TUESDAY, 22 JUNE 2004 __

          PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
                                ____

The Council met at 10:02.

The Deputy Chairperson took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.

ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS - see col 000.

              MOTION ON REVIVAL OF ANTI-TERRORISM BILL

                           (Announcement)

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): Hon members, I was informed that the Whippery has agreed that we won’t have Motions today. We will, therefore, proceed straight to the Order Paper. Just before I do that, may I remind all members that we do have a very congested day today? We will not be very lenient in terms of time allocated to you. At times we become very lenient, but today we’re going to be strict on time.

You had better look at your speech again and pick up what you think is most important, because the time allocated to you will be the time allocated to you. If and when I say the time has expired, you’ll have to respect the Chair, unfortunately, and sit down. We don’t like to do it in the NCOP. We normally give you some extra time to finish your sentence, but we’re going to be a little stricter today. If you don’t know how many minutes you have for speaking, can the provincial Whips please assist? Let’s do that. The Chief Whip is also available to inform other people regarding the time allocated to them.

                      REVIVAL OF ANTI-TERRORISM

                         (Draft Resolution)

The ACTING CHIEF WHIP OF THE COUNCIL (Mr V V Z Windvoël): Chairperson, I move:

That, subject to the concurrence of the National Assembly, the Protection of Constitutional Democracy against Terrorist and Related Activities Bill, which was originally introduced as the Anti-Terrorism Bill, be revived and consideration of the Bill be resumed from the stage where the Bill, in the version passed by the National Assembly, is transmitted to the National Council of Provinces for its concurrence.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): There is no speakers’ list. I shall now put the question, and the question is that the motion be agreed to. As the decision is dealt with in terms of section 65 of the Constitution, I shall first ascertain whether all delegation heads are present in the Chamber to cast their provinces’ votes. Are all delegation heads present? They are.

In accordance with Rule 71, I shall first allow provinces the opportunity to make their declarations of vote if they so wish. Is there any province that wishes to do so? None.

We shall now proceed to the voting on the question. I shall do this in an alphabetical manner. Delegation heads must please indicate to the Chair whether they vote in favour or against, or whether they abstain. Eastern Cape?

Mr A T MANYOSI: Siyaxhasa. [We support.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): Free State?

Mr T S RALANE: In favour.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): Gauteng? Mr E M SOGONI: Gauteng supports.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): KwaZulu-Natal?

Mrs J N VILAKAZI: Siyayixhasa. [We support.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): Limpopo?

Kgoshi M L MOKOENA: In favour.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): Mpumalanga?

Mr B J MKHALIPHI: Siyayisekela. [We support.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): Northern Cape?

Mr M A SULLIMAN: Northern Cape votes in favour.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): Western Cape?

Mr N MACK: Western Cape supports.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): North West?

Mr Z S KOWENI: Re a rona. [We agree.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): All nine provinces voted in favour. I therefore declare the motion agreed to in terms of section 65 of the Constitution.

              REVIVAL OF NATIONAL PORTS AUTHORITY BILL

                         (Draft Resolution)

The ACTING CHIEF WHIP OF THE COUNCIL (Mr V V Z Windvoël): Deputy Chairperson, I move:

That the Council -

(1) notes that -

   (a)  in the Second Parliament the National Ports Authority Bill [B 5B
       - 2003] (National Assembly -  section  75)  was  passed  by  the
       National Assembly on 16  September  2003  and  referred  to  the
       National Council of Provinces for concurrence; and


   (b)  the National Council of Provinces was  unable  to  complete  its
       consideration  of  the  Bill  before  the  end  of  the   Second
       Parliament and the Bill consequently lapsed; and

(2) resolves, subject to the concurrence of the Assembly, that the National Ports Authority Bill [B 5B - 2003] be revived and consideration of the Bill be resumed from the stage where it stands referred to the relevant committee of the Assembly for consideration and report.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): As there is no speakers’ list, I shall now put the question, and the question is that the motion be agreed to. As the decision is dealt with in terms of section 65 of the Constitution, I shall first ascertain whether all delegation heads are present in the Chamber to cast their provinces’ votes. Are all delegation heads present? They are present.

In accordance with Rule 71, I shall first allow provinces the opportunity to make their declarations of vote if they so wish. Is there any province that wishes to do so? None.

We shall now proceed to the voting on the question. I shall do this in an alphabetical order per province. Delegation heads must please indicate to the Chair whether they vote in favour or against, or whether they abstain. Eastern Cape?

Mr A T MANYOSI: Siyayixhasa kakhulu. [We support wholeheartedly.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): Free State?

Mr T RALANE: Re a dumela. [We support.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): Gauteng?

Mr E M SOGONI: Siyavuma. [We agree.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): KwaZulu-Natal?

Mrs M N OLIPHANT: Siyayixhasa. [We support.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): Limpopo?

Kgoshi M L MOKOENA: In favour.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): Mpumalanga?

Mr V V Z WINDVOEL: Siyayisekela. [We support.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): Northern Cape?

Ms P HOLLANDER: Siyawuxhasa. [We support.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): North West?

Mr Z S KOLWENI: In favour.

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): Western Cape?

Mr N MACK: Die Wes-Kaap steun. [The Western Cape supports.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): All nine provinces voted in favour. I therefore declare the motion agreed to in accordance to section 65 of the Constitution.

                         APPROPRIATION BILL

Debate on Vote No 14 - Arts and Culture

Debate on Vote No 18 - Science and Technology

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP (Mr M J Mahlangu): Just before I call the Minister, I want, on behalf of the Council, to thank the executive members. You would realise that we have clustered our committees in the NCOP, and therefore the debates. This Parliament would like to be clustered and we are happy that we have acceded to this type of a cluster also. It tells us a lot of things, because as the NCOP we then begin to understand that the two departments have to consult with each other, and when we go to the provinces, we are more informed as we do our oversight. So, on that score I would like to thank all of you, particularly the two Ministers and their Deputies …

The MINISTER OF ARTS AND CULTURE: Deputy Chairperson, MECs here present and their Deputies, hon members of the NCOP, the nine provinces of our country are blessed with a wealth of arts, cultures and languages. From these diverse components we have made a collective commitment to knit together a new nation. That challenge stands at the core of the work of the Department of Arts and Culture. This department has been tasked with the responsibility of being the custodian of South Africa’s diverse cultural and artistic heritage. And our vision is to harness these to engender social cohesion and to enhance nation-building.

In his state of the nation address, President Mbeki urged us to achieve …

… further and visible advances with regard to the improvement of the quality of life of all our people, affecting many critical areas of social existence, including moral regeneration, social cohesion and opening the doors of culture and education to all.

This department is uniquely placed to contribute to the realisation of these goals. We owe our achievements over the past 10 years to the Department of Arts and Culture’s predecessor, the Department of Arts, Culture, Science and Technology. The Department of Arts and Culture is thus a new department, created this year by separating out the arts and culture functions from those of science and technology.

I want to acknowledge the sterling contribution of former Minister, Dr Ben Ngubane, who oversaw many of the achievements in this sector over the past decade. A new directorate, Arts and Culture in Society, has been set up within the department to steer the arts and culture on a course of social regeneration by providing strategic support to arts institutions and organisations of civil society. Addressing the issues of inclusion and integration, so as to end resource inequalities in the sector, is its central task. Inclusion of vulnerable groups such as the disabled, youth, women and children is one of its strategic imperatives.

Two sub-programmes contribute directly to social development and social cohesion. They will be directed at out of school youths, the rehabilitation of prisoners and the Moral Regeneration Movement. Arts and Social Development is responsible for initiating and managing projects and programmes aimed at the youth, HIV and Aids, crime prevention, human rights and disability.

We are planning a project in co-operation with the Department of Correctional Services: Arts in Prisons'', using the arts to modify the behaviour of offenders serving time in prison. TheOutstanding Inmates in Arts’’ and ``Dramatists against Crime’’ projects will commence in July

1. During 2003 the National Heritage Council was established. Transforming our museums and art galleries is a big challenge that would entail rigorous research to make them truly representative and to correct numerous historical distortions. Four of nine Pilot Legacy Projects, approved by Cabinet in 1998, were completed in June 2003, including the Women’s Monument and Constitution Hill. The Chief Albert Luthuli project will be unveiled in July 2004 once it has been completed.

A new portfolio of projects located in various provinces - the Mapungubwe, eMakhosini Valley, Liliesleaf, Steven Bantu Biko, Robert Mangaliso Sobukwe and Sarah Baartmann projects are in the pipeline. To speed up their implementation, the Department will co-operate with other implementation agencies, non-governmental organisations and community-based organisations. Last year Cabinet approved the National Language Policy Framework to promote the equitable use of the 11 official languages and to ensure redress for previously marginalised indigenous languages.

In March 2004 the Department launched the Language Initiatives Programme. Of particular importance to the provinces is the setting up of nine Language Research Development Centres, one for each of South Africa’s nine indigenous languages, at tertiary institutions situated among communities where those languages are spoken. One of the National Language Service’s outputs for 2003 was the development, in collaboration with nine tertiary institutions, of mathematics terminology in all nine African languages. A mathematics terminology list, containing approximately 10 000 terms, was consequently launched in June 2004.

In the 2003-04 financial year, substantial progress was made with Declared Cultural Institutions situated in six of the provinces. New councils were established for all 13 bodies and a transformation budget of R7 million has been distributed. These new councils face numerous challenges. They have to improve access to the museum infrastructure, develop new audiences, develop human resources, implement an affirmative action policy by training, grooming and appointing a new generation of curators and managers from all races, implement exciting community outreach programmes, introduce acquisition policies that accord indigenous artefacts their rightful place, and integrate living heritage in the form of oral tradition, oral history and indigenous knowledge systems into the ambit of our heritage institutions.

Within the department itself, the targets set by the White Paper have been exceeded. The White Paper had set a target in management of 50% black. It now stands at 86% black. The target for females in management set by the White Paper was 30%. It now stands at 32% female. Overall, the staff composition at present stands at 70% black, 30% white, 55% female and 45% male. I think that is quite remarkable. Service delivery in all our programmes has been good. Arts and Culture in society mainstreams the role of the arts and culture and supports various disciplines via grants disbursed by the National Arts Council. In the past year the department successfully assisted 15 historic community arts centres with their funding applications to the National Lottery Distribution Fund. The R5 million application has been approved by the Fund. The setting up of Provincial Steering Committees and the National Steering Committee for community arts centres will ensure a long-term, transparent relationship between the department and the sector.

Collaboration with provincial departments is yielding gradual, but positive results. Eight provinces have received funding for their projects, which involve all the major centres in each province. In total R1, 8 million has been invested in regional community arts centre projects. Through the Promotion of Arts and Culture in South Africa subprogramme, six theatres, three orchestras and a range of other artistic endeavours were funded.

The promotion of our new national symbols to the South African public will begin this year, 2004-05. Cultural Development and International Co- operation, one of the Department’s most important programmes, is the gateway to economic and other developmental opportunities for South African arts and culture at provincial, national and international level. Key activities include supporting the cultural industries and the development of arts training, as well as maintaining 37 international agreements.

In partnership with the Flemish government, we are developing a arts and education training centre in KwaZulu-Natal by the in and pre-service training for artists and for art teachers. Arts education and training has also held accreditation workshops around the country to alert training institutions in both the formal and informal sectors to the requirements of the SA Qualifications Authority.

The establishment of Create SA stands out as arts education and training’s most important achievement. Through Create SA, learnerships driven by industry demand have been awarded in a wide range of areas, including music, design, crafts, arts management, heritage and the performing arts. Since 2003 approximately 2 000 learnerships or skills development programmes have been taken up.

Our Cultural Development and International Co-operation programme is also responsible for the Investing in Culture programme, which focuses on the crafts, music, heritage and cultural tourism sectors. The Investing in Culture programme aims to identify and use existing skills within communities and among individuals. It is the single most significant intervention this department is making in the second economy.

To date, some 12 000 jobs have been created; some 22 000 people have been trained; and 428 000 training days have been accumulated. The National Treasury has recognised the contribution that the Department of Arts and Culture is making in the fight to eradicate poverty and to create remunerative work. We want to appeal to this House to support us in seeking a bigger budget allocation which will enable us to do a great deal more.

The department’s plans for 2004-05 are dominated by transfers to the heritage institutions and to the arts and culture institutions. It is projected that such transfers will take up an average of 82,9% of the department’s expenditure over the medium term. The department plans to continue the work outlined earlier, as well as to attempt an equitable distribution of funds to ensure the sustainability of playhouses, orchestras and the Moral Regeneration Movement. Two new orchestras are projected for the financial year 2004-05. We will also provide grants to programmes in the 24 community arts centres where we are active, and fund 10 arts festivals. We plan to increase the participation of the disabled in festivals and to enhance their access to arts and culture in general.

The sum of R93 million has been allocated to performing arts institutions. Orchestras will receive R9 million. Promotion of Arts and Culture has been allocated some R36 million, and the National Arts Council has been allocated R44 million. Arts and Culture in Society is to receive R218 million or 19,11% of the department’s budget.

Equity for indigenous languages, the heart of the language policy spelt out in our Constitution, came closer to realisation when the department unveiled three language development initiatives at the Advancing Multilingualism in a Democratic South Africa conference in Durban during March 2004.

The department has provided R9 million in its budget for the current financial year for the setting up of the Language Research and Development Centres and R5 million for a bursary scheme. Sepedi, Sesotho, Setswana, siSwati, Tshivenda, Xitsonga, isiNdebele, isiXhosa and isiZulu will each have an LRDC to ensure their public use in important fields, ranging from law to education, and to encourage and support language-related research that is relevant and responsive to the needs of the speakers of these languages. The centres will be set up and will work closely with tertiary institutions around the country with the respective communities, and will forge partnerships with nongovernmental and community-based organisations. Of all their tasks, perhaps the most immediately important will be providing interpreting and translating services to the community, either directly or by referral.

Here I must point out the application of the principle of functional multilingualism or linguistic differentiation that will ensure that communities located in close proximity to the institution have access to both the production and consumption of knowledge. The need for translation from and into foreign languages has, of course, increased as South Africa has become more involved in the international arena. This finds reflection in this programme’s budget.

We plan to establish 20 sites for a telephone interpreting service at clinics and customer-care centres by December 2004. The completion of terminology lists for science and technology is scheduled for completion in September 2004. Overall, the National Language Service has been allocated some R78 million, which amounts to 6,8% of the department’s budget. The provision for the National Language Service includes a once-off amount for implementing the National Language Policy Framework.

Cultural industries have been allocated some R16 million. Funds will be transferred to support music, crafts, books and publishing, film, design and other sectors. Cultural Development and International Co-operation has been allocated 13,5% of the department’s budget.

Of the Heritage Promotion budget, we have set aside R340 million for declared cultural institutions and R175 million for capital works. The National Heritage Council and Transformation received R21 million. Heritage transformation projects include the Oral History Project, the results of which we plan to incorporate into a national register of oral sources.

The SA Heritage Resources Agency is of specific interest to the provinces. Section 34 of the National Heritage Resources Act of 1999 places the responsibility of granting permits squarely with provincial heritage resources authorities. This suggests that the provincial heritage resources authorities must be built up because they carry the sole responsibility for granting permits that are necessary for development and conservation. The challenge that the heritage sector has been facing is the slow inauguration of the provincial heritage resources agencies in some of the provinces. Even where they exist, they lack capacity to execute their functions.

In the budget, the SA Heritage Resources Agency is allocated R16 million. With the participation of communities, we aim to declare several new heritage sites by September 2004. A total of R593 million, or 52%, of the department’s budget has been set aside for heritage promotion. We are taking up the challenge to get down to work in a people’s contract to build a better South Africa and a better world.

I want also to take this opportunity to thank, in the first instance, my Deputy who will be speaking later in the debate, the director-general and his staff for the contributions that have been made to the work of this department. I also want to acknowledge the contributions that have been made to the success of the work of this department by the various Deputy Ministers in Arts, Culture, Science and Technology. There have been three Deputy Ministers over the past 10 years. I don’t think I need to name them all; you are all aware of who they were. I want to thank them for the contribution they have made to building up this particular sector. Thank you very much. [Applause.]

The MINISTER OF SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY: Chairperson, hon MECs present, hon members, our Ministry and department, as members may be aware, are mandated to realise the full potential of science and technology in social and economic development through the development of human resources, research and innovation.

I am honoured, therefore, to present to the Council, for the first time, the Budget Vote on Science and Technology. The new Ministry of Science and Technology is the result of a deliberate attempt by Government to renew our research and development of human capital as a means of growing and modernising our economy, and thereby improving the lives of our citizens. To underpin this intent, in his second state of the nation address in May, the President announced Government’s intention to increase the resources for research and development.

The Department of Science and Technology will give expression to this social and economic development vision of Government by actively supporting the transfer and application of new technologies derived from cutting edge research, to the benefit of all our people. This means that the Department of Science and Technology will provide the foundation which supports the delivery that ultimately takes place in different sectors and different departments of Government.

As already stated in our budget debate in the National Assembly last week, the national research and development spending fell sharply from 1,04% to 0,75% of the GDP from 1991 to 1993, when the former government drastically curtailed its strategic technology-based missions, such as its nuclear capability and the technology platforms underpinning South Africa’s military dominance in the subcontinent. This had a profound effect on research and development in our country. The new Government, therefore, inherited a science system that had its key drivers removed. We need to motivate our scientists by redirecting them towards new missions of national competitiveness and quality of life, and to produce a cohort of young scientists that is more representative of South Africa’s people. This is one of our biggest tasks because, as things stand at the moment, the vast majority of our scientists are ageing and are white. Women and black people need to be drawn in larger numbers towards science, technology and development.

Our expenditure on research and development, according to the 2001-02 survey, now stands at 0,76% of the GDP. Over half of this research and development is conducted by the private sector, indicating the increasing role of innovation in the South African industry. However, we need to raise this level of investment to at least 1% of the GDP, which is the target we set ourselves in the 2002 Research and Development Strategy.

