle imbono ethi ubunzima bentlalo, iinkxwaleko zomtshato nobuhlwempu ziyabuguqula ubume bengqondo yendoda, izale iingcwangu nentlondi. Ubunyaniso okanye ubu-ethe ethe bezi zizathu Sekela-sihlalo ndibushiya nale Ndlu ukuba ibetyise. Xa sisondela ekufumaneni iyeza nezisombululo ezizizo ngale ngxubakaxaka yokudlakathiswa kwabasetyhini nokunyathelwa ngeenyawo kwamalungelo abo, i- UDM ivakalisa ukuxhasa zonke zizindululo eziqulathwe kumqulu wale ngxelo siyixovulayo namhlanje, ngakumbi le ithi amadoda amsulwa, angadyobhekiyo kolu lwabhici, makavakalise ngelizwi elinye elikhulu, angenelele ukukhalimela lo mkhwa mbi kangakanana uthoba isithoba isidima samadoda nabafazi ngokufanayo. Masisixhase kananjalo isindululo esithi ubuhlwempu obugqubayo nesifo ugawulayo ogqugqisayo elizweni kumele kunikwe ingqwalasela eyodwa xa kucetywa amalinge namacebo ophuhliso kwezo ndawo zithwaxwa yindlala. Yinyaniso emsulwa kananjalo ethi amasebe onke kaRhulumente abandakanyekayo ekulweni ugonyamelo lwabafazi ngamadoda, makabe nazo zonke izixhobo ezifanelekileyo nolwazi olufanelekileyo kwiinkundla zakwamantyi, izitishi zamapolisaÿ.ÿ.ÿ. [Kuyaqhwatywa.] (Translation of isiXhosa speech follows.)

[Mr H T SOGONI: Deputy Chairperson and hon members of this House, please allow me first to rectify the mistake that was made by my colleague Mr Windvoël, when he said that the UDM was idle. I rise to add a few words on the topic that we are discussing here today.

Chairperson, you will allow me to quote the words of one of the experts on African culture, Mr Khaba Mkhize, where he says that there is a secret about women that we, as today’s generation, know about: ``These are great and humane people’’. He goes on and tells us that women deserve respect and should be treated with dignity. He goes on and warns us when one is no longer ashamed of anything, disgrace creeps in.

I quote this wise man’s words because every man that has looked carefully at the report that is tabled before us here today should be ashamed. In actual fact our dignity as men is running the risk of being looked down upon because of the shame it brings to society because of the crime of abuse of women by some men. According to the report it has become clear that some men have lost the respect of human nature especially, and that results in their perpetrating serious and shameful acts. Research recently conducted indicates that there are men who are also abused by women. Even so, their numbers can never be compared to the pain with which women live under the cruel hands of some men.

Statistics show that one in every four women suffer abuse and violence from their husbands every week. Eighty percent of abused cases of women are domestic cases that are perpetrated by husbands who had sworn that they loved their partners. With some women it may take ten years to realise and accept that she is being abused and can no longer stay in the marriage. Some stay for more than 39 years, suffering abuse and beatings by husbands before they decide to summon help. Sometimes their situation develops into what is called the ``battered woman syndrome’’. Some believe that the situation they live in can never be changed. Sometimes a woman would even tells herself that she might be the cause of the abuse. Sometimes these victims believe, and wrongly so, that the man has control and power over her and even the law would not be able to stop the situation. That is the extent of the problem in our society nowadays.

The big question then, Deputy Chairperson is: Where has it gone wrong? Why is the standard of humanity going down? Why are people conducting themselves like animals and have no shame in our country? There are many reasons that are given for this situation. Some claim that men want to prove that they are the ones who have power and control in marriages or in love relationships. Some believe that alcohol and other substances play a part in causing some men to be uncontrollable. There is also a belief that jealousy is another contributing factor, and to me that might be a sign that the man does not trust the other partner. Some believe that abusing a woman is hereditary. By all of this we are not underestimating the fact that there might be problems in marriages and that, together with poverty and strife, these factors contribute to exacerbating the situation, and probably alter a man’s state of mind for the worst and fill it with rage, derision and cruelty. Chairperson, I would therefore like to leave the details or rather the delicacy of these issues for the House to deal with.