In our estimation we are still about R2 billion per annum short of this target. In the current budget, our request for R1 billion new and additional resources was trimmed in the ultimate allocation to around one tenth of the amount. Although this amount did not meet our expectations, we still made the following gains: We were allocated an additional R10 million for the establishment of the new National Energy Research Institute and we are also one of the departments that were granted additional funding to continue our poverty reduction projects to the tune of R45 million, R47 million and R53 million over the Medium-Term Expenditure Framework period for the community level projects that use science and technology to create employment and businesses on a sustainable basis.

We have also realised that we need to involve all three spheres of Government in order to effectively implement policies addressing development, poverty alleviation and service delivery priorities. One programme where this approach has been successful is the Poverty Alleviation Project, where we have had positive outcomes in businesses and co-operatives focused on, among others, bee-keeping, papermaking, African design incorporation in clothing and textiles based on natural fibres, and indigenous cattle production. These projects are concentrated in the poverty nodes as identified by the Government’s Integrated Sustainable Rural Development Plan, and have yielded over 2 899 jobs employing 1 675 women, 862 youth and 68 people with disabilities.

Another area where we stand a better chance of increasing our international competitiveness is in the indigenous knowledge systems. The central challenge for governments the world over is the protection of their indigenous knowledge systems. This is why the South African Government has placed great emphasis on the development of an IKS policy and IKS legislation, which will significantly protect, develop and promote IKS, and help improve the livelihood and economic wellbeing of indigenous communities by ensuring equitable and fair benefit sharing. For this reason, we intend tabling the IKS policy before Cabinet very soon.

My department’s commitment in recognising the indisputable wealth of indigenous knowledge is validated in various projects which include, inter alia, the drafting of the IKS policy and Bill; financial support of the Indigenous Knowledge Systems of South Africa Trust; the establishment of an interdepartmental committee on IKS; dedicated ring-fenced funding from the NRF for IKS research; and the development of a framework for the establishment of the South African Indigenous Knowledge Digital Library. This is based on the Traditional Knowledge digital Library completed recently by India.

Implementation of the National Biotechnology Strategy is continuing apace, with substantial portfolios of research in medical, agricultural and industrial biotechnology taking place mainly through research consortia, facilitated through the biotechnology innovation centres.

The key three centres to leverage biotechnology opportunities according to specialisation in biotechnology are: the Biopad Bric in Gauteng region, which focuses on animal health and industry/environmental-related biotechnology; the Ecobio Bric in KwaZulu-Natal, which focuses on human health and bioprocessing, with a plant biotechnology focal area to contribute to plant biotechnology; and the Cape Biotech Initiative Bric in the Western Cape, which focuses on human health and bioprocessing.

The National Technology Transfer Strategy is now in its final stages of review and adoption, and should be implemented intensively from 2005-06 onwards. This strategy is premised by the critical role that technology plays in wealth creation and social development. Technology transfer is generally driven by imperatives to introduce manufacturing efficiencies, value-added product developments, novel products for competitive strengths, efficiencies in service provision and quality of life improvements in terms of access to basic goods and services. In the current setting there are two Department of Science and Technology interventions, namely, the Godisa Programme, an incubator and technology demonstration programme, and the Tshumisano technology stations at Universities of Technology that are aimed at business creation and support through technical improvement, product and process innovation.

The Godisa Programme was launched in 2001 to stimulate technology transfer. It is currently supporting eight technology transfer centres in five provinces, which are Gauteng, the Free State, KwaZulu-Natal, the Eastern Cape and the Western Cape, focussing on a multitude of technology platforms and markets such as biotechnology, life sciences, medical devices, software, embedded systems, fine and performance chemicals, small scale miners and hydroponics for cut-flower exports. This technology transfer has very real local and international benefits and directly leads to job- creation, increased levels of competency and enhanced international competitiveness.

With over seven hundred small-scale miners and almost one hundred manufacturing SMEs supported so far, Godisa is set to double the level of services to SMEs in terms of technical support over the next two years. This year, the establishment of two further centres to support the National Public Works’ Emerging Contractors Programme in Limpopo and KwaZulu-Natal and the Biodiesel Initiative in Limpopo are underway.

There are now nine Tshumisano stations operating out of the Universities of Technology environment in specific sectors to enrich research and development, teaching and learning activities with better equipment and more realistic understanding of industry and its needs. The sectors include chemicals, textiles, electronics, metal processing, mechanical engineering and food technology. Members might be aware that this department has prepared a recipe book which is being used by various communities in our country in order to enhance traditional dishes and, of course, also to make a living out of implementation of programmes related to food technology.

During the past year, Tshomisano doubled its SMME client base from 206 to just over 400 SMMEs with about a thousand development projects. This will grow to a target level of 800 SMMEs. Support for the SMMEs owned by historically disadvantaged individuals in the sectors outlined earlier, has also been increased by roughly 50%. In closing, I would like to reiterate my department’s commitment to working with all role-players to contribute to the improvement of the lives of all our people. We certainly need a governance approach which involves all three spheres of government. Deputy Minister Hanekom will elaborate on some of the programmes that the department is involved in, when he gets his chance later on. Thank you very much, Chair. [Applause.]

Mr B J TOLO: Thank you, Chair. At the beginning of this debate you made a remark about time, and I just want to tell you that I have been given 10 minutes to speak and I am going to donate some of these minutes to you and you can use those at your own discretion. [Laughter.] At the beginning we want to congratulate both the Ministers and their Deputies on their appointments in their respective departments. We have no doubt in our minds that they will discharge their responsibilities with distinction.

Over the past decades, and even during the past century, the world saw a scientific and technological revolution. It was a revolution that has changed the productive forces in the economies of the developed world beyond recognition. The ability to create, distribute, reinvent and exploit knowledge has become a major source of competitive advantage. The newly industrialised Asian countries, which are today known as the Asian tigers, are testimony to this. Countries such as South Korea, Taiwan, Singapore and others, which not long ago were backward countries, are today an envy to many nations in the world. They transformed their economies by improving the technological performance of their industries through well thought-out science and technological policies and strategies.

Unfortunately the same cannot be said about African countries. In the past 40 years or so, the economies of the African countries have either declined or stagnated. This is due to, among other things, the fact that African countries have not yet been engulfed by the scientific and technological revolution we are talking about. The challenge therefore, for developing countries in Africa and elsewhere, is to invest in science and technology if they are to be partners in this globalising world.

Our democratic Government has realised that we cannot be perpetual buyers of developing technology, but we must be developers of technology ourselves through scientific research. To be able to do so, we need to develop home- grown scientists who will engage in research and come up with scientific inventions that will go a long way in bettering the lives of our people. It is for this reason that our Government decided to establish a fully-fledged Department of Science and Technology. This department will focus on realising the fulfilment of science and technology in social and economic development through the development of human resources, research and innovation, as the mission statement of the department indicates.

The department seeks to provide strategic direction and support scientific research and technology, both in the public and private sectors, so that we can see new businesses and products in the market. We are told that this is already beginning to happen, but we need more. We say this because in the long run this department will be seen as a messiah to help us to solve many of our problems. It is good to call on other countries to invest in South Africa to help solve the problem of unemployment, but it is not good enough. In the long run we must depend on our own resources to solve the problem of unemployment. This can only be done through new businesses.

Here we are not talking about traditional businesses. We are talking about businesses at tertiary level. This department is at the centre of developing brains that will develop such businesses while the education system develops the work force that will access those high technology jobs. Our departments must not be seen as watertight compartments which have nothing to do with each other or one another. There is interrelationship amongst them. This is why this department, although it is now a stand-alone department, is connected like an embryo to the mother through an umbilical cord, particularly to the Department of Education. It is therefore our belief that science and technology must grip the minds of our young people while they are still at school. The school curricula cannot be complete if they do not include science and technology. In this regard, I am always fascinated by the Japanese example

• and I have said this before in this House. In the 1960s, any product that came from Japan was said to be like Japan itself because of the low quality. However, since they went out to invest in science and technology, their products rank amongst the best in the world today. As it is now, they even see raw materials in what other countries refer to as finished goods.

I have one good example here. In the 70s and 80s Russia used to produce very big, thick steel trucks. The Japanese bought lots and lots of these trucks, but the Russians did not see the trucks in the streets of Japan and they were wondering what the Japanese were doing with the trucks. At last they discovered that on arrival of these trucks, the Japanese took off the wheels and threw them into the furnaces because they saw the raw material in the product of another country. We are saying, therefore, that South Africa must strive to emulate Japan in terms of production of high technology products, and this can only be achieved if we put more money in the department. We have heard the Minister indicating in no uncertain terms that the budget that the department has, does not address their problems and they will not be in the position to address all that they want to do. It means something must be done. Of course, the President, in his state of the nation address, alluded to this that more money will be allocated to this department, and we appreciate that.

The Department of Arts and Culture is also a relatively new department in our country; new in the sense that it became a stand-alone department in the year 2000. It is a department at the centre of preservation of our history and nation building. A nation that does not know where it comes from will always be rudderless and it will not know where to go. We are therefore pleased to learn that the department will do everything in its power to see to it that our indigenous languages will, in fact, be developed and promoted. We are heartened to hear that our Government departments will not be mistaken for some government departments somewhere in Europe, because they will not be using only English as a language. Our people who are our clients will now be able to communicate and express themselves freely using their own mother tongues in this department.

Many place names in our country still have colonial names. We still have place names like Kafferkraal, Hotnotfontein and many others. These names are an insult to us and to our democracy. We therefore call upon the department, and the provinces in particular, to fast-track the process of changing place names in our country. I was pleased to hear the other day that the name of the capital of my province is going to be changed from Nelspruit to something else. I just hope that the name that they will give to the capital will unite the people of our province.

The economic potential of crafts, music, film and publishing cannot be over emphasised. We are pleased to see that our department is hard at work to promote these through public and private partnership with the market to enhance these industries. We will all agree that these play a very big role in spiritual fulfilment and in addressing the big problem of poverty in our country. The establishment of the Freedom Park is one of the milestones of this department for preservation of our history. It will go a long way in attracting both local and foreign tourists who are interested in knowing the history of our country.

During the wars of liberation, some our finest sons and daughters perished in foreign fraternal countries. Our dream, therefore, is to see the department looking at possibilities of repatriating their immortal remains, so that their next of kin and the people in general can go to their graves to draw inspiration and recharge. If this dream proves to be a mission impossible, let us erect a monument with their names inscribed on it for posterity. We support both Budget Votes.

Ms N JAJULA (Eastern Cape): Hon Deputy Chairperson, hon Ministers, Deputy Ministers, MECs, hon members, I will attempt to craft my policy presentation by first identifying the vision of the department, which is an Eastern Cape devoid of inequalities of the past, unified through integrated and sustainable economic, social and cultural development; thus providing an acceptable quality of life for all its people in the context of a united, nonracial, nonsexist and democratic South Africa.

The key strategic goals encapsulate the following: to mobilise artists through awareness and development programmes; to conserve and promote the culture and history of the province; to promote multilingualism and increase literacy; to facilitate access to and the dissemination of information; to promote economic opportunities through the optimal use of natural resources and job creation; and to facilitate the development of infrastructure for the effective implementation of arts and culture programmes. All this is to take place in partnership with local government, municipalities, the private sector, Government departments and other countries.

The province is focusing mostly on the facilities that include the theatres for promoting the performance of excellence, especially in the rural towns and areas which constitute 70% of the total land of the province. This is mostly within the former Transkei and Ciskei.

There is no constructive engagement with the Department of Education so far, but we are forging ahead with a partnership with arts education and libraries, which is coming forth in a strong manner.

There is a limited cultural affairs budget of R41,4 million, of which 70% goes to personnel and 10% to service delivery. To us it is a challenge. The budget for sports, arts and culture needs to be reviewed. We are hoping that the Minister will assist us with a conditional grant in the near future.

Through prioritisation and a focus on the key strategic areas for the 2004- 05 financial year, we are considering dealing with the following: to actually pass the Bill which emphasises the translation, promotion and development of five provincial languages, namely isiXhosa, Sesotho, Afrikaans, English and isiZulu. Training will be offered to community members in sign language, and we will train 120 community members and 50 officials in one of the languages of disabled people. In terms of the Expanded Public Works Programme, we are focusing on the next 100 days. The Mount Fletcher Library costs R860 000, and the Peddie Arts Centre, which will take off next week Monday, is going to cost us R400 000.

The department will monitor learnership bursaries in relation to arts and academic qualifications. We are contributing R595 000 towards the learnership programme this financial year.

The National Arts Festival, which is a provincial and national flagship project, will promote business to local communities in the township where 800 beds in 120 houses will be available for tourists and guests - and, hon members, you are all invited. The festival is in Grahamstown and starts on 1 July. The department is behind the jobs that will be created, and these will contribute to the economy of Grahamstown an amount of R1 million by the end of the festival.

We are focusing on the provincial Film and Video Foundation, which will receive R750 000. There is promotion of minority cultures by developing the Coega tourism route where Sarah Baartman will be featuring as an icon for women-empowerment programmes. The promotion of the O R Tambo tourist route is intended for the preservation and conservation of communities, people, and the culture and history of those areas. We will be handing over the Port St Johns Museum to the community within the next few months. This will empower the people of Port St Johns to be proud of their artwork which is in that area. The Mbashe and Bedford Amathole Heritage route will be taken on board within this financial year.

An amount of R6,4 million has been budgeted for library material which focuses on promoting indigenous languages in the province. By the way, we have started recording these on video and other material from the people who cannot write or read so that we translate that into print and booklets for our children in order to learn about the history and stories of our ancestors.

The film and video industry, the crafts industry, the music industry and the publishing industry will take off this financial year. There is surely no doubt that the department will ensure that the central cultural industries flourish in the province.

We will ensure that all the provincial development programmes are in line with the plans of the province, and we are going to ensure that the Moral Regeneration Movement is part and parcel of the Arts and Culture department, so as to ensure the resuscitation of the moral fibre of our society.

Moral regeneration will ensure that we promote awareness of the following diseases that are engulfing our society. We are going to ensure that there is no child rape, women abuse, criminal attacks, liqour abuse, substance abuse and that the scourge of HIV/Aids is tackled within this cultural aspect. We take that as a power of moral regeneration.

We believe that we will bring about the systematic eradication of poverty and the development and manufacture of tourism with the infrastructure that has been spelt out above. Our communities will be able to get some jobs and sustain the economy of the province. We will be ensuring that our heritage will be sustainable, that our society will be worth living in and that the province will always be worth visiting. I thank you. [Applause.]

Ms T MADIKANE (Northern Cape): Hon Deputy Chair, hon Ministers, hon Deputy Ministers, hon MECs, hon members and distinguished guests, I am very honoured and humbled today to be speaking in this House. I will chat briefly about what the Northern Cape is doing and intends to implement.

Firstly, in the Northern Cape we have established a conservatoire theatre that will produce six quality dramas this year, using local actors who went through the departmental artistic development programme. From these six productions, the one about the 1952 Mayibuye uprising in Galeshewe has already been performed. There is another production called, ``You strike a woman, you strike a rock’’. That production is in the process of being rehearsed. The symbolic importance of these productions will be to relive our history and past experiences, and also to teach our youth the role that our province has played in the liberation struggle.

Many of our unemployed people are prepared to tackle poverty right on by using their God-given talents. The department will continue this year with the craft development programme, and for this financial year we will construct and complete the Upington Craft Centre. The main partners for this project are the Upington Rotary Club, Xa-Rise municipality and our national Department of Arts and Culture. The centre will specialise in the production of papier-mâché, quilting, sewing and embroidery, mosaic art and wooden products. A comprehensive choral music development programme has been developed to increase the standard of choral music in the province. This programme will include capacity building for conductors and training on the composition of choral pieces. We have established an orchestral development programme with the Kimberley Music Academy.

We are also accelerating the programme to develop and promote all the languages of our country, particularly the previously disadvantaged languages. To this end, the language unit in the department will conduct research into African proverbs, folklore and songs in Setswana, IsiXhosa and Nama, which would lead to a provincial publication. This year we will also see the continuation of a very successful multilingualism campaign. High on our agenda this year is to get the draft language policy through the legislative process in preparation for the promulgation of our own provincial language policy. Through the heritage collection and the African writer’s series, library services have ensured that previously banned materials are now available to the communities throughout the province. This year library services will launch the political history collection which will include books written by prominent and most acclaimed writers and leaders of our continent. Some of the names amongst the collection will include names such as Solomon T Plaatje, Nelson Mandela, Steve Biko, Nadine Gordimer and Bessie Head. In other words, books that were previously banned can now be seen on our library shelves, allowing communities to have access to their heritage, as well as to foster respect and understanding of the political and social history of our continent.

There is also another book that has been published called Enter the light. This book reflects the commitment towards preserving the culture and heritage of the indigenous Khomani San people of the Northern Cape. The publication of this book comes at an opportune time in the history of our country, shortly after the celebration of 10 years of democracy. It is a reflection of how far we have progressed over this period, in broadening our understanding of what we value in terms of human knowledge and culture, knowledge of the culture that now enters the light, in the same way as the Khomani as an identifiable people have once again entered the light in the 10 past years. I just want to mention that this group of people are more or less on the verge of being extinct and we actually have less than 20 of them that are living today. So it is important that we capture this whilst we still have the time. This book is intended to be used in schools and libraries throughout the Northern Cape, but also elsewhere, and it is hoped to be the beginning of a publication of a vast knowledge on the Khomani as gathered by the communities over the past several years.

Over the next five years, library services will tend to take the process of access to information services further by expanding on the Internet services. This has already been implemented in 80 libraries, thus upholding one of the most important principles of democracy, that is, access to information. Through breaking the digital divide that exists in our libraries, the provincial library service will build on the knowledge base that exists in our communities, by bringing information to the fingertips of its users. Improving the capacity of our community, library staff will go hand in hand with the ICT expansion, ensuring the sustainability of the ICT service.