As we are about to offer solutions to try and remedy the situation of abuse of women and domestic violence, and violation of their rights, the UDM would like express their support for all the recommendations and resolutions that are in the report that we are discussing today, especially the part that says that those who are innocent and do not commit these atrocities should say in one big voice that they condemn this dirty habit that is aimed at downgrading the dignity of men and women alike. Let us support the recommendation that poverty and HIV/Aids should be given special attention when planning development initiatives and programmes for places that are most hit by poverty. Government departments, like magistrate courts, police stations and all others that are included in the fight against violence against women, should be provided with all the necessary resources, skills and education about this matter. [Applause.]]

THE CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Order! I am afraid your time has expired.

Ms S N NTLABATI: Chairperson, I stand to talk as a target. [laughter.] …

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Order! No discrimination, of whatever tenor, will be allowed in this House. Proceed hon member.

Ms S N NTLABATI: I think, as a target, I must first salute all the men here who have joined this war in favour of us, and I salute even the other men outside there who are on this bandwagon with us. Because many people have already spoken on this matter, I will just talk on two issues, namely proactiveness and the implementation of the laws we make, etc. Why? Because today, probably now, as I am speaking, there is a woman in pain because of someone having sex with her against her will and, during that, HIV/Aids is knowingly being transmitted to her. In most instances three month old or six month old babies, because of false beliefs, are victims. Usually, it would be a stranger and, now, even somebody known and supposed to be trusted by this woman.

As a target, I firstly want to make a plea that during this week, starting from tonight, we will have to start thinking globally. We have just been talking about Nepad, which is a continental and global issue. I am pleading that, although we are going to be acting locally when we implement, for now, let us also think globally about violence against women, and not say we do not have the things I am going to mention, that is genital mutilation.

Imagine the agony of it, how painful it is when a pin pricks you. So how painful is it when one stitches the flesh of a young woman who is maybe eleven or twelve years old. In this instance, it is violence by women against women when genital mutilation is performed.

Let us think today about early marriages of eleven or twelve year olds in areas South America, where it is happening. How painful is it when a child jumps the steps of childhood, becomes an adult and gets married. The string of trafficking. Let us not say, as South Africans, these things are not happening here because we are in a world which is globalising. So I think we need to be proactive, even on these issues, although we say it is not happening to us.

As a target, and in the context of proactiveness, I want to start from the home and plead for a change of mindsets in us as parents. When a boy is born, we buy blue which signifies the sky, the sea and strong things. For a girl we buy pink which signifies the soft petals of a flower. What does that mean? I am saying to this young girl: You will have to be submissive. You are a soft thing which has to be submissive''. I am saying to this boy:You are going to be a strong thing which has to be aggressive’’. That is why I am saying let us also be proactive right from the way we bring up our children in our homes. This I am still saying as a target.

At schools there are a lot of emotional abuse even from male teachers when a young girl wants to choose certain subjects. Though of late, in the 21st century, the teacher may not openly say it but there will be a frown. She will simply to be told, Oh, you are brave' when a girl says,I want to be an analytical chemist’’. That is emotional abuse, meaning that she is trampling in a field which is not hers, as it used to happen in the past. A professor, where I trained as a nurse, used to say to females going into medicine: ``For six years? When are you going to have babies, as God intended you to?’’. We are now in the 21st century but it is still happening in a very subtle way.

With regard to implementation, we have to ask ourselves questions as to why. Are we not probably failing in the very Acts which we have set up, the declarations which we have signed? During the period when this committee visited the provinces to give this report we discovered in Welkom that there are people in the police stations who are not sure about the very Act, who do not even know the terminology when one speaks of protection orders. In the year 2002 they are still using the old terminology. How do we then expect those people to protect women?

The other things we forget with regard to implementation, is in the context of violence. Other than the police stations, the place where more women, whose rights have been violated, go to is the hospital, the casualty department of the hospital. We never speak about training the clerks in the hospitals, in terms of how to receive victims of violence. We have never taught the doctors or the female nurses. How to receive a victim in this situation is not in the curriculum. So I think in the context of implementation we seem to forget those other minor places where women, whose rights have been violated, go to.

In the church there is a very beautiful institution called the Sunday school, where children up to the age of 18 years are taught. I have no objection to children being taught that Jesus Christ was born in Bethlehem, this, that and the other. However, that is also a target group. I am now challenging churches that this is also where education on violence against women, and all its instances, needs to take place.

Lastly, let us not hide behind culture, because in every book, which one might open to read the definition, one realises that culture is not static, it is dynamic, it moves with the times. But why does it not move when it comes to issues which violate our rights as targets? That needs to be given thought. Many members here have spoken about alcohol being predisposing sometimes. So I think it is also a challenge to us that we somehow need to do something about the liquor laws. At the moment I do not have an answer but I think we need to look into that situation.