Archival records help us to understand who we are and where we come from. They give us information about the past, our past, and thus help us to grasp our present. This information is as important to a nation as the individual memory is to each and every person. Some of this information may make us proud of our past achievements and some will not, but strengths of our past, great moments, times of conflict, decisions of wisdom and areas of judgment are woven together in a tapestry that is uniquely ours. It is this public record of past events that makes us distinct from all other nations, and something that all South Africans can share. The archives of the Northern Cape similarly distinguish us, the citizens of this province, from people of other provinces, yet at the same time contribute to the tapestry that makes us all part of the great South African nation. Our biggest challenge in this regard is the establishment of a provincial archive repository, which is a Constitutional obligation. This will enable us to claim and bring back what rightfully belongs to the Northern Cape. This is the biggest challenge we have to face at this level now, but then the establishment of the archive repository will become a major tourist attraction for the Northern Cape. Historians and novelists will do research in the repository and market it abroad.

On International Museum Day, 18 May, an exhibition to celebrate the 10 years of democracy was opened. This educational display can still be viewed at the McGregor Museum. It highlights the dramatic process laid by our young democracy. It places the past decade into its historical context and should be viewed as an educational tool by educators and learners. A world- class exhibition of the photographer Alfred Martin Duggan-Cronin will be opened at the Duggan-Cronin Gallery on 15 July 2004. This exhibition will also form part of our 10 years of democracy celebration, and will be on display, first provincially and then nationally. The restoration and digitisation of the Duggan- Cronin photographic collection will commence this year. This conversation project of a million rand, together with the unique storage facility at the McGregor Museum, places our province well ahead of other provinces.

Running concurrently with the Duggan-Cronin exhibition will be the De Beers Consolidate mines photographic exhibition of the work of children born in

1. This year we will also see the commencement of a R1,5 million restoration project of the Duggan-Cronin gallery since it is actually falling apart. The gallery, once restored, will permanently house what is regarded as the world’s top 10 photographic collections. Once finished, this will be world-class gallery that will also be made available to local, national and international photographers to showcase their talent, and also to promote photography as an art form. In this gallery, we have the nucleus
   • actually more than the nucleus - of a national repository of ethnographic photographs. We will be able then to exhibit and store safely our numerous photographic collections.

We will also continue with our research into a tragic and sensitive part of our history and that will focus on the remains that have been excavated. We are also in the process of applying to make sure that some heritage sites are actually declared as such. So, there is quite lot of work that we are busy with. In conjunction with the Freedom Park, and the whole idea of a Freedom Park in the Northern Cape, we intend to have a garden of remembrance, as well as a provincial monument in honour of heroes or heroines who selflessly laid down their lives and contributed to this democracy that we are celebrating today. The unveiling of the monument is earmarked for 16 June 2006. I thank you. [Time expired.] [Applause.]

Ms D ROBINSON: Hon Chair, hon Ministers and hon members, I would like to congratulate the Minister of Arts and Culture on his appointment to office. I sincerely hope that his appointment will mark a turning point in our cultural development, since arts and culture have always tended to be neglected in favour of sport.

Let me assure you that I am by no means hostile to the promotion of sport, and my colleagues in the House will attest to that. I was making a strong case for sport in schools yesterday. It certainly has great value, but the promotion of the arts has been sadly neglected within our society, and I look forward to a renaissance of artistic and cultural endeavours in the next decade.

Properly managed, the Ministry of Arts and Culture can be a powerful instrument in reconciliation and healing - an asset to our national psyche. It is precisely the diversity of cultural backgrounds and the heritage of our many indigenous and immigrant communities that make South Africa one of the most exciting and richest nations on earth.

The specific traditions and customs, literature, art, performance and creative skills of each community are what make us unique and proud to be South Africans. Each of these traditions should be promoted to form one of the rich threads of the great South African tapestry.

We have world-class singers being trained in our Opera School, especially founded by Angelo Gobbato to develop indigenous talent. Attend one of these concerts at the Artscape Theatre, hear their powerful voices and you will know why they are in such demand. I happen to know that the Opera School is largely funded by private patrons who love music and want to see opera, as an art form, growing. The recent performance of Fidelio on Robben Island was an outstanding opportunity for our talent to be showcased, and the spin- offs of that were invitations to tour other parts of the world.

Overseas visitors are impressed by the energy, vitality and strength of our performances, hence the invitations pouring in. Our local talent is becoming an export commodity, creating more opportunities for our artists.

I believe that the time has come for the Finance Ministry to become the catalyst in creating a national culture of giving, of encouraging benefactors by offering even modest tax breaks directly to any citizen who wishes to support a cultural enterprise of his or her choice. Even if an upper limit of R1000 per taxpayer per annum were to be enacted there would be a significant degree of grassroots financial support for arts and culture, at no great loss to the exchequer. This could even be extended by securing donations and sponsorships for other cultural activities and institutions such as museums and art galleries.

I was saddened when I discovered recently that the Koopman De Wet House, Bertram House and Bo-Kaap museums are now all closed, except for Mondays, and then by appointment only. It is unfortunate that Iziko has not made this known to the wider public, simply announcing this in the internal newsletter. These are all treasures of our past. No nation can go forward without acknowledging its past - good and bad. The depth of the roots will determine the vigorous growth into the future. Perhaps sponsorship can be found for them, or perhaps tax relief can be given. Of course, there would be a need for sound financial reporting.

Ek wil graag ‘n paar voorstelle maak. Daar moet beslis daaraan aandag geskenk word om dit vir voornemende kunstenaars die moeite werd te maak om ‘n loopbaan in dié rigting in Suid-Afrika te volg. Ek wil voorstel dat daar vir elke moontlike geleentheid of fees ‘n Suid-Afrikaanse werk - musiek of kuns - geskep word wat deur die Regering geïnisieer word. Daar kan pryse of borgskappe daaraan verbonde wees. Daar móét geleenthede wees vir uitvoerende kunstenaars in Suid-Afrika om dit vir hulle aantreklik te maak om hier te bly.

Daar moet baie meer beurse beskikbaar wees sodat jong Suid-Afrikaners hulself in die kunsterigting in Suid-Afrika kan bekwaam. Vergelyk dit maar met sportbeurse.

Alle instrumente en bladmusiek moet van die buiteland ingevoer word, en is vir ons Suid-Afrikaners baie duur as gevolg van die wisselkoers. Wat is die moontlikheid van belastingverligting op sulke items wat nie in Suid-Afrika vervaardig word nie?

Die finansiering vir ons professionele orkeste is drasties gesny en daardeur is die moontlikheid van loopbane hier ‘n geweldige knou toegedien. Trusts kan geskep word om kultuuraktiwiteite te ondersteun. Sulke skenkings behoort vrygestel te word van belasting. As ons van hierdie voorstelle kan implementeer, sal ons musieksentrums, soos Hugo Lambrechts en Beau Soleil, miskien kan oorleef. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)

[I would like to make a few suggestions. We should definitely pay attention to making it worthwhile for prospective artists to follow a career in this field in South Africa. I want to suggest that for every possible event or festival, a South African work - music or art - be created, initiated by the Government. Prizes or sponsorships can be attached to these. There must be opportunities for performing artists in South Africa to make it attractive to them to stay here.

Many more bursaries should be available so that young South Africans can qualify in the field of art in South Africa. Compare this with sport bursaries.

All instruments and sheet music must be imported from abroad, and they are very expensive for us South Africans as a result of the exchange rate. What is the possibility of tax relief on such items that are not manufactured in South Africa?

The financing for our professional orchestras has been cut drastically and as a result the possibility of careers here has been greatly lessened. Trusts can be created to support cultural activities. Such donations should be exempt from tax. If we can implement some of these suggestions, our music centres such as Hugo Lambrechts and Beau Soleil might be able to survive.]

I’m also thinking of the Tygerberg Children’s Choir which has received accolades and won many prestigious awards overseas. It does not receive any state funding and when one considers how accomplished and professional it is, and what opportunities it offers our young people, one cannot but hope that some form of matching funding will be found to assist it. It is an enormous burden for parents and sponsors to bear alone.

The Joseph Stone Auditorium in Athlone has been monumental in its contribution to culture throughout the dark days and in the present, and we must pay tribute to each of those artists.

A few years ago the tourism industry was a Cinderella industry. It was ignored, patronised, underfunded - every day brought a struggle for recognition for funding, but today tourism is recognised as one of our leading growth industries.

There’s a growing recognition of the importance of arts and culture throughout the halls of government throughout the world. Support for the arts and culture is sound economic policy. Internationally, the cuts in school arts funding have been reversed as it is recognised that through the arts students develop cognitive and physical skills. Arts and cultural activities are also valued as a key element in programmes to revitalise decaying urban areas.

In the nations around the world, the poet Shelley’s suggestion that ``poets are the unacknowledged legislators of the world’’, is finally being taken seriously. The poet Roy Campbell so aptly described the struggle that most artistic souls have within themselves, and in society, in his poem Horses on the Camargue. I quote:

Still out of hardship bred, Spirits of power and beauty and delight Have ever on such frugal pastures fed And loved to course with tempests through the night.

May our contribution be to make the pastures less frugal and to acknowledge and support our artists and musicians. Ndiyabulela. [I thank you.]

Mr F ADAMS: Hon Chairperson, hon Ministers, MECs, special delegates and members of the House, I want to congratulate the Ministers and Deputy Ministers on their appointments. I know that you will, and shall, do well in your portfolios. We in South Africa really ought to be conscious of the moment in history in which we are called upon to do what we are doing.

Suid-Afrika het ‘n hoë ongeletterdheidsyfer en etlike pogings om daarop te verbeter, word reeds aangepak en juis daarom moet daar noue samewerking plaasvind tussen al die betrokke departemente om ons kunstenaars en wetenskaplikes van alle gemeenskappe te stimuleer én te ondersteun, en andersyds, om optimale toegang tot relevante inligting koste-doeltreffend by elke aspirerende kunstenaar en wetenskaplike te kry. Die NNP steun die twee begrotingsposte. Ek dank u. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)

[South Africa has a high illiteracy rate and several attempts to improve this have already been tackled, and for that very reason there should be close co-operation amongst all the relevant departments to stimulate and support our artists and scientists from all our communities and, on the other hand, to grant each aspirant artist and scientist optimal access to relevant information in a cost-effective manner. The NNP supports the two Budget Votes. I thank you.]

Mr T S SETONA: Hon Deputy Chairperson of Committees, hon Ministers, hon Deputy Ministers, hon members, fellow comrades, friends and colleagues, let me rise to join those who spoke before me and congratulate the Ministers and Deputy Ministers on their appointment in these new challenging positions.

This Budget policy debate on Arts and Culture takes place at the most critical time in the history of our country. It is the first debate in the second decade of democracy. It’s taking place during the month of youth, and three days before the 49th anniversary of the adoption of the Freedom Charter - our very blueprint for a new society that we seek to built today.

On the basis of the historic significance of the context within which this Budget policy debate is presented, it should sound warning bells that remind all of us of who we are, where we come from and where we are destined to go as a country and as a nation.

Before the advent of colonialism and the attendant introduction of a capitalist mode of production in South Africa, the African people enjoyed poetry and music; they sculptured pottery and danced freely, all by themselves and for themselves. For them poetry had nothing to do with books, hence, when a young man saw his bull of choice among the herd of cattle he recited poetry, which was an artistic medium of expressing appreciation.

The same applied to music and dance. Although there were professional poets and musicians - that is, those recognised as more talented in the community

• no sharp distinction could be drawn between artists and the rest of the community, because they were agents of social cohesion and the dissemination of moral values from one generation to the other. There was always a participatory relationship between the people and the artists, who also knew that they existed in order to serve the people.

The dawn of colonialism and racial oppression altered the character and purpose of the South African cultural and artistic expression, thus bringing to the fore two cultures in one country. Of course, while we are attempting to build one culture in this divided society, some amongst us continue to speak and preserve the status quo of the dominant culture. The dominant culture of the rich and the subdued culture of the oppressed; these are the two currents of the cultural system that we have in our country today.

The profit motive of capitalist relations of production has become the primary service point of cultural and artistic expression, not the common good of our society. As with other commodities in the capitalist economy, cultural and artistic products also pass through three stages, namely, production, marketing and consumption, thus alienating the downtrodden majority of our people in the cultural and artistic development and life of our society.

Our people never succumbed to this cultural subjugation and domination. The formation of ``Amandla’’, the ANC cultural group, was part of an organised response to this subjugation and domination. There were not many instruments at the time - several pennywhistles, an occasional guitar; mouth organs and a few drums acquired locally were the meagre resources available to our people. However, they improvised with tin cans, bottles filled with water to various levels, and just about anything that they could grab.

Later, new songs of liberation flowed from the camps of liberation movements in exile as more and more young people put their minds together to compose music. Whenever the ANC gathered, which is a tradition even today, liberation songs were sung and cultural groups performed in concert poetry, music and dance.

With our history of deep polarisation, hate and prejudice, arts and culture can play a critical role in the promotion of nation-building, development, peace and a common identity, which is a central and strategic goal that should obsess all South Africans across class, racial and gender bases.

The transformation of our school curriculum, in particular, as it relates to the rewriting of our history, is indispensable in this regard. As we celebrate the decade of our democracy, generations to come must know that in the city of Mangaung-Bloemfontein, more than 90 years ago, two architects of our fledgling democracy were born; the African National Congress and the then National Party.

As we see unity and diversity in action today, finding expression in the co- operation of these two parties to forge ahead with nation-building projects, generations to come must know that their birthplace is in the heartland of our country, in the city of Mangaung. It therefore becomes incumbent upon the Department of Arts and Culture to then preserve and promote these important historical sites, including the house where comrade Nomzamo Winnie Madikizela-Mandela resided during her banishment in the early 1980s.

In support of this Vote, we therefore want to, on behalf of the ANC, say that the beginning was in 1994, and in this current decade of democracy, which is the second decade of democracy, the challenge for all of us is to ensure that the programmes and the activities of the Department of Arts and Culture cut across all other departmental programmes. That is the only way in which we can use this important instrument as an instrument for nation- building, a common identity and for reconciliation. I thank you. The DEPUTY MINISTER OF ARTS AND CULTURE: Thank you, Chairperson. Minister Pallo Jordan, Minister Mosibudi Mangena, Deputy Minister Derek Hanekom and all MECs present here, hon delegates, directors-general and officials of the Department of Arts and Culture, as well as the Department of Science and Technology, in August 2002 the then Department of Arts, Culture, Science and Technology was split into two separate departments. This resulted in the establishment of the Department of Arts and Culture, on the one hand, and the Department of Science and Technology, on the other.

However, these two departments remained for a while - until early this year

• under one Ministry. It was only in the third term of our democratic Government, on 28 April, that our President, beloved Comrade Thabo Mbeki, announced the establishment of a new Ministry of Arts and Culture. As you can guess, we are still in the process of setting up our brand new office.

Be that as it may, with the support of our very able team of officials, under the able leadership of our Director-General of Arts and Culture, Prof Mosala, as well as the support of parliamentary committees, our social partners and stakeholders, we have been able to find our feet. Let me say, here and now, that we will rely heavily on the active support of this Council, as well as the provincial legislatures and local government in executing our mandate.

At the official opening of the first session of our third democratic Parliament, our President, among other commitments, committed his Government to, and I quote:

… move our country forward decisively towards the eradication of poverty and underdevelopment in our country, taking care to enhance the process of social cohesion and also to achieve further and visible advances with regard to the improvement of the quality of life of all our people, affecting many critical areas of social existence, including health, safety and security, moral regeneration, social cohesion, opening the doors of culture and education to all, and sport and recreation.

These are the marching orders and, to achieve this, our Ministry’s and our department’s mission is to realise the full potential of arts and culture in social and economic development, nurture creativity and innovation, and promote the diverse heritage of our nation.

Arts and culture permeate all aspects of society and are an integral part of social and economic life. Arts and culture embrace custom, tradition, belief, religion, language and all other forms of art. It can and must, therefore, play a crucial role in nation-building, reconciliation and the development of a new national identity and ethos which is reflective of our new democracy. It also has great potential to make a significant contribution to poverty alleviation, job creation and economic development in the context of a people’s contract.

Before the advent of democracy in our country, the culture of the majority of our people was neglected, distorted and stifled. Culture was used as a tool of suppression and discrimination. Our people and our communities were denied access to resources and facilities to exercise and develop their creativity in cultural and artistic expression. It is, therefore, imperative for the arts, culture and heritage sector to be subjected to rigorous scrutiny and to be radically transformed.

In 1994, the first democratic Government of National Unity adopted the ANC’s Reconstruction and Development Programme as a policy guideline to effect this transformation. The policy statement, as articulated in the White Paper on Arts, Culture and Heritage is, therefore, based on the following values, and I quote:

Access to, participation in and enjoyment of the arts, cultural expression and the preservation of one’s heritage are basic rights; they are not luxuries, nor are they privileges as we have generally been led to believe.

The Bill of Rights of our Constitution states that everyone has the right to freedom of expression, which includes freedom of artistic creativity; and everyone has the right to use the language and to participate in the cultural life of their choice. It is the role of Government to facilitate the optimum conditions in which these rights may be enjoyed and practised.

A fundamental prerequisite for democracy is the principle of freedom of expression. Rooted in freedom of expression and creative thought, the arts, culture and heritage have a vital role to play in development, nation- building and sustaining our emerging democracy. They must be empowered to do so.

Humans are holistic beings. They not only need improved material conditions in order to have a better quality of life. Individuals have psychological, emotional, spiritual and intellectual expression, all of which require nurture and development for them to realise their full potential, and act as responsible and creative citizens.

Arts and culture play a healing role through promoting reconciliation. Our approach to culture is premised on international standards in which culture is understood as an important component of national life which enhances all of our freedoms. Culture should not be used as a mechanism of exclusion, a barrier between people, nor should cultural practices be reduced to ethnic or religious chauvinism.

South Africa is now once more part of the international family of nations. We not only derive benefits from such acceptance, but also have the responsibility to pursue and implement agreed and accepted norms and standards in various sectors of our society, including arts and culture.

In this respect, our Ministry and department will encourage an active partnership with provincial and local government spheres, as well as the private sector and other social partners, to facilitate the implementation of the programmes which have already been referred to by the Minister of Arts and Culture, Pallo Jordan.

I do not intend to repeat what he has already mentioned, save to say that, in implementing these programmes, we must also ensure that women, youth, people with disabilities and senior citizens are central, without neglecting the issue of the interdependence of women and men, as well as the issue of gender equity.

Another issue of importance is the narrowing of the urban/rural divide. The cities and metros have made tremendous progress in promoting arts, culture and heritage over the past 10 years. Our greatest challenge is in accelerating the implementation of our programmes in the rural areas. We will need to attend to this as a matter of priority.

Lastly, the importance of our participation in the New Partnership for Africa’s Development, Nepad, is absolutely crucial if we want to make the concept of an African renaissance a reality. Our department has developed a position paper on arts, culture and heritage, which will be presented at a collaborative workshop with the Nepad steering committee in September this year.

The Ten-Year Review Report on the implementation of Government programmes noted that there has been an appreciable resurgence of local self-assertion in the areas of music, the arts, literature, dress and - to a limited extent - film and video. However, despite the progress made, there remains a counter-tendency of creating poor imitations of more generic international styles and expressions.

This budget, although it might be inadequate, gives us enough scope to begin to implement the programmes already outlined by Minister Jordan. However, it will require us to manage the available funds in a more prudent and efficient manner. At the same time, we will have to try to strike a balance between efficiency and equity.

We would like to pay tribute to our predecessors in the Ministry of Arts, Culture, Science and Technology: former Minister Ben Ngubane, Ministers Brigitte Mabandla and Buyelwa Sonjica - the latter two were both previously Deputy Ministers of Arts, Culture, Science and Technology; as well as the Minister of Minerals and Energy who was acting Minister of Arts, Culture, Science and Technology for a while after Minister Ngubane had left earlier this year.

We acknowledge and appreciate the sterling work done by the former hon Ministers, former hon Deputy Ministers and the former Department of Arts, Culture, Science and Technology. They have laid a solid foundation for the programmes of our department which have enabled our smooth take-off. We also thank them for their continued support.

Thank you also, Minister Jordan, for your guidance and support. However, I would like to make a slight correction to what you said earlier. Since 1994, we have only had two Deputy Ministers of Arts, Culture, Science and Technology. They are now Ministers Mabandla and Sonjica. Minister Jordan and Deputy Minister Botha are the first in the brand-new Ministry of Arts and Culture. So we have made history. May we also take this opportunity to congratulate the new Chairperson and Deputy Chairperson, the presiding officers of this NCOP and new delegates and members, as well as MECs responsible for arts and culture - and whatever else they are responsible for - on their election and/or appointment.

Unfortunately, the Minister and I have not yet had an opportunity to meet formally with the MECs, but we look forward to working together and must urge that we sustain the work already begun and ensure that we accelerate implementation of the programmes. By so doing we would be assuring our people that we are truly committed to a people-centred and a people-driven process of social transformation.

So, as commanded by our beloved President, Comrade Thabo Mbeki: ``Let us get down to work in a people’s contract to build a better South Africa and a better world’’. I thank you. [Applause.] Mr M J MAFEREKA: Chairperson, hon Ministers, Deputy Ministers, MECs present here today, hon members of the NCOP - permanent and special delegates - ladies and gentlemen, in the face of the so-called globalisation, those of us who are in the Third World are challenged to rise and jealously guard against the death of our cultural heritage and artistic creativities. Surely, the global village does not imply the supremacy of other cultures which have somehow gained global hegemony over others. It is for this reason that I stand up today in this hallowed House to give wholehearted support to the hon Minister’s Budget Vote, which serves to further advance our cultural heritage which is undoubtedly under siege as a consequence of globalisation.

As a province, we are also firmly rooted in this principle of developing our arts and culture, as espoused by the Minister in his Budget Vote. A total amount of R35,036 million has been made available for cultural affairs in the Free State, which covers arts and culture, museum and heritage services and language and translation services. I take this opportunity to outline to this House our programmatic interventions in advancing this principle.

The programme on arts and culture in the Free State has been allocated an amount of R19,689 million, and covers visual and performing arts, as well as a music academy and three community art centres. The Free State departments of sport, arts, culture, science and technology and social development formed a partnership to establish a grass-weaving factory in Phuthaditjhaba in Qwaqwa. This has been a very successful project, creating many jobs and securing a regular income for numerous people in the Qwaqwa area.

The Craft Development Programme, which is running over a three-year period, is mainly funded by the national Department of Arts and Culture. The purpose of this project is to develop the variety and quality of crafts in the Free State, to train crafters to reach their full potential and to find market outlets for their products. At present, a total of 12 poverty alleviation projects in the province are funded by the national Department of Arts and Culture. A total number of 437 people, mainly women and 20 disabled people, are benefiting from these projects directly.

Moreover, the Performing Arts Division provided an amount of R1 million in funding in order to stage the Mangaung African Cultural Festival, Macufe, which focuses on visual and performing arts from the African continent. Macufe plays an important role in the marketing our province through cultural tourism, while focusing on the celebration of the African culture in the true spirit of the African Renaissance.

On the music front, the Free State Musicon is a music academy providing certified music tuition in all instruments of the standard symphony orchestra and symphonic wind bands, as well as the piano, keyboard, classical guitar and traditional percussion instruments. In 2003, a partnership between the Musicon, Pacofs, the International Performing Arts Trust and the University of the Free State was established to ensure the continued existence of the Free State Symphony Orchestra. I notice that in the Department of Arts and Culture’s budget, no allocation has been made to the Free State Symphony Orchestra. This is a challenge that we will need to address, since this orchestra is a training and development orchestra for musicians in the province.

To further advance the performance arts in the province, the Mangaung String Programme was established in 1997 with 18 students. At the moment, 152 children are involved in the programme that has three orchestras - junior, intermediate and senior. This programme is targeted at disadvantaged children who are either taught at their schools in the township, or are collected at their schools and transported to the University of the Free State where they receive music and music theory tuition. This is another side of the partnership between the Musicon and the university to advance the arts in our province.

I want to stress that arts in the Free State continue to gain momentum everyday thanks to the existence of three community arts centres in the province, based in the Lejweleputswa - Thabong, Northern Free State - Zamdela and Motheo - Thaba Nchu - districts. The functions of these centres include teaching, development, heritage preservation and service delivery in respect of drama, dance, music, art, sewing and quilting. Plans for this year include securing partnerships with the local municipalities where these centres are situated, which will lead to better service delivery to the communities involved.

I have already noted that the need to preserve and advance our cultural heritage, in the face of the threats posed by globalisation on the cultural front, is essential. We can show our seriousness in defending what is historically ours through specific programmes that are funded. Under the auspices of Heritage Promotion, the Museum and Heritage Services in the Free State have been allocated an amount of R14 273 million for the current financial year.

The National Museum Division consists of the National Afrikaans Literary Museum, the National Sesotho Literary Museum and the National Theatre and Music Museum. These museums, given their respective levels of operational development, infrastructure and resources, render services of a national scope and importance, promoting heritage awareness and a fostering of our collective literary, creative and artistic heritage.

Amongst other agencies for heritage promotion, I want to mention the following in brief: The Basotho Cultural Village is a living museum, aimed at promoting and preserving the cultural heritage of the Basotho people through exhibiting their art, architecture, traditions, crafts, indigenous games and performing arts.

In terms of the SA Geographical Names Council Act No 118 of 1998, a Free State Provincial Geographical Names Committee was established towards the end of last year. Its aim is to change about 5 000 offensive names in the Free State.

Language and translation services in the Free State have been allocated an amount of R1,074 million - far too little for the scope of work and the importance of this service which is a direct effort in nation-building and a way to work towards a people’s contract to build a better life, a better South Africa and a better world. The language unit has been instrumental in developing a draft language policy in collaboration with various stakeholders. This draft policy, together with the SA Languages Bill, was used to produce the Free State Languages Bill, which will be tabled in the Free State Legislature this year. Since Sesotho is the language spoken by the majority in the Free State, this province is at the core of the development of this language. The creation of a trilingual terminology database - English, Sesotho and Afrikaans - is at this stage only an idea, but with the right financial backing it will soon become a reality.

In conclusion, despite these advances, a number of challenges still lie ahead of us. Due to time constraints I will just summarise a few. Firstly, there is a need to investigate the possibility that the function of the National Afrikaans Literary Museum be transferred from us to the national Department of Arts and Culture. We are going to need about R8 million and we have no funds. Secondly, the need to transform displays in museums to become more representative of all communities is very urgent. Thirdly, outreach programmes and heritage awareness, as well as the provisioning of information and the marketing of museums, are vital.

I have already mooted the idea of the establishment of a communication and marketing directorate in the department to address this and other communication and marketing gaps. Lastly, funding to implement section 23 of the National Heritage Resources Act remains a challenge to us.

I want to take this opportunity to further express my support for the Minister’s Budget Vote. It takes us in the right direction in these challenging times. I still have to meet with the Minister, so that when we come here, there would be a bond between the Free State and the national department. I thank you. [Applause.]

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY: Chairperson, hon Ministers, Deputy Ministers, MECs, hon members, let me just start off by congratulating members, many of whom have come back to this House, on their election to this House. To the many new members who are sitting in this House today: Congratulations on being here. We look forward to working with you.

Minister, you might be relieved that I am not going to contest the numbers of Ministers or Deputy Ministers that preceded you, because you are the first Minister of Science and Technology and I am the very first Deputy Minister of Science and Technology. [Laughter.] So there is no dispute about that.

In his state of the nation address, the President highlighted and stressed the importance of science and technology. If we are going to achieve the objectives that we have set ourselves of economic growth, of improving the living conditions of all our people, the role of science and technology is absolutely imperative; it’s vital. We will not achieve our economic growth objectives, for example, if we don’t have substantially increased investment in research and development and if we don’t have science and technology to back up our endeavours in the various sectors of our economy. For example, technologies in the manufacturing sector, improved mining techniques and investment in improved communications infrastructure, etc, are all vital to ensuring that we have sustained economic growth.

However, it is not only about that; it’s also about the second economy, about the quality of lives of our people and, there again, the work that has been done and funded by Science and Technology, for example in medical research, is quite critical to the improvement of the quality of lives of our people. For example, as we speak there is a lot of work going into the development of an Aids vaccine and into many other areas of medical research which will ensure the improved health of our people.

We also have technologies to reduce pollution. Now, we might see these things as unimportant, but actually they are linked to each other. The health of our people is fundamentally affected by the water that they drink; the air that they breathe. And the technologies designed to reduce emissions from vehicles for example, to have improved waste management, ensure that we live in a healthier environment with less pollution and therefore we are less prone to disease, for example. Science and Technology therefore cuts across many sectors and affects our lives quite fundamentally.

The Minister said that I would expand on the work of the department and on some of the many things that he has said. I will try to do so. I have to say to you, Chairperson, that what I am presenting to you today is a slightly cut and paste job, because much of what I was going to say has already been said and I don’t want to burden this House with repetition. So, don’t get the people from Hansard to ask me for a copy of my speech at the end of this. It will be confusing.

I should just say something about the Minister which might interest the House. Some years ago he spent some time in jail. Not long after he was released, I spent some time in jail. When I was in jail, I came across a person by the name of Rob Adam who is now the Director-General of the Department of Science and Technology. So, be warned, this is not an academic department; it’s headed by three former jailbirds. [Laughter.]

In elaborating on some of the points made by the Minister, I’m going to start off with an area which he hasn’t really covered, and that is the area of astronomy. Astronomy is about the planets, the stars and the moons in our skies. The President mentioned in his state of the nation address that we are developing Southern Africa as a global hub for astronomy. This is part of a broader strategy to develop critical areas in which South Africa has a global niche advantage and can provide a service in research and development at a more competitive rate than is available elsewhere. Astronomy is one of the obvious examples here, with a huge effort currently underway to position the subcontinent in all the relevant areas of astronomy - what they call the electromagnetic spectrum, from radio to optical to gamma rays. Now, probably none of us really understand what these things are. Don’t worry; they are about studying the stars and the planets more effectively.

The best optical and gamma-ray observatories of their kind have been built in Sutherland in the Northern Cape and in the Gamsberg, in Namibia, respectively, largely with international funds, but with very favourable terms for South Africa or to African astronomers. We have now put in a bid to build a telescope, and I must say that once again this involves the Northern Cape. Let me not be accused of favouritism simply because it is my constituency province. These things happened before I was given this responsibility, so I take no credit or blame.

What we call “the mother of all telescopes” is to be built in the Northern Cape. It is called the Square Kilometre Array. This will be the biggest telescope of its kind in the world and possibly the most ambitious scientific instrument ever built. This involves approximately US$1 billion in investment, so it has huge significance for our country. I would say, for fear of treading on the toes of those who are promoting the sports sector, that this bid is as important, if not more so, than the soccer bid that we recently won.

The question is often asked why the international scientific community is prepared to spend so much on these instruments, these telescopes. Well, the simple answer is that human progress has always been driven by our desire to know more - from the earliest days of our ancestors seeking explanations to the wonders that surrounded them. The signals picked up by these instruments can be described as faint whispers from the early years of the universe, billions of years ago. When we pick up these signals, it is almost like a trip backwards in time. We’re picking up signals that came billions of years ago, and this gives us some answers to the origins of our universe. In fact, even more tantalisingly, this starts giving us answers to the destiny of our universe.

In one of our more applied areas, the Medical Research Council has just won a bid to host the European and Developing Countries Clinical Trials Partnership Programme. This is a 700-million Euro programme, and a significant proportion of these funds is now likely to flow into our medical research programmes. This will give a huge boost to our medical research capacity and will assist in the development of treatments for a range of infectious diseases, like tuberculosis, malaria and HIV/Aids. There will be positive spin-offs for our research institutions in that the R&D associated with the programme will be carried out by them.

The key in these very large global ventures is to know your own strengths and how to match them with the world’s needs. These needs and the associated opportunities clearly extend right across the research spectrum

• from pure basic research in astronomy to experimental development in the health programme.

Minister Mangena spoke about the DST poverty alleviation programmes, so I’m not going to repeat what he said, except perhaps to also emphasise that the key role that the Department of Science and Technology will be expected to play, and where there will be a shift in future, will be to add value to the work of other departments essentially, and other projects. This is so that the projects run by various departments achieve better results through the application of the best of technology and innovation. So, while we are running and funding very important programmes or projects at the moment, these will continue, but there might be a shift in emphasis towards supporting projects that are initiated and run by other departments.

A great deal of the work done by researchers and scientists is in laboratories and out of the public eye. It is often painstakingly slow and the benefits to society are not always that immediately apparent, but hon members should be assured that the science councils that are funded through the budget of the DST are driven by the same agenda that drives us as members of Parliament, and that is to ensure a real improvement in the quality of the lives of our people in a sustainable way.

One of the challenges already mentioned by the Minister facing our national system is the attraction of young researchers, particularly young black people, to sustainable careers in science, engineering and technology. Amongst the set of interventions that the department has embarked upon to address this issue is the launch of the Centres of Excellence Programme in partnership with the National Research Foundation later this month. The Centres of Excellence that will be funded in this first round are aimed at focusing strongly on excellence in human resource development at the cutting edge of global science.

These centres will also play a role in popularising science in South Africa and across the African continent. Our focus on human resource development is rooted in the dual need to radically increase the number of women and young black people entering and remaining in the sciences and, at the same time, to maximise the achievement of excellence. It is no accident that the R446 million that is transferred to the National Research Foundation, South Africa’s premier agency for human resource development in science, engineering and technology, now constitutes the single largest item on our budget.

The Minister has spoken about technology transfer. I suppose we should just highlight the fact that even with the best technology in the world, unless it is effectively made available to the users of such technologies, to the many people engaged in our economy, and unless such technology is effectively transferred, it won’t really have the benefits that are intended.

Finally, let me speak a little bit about the department’s organisational structures and the budget. We put an effective department in place. In the past financial year, 2003-04, the department spent over 99,8% of its budget. So, it is quite clear that the department does have the capacity to absorb new resources and to direct them towards our goals, and that the DST has competent financial management.

Essentially, the department has agreements with many other departments. It has seen the CSIR, for example, being transferred from the DTI to the DST. More recently, there has also been the transfer of the science portion of the SA National Antarctic Programme from the Department of Environmental Affairs and Tourism to the Department of Science of Technology. This programme helps us in monitoring climate change in South Africa and the world with appropriate early-warning systems. This is particularly relevant, given our experience of periodic floods and droughts, and the devastating social and economic impact of these events. This makes our membership of the Group on Earth Observations more relevant and beneficial to our country, our region, our continent and the entire world.

The Minister also mentioned something concerning indigenous knowledge systems. Once more, something that the Northern Cape can take note of is the hoodia plant, also in the Kalahari, which has long been used by the same Khomani San communities referred to by the MEC. Their traditional way of life included days of not necessarily having access to food, hunting and gathering, and this particular plant acted as an appetite suppressant and enabled them to spend those days on their own economic activities. Many of us in this room today are quite keen on reducing a bit of our weight, and this knowledge that was held by the Khomani San is going to be of great value to some members of this House, but I don’t want to mention names. [Laughter.]

The point is that so much knowledge is held by the indigenous people of our country, knowledge that is not valued, knowledge about which not much is known. This endeavour in promoting indigenous knowledge is therefore a very important aspect of the work of the Department of Science and Technology, again in collaboration with other departments. I think I have said enough. Thank you very much. [Applause.]

Mr F VAN HEERDEN: Thank you, Madam Chairperson. It is for me a particular privilege to congratulate the Minister of Arts and Culture, Dr Jordan, on his appointment. I remember many years ago, Madam Chair, that is prior to 1994, that we were engaged in a television debate.

Ons is baie bly dat die agb Minister hierdie portefeulje behartig. As historikus glo ons hy is die regte persoon om hierdie spesifieke portefeulje met sukses te behartig.

Agb Voorsitter, die Vryheidsfront Plus het met tevredenheid kennis geneem van die debat van die agb Minister en steun die aspekte wat hy geopper het. Ons as Vryheidsfront Plus is natuurlik hoofsaaklik Afrikaanstalig- georiënteerd en daaroor sal ek ook die res van my kort bydrae in Afrikaans lewer. Ons neem ook positief kennis daarvan dat ook die ander tale mettertyd en geleidelik, nie alleen in die Parlement nie, maar ook in die land gelyk beregtig sal word.

Ons handhaaf die veeltaligheid van hierdie land en is dankbaar vir die duidelike suggesties van die kant van die Ministerie met betrekking tot ook die ander tale, benewens Engels en Afrikaans.

En as ek net kan verwys na die Vrystaat waar ek vandaan kom, waar die drie hooftale Afrikaans, Sotho en Engels is. Baie Engels word gepraat terwyl Engels een van die minder gebesigde tale in die Vrystaatse provinsie is. Afrikaans en Sotho en Xhosa is die tale wat meer gebesig word. Wat die Vrystaat betref, kan ek getuig dat die Vrystaat inderdaad veeltaligheid handhaaf. Ons steun die debat. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)

[We are very glad that the hon Minister is handling this portfolio. As he is a historian, we are convinced that he is the right person to manage this specific portfolio successfully.

Hon Chairperson, the Freedom Front Plus took note with satisfaction of the debate of the hon Minister and supports the aspects which he raised. We as the Freedom Front Plus is of course mainly Afrikaans-oriented and therefore I will be delivering the rest of my short contribution in Afrikaans. We also take positive note of the fact that the other languages will also in time and gradually, be treated equally, not only in Parliament, but also in the rest of the country, as well.

We uphold the multilingualism of this country and are grateful for the clear suggestions from the Ministry’s side with regard to other languages also, in addition to English and Afrikaans.

And if I may just refer to the Free State, where I come from, where the three main languages are Afrikaans, Sotho and English. A lot of English is spoken while English is one of the less used languages in the Free State province. Afrikaans and Sotho and Xhosa are the languages used more frequently. As far as the Free State is concerned, I can attest that the Free State upholds multilingualism indeed. We support the debate.] Mr N SINGH (KwaZulu-Natal): Ngiyabonga kakhulu Mphathisihlalo. [Thank you very much, Chairperson.]

I see you’ve given me an additional first name. My initial is N Singh, but my wife is M. I think she has some influence here in this House. I noticed the other day when I spoke in the Tourism debate as well, that my name was indicated as M N Singh, but I thought it was an error. I think she’s made a few telephone calls here.

Let me start off by congratulating the hon Minister, Minister Jordan, on his appointment, and also the hon Deputy Minister Botha. I’ve had the pleasure of working with Minister Jordan in the past when he was Minister for Environmental Affairs and Tourism. At this initial stage, I want to thank him most heartily for visiting KwaZulu-Natal on Friday last week to assess the progress of a legacy project which will ensure that the Chief Albert Luthuli Museum, the church, and all allied facilities and infrastructure in his house are officially opened in a few weeks’ time.

I also wish to take this opportunity to congratulate Minister Mangena on his appointment - I also worked with him when he was Deputy Minister of Education - as well as my colleague, Derek Hanekom. We worked together in agriculture when he was Minister for Agriculture.

Chairperson, in the eight minutes allocated to me, I’m sure I’m not going to have enough time to go into detail on some of the issues that the hon Minister dealt with, but I think I will flag some of them for further debate and discussion by this House.

I want to agree with my colleague Jajula from the Eastern Cape who spoke about moral regeneration. I think, Chairperson and hon Minister, it’s extremely important that we moot a moral, spiritual and cultural revolution in our country, and we can do this through arts, both performing and visual arts. We can do this by promoting and supporting cultural diversity in our province and our country, and we can also provide support to spiritual organisations, because through them and through other partners, we can ensure that our youth learn about alcohol and substance abuse, learn about what HIV and Aids is all about, and I think through arts and culture we have this opportunity.

Chairperson, today’s debate is a Budget Vote debate and, therefore, before you count me out for time, I think let me speak about the budget and the amounts that are allocated to Department of Arts and Culture. Let me also add that I’m heading a new department in KwaZulu-Natal, which is arts, culture and tourism, unlike the other departments, which are generally arts, culture, science and technology, and sports and recreation. In the past five or six weeks since my appointment, I found that there is quite a nexus between arts, culture and tourism. When we promote people and develop them, we ensure that we have different kinds of art forms in our province and our country. When we discover heritage sites we go back in history, like we did on Sunday past, when the hon Deputy President, His Majesty the King, the Chairman of the House of Traditional Leaders and our hon Premier met at Kwaceza where on this day, that is 22 June 1888, Prince Dinizulu prayed for God’s wisdom to end civil wars among the Zulus. It was a very interesting day that we had, and we have decided as a province, through the injunction of our Premier, to build a museum on that site and to ensure that the roads are improved. We can also turn this heritage site into a tourist destination, so I’m very pleased about the nexus.

Having said that, Chairperson, I wholeheartedly support the hon Minister in his quest to persuade Cabinet and Treasury to provide more funds to his department, and I think this House also needs to support him. I do know that in provinces, generally, there is a focus on the social sector, that is education, health and welfare, and while arts and culture, science and technology, you know, are the Cinderellas. However, I think we need to support the hon Minister, so that there can be reciprocal support for us in our provinces to persuade our own treasuries and our Premiers to put more money towards arts and culture.

At this stage, Mr Minister, I would also like to thank the department for the kind of funding that they are able to source from international partners. Last week I saw that there was some fund from Sweden. There’s also a partnership with the Flemish government. We in KwaZulu-Natal have MOUs with the Flemish Government, with Baden Guttenberg in Germany, with Reunion Islands and with the region of Walonia in Belgium, and I’m sure with the help of your department, we in KwaZulu-Natal could exploit opportunities and make sure that these MOUs are not just fancy words written on paper, but something tangible that we can see and witness.

Chair, I would also like to talk about the National Arts Council, because I do know that a number of people involved in the arts sector do complain about the kind of funding that we provide to them. Whilst they have to realise that the funding we provide is within the financial constraints that we are all exposed to, I think we’ve got to ensure that for every Rand, we get R2 worth. I would like the hon Minister and the department to ensure that the funding to the National Arts Council is done in such a way that we as a Council here can be proud of the fact that we have a National Arts Council that’s running its affairs in a very effective manner.

Having said that, Chairperson and hon Minister, we do know that with one of our organisations in KwaZulu-Natal, called the Playhouse Group, we are having some problems. There is evidence of alleged maladministration and we hope that between your department and our department, which also funds the Playhouse to the tune of R5 million per annum, we could get to the bottom of this and ensure that there are better control mechanisms.

I’m not as yet responsible for libraries, archives and museums, but that’s a domestic matter and I’m sure that our Premier will sort that out in due course.

However, another issue that I think we need to tackle, hon Minister, is the question of the constitutional impasse when it comes to the function of libraries. At the moment there is a grey area. It is not a function of local authorities; it’s our function, but we don’t have the kind of funding to be able to sustain all these libraries, so I think that is something that we need to look at.

On the question of languages, hon Minister, we always talk about promoting indigenous languages, which is something that we wholeheartedly support. I think KwaZulu supports it and everybody else supports it. However, a few months ago a startling reality came to my attention when I visited an area called Greytown, where three children were killed when they were travelling in a bakkie. Nineteen of them were in a bakkie and they were travelling from the school back to their homes. I met the parents of these children and I discovered that there were at least four or five schools in between the 50 kilometre single journey that these children take every day. I then asked: Why do you send your children at great risk, financial risk as well, to a school in Greytown? They said: ``Well, we want to send our children to an English-medium school, otherwise when it comes to getting jobs, they cannot get jobs.’’ So, hon Minister, while we look at the promotion of indigenous languages, we’ve got to also devise mechanisms of ensuring that in our schools where Zulu is the first language, we have teachers in place who can teach our children English, because it is an accepted fact that English is the commercial language of the world, and I think we’ve got to look at it that way, as well. Thank you very much, hon Minister. [Applause.]

Mr M MASUKU (Mpumalanga): Chairperson, thank you for the time that has been given to me. Hon Minister and the members of this House, I want to express my thanks for the opportunity to deliver my maiden speech in the NCOP. We in Mpumalanga take the issue of arts and culture very serious, because we believe that South Africa has come from a gloomy past, as Deputy Minister Botha has mentioned. We have come from a racially fragmented past, a past where the culture of the majority were suppressed; an apartheid past where the moral fabric of the society was seriously ravaged, just as many souls from those who were aspiring for a South Africa, such as the one we are living in today, have been forced to depart unduly; a past that limited South Africa from fully displaying its rich heritage and talent and exploiting it for its economic benefit. What we are saying is being said within that context. So, whatever arts and cultural programme we have, we should take it into account. Unfortunately, while I was looking at the definition of what culture is, I came across a definition that said: ``Culture can be simply defined in terms of our way of life.’’ However, our way of life, at the same time, needs to be derived from our historical past and our cultural heritage.

The question that comes to mind is: What sort of historical heritage can you derive from an apartheid past, its division, its hatred and so on and, therefore, if you have to derive it from that particular past, it means that there would have to be a lot of engineering. That is why sometimes when we practise our art, which is a creative display of what this way of life is supposed to be like, you find in most cases in my province there is a great difficulty to bring together people from different and diverse backgrounds. That is why culture has been downplayed as just the mere art of entertainment. It has actually been relegated to the background and taken for granted and kept right on the periphery.

It is my fervent belief that arts and culture do not belong on the periphery of social development, but are integrated parts thereof. They contribute immensely to socioeconomic and political transformation. The role arts and culture play in instilling a sense of common identity, belonging and patriotism cannot be overemphasised, as has been mentioned in this House. This House has gone a long way in building bridges across the boundaries of race, language, religion, culture and creed.

The physical renewal of our country, while important and essential, is not the only influential prerequisite for sustaining the social transformation process. What is equally important, as members have mentioned, is a spiritually and morally healthy social being who embraces attitudes to uphold human dignity and respect and tolerance towards others, a spirit that is at peace with the unfolding process of social progress and justice. It is in this spirit that we welcome the arts and culture programme, with specific focus on the previously disadvantaged and youth, which the national department has already started. For our part, we have also initiated programmes that are going to address this, and that’s something we are going to discuss when we have an opportunity to meet the Minister.

Sir Seretse Khama once mentioned that a nation without a past is a lost nation, and a people without a past is a people without a soul. We believe that the Department of Arts and Culture is mandated by the Constitution to promote a consciousness that celebrates this diversity of culture, and that will shape our common future where democracy is enhanced by vibrant artistic practices and culture of life. I am saying that it is within this spirit that we welcome the work in progress that the national department is engaged in, namely the establishment of new heritage sites. In Mpumalanga we are going to ensure the resource agency is going to be made functional, and we will add more numbers to those new heritage sites that the national department has identified.

In 2005 we are going to host an International Gold Panning Competition in Mpumalanga. This International Gold Panning Competition is going to be held at the historical gold town, Pilgrim’s Rest. We feel historical gold mining will very soon be promoted as a national heritage. We are planning to use this gold panning as a way of displaying the heritage of South Africa, and all our programmes that we are going to focus on this year is to build up towards that.

Our next target will be 2010, because we are saying that gold panning should be a springboard which can help us display our cultural heritage, our art, craft and music to the whole world, and we will be looking at improvements on these. Come 2010, because Mpumalanga is part of those who want to host it, we want to finish up by showcasing this particular activity. We therefore welcome the initiative that the department has already taken in the craft industries, and which has resulted in the creation of jobs and the training of people. We are going to piggyback on these trained people in order to build a future.

Last weekend I went to Mozambique, but before I went there the Premier had just addressed the legislature and said that our province was littered with a lot of mampara names. This did not ring a bell on what is it that you can call a mampara name, but when I drove out of town there were names all the way to Mozambique that, when I looked at them, made me think of the past - the past divisions and so on. When I went into Mozambique, I drove through a street called 23 July, and then I drove in roads with street names like Julius Nyerere, Kwame Nkruma and Albert Luthuli. Whilst I was looking at these names, my mind became a giant telescope, and I began to pick up signs, and within myself my soft voice was beginning to sing, all these ….

``bonke laba abakhululi bethu.’’ [All these are our liberators.]

All these people had been our leaders, and I had a feeling of being an African. We are also committed that when you talk about this moral regeneration and the African renaissance, we are going to make sure that … [Time expired.] [Applause.]

Rev E ADOLPH: Thank you, hon Chairperson. I want to congratulate the newly appointed Ministers of Science and Technology and of Arts and Culture. Owing to time constraints, I’ll be very brief and focus on Science and Technology only.

We would all agree that the Department of Science and Technology, as a newly established department, is underfunded. This is not acceptable because we have to compete on a global scale with people who have First World budgets and economies.

I am concerned that more than 90% of the budget is being spent externally from this department, and the ID are very mindful of the problems and challenges facing this department. Coupled with this, we have the problem of national and international investment trends. It is quite evident that the GDP is not growing, therefore there is no effective movement in Science and Technology because the two are closely interlinked.

We want to commend and re-emphasise the President’s announcement that he will increase resources for human resource development and research programmes. We, as ID, appreciate the newly launched centres of excellence which were established to popularise science and technology, especially among black and women scientists. There is a shortage of, and a major problem with skilful black and women scientists, and we are grateful that these institutions of excellence tackle the problem of the lack of people with substance who can compete on a global scale in terms of the ever- changing new developments in science and technology.

We also want to congratulate the department for community intervention, projects such as Godisa, as well as Tirisano. We would challenge them to cascade them down to the three spheres of government, particularly the local level, and want to encourage them to do the same with the poverty reduction programmes. I thank you, Chairperson, sir.

Mr B BOSHIELO (Limpopo): Chairperson, after a thorough consultative process which ended in 1994, the people of our country produced a document which was titled the Reconstruction and Development Programme (RDP). In defining the problem statement within the area of Arts and Culture, the RDP had this to say:

… that under colonialism and apartheid, the culture of the majority of South Africans was neglected, distorted and suppressed. Freedom of expression and creativity was stifled. People and communities were denied access to resources and facilities to exercise and develop their need for cultural and artistic expression. Illiteracy, lack of effective education system and extreme poverty compounded this cultural deprivation …

In search of solutions, and as a way of setting the way for the incoming Government, the document went further to say this about the RDP of arts and culture: ``… that the new Government should strive to promote the development of a unifying national culture representing the aspirations of all South Africa’s people.’’ This, they said, cannot be imposed, but requires educating people in principles of non-racialism, non-sexism, human rights and democracy. They went further to commit us to “conserve, promote and revitalise our national cultural heritage so it is accessible to all communities …”

It is these challenges, as outlined above, which influence our thinking around the reinvention and development of our arts and cultural heritage and nation-building exercise. For us, therefore, a fundamental prerequisite for a democracy is the principle of freedom of expression and creative thinking. Arts and culture and heritage play a pivotal role in development, in nation-building and in sustaining our democracy. Over and above that, arts and culture industries offer potential employment and wealth-creation opportunities.

It therefore holds, Chairperson, that a deliverable programme of investment in arts and culture is a direct response to the challenges that the Government has committed itself to dealing with in our second decade of democracy, which is the eradication of poverty and creation of employment. To this end, the province is forging ahead in exploring arts and culture areas which were formerly beyond the reach of black people, especially Africans. In this regard, our province will put more emphasis on the area of film, video and theatre industry. A film and video kgoro [meeting] is being organised for later this year to pursue this objective. We remain convinced that with the involvement of our stakeholders and our own determination, we will change the face of this industry.

In this regard, we are inspired by one of the youngest leaders this continent has ever produced, the late Comrade President Thomas Sankara of Burkino Faso who, despite the fact that he led one of the poorest nations in the world, developed it into one of the biggest film producing nations which ultimately kick-started economic development as a result of economic growth.

We acknowledge the fact that libraries constitute an integral part of our nation. However, we are keenly aware that the erection and stocking of our libraries will not necessarily meet our objective of establishing a reading nation and knowledgeable society. In this regard, we require a concerted effort which will take our people out of clubs and pubs and into libraries to read.

We conclude by urging that we should, in our lifetime, acknowledge those who stood firm during the dark days to preserve our cultural heritage through pen and paper and other means. These include the likes of Prof Ndebele, O K Matsepe, Wally Serote, Fatima Meer, Philip Tabane, Gomolemo Mokae and many, many others. These children of the soil should be recognised while they are still alive.

We support this budget and wish you success with its implementation.

Mr M SULLIMAN: Thank you, Chairperson. Hon Ministers, Deputy Ministers, allow me to follow in the footsteps of my colleagues to congratulate our Ministers and Deputy Ministers on their respective appointments, and we would like to assure them of our commitment and our support throughout their term of office.

As the ANC we are indeed pleased to have this important Budget Vote before this House today. Because it seeks to demonstrate the extent to which Government and the department have moved towards ensuring our technological progress and innovation in the science field, it has become a major source in improving the quality of life of our people.

As is the case with all our programmes and policies, it is perhaps appropriate that we have a review of our achievements over the past ten years. Chairperson, as we all should know, the Department of Arts and Culture launched its flagship project, the National Research and Development Strategy in 2002. Its core objective is to identify the need to pay greater attention to human resource development as a wealth and employment creator, and to bring innovation to the fore in all the department’s activities and to facilitate performance across Government.