The other thing is with regard to the Joint Monitoring Committee. For instance, here in our committee there are only two men. One party also had a male but he was removed and a woman was brought in, which means that this issue of the status of women has to be fought by women only. I am pleading to our Parliament that that should not be the case. The last thing is a question which torments me.[Time expired.] [Applause.]

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: That concludes the debate. I shall now put the question. The question is that the report be adopted. The decision is dealt with in terms of section 65 of the Constitution. I note that all delegations have delegation heads present. Is there any province which wishes to make a declaration of vote? There is none. We therefore proceed to voting on the question. This will be in alphabetical order. Eastern Cape ?

Ms B N DLULANE: We support.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Free State?

Mr T S SETONA: We support.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Gauteng?

Ms J L KGOALI: Gauteng e a go amogela. [Gauteng supports.]

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: KwaZulu-Natal?

Ms J N VILAKAZI: We support.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Mpumalanga?

Ms M P THEMBA: Siyayimukela. [We support.]

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Northern Cape?

Ms E N LUBIDLA: We support.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Northern Province? Mr M I MAKOELA: Re a go thega. [We support.]

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: North West?

Mr Z S KOLWENI: In favour.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Western Cape?

Mr C Ackermann: We support.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: All provinces have voted in favour of the adoption of the report. The report is therefore agreed to and adopted in accordance with section 65 of the Constitution.

Debate concluded.

Council adjourned at 17:41 ____

            ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS

ANNOUNCEMENTS:

National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:

1. The Speaker and the Chairperson:

 (1)    The following Bill was introduced by the Minister of  Health  in
     the National Assembly on 21 August 2002 and referred to  the  Joint
     Tagging Mechanism (JTM) for classification in terms of  Joint  Rule
     160:


     (i)     Medicines and Related Substances Amendment  Bill  [B  40  -
          2002] (National Assembly - sec  75)  [Explanatory  summary  of
          Bill  and  prior  notice  of  its  introduction  published  in
          Government Gazette No 23684 of 29 July 2002.]


     The Bill has been referred to the Portfolio Committee on Health  of
     the National Assembly.


     In terms of Joint Rule 154 written views on the  classification  of
     the Bill may be submitted to the  JTM  within  three  parliamentary
     working days.


 (2)    The Joint Tagging Mechanism (JTM) on 20 August 2002 in terms  of
     Joint Rule 160(6), classified the following Bill as  a  section  74
     Bill:


     (i)      Constitution  of  the  Republic  of  South  Africa   Third
          Amendment Bill [B 33 - 2002] (National Assembly - sec 74).


 (3)    The Joint Tagging Mechanism (JTM) on 20 August 2002 in terms  of
     Joint Rule 160(6), classified the following  Bills  as  section  75
     Bills:


     (i)     Corporate Laws Amendment  Bill  [B  32  -  2002]  (National
           Assembly - sec 75).


     (ii)     Broadcasting  Amendment  Bill  [B  34  -  2002]  (National
           Assembly - sec 75).


     (iii)   Special Pensions Amendment Bill [B  35  -  2002]  (National
           Assembly - sec 75).


     (iv)    South African Revenue Service Amendment Bill [B 36 -  2002]
           (National Assembly - sec 75).


     (v)     Medical Schemes Amendment Bill  [B  37  -  2002]  (National
           Assembly - sec 75).

National Council of Provinces:

1. The Chairperson:

 (1)    Bill passed by National Council of Provinces on 21 August  2002:
     To be submitted to President of the Republic for assent:


     (i)     Export Credit and Foreign Investments  Insurance  Amendment
          Bill [B 29B - 2002] (National Assembly - sec 75).


 (2)    Message from National Assembly to National Council of Provinces:


     Bills  passed  by  National  Assembly  on  21   August   2002   and
     transmitted for concurrence:


     (i)     Defence Bill [B 60B - 2001] (National Assembly  -  sec  75)
           (referred  to  the  Select   Committee   on   Security   and
           Constitutional Affairs).


     (ii)    State Information Technology Agency Amendment Bill  [B  24B
           - 2002] (National Assembly - sec 75) (referred to the Select
           Committee on Local Government and Administration).

1. The Chairperson:

 The following papers have been tabled  and  are  now  referred  to  the
 relevant committees as mentioned below:


 (1)    The following papers are referred to  the  Select  Committee  on
     Security and Constitutional Affairs for consideration and report:


     (a)     International Convention on the  Suppression  of  Terrorist
          Bombings,  tabled  in  terms  of   section   231(2)   of   the
          Constitution, 1996.