Moreover, it has established the reference group of women in science and technology, aimed at creating an environment in which women contribute, participate and share benefits equally with their male counterparts in the science, engineering and technology fields.

In 1996 it launched the Science and Technology Agreements Committee through the offices of the National Research Foundation to effectively service intergovernmental science and technology agreements and multilateral activities.

To us in the ANC, this budget is clearly geared towards the high-tech demands of the 21st century, however, with an emphasis on African development. To achieve this goal, this budget has clearly stipulated and measurable objectives. Accordingly, it is underpinned by the following programmes: administration technology for development, international corporation and resources, the Government science and technology system and science and technology for competitiveness.

As we are celebrating 10 years of democracy, this Budget Vote is indeed people-centred and is in line with our people’s contract to create work and fight poverty. For this reason, the department has established the poverty reduction programme, focusing on the agro-processing area, with big potential for achieving sustainable reduction in poverty levels, especially in the rural area and peri-urban areas. Its mechanism is the establishment of small and micro ventures within targeted communities once skills transfers has taken place.

The programme emphasises the transfer of skills, the utilisation of low- cost labour-intensive technologies, stimulating demand, securing orders within the South African domestic market and establishing and maintaining product quality standards and the practice of general good business management.

This programme has established a variety of projects. For example, the department has funded the cost of training communities across the country to keep honey bees and to make honey, sweets and candles from wax. In addition to that, the programme has also led to the production of crafts and other products such as handcrafted containers for honey, bees wax candles and making of protective clothing. It was implemented in 35 rural areas across South Africa and projects were implemented in Stinkwater, Muldersdrift and Atteridgeville in Gauteng. Products were proudly showcased during the World Summit on Sustainable Development.

The National Research Foundation is responsible for managing five national research facilities of which one is located in the town of Sutherland in the Northern Cape, where I come from. The telescopes at the observatory are used for optical and infrared observations. It provides an international facility for research in astronomy in Africa and educates the community. At present, an 11 metre optical telescope is in construction, and I believe it will be operational during the end of this year. Needless to say, the potential in terms of tourism and the related economic benefits are indeed great. Moreover, it will certainly inspire our youngsters from the Northern Cape province to pursue careers in this fascinating field of study.

Chairperson, hon Minister, you will agree with me that the science field is one of the serious wars we have to wage as a nation. Having said that, we must acknowledge the role, the expertise and contributions made by the previously advantaged in the science sphere in our country. However, the political objectives of access to the field of science needs to be fast- tracked as a matter of urgency.

Taking cognisance of this objective, as spelled out clearly in our human resource development strategy, we in the ANC will work together with the Department of Science and Technology to extend assistance to this sphere. Moreover, this will enable us to effect the necessary changes to ensure that we have the people with the right skills in the right places.

Many reasons are put forward as to why unemployment and poverty persist in our society when there is still so much to be achieved. Not all the reasons have to do with the capabilities of people. Many have to do with the unequal distribution of science skills in our society. It is, therefore, critical that we push back the frontiers of ignorance amongst our school- going population, and remind them that we have been historically deprived of the opportunity to study in these career paths.

Moreover, we believe that current initiatives and joint programmes between the Departments of Science and Technology and Education will ensure the sufficient publication of scientific literature in simple language of innovations and interventions. This, we believe, will create a sense of curiosity amongst our young people and will encourage them to emulate some of the recorded scientific achievements, but most importantly, it might just produce the first Einstein from Africa. With those few words, Chairperson, the ANC supports this Budget Vote.

The MINISTER OF ARTS AND CULTURE: Chairperson, I want to thank all the hon members who have participated in the debate. I have noted some of the remarks that have been made and some of the very sound suggestions put forward and proffered by hon members. We shall be following up some of them. I am not going to respond to every contribution that was made, but I will pick some that I think were particularly useful.

Firstly, I would like to address the problem that was faced by hon member Robinson, about the Iziko house museums. I think the hon Robinson was perhaps a victim of bad timing. The temporary closure of the museums she referred to had in fact been announced in the printed media here in the Cape, so on the day she went there she was just unfortunate. Since April, with the exception of the Natale Labia Museum in Muizenberg, the other museums have been open three days a week and that too was announced in the Cape-based media.

We are currently working on a feasibility study for more effective management of these museums and this will be completed in September. That too, interestingly, was in the media. Please bear with us. We will get it right. As I have said, by September we should have a management plan for the more effective management of these museums. Everyone has emphasised the role that arts and culture can play in the process of reconciliation and nation-building, and also in the process of engendering a new sense of South African patriotism. All these are absolutely very true.

However, I think we shouldn’t lose sight of the other side of arts and culture. A musician who died too young, Albert Ayler, once referred to music as the great healing force in the universe. Another musician, who wrote a song called Alexandra’s Right Time Band, has as one of the lines in that song that they play the national anthem in such a way that you would want to go to war. So it can heal, but it can also do a great deal of damage.

So let’s start to romanticise arts and culture. It can be a healing force in the universe and it can also be a very damaging force in the universe. We, of course, want to emphasise the healing dimension of arts and culture. In that process of healing, we find that we have to undo a lot of the damage that was also done by arts and culture in the past. I am pleased to see that many of the hon members are very aware of that sort of problem, because there were many references made, for example, to misrepresentations and distortions that we have in many of our museums, art galleries and at our heritage and legacy sites. This is something that the department is addressing. We will need the cooperation of the provinces, especially the MECs responsible for these areas in repairing a lot of damage that has been inflicted through arts and culture in the past.

There was a specific reference made to the promotion of indigenous languages and the problem which my hon colleague, Mr Singh, from Kwazulu- Natal has about the promotion of indigenous languages and perhaps the neglect of English, which is universally recognised as a language of international commerce. I would say that there is nothing wrong with the promotion of English. What has been wrong in the past is that certain languages have been promoted at the expense of others. That is part of the damage that one is trying to repair.

At this moment in time you will find many parents saying that it is better for their children to learn English than their mother tongue, because in our own society the balance of forces is such that if you are proficient in English, you have an advantage over someone who is proficient only in his mother tongue. I think that too will change in time as we begin to repair this damage that has been inflicted by past practices.

Equally, on the issue of issue of geographical names, let’s remember that South Africa, contrary to some of the damage that has been done, not by arts and culture in this time, but by another discipline, history, was not an empty land. Every place in this country which has a name, either in English, Afrikaans, German or French, had a previous indigenous name. Many of those are maybe lost and some might be forgotten, but there are certain areas where I suppose it is relatively easy to correct that sort of damage that has been done.

I visited a place last September in Limpopo province. On all the maps it is called Tzaneen. I kept asking myself what language was that. Until I got there to discover, after speaking to the Africans in the area, that its name was Tsaneng, but it has always been referred to as Tzaneen on the maps, because that is the corruption of the original African name. There are many instances like that. That one, I suppose, is relatively easy to correct, but there would be other areas where it would be a little more difficult. Let’s remember also when we correct names or rename places to resurrect an original African name that it is quite costly. It is not a cheap exercise. It might be cheap for me in the sense that I would say: Give it that name or that other name, but every map in the world will have to be changed. Remember that. Every map in South Africa will have to be changed. All our road signs will have to be changed. It is quite a costly exercise. It is not something we embark on lightly, but one recognised, of course, the need to rectify some of that which has happened in the past.

Equally, on the issue of the graves of the fallen, this department is charged with looking after the burial sites and graves of the fallen, either after the wars South Africa had waged in Europe and the rest of Africa, or those who have had fallen in the struggle for liberation. There is no plan, nor is there a budget at this point, for the repatriation of the remains of anybody. Let us not raise false hopes in our communities, because there are no such plans. What there is a plan for is the identification of ways and means of preserving those burial sites and graves of our fallen, in various parts of South Africa and in the rest of the world. I also want to thank the hon members for the suggestions that they have made. I want to assure them that where there are important historical, heritage and possible legacy sites, the department will take that on board quite seriously. However, we also need the assistance, especially of hon members in the provinces. If you take, for example, a province like the Free State, mention was made that it was the site of the founding of the ANC and of the NP. As far as I know, the House where that first ANC conference was held is still standing in Mangaung in Bloemfontein. There are also other sites in that province that could very well become legacy projects, but we would want the hon members from that province to identify them and also to point them out to us.

Yes, the cultural industries are a very important and perhaps a potentially strong area of economic growth for South Africa. I have seen a statistic somewhere that, in terms of its exports, one of the chief exports of the United States, for example, are various cultural products. We need only turn on the radio or television to realise that we are particularly strong in the area of performing arts as South Africans, especially, when it comes to music, song and dance. We have a very keen interest in developing the South African film industry, and I am pleased to say that our participation in various festivals, especially the Cannes Film Festival, has enabled us over the years to establish both memoranda of understanding, but also cooperation agreements with various other nations in the world that are engaged in that line of business.

The concerns that the hon members have raised in relation to the National Arts Council, the Playhouse, the libraries, yes, I think that we are following these very closely. We shall be handling them in due course. I think we will have answers to some of the problems that we have been facing in the National Arts Council within the next few days, because that matter has been attended to.

I want to thank the hon members for their participation and we will try to make sure that we follow up some of their suggestions. I thank you.

The MINISTER OF SCIENCE AND TECHNOLOGY: Hon Chair, may I start by apologising for crossing the line. I should have gone to the other side. I had no deliberate intention of undermining your power and your privilege in this House.

When I came into the House and looked at the speakers’ list, especially from the provinces, I noticed that all the delegates who are MECs are MECs of arts, culture or sport, and only the Free State has an MEC for arts, sport, science and technology. I thought that when the time comes for me to reply I would say: “Haak, Vrystaat!”, because it is the only province that realised where we need to go. [Laughter.] But, “Haak, Vrystaat!”, they did not utter a single word about science and technology. [Laughter]. Now, I do not know what to say.

In fact, for the greater part of the debate, we wondered whether we were in the wrong debate or in the wrong House, because we were either completely ignored or boycotted - it could be any one of those words.

This happened most probably because most members do not feel comfortable when talking about science and technology. It is an area for obscure people in laboratories in dustcoats who must deal with such issues, and yet science and technology rules our lives. Everywhere we go, in this House and elsewhere, as well as in our homes, the microwaves, the TVs, the refrigerators, the soap we use in the morning - and we are so clean and smell nice - the chemicals that we put under our armpits this morning and the polish on the fingers of our beautiful ladies are all products of science and technology, research and development.

At all times in the industries there are people in laboratories who are not just satisfied that they have a piece of soap, but they are always looking for ways and means of improving that soap, producing it faster and cheaper. That is what science or research and development is about in the private sector in particular.

The cars that all of us drove to come here this morning, the cell phones we have, such as Nokia, Samsung and others are the same names you find on your microwaves, refrigerators, televisions and music systems in your homes. This system that I am using here is a Phillips product, from a Dutch company, and I am just wondering how much we put in it as South Africa before we use it, before we consume it in the manner that we are consuming it. Will there be a day when we will have a state-of-the-art cell phone made in this country, a Nokia or Samsung of our own? Because, what is happening now is that we are importing all our refrigerators, cars, cell phones and everything else. We also import computers and other products. We are consuming the work of other people and unless we increase research and development, we will fall far behind in as far as the modernisation of our society and the economy is concerned, because you cannot compete as long as you depend on other people.

Countries that are powerful, such as Japan, Korea and others, are economic giants and we are buying from them because they have invested a hell of a lot in research and development. They dominate us economically and technologically. The US does the same, but also militarily. They can klap'' [strike] anybody they want at any time because they have invested in science, technology and development. We cannot stand up to them even if we disagree with whatever they do. We mustthambela mthetho’’ [obey the rules] because they can ``klap’’ [strike] us. So, it is absolutely important that we as hon members must become comfortable talking about science and technology.

Earlier on I saw kids in the gallery over there. We hope in due course to invest, not only in the laboratories, in the science councils and others, but also in our school system, where we can make available facilities for our nation, for our kids to develop and to love science. The Department of Science and Technology wants to establish science centres in all the provinces, and we hope that the provinces will support this and perhaps even help us to build more centres so that kids can enjoy and love science and technology. If they do so, then we will have the knowledge, the science workers and the technology workers that we need in order to take this country to the level where it is supposed to be. However, as things stand at the moment, we are not doing well at all. What is even more disturbing, is that we are not doing well at school level in terms of maths and science. Once kids have maths, they can do anything related to science and technology. The alarm bells should ring, especially among the majority of black people, because that is where the problem is, and we know what the issues and reasons are. All of us must go out and solve some of those problems, because you cannot have a situation where the majority of our population are not comfortable with this area and the minority is, because we will never be able to build the kind of society that we want.

I keep telling people that I have this little paper here - men’s shirts with their pockets on the left are useful because it means that this little paper sits next to my heart - but it shows that we have not, as a country, been able to develop the majority, as far as I am concerned, that is the African component of our population. Because of history, the facilities that exist in the townships and the villages, and the poverty of the schools and the universities, etc we have not been able to develop that component of our population, and therefore we will not get researchers from that component of our population. As things stand now, let me tell you that the African component of our population constitutes 79% of the population of this country, but they constitute only 2,4% of all engineers. They constitute only 7,5% of all medical doctors. They constitute only 1,6% of dentists and only 2,4% of actuaries. Actually, the number is 12 in the entire country. That tells you that the education system, the research establishment in industry and everywhere, is not able to tap into the majority of the people in our country. So, we will never have our own Nokia and our own South African car. We do not have it. All cars are manufactured elsewhere and if we do make them here, we make them under licence. We will never have those things and we will never do them on our own. We face a big challenge, so let us have science at the centre of our lives and we will become a better country, a more powerful country, able to compete with others on an equal footing. Thank you very much. [Applause.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Hon members, Ministers, Deputy Ministers and special delegates, that concludes the business for the day, and before I can call on hon members to depart, I just want to make an observation that indeed our approach of clustering debates has been of great significance, not only to us as a House, but also in terms of promoting one of the cornerstones of our Constitution, which is co- operative governance. Through this kind of cluster debate, we are not only learning from the experiences of the provinces and Ministers are not only learning from the experiences of the provinces, but they are beginning to have a sense of how other issues in other departments are impacting on their own work as different departments, so in that sense the whole notion of an integrated approach to development is beginning to be taken more seriously. I want to thank the Ministers and special delegates for taking these kinds of debates seriously. This is a national duty that all of us must continue to build on.

That concludes the debate, and I want to remind hon members that proceedings will be suspended until we resume after lunch. Thank you.

Business suspended at 13:06 and resumed at 14:05.

Afternoon sitting

                         APPROPRIATION BILL

Debate on Vote No 15 - Health;

Debate on Vote No 20 - Social Development:

USIIHLALO WAMAKOMIDI: Malungu ahloniphekile, angithathe leli thuba ngibonge ukuba khona koNgqongqoshe kule Ndlu namhlanje. Sibonga ukuba khona kukaNgqongqoshe wezeMpilo umhlonishwa uManto Tshabalala-Msimang, iPhini lakhe uNozizwe Madlala-Routledge kanye noNgqongqoshe wezokuThuthukiswa koMphakathi. Siyabonga. (Translation of isiZulu paragraph follows.)

[The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Hon members, let me take this opportunity to thank the Ministers for their presence in this House today. We appreciate the presence of the Minister of Health, hon Manto Tshabalala- Msimang and her Deputy, Nozizwe Madlala-Routledge, and the Minister of Social Development. We thank you.]

The MINISTER OF HEALTH: Chairperson, Minister Zola Skweyiya, Deputy Minister of Health, MECs present, Deputy Minister of Social Development, hon members of the NCOP, I wish to dedicate this speech to the late Comrade Aggrey Klaaste, the former editor of Sowetan. The late Mr Klaaste’s life and dedication to nation building should be an inspiration to all of us. I wish to convey my sincere condolences to his family and friends, and to all of us who will miss him.

It is a pleasure for me to address this House on my budget vote today. It is a pleasure because the electorate has demonstrated its confidence in the policies and programmes of the two successive ANC-led Governments by re- electing the ANC with such a great majority. It is a pleasure because we can collectively take credit for our achievements in the first ten years of our democracy. It is also a pleasure because, by sharing this budget vote with my colleague, Minister Skweyiya, we are illustrating in concrete terms the extent to which integration in Government works. It is a pleasure because, despite many obstacles, we are well on our way to transforming the delivery of social services in our country.

In the process of electioneering, in particular, I travelled many provinces and was told repeatedly by our people how much they appreciate the services provided by this Government. When one hears this and tries to reconcile it with the newspaper headlines, one should realise that the poor and the marginalised people of our country do not have access to the media and therefore cannot tell their true stories.

One also realises that the policies that we have adopted are making a difference. The marginalised are benefiting from our policies and programmes. If they did not, they would not have voted for the ANC in such overwhelmingly large numbers.

Of course, those parts of our society that were reaping extraordinary benefits at the expense of the poor are beginning to feel the pinch. If we want to broaden access to social services to make health services more affordable, equitable and sustainable, we have no choice but to regulate those issues that impact negatively on the provision of equitable, affordable and high quality services to the historically disadvantaged. This is not to say we are in the process of throwing the baby out with the bath water. We have a coherent plan and an internationally benchmarked and respected set of policies. What we do need is your active support to ensure successful implementation.

Before I speak about the budget and what we hope to focus on in the next year, permit me to focus on some of our key achievements in the past year or so: We have improved child health care in our country; our immunisation coverage has improved to 74%, with no deaths of children from measles since 1999; we have trained at least one health care worker per facility that provides child health care in the integrated management of childhood illnesses strategy; we have developed and are phasing in the implementation of a school health policy; our tobacco control policies, combined with our health promotion activities, have resulted in fewer youth taking up smoking. I think we need to applaud this. Please, do so on my behalf. [Applause.]

With regard to the issue of malaria, we have, in collaboration with our neighbours - Mozambique, Swaziland and lately with Zimbabwe - enhanced our malaria control programme, which has resulted in significantly fewer cases in the past five years, as well as significantly fewer deaths. I’m proud to announce that we have succeeded in lowering the death rate to below the target set by the World Health Organisation. I therefore ask members, especially from KwaZulu-Natal, Limpopo and Mpumalanga to both send letters of appreciation to our health personnel in these provinces and to support our continued efforts to reduce the impact of malaria on our communities in the coming years, as outlined by the President in his state of the nation address.

In a similar vein, I wish to convey to this House another very good piece of news - our immunisation coverage has increased since 1998 from 63% to 74% in 2003, and I’m sure we can do better this year. Whilst there are still provinces that are lower than the national average, this level of coverage has resulted in no death from measles in all the provinces in our country, with no deaths of children since 1999. In addition, we are confident that we will be certified polio free by the WHO next year. I am therefore pleading with members of this House to please take the immunisation campaigns very seriously. In order to increase our immunisation campaign, we will embark on a national immunisation with our counterparts and compatriots in the SADC member states. We hope that such collaboration will enhance our collective efforts to prevent disease and promote health.

With regard to the issue of HIV/Aids, we have expanded our prevention and care and support programmes in all provinces. This has been accompanied by a significant increase in resources that this Government has made available to provinces and NGOs. I shall return to this issue when I deal with the budget. We are working with other Government departments to ensure that we all have policies and programmes that compliment each other in our fight against the spread of HIV and the impact of Aids on our country.

Despite our efforts, we are not doing very well with regards to TB. We have, however, expanded the Dots programme to ensure that every TB patient has a supporter who ensures that the patient takes her or his medication and completes the course, but our cure rates are still well short of our targets. So, again I wish to request that members of this House assist us in this regard. We need greater commitment from patients and communities, including community leaders to ensure that this programme delivers the results that you want. I, therefore, urge hon members to take this message to their constituencies and to work tirelessly to convince communities and local leaders to work with the health personnel to strengthen our TB control programme in each and every district.

The provision of health services is labour intensive. This is positive in the sense that the provision of health services creates work. However, it also requires that we are able to manage our human resources very effectively by providing appropriate training, the right mix of incentives and the management of training, recruiting and retaining health personnel in all parts of our country, but especially in our rural communities.

As part of our contribution to work creation, we will expand the community health worker programme that already exists in the country. This cadre will be the interface between the communities and the formal health sector. They will assist communities to take over some of the burden of families who have to cope with caring for family members who are ill. They will also assist communities to remain healthy by spreading the health promotion messages. In addition to expanding the community health worker programme, we have initiated a range of other measures to strengthen and support our health personnel. These include the implementation of a mid-level cadre for a range of health professions; the provision of scarce and rural allowances since July 2001; the strengthening of community service for health professionals via the use of telemedicines, for example. I must also tell this House that as of January, we will have community service for nurses.

To counter the high recruitment of our health professionals by agencies for placement in developed countries, we have signed a number of agreements with government departments of the United Kingdom and with the Commonwealth to regulate the migration of health professionals. We will be working with other countries to do the same, notably Canada and Australia. In fact, as I speak to this House today, officials are already in Canada to ensure that we sign yet another agreement with Canada.

We also need to ensure that the health services provided in the public and private sectors are affordable. We have known for some time - this is reflected in the National Drug Policy that we adopted in the first five years of our democracy - that there are a range of incentives like discounts and rebates in the health market. In order to address these issues, we have introduced legislation that will provide for a single exit price for medicine.

On the issue of quality we have introduced legislation that will require all those health professionals who wish to dispense to complete a dispensing course and to obtain a dispensing licence from the Department of Health. My colleagues in the health sector have known about it since a year ago, so I would have expected that they would have taken responsibility, if they were so interested in providing and protecting the interests of the patients, and would have done this dispensing course and completed it to ensure that they could obtain a dispensing licence from the department.

Let me reiterate, the first measure is to reduce the price of medicines, and the second is to improve the quality of dispensing of these medicines in our country. I really want to know if there is anybody in this House who would say: No, we don’t want the reduction in the price of medicines, and we don’t want to ensure that we improve the quality of the dispensing of these medicines. I will therefore rely on my colleagues in this House to help us to help our communities to actually understand what this Government is trying to achieve.

There have been suggestions that this Government wants to destroy the private health sector. Nothing can be further from the truth. However, we are committed to ensuring that the private and public health sectors work in synergy to provide the most affordable and best quality care for all the people of our country. I think we really have to do this. There is no way we cannot do this, and again I plead with the members of this House to ensure that we really communicate the correct message to the doctors, pharmacists and everybody out there who are feeding people with wrong information. We are beginning to get memos that indicate that we want to destroy the private health sector. That is far from the truth.

Given our values we cannot be complacent when the public health sector spends between R627 and R922 per person, whilst the private sector spends R6 231 per person. I do not think I can rest in peace, even on my bed at night, with those figures. Hon members, I am sure you will agree with me that this is totally unacceptable. I am sure it is unacceptable to all of us. Given that I have begun to touch on the health financing issues, let me turn to the budget for 2004-05, and then I will close with a few paragraphs on our priorities for 2004-05.

Of the R8,7 billion that the department received in the 2004-05 financial year, R7,7 billion, or if you like, 88,5%, is in the form of conditional grants which are largely allocated to the provinces. Conditional grants are for the integrated nutrition programme; the HIV and Aids programme, and I am hoping that people are listening very carefully - it is HIV and Aids; it is not HIV/Aids - the transfer of South African Police Services mortuaries to the provincial departments of health; the national tertiary services grant; the health professional training and research; the hospital revitalisation programme and the hospital management grant.

A major increase in conditional grant funding for the HIV and Aids programme has been provided for, as I have said. Conditional grant funding increased from R333 million in 2003-04 to R781 million in 2004-05. These funds are to be used to finance the comprehensive HIV and Aids Care Management and Treatment Plan. I wish to stress that it is not a rollout of ARVs. It is the comprehensive HIV and Aids Care Management and Treatment Plan for South Africa. I urge, therefore, the MECs for health, in particular, to ensure that these funds are spent appropriately and efficiently. I again stress: it is not the rollout of ARVs, and I rely on this House to tell our citizens what it is. It is a comprehensive HIV and Aids care management and treatment plan for South Africa. Let me emphasise, however, that the implementation of the plan must strengthen the health system as a whole.

I am sure that hon members would also like to understand how the provincial departments of health are funded. Provinces obtain the bulk of their funds from the national fiscus. The division is done through a formula, a block grant, which is called an equitable share, which is given to each province. Provinces then divide the funds among their different departments. Guidelines are provided to provinces about what percentage of the budget should be used for social services; and what percentage should be allocated for each social service, namely education, health and social welfare. However, sadly, what provinces are finding is that the percentage allocated to health is decreasing, whilst the allocation to social development - largely for the grants - has been steadily increasing. Some provinces, therefore, are underbudgeting for health services.

In the 2003-04 financial year, provinces collectively overspent on their budgets by 0,5%. However, three provinces overspent by a very large margin. These are Gauteng, North West and the Northern Cape. This, it may be argued, reflects the extent of underbudgeting.

When one compares the allocations to provinces for the 2004-05 financial year, one finds that on average that the budget increase is 8%, compared to 2003-04. The increase of 8% is about 2% better than inflation. However, the additional funds are largely earmarked for the comprehensive plan for HIV and Aids. It is, however, heartening to note that some provinces with the lowest per capita health budget, like Limpopo, North West and the Northern Cape, will get increases that are higher than the national average of 8%.

Whilst the allocation of funding for HIV and Aids has been growing, we, as South Africans, must not forget that we suffer from certain other diseases and die from a range of diseases, and that we, therefore, must make suitable provision for noncommunicable diseases like asthma, hypertension, osteoporosis, diabetes and unnatural causes of death, like traffic accidents, suicides and homicides.

The National Treasury, I understand, is currently reviewing the equitable share formula which is used to allocate funds to provinces. I urge members of this House to actively participate in this review process. Let me now turn to the provision of selected services.

As members know, we embarked on an ambitious hospital revitalisation programme at which 27 hospitals are currently enrolled. This programme will, over the next 20 years, ensure the revitalisation of all public hospitals that need improvement. I hope you can support us in this regard when we ask for additional resources. What members might not know is that the programme targets physical infrastructure, equipment, improvement of management and quality of care.

Provinces choose the hospitals that they wish to enrol in the revitalisation programme each year - as funds are made available by National Treasury. However, members are urged to ensure that in each province psychiatric hospitals are included in the revitalisation programme, as well. The state of psychiatric hospitals and mental health care in general really leaves much to be desired, and I want to commit my department to work more vigorously with provinces to ensure that we strengthen mental health care in all our nine provinces during this coming year. In this context we will be exploring how we can strengthen our collaboration with the Ministries of Social Development and Education in particular.

As I end, permit me to share with this House some of our priorities for this year, and in the term of office of this Government. We need to sharpen the implementation of our policies. As you are all aware, implementation takes place within provinces and within municipalities. This implies that the three spheres of Government - national, provincial and municipalities - must work together to ensure that social services reach those in greatest need.

Many of our people who are in the greatest need live in rural areas and in informal housing in the urban areas. We must be able to plan and deliver services so that these South Africans are also reached. We shall do our best by increasing resources allocated to these areas, by increasing the number of community health workers who provide preventive and promotive health services in these areas, and by increasing the number of health workers who are allocated to the clinics that are built in these areas. National and provincial government must work closely with local government to increase our ability to reach those most in need of these services.

By ensuring better collaboration between various departments that provide social services, we will improve both the quantity and quality of services to the marginalised and the historically disadvantaged in our country, particularly the poor. This will be our collective contribution to restoring the dignity of our people. Clearly, we will continue our efforts to reduce morbidity and mortality from malaria, cholera, TB, HIV and Aids, but we shall also focus on noncommunicable diseases like, as I said, asthma, diabetes, osteoporosis and so on. We will therefore also focus our efforts on the promotion of healthy lifestyles and initiate a healthy lifestyle campaign which we can encourage all our members to participate in.

I was very proud when I was at the World Health Assembly, because we chaired a commission that looked at healthy lifestyles and physical exercise, and we were able to influence the resolution that was taken by the WHO. This campaign will also include interventions to emphasise responsible alcohol use and the reduction of tobacco use, especially amongst the youth. As I stand here before you, we have a delegation that is going to Geneva to actually begin to discuss and strengthen our approach to tobacco abuse and its reduction. Research and our own assessment reveal that non-natural causes of death from inter-personal violence, traffic accidents and suicides, many related to substance abuse, are increasing at an alarming rate. Together with our colleagues in the social sector cluster - the Ministers of Education, Social Development and Transport - we will develop a comprehensive intervention strategy. However, Government cannot work alone. I therefore implore members of this House, the private sector and the communities to work with us to deal decisively with these issues.

We have much work to do. We will only succeed if Government works as one cohesive unit at national level and with the provincial and local government. In addition to the Government working in synchronisation, dealing with social problems requires social mobilisation and the involvement of all sectors of society. We must, therefore, commit ourselves to working together to ensure a better life for all our citizens. In conclusion, permit me to thank my colleagues, the MECs, who were responsible for providing the stewardship of the national health system in the past five years and to welcome the newly appointed MECs. I am sure that we will work together effectively to ensure that our policies and programmes are implemented in ways that benefit all our people. In this regard, I also want to welcome my colleague Nozizwe Madlala-Routledge who has just joined us, and I am sure we will work together very well to ensure the implementation of policies.

I also wish to place on record my personal thanks to the former chairperson of the Select Committee on Social Services, Loretta Jacobus, and the members of the committee. I also wish to welcome the newly appointed Chairperson, Ms Rejoice Masilo, and her new committee, and I pledge that the Department of Health will closely work with them to ensure that the oversight that they provide sharpens implementation. I hope you will really do good oversight so that we can implement the very good policies that we have developed over the years.

Finally, I wish to thank the officials at the local, provincial and national levels for the sterling work that they have done in the past five years, and encourage them to rededicate themselves to serving the people of this great land, South Africa. I have also given them instruction that when they go to the provinces, I do not expect them to be interacting only with the officials; they must really go to the people so that they can understand the needs of those to whom we want to deliver excellent, quality health services. I thank you very much. [Applause.]

The MINISTER OF SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT: Chairperson, I would like to acknowledge all the new members of the National Council of the Provinces and request that they, together with all the hon members of this House, emulate the previous NCOP and maintain a clear and sharp focus on the mandate given to us by our people.

We have been given a mandate to fight poverty and unemployment and ensure that all South Africans, especially those living in poverty or confronting all vulnerabilities, are fully able to exercise their constitutional rights and enjoy the full dignity of freedom.

Today we are requesting that you support the Department of Social Development in building a caring and integrated system of social development service that facilitates human development and improves the quality of life of all our people. This applies especially to children, women, older persons and people with disabilities.

In my last address to the previous NCOP, before the close of the term, I spoke of social assistance and the SA Social Agency Bills. I am pleased to report that the establishment of the National Social Security Agency is now well underway, and it was announced by the President that it would be in place by April of 2005.

This task requires urgent completion of the provincial inputs necessary for the finalisation of the budgets for social grants over the MTEF period. It also requires that each province and its government reinvest and subsequently separate the social grants function from other services provided by the provincial departments of social development. It also requires a reorganisation of the provincial department of social development to put a greater and more comprehensive focus on other social welfare responsibilities.

Our strategy is to transform and enhance the social welfare services by encompassing the following initiatives: Firstly, the retention strategy for social workers of the department and the development of associated social services professions; secondly, the upgrading of the salary levels of the social work professionals; thirdly, the proposed introduction of incentives to professionals working in rural areas; and fourthly, the development of an appropriate service delivery model and a policy framework for the granting of financial awards to nongovernmental organisations that render statutory welfare services.

As the National Council of Provinces is aware, this matter has been a matter of ongoing concern. The existing policy is antiquated and does not channel adequate resources to the welfare institutions that need their assistance the most, especially those working with children and in the rural areas.

Many welfare institutions, in particular those created in the past 10 years, are underfinanced and do not have the necessary trained staff. Many institutions, civil society and faith-based organisations find themselves unable to cope with the need and demand for their services. We are working on putting into place an all-encompassing framework that will assist this framework institutions, civil society and faith-based organisations, especially those who care for orphaned and vulnerable children. I am sure that members of the NCOP are aware that all the partners in the social developmental sector are currently conducting a campaign to register children of up to the age of 11 who qualify from the first of April this year for a child support grant.

As we intensify our campaign to register all eligible children under 14 years by the year 2005-06, we expect an additional 3,2 million children to also receive the child support grant, thereby bringing the total number of children in the system to over 7 million. While significant progress has been achieved in extending basic social assistance, there is still outstanding work that needs to be done to ensure that we strengthen our contributory arrangement for comprehensive social security.

The most important elements of this work is the finalisation of negotiations between the National Treasury and the Department of Health, social health insurances and the development of an integrated implemented framework for social health insurance and the Road Accident Fund. These elements will be completed by September this year. As part of the provision of basic social assistance services, we will do further work to improve the understanding of the composite value, distribution and targeting of the social wage. We will report to Cabinet on this matter by November this year.

On the legislation front there is still some unfinished business that we are requesting the NCOP to address with urgency. Government presented a package of four Bills to the previous Parliament. The research, drafting, public participation progress and redrafting of these four Bills had been going on for more than four years prior to their presentation to Parliament. It is time to ensure that issues regarding children, as addressed in all the present Bills, are properly considered and that these Bills are speedily passed by Parliament. As we celebrate 10 years of democracy, it is time to ensure that children and older persons are able to fully exercise their constitutional rights and enjoy the full dignity of freedom.

As the Older Persons Bill is a section 76 Bill, I have accordingly requested the Leader of Government Business, big business and Parliament to reintroduce the Older Persons Bill in the NCOP for referral to the Select Committee on Social Services. The overall goal of the Bill is to maintain and increase the capacity of older persons to support themselves and to contribute to the wellbeing of those around them.

The many and varied stakeholder organisations working in support of the active aging of our older persons have participated in the process that will lead to the appeal of the Aged Persons Act of 1967 and the Aged Persons Amendment Bill of 1998. They are also keen to have the Bill properly considered and speedily passed by Parliament.

The priority elements of the Government programme of action of this year have been clearly articulated by the President in his state of the nation address to Parliament. They are underpinned by the joint programme of the various sector clusters in Cabinet, and I would like to spend some time elaborating on some of the key development components of the programme of the Cabinet cluster for this year.

Firstly, the national food emergency scheme that is part of the integrated food security and administration programme, uses Statistics SA’s categorisation of poor households in South Africa of five bands based upon the levels of expenditure on basic domestic essentials per month. To date food emergency schemes have focused only on the poorest households, those are households in band A which spend less than R200 on domestic essentials and which do not have household member who receive a social assistance fund in excess of R200. In other words, the only poor households that qualify for this food relief are those in band A, whose only form of social assistance is a child support grant.

According to the research conducted by Statistic SA, the majority of these households are geographically concentrated in the nodes of the integrated sustainable rural development programme and the urban renewal programme. Some of the households are also located in the provincial poverty pockets. Despite the urgent human needs and the logistical challenges faced by the national food emergency scheme, things have generally gone well, but there have been some problems. Although committee organisations have assisted in the identification of needy families and child-headed households, the noninvolvement of civil society structures has in some cases raised problems. Service providers have by and large co-ordinated their distribution of food parcels with some traditional leaders and faith-based organisations, but a more inclusive approach could have been used and could have been better.

During this year the department will be working to standardise the use of stakeholder forums in their identification of households to receive in kind emergency food aid. The department will also be investigating all contractive service providers to ensure that the food parcels that are distributed contain foodstuffs that are of good and nutritious quality and with the right value. We have found cases where this has not been the case, which raises questions about the ethics and practices of some of these services providers.

The department is working with other social welfare cluster departments, its provincial counterparts and other stakeholders to review the entire programme in order to make it more effective and efficient, and to ensure that it is both implemented correctly and reaches the most vulnerable members of our society.

It is also necessary, in order to ensure the sustainable and ultimate independence of the beneficiaries of food parcels, that the registration of social fund beneficiaries who receive agricultural starter packs take place. In that way the household to food production initiative will receive attention.

Government recognises that not all qualifying households have the capacity to prepare food for themselves. Therefore, designated drop-in centres have been established to provide prepared meals and nutritional supplements to child-headed families, frail older people, TB patients and frail people living with HIV/Aids.

The second joint programme of the Cabinet cluster that I would like to bring to the attention of the NCOP is the Expanded Public Works Programme. Government’s Expanded Public Works Programme, under the leadership of the Department of Public Works, is also in the social cluster and it is aimed at expanding social services, enhancing skills and creating work opportunities. In the short term, the programme focuses on enhancing early childhood development services and the provision of home and community- based care services.

With respect to early childhood development services, it was estimated in 2000 that only 16% of the children under the age of six years old had access to these services. In addition, 85% of the caregivers at these ECD facilities required further training. We will endeavour to sustain our interventions by linking them to the national food emergency scheme and the school nutrition programme, with the ultimate objective of ensuring that all children attend school and receive at least one meal a day. In this regard we applaud the priority that the new Minister of Education, Naledi Pandor, is assigning to preschool education. With respect to existing home and community-based care facilities, it is estimated that they are staffed by approximately 2 500 fulltime caregivers and 20 000 volunteers. Only a quarter of these volunteers receive stipends of any kind. Government has made a special allocation of R70 million for the department to support and increase the number of home and community- based care sites. Increased support for the establishment of community child-care forums is also envisaged. The department is also co-ordinating an umbrella research project on the effects and impact of HIV on social service provision in Government.

Before I conclude, allow me to return to the issue of the mandate that we have been given by our people. Youth are central to the Government’s commitment to fighting poverty and unemployment. During the month of June, which is Youth Month, we are rededicating ourselves to this task and intensifying our efforts to address the challenge faced by young people. In this regard our sector will focus on developing skills and work opportunities for young people.

We are working with the Department of Labour to ensure that the Sector Education and Training Authorities increase the number of learnerships available in our sector. We will work through not-for-profit organisations to enhance the utilisation of the Umsobomvu Fund and to ensure the broadening of the base of the black economic empowerment process.

At this point we would like to acknowledge the new board of the National Development Agency, led by its chairperson, Bishop Malusi Mpumlwana, and commend them for their strategic initiatives that not only strengthen good governance, but also ensure that project assistance reaches the poorest communities in our society.

As part of our work to building a caring society, we are also attending to qualitative issues such as the role and place of the family, societal value systems and moral regeneration, especially during this year, the International Year of the Orphan.

Members of the NCOP, it has to be said that while this work progresses, the scourge of drug and substance abuse continues to ravage our communities, families and youth. What is even more worrying, is that this problem is starting to crop up in schools and amongst children.

Working together with all spheres of Government and all sectors of society, we will give this issue priority attention in the coming year. We have to reduce this scourge and promote healthy lifestyles. We will therefore intensify awareness campaigns that contribute to moral regeneration; finalise the norms and standards for the treatment and rehabilitation of drug addicts; and ensure that treatment centres are registered, function in accordance with the Constitution and the law, respect human rights and operate in terms of good governance principles.

In this regard, I take this opportunity to announce that we have decided not to grant the Noupoort Christian Care Centre permanent registration, but rather look towards its closure. This follows the recommendations of a task team established by the director-general that found violation of human rights; a lack of compliance with legislation, such as the Child Care Act and the Drug Treatment Act; and a lack of compliance with the set norms and standards for such centres in this country. This is despite the fact that the management of the centre had been given more than two years to relook its own act.

We granted the centre temporary registration for a period of over two years after a number of parents had requested that the centre not be closed. We also went further and made proposals on how the centre could bring its service in line with the Constitution, pertinent legislation and good governance principles. The report that I have received shows that not enough has been done to this effect. We as Government cannot allow this situation to continue endlessly, and we would like to urge the parents and communities to co-operate with us in addressing this matter.

Our effort at social integration also requires that we pay particular attention to services for people with disabilities. The department is in the process of redeveloping national norms and standards on service delivery to people with disabilities. This year, together with the Health Department and the Presidency, we will be finalising the procedures for the granting of the disability grant, based on a common definition of disability that encompasses the elements suggested by the World Health Organisation.

Across the entire spectrum of the work of the Department of Social Development, the attainment of our objectives requires co-operative governance and effective collaboration with civil society. We will, therefore, engage civil society organisations in our country and on the African continent to develop a common platform of action this year. In order for us to succeed in elaborating upon these hallmark principles of co- operative governance and implement our plan of action, we urge members of the NCOP to support the Budget Vote of this department. Thank you. [Applause.]

Ms J MASILO: Ke a leboga modulasetilo. [Thank you very much, Chairperson.]

Madam Chairperson, hon Ministers, hon Deputy Ministers, MECs from the provinces, senior officials of the departments, provincial delegates, special delegates and hon members of this House, as the acting chairperson of the Select Committee on Social Services, I am very happy to have this opportunity to address both the Minister of Health and the Minister of Social Development on their respective Budget Votes. I also want to congratulate them on their reappointments. Even though I have been with this committee for a very short time, I am fully aware of the enormous responsibilities that these two Ministries are facing in the road ahead.

With regard to Vote No 16: Health, the overall responsibility of the Department of Health is to ensure that our nation’s health does not decline and that all our citizens are afforded access to health services where they live, at the facilities at their disposal and at a price they can afford.

Indeed, the protection of the wellness of our country’s people is one of the most fundamental services that our Government can perform. This is especially important in a global environment where diseases have no respect for man-made boundaries, as was manifested by the Sars virus which first struck in China and then crisscrossed the globe. It then found its way to our shores, albeit on a very small scale. Without the prompt intervention of the Department of Health, we could potentially have had a 21st century version of the black plague.

Through the transformation of the health care system, a mammoth task which began by merging the fragmented health system that practised racial discrimination in all facets of health service delivery, to a situation in which there was quality primary health care for all across the racial divide, the Ministry of Health has steadfastly stayed committed to bringing quality health care to all people.

Some public hospitals and clinics were notorious in provinces, being health hospitals - legae la baswi - places where people went in sick and did not come out alive, regardless of the level of seriousness of their ailments. Conditions, particularly in rural communities and townships, were terrible. With patience, after a long day spent waiting for a doctor to see them, they would be turned away at close of business only to begin the whole process again the next morning.

The Department of Health can hold its head high for ensuring that there has been a change in the distribution of health resources through its deliberate redistribution of funding resources to provinces. Those provinces that had been historically disadvantaged found themselves with bigger funding sources where these sources had been inadequate before 1994. Clinic services and preventative health programmes, through a focus on primary health care, were helped along by a deliberate allocation of funds.

Substantial funding has also being set aside to implement the hospital revitalisation programme. A total of 27 capital projects and other infrastructural projects have been budgeted for, such as those at the Inkosi Albert Luthuli Hospital in Durban and the Nelson Mandela Hospital in Umtata.

Even our providers of professional services such as doctors, dentists, pharmacists and other health professionals, found themselves, through mechanisms set up by the Department of Health, being relocated in order to provide services in areas where the need was the greatest. The total number of professionals who have done community service is as follows: doctors 6 700; dentists 602; pharmacists 1 527; and other professionals 2 740.

The Department of Health has also entered into agreements with other governments such as Cuba to send doctors to our country, especially for our rural provinces, the North West being one of them. To date, approximately 640 Cuban doctors have served our people with dignity. What this has meant in real terms is that people in provinces who saw doctors only rarely and who had to travel many hundreds of kilometres to get to service centres, now have the services of community service doctors or foreign doctors to bring healthcare to their communities. Over and above professional health practitioners, nonprofessional workers, for example community health workers, have lent their support in addressing their communities’ healthcare needs. Some community counsellors assist, especially in the HIV/Aids voluntary counselling and testing programmes, in TB management through Dots and in the ARV roll-out plan, but the department is aware that one should not take advantage of the voluntary services of community workers. They have already investigated the possibility of volunteers receiving a stipend of R1 000 per month.

The relationship between the Department of Health and NGOs is a sensitive one, but one that must be carefully nurtured. NGOs depend on support from the department to continue with their vital community project work. With regular funding, NGOs can be empowered to form a complementary workforce for professionally trained healthcare staff.

Many countries on the African continent are still vigorously combating potentially crippling diseases such as polio, measles and malaria. We have been fortunate in South Africa in that, owing to routine immunisation programmes in childhood, polio has been eradicated since 1989. Our immunisation coverage has increased from 63% in 1998 to 78% in 2002.

The multinational Lubombo Spatial Development Initiative, partnered with Mozambique and Swaziland, has succeeded in lowering malaria cases substantially. Of the 3 777 cholera cases reported in 2003, there were only 40 fatalities. This all bears testimony to the fact that the Department of Health is vigorous in its attempt to control these various diseases. Our neighbours are not as lucky. Our responsibility, however, through Nepad and our commitment to an African renaissance lead our polio and other contagious disease programmes with our neighbours, and together we hope to eradicate these diseases from our continent. In view of the department’s commitment to health care for all its people, this Select Committee is happy to support the Health budget, Vote No 16.

On Vote No 19: Social Development, South Africa has always had two economies in one country, and the Ministry that is charged with the alleviation of the pain of the second economy is the Ministry of Social Development. In fact, the department has had a special programme geared specially towards poverty alleviation that is now being phased out. Instead, the department’s poverty alleviation activities are being incorporated into the new Expanded Public Works Programme that will integrate all social sector poverty relief programmes.

Despite the phasing out of the poverty alleviation in terms of special programme funding, the department still has the administration and distribution of social security grants as its largest poverty alleviation initiative during this MTEF period. According to the department’s estimates, there are currently over 8 million beneficiaries of social grants, and of that group over 50% are children living in abject poverty.

The new Social Assistance Bill and the South African Social Security Agency Bill, which were passed in February this year, have direct implications for the way provinces distribute social grants. In fact, a new national social security agency, established through the passage of the Bill, has as its primary task the improvement of service delivery with regards to the provision of social security. The agency will be fully operational by March 2005, and the inspectorate should be ready by April 2005.

All of us in the provinces have first-hand knowledge of the corruption, maladministration and general misappropriation of grant moneys that exist. It is therefore no surprise that the focus of this agency will be on improving the effectiveness of, and efficiency in grant management and on reducing fraud and corruption and, most importantly, on restoring the dignity of our people receiving grants through the enhancement of Batho Pele principles in the delivery of quality of service.

The impact of the national social security agency means a new way for provinces to allocate provincial budgets. Previously, budget allocations to provinces included social security funding, which took up approximately 80% to 90% of provincial budgets. Now provinces have the potential to focus funding on developmental welfare services. We hope that workers currently employed in the directorate of social security across all provinces will have the assurance that their services will continue in the new envisaged restructuring process, because provinces will be relieved of the responsibility of administrating grants. They will have the opportunity to focus on welfare services.

The transformation of welfare services means that social workers will become more prominent in the department. This change in focus can only benefit the department, especially social workers. Hopefully, the end result will mean that they will no longer be the worst paid public servants, but that they will have a salary package corresponding to their skills.

Despite their heavy emotional and physical responsibilities, and despite the fact that they have degrees that require the same number of years of training as their counterparts in other faculties, their remuneration leaves much to be desired. It therefore becomes a challenge for the Department of Social Development that requires skilled human capacity to implement its programmes. Without a review of the salary packages for social workers, the work of the department may very well grind to a halt. In addition to human resources, the department will also be able to focus on older persons. An audit of the state of old-age homes is long overdue, as is the service to disabled persons.

In conclusion, young people are extremely vulnerable when it comes to substance abuse. Increasingly, schools are reporting drug addiction in young learners. These days it is not uncommon for primary schools to report that their learners are addicted to hard drugs. We are pleased that the department has developed a policy framework on the prevention of substance abuse and on rehabilitation. These are the kinds of programmes in terms of which provinces will increasingly find their attention focused.

The select committee is pleased to support the Budget Vote of Social Development, Vote No 19. I thank you. [Applause.]

Mrs L JOHNSON (KwaZulu-Natal): Thank you, Chairperson. We have noticed with appreciation that, compared to the past, there is a steady increase in the national health budget. This year the increase stands at 4,8%. We have also noticed with even greater appreciation that KwaZulu-Natal is getting the attention that it deserves. It has the biggest health department in the country, with some of the biggest health problems. Some even call it the epicentre of the Aids epidemic. We are grateful for the attention that KwaZulu-Natal is getting. We are hopeful that we will quickly lose our unofficial status as the Cinderella province. Not only is the increase in the health budget evident at the national level, but this is generally also the trend in other provinces.

The slice that we are getting from the national department will enable us to implement and strengthen many of our programmes, particularly the primary health care programme. This programme has become the backbone of our health service delivery. We have recorded many successes in this area. Through the district health system approach, our department has continued to enhance the primary health care services, with special emphasis on the underserved areas of our province. This has been achieved through the provisioning of clinics and community health care centres which were required to improve the access of medical facilities, to those people living in the deep rural areas.

Funding has been directed from the higher level, from the more expensive service levels to the less expensive, but more important primary health care levels, thereby enhancing and enabling more people to access the available health care facilities. The steady progress made by the department in this respect is reflected in the growth of head counts at clinics and community health centres. This has increased from approximately 12,7 million in 1999-2000 to some 19,2 million patients in 2003- 2004. What this means is that the burden on hospitals is lessened, and this translates to shorter waiting times and better conditions for both the staff and patients.

Having said this, a lot of work still remains to be done. For example, the province will require 200 clinics and community health centres and over the current MTF, but we are confident that with the support of the national department, we are up to the challenge. We have made further strides in increasing access to our health services through our community health worker network, and also through the MSC outreach programme. We are reaching more people than before, and striking a balance between our primary health care and our curative services. The Inkosi Albert Luthuli Central Hospital is a testimony to this. This hospital has demonstrated that our department is capable of being a leader by breaking the frontiers of science and technology in order to enhance patient care and support. It is the first public-private partnership health project in South Africa, and is already proving to be a success and landmark. It has given hope to many people, and has shown that it is possible to get world-class state-of-the- art health care in a Government institution. It is the most fitting tribute to Inkosi Albert Luthuli, one of our country’s bravest sons. We are using a conditional grant from the national department to fund this facility. As a good training facility it is an asset, not only to the people of KwaZulu- Natal, but also to those in some parts of the Eastern Cape and, indeed, the whole country. Thank you [Applause.]

Ms H LAMOELA: Hon Chair, hon Ministers, hon members and guests, when you stand on the ground, you cannot see what shape the earth is, but if you were an astronaut in a spacecraft, you would be able to see that the earth is round. I am sure we do not want to be astronauts in spacecrafts to identify from the sky the problems facing our country, but we would rather like to believe what those on the ground predict. Therefore, hon Chair, I beg of you and the hon Minister Skweyiya to please consider my input on issues concerning child grants, foster care, disability grants and old age pensions, especially in rural areas.

Agb Voorsitter, die welsyn van al ons landsburgers is vir die DA van kardinale belang. Tot groot misnoë moes ek weer eens vind dat afsprake rakende mediese verslae vir aansoekers by plaaslike distriksgeneeshere reeds tot November 2004 vol bespreek is. Hierdie toedrag van sake is uiters kommerwekkend en veroorsaak eindelose ongerief en swaarkry vir die aansoekers. Baie van hierdie aansoekers sterf selfs voordat hulle `n toelaag ontvang. In sommige gevalle word toelae gekanselleer of oorbetalings geskied sonder kennisgewing. Heraansoeke veroorsaak eindelose probleme, soos lêers wat wegraak omdat alle kantore nog nie van rekenaars voorsien is nie.

Verdere implikasies is dat agterstallige gelde wat na maande uitbetaal word, groot bedrae van byna R15 000 op n keer beloop. Misbruik van hierdie geld vind op groot skaal plaas. Wetgewing bepaal dat toelae nie gebruik mag word om lenings by geldskieters aan te gaan nie, maar wel om mense uit hul armoede te help. Ongelukkig verval mense dieper in armoede weens die groot bedrae wat na maande uitbetaal word, omdat geldskieters uiteindelik die Regering se verantwoordelik maande lank moes dra. Meer doeltreffende wetgewing rondom betaalstelsels wat deeglik gemonitor of gekontroleer kan word, moet ingestel word. Korrupsie in die departement behoort dan ook tot n groot mate uitgeskakel te word.

Wat betref pleegouersorg en kinderondersteuningstoelae, maatskaplike werkers neem veels te lank om pleegouersorg af te handel. Uitgerekte, tydrowende prosedures word gevolg en uiteindelik neem selfs hierdie traumatiese proses maande om afgehandel te word. Maatskaplike werkers se geduld word hier tot die ergste graad getoets, en dit met soms baie beperkte middele tot hul en die betrokkenes se beskikking. In landelike gebiede word plase nie genoegsaam gedek nie, omdat areas groot is en `n beperkte aantal beamptes nie altyd toegang tot sommige plase kan bekom om sodoende geregtigheid aan betrokkenes te laat geskied nie.

Verlede jaar se instroming van bykans 48 000 persone uit ander provinsies na die Wes-Kaap oefen groot druk op die bestaande begroting vir welsyn uit, sowel as uitputting van amptenare wat sonder ekstra hulp groot werkladings moet hanteer. Miskien moet hier na bepaalde oplossings rondom instroming gekyk word wat kan verhoed