     (b)      International  Convention  for  the  Suppression  of   the
          Financing of Terrorism, tabled in terms of section  231(2)  of
          the Constitution, 1996.


     (c)      Organization  of  African   Unity   Convention   for   the
          Prevention and Combating of  Terrorism,  tabled  in  terms  of
          section 231(2) of the Constitution, 1996.


     (d)     Explanatory Memorandums to the Conventions.


     (e)     Protocol on the Control of Firearms, Ammunition  and  other
          Related  Materials  in  the   Southern   African   Development
          Community (SADC) Region, tabled in terms of section 231(2)  of
          the Constitution, 1996.


     (f)     Explanatory Memorandum to the Protocol.


 (2)    The  following  papers  are  referred  to  Select  Committee  on
     Education and Recreation:


     (a)      Annual  Report  and  Financial  Statements  of  the  South
          African Certification Council for 2001-2002.


     (b)     Revised National Curriculum Statement Grades R-9  (Schools)
          Policy 2002:


          (i) Languages Learning Area Home Language;


          (ii)     Languages Learning Area 1st Additional Language;
          (iii)    Languages Learning Area 2nd Additional Language.


 (3)    The following papers are referred to  the  Select  Committee  on
     Land and Environmental Affairs for consideration and report:


     (a)      The  Rotterdam  Convention  on  Prior   Informed   Consent
          Procedure for certain Hazardous Chemicals  and  Pesticides  in
          International Trade, tabled in terms of section 231(2) of  the
          Constitution, 1996.


     (b)     Explanatory Memorandum to the Convention.

TABLINGS:

National Assembly and National Council of Provinces:

Papers:

1. The Minister of Labour:

 Annual Report and Financial Statements of the Banking Sector  Education
 and Training Authority for  2001-2002,  including  the  Report  of  the
 Auditor-General on the Financial Statements for 2001-2002 [RP 95-2002].

COMMITTEE REPORTS:

National Council of Provinces:

1. Report of the Select Committee on Land and Environmental Affairs on Exclusion of Land from Kalahari Gemsbok National Park, dated 21 August 2002:

   The Select Committee on Land and Environmental Affairs, having considered a request for approval by Parliament of the exclusion of two portions of land from the Kalahari Gemsbok National Park, referred to it, recommends that the Council approve the following: The exclusion from the Kalahari Gemsbok National Park, in terms of section 2(3) of the National Parks Act, 1976 (Act No 57 of 1976), of the land described as -

       (a) the area CDEFGC (portion 1 of farm 643) San  Erfenisgronde
           in the Surveyor-General Diagram No. SG253/2002, in  extent
           30 134,7803 ha, situated in  the  administrative  district
           of Mier NCO81, province of the Northern Cape; and
   
   
       (b) the area ABCGA (portion 2 of farm 643) Mier  Erfenisgronde
           in the Surveyor-General Diagram No. SG254/2002, in  extent
           27 769,2969 ha, situated in  the  administrative  district
           of Mier NCO81, province of the Northern Cape,
   
   
       for handing back to the Department of Public Works, upon which
       the Minister for Agriculture and Land Affairs will  issue  the
       title for transfer to the +Khomani San and  Mier  communities,
       as specified in the Ae! Kalahari Heritage Park Agreement.
   

 Report to be considered.

1. Report of the Select Committee on Land and Environmental Affairs on the Nairobi Convention, dated 21 August 2002:

   The Select Committee on Land and Environmental Affairs, having considered the request for approval by Parliament of the Convention for the Protection, Management and Development of Marine and Coastal Environment of the East African Region and Related Protocols (Nairobi Convention), referred to it, recommends that the Council, in terms of section 231(2) of the Constitution, approve the said Convention.

   The Committee notes with concern the fact that most contracting parties do not pay their contributions.

 Report to be considered.

1. Report of the Select Committee on Land and Environmental Affairs on the Abidjan Convention, dated 21 August 2002:

   The Select Committee on Land and Environmental Affairs, having considered the request for approval by Parliament of the Convention for Co-operation in the Protection and Development of the Marine and Coastal Environment of the West and Central African Region and Related Protocols (Abidjan Convention), referred to it, recommends that the Council, in terms of section 231(2) of the Constitution, approve the said Convention.

   The Committee notes with concern the fact that most contracting parties do not pay their contributions.

 Report to be considered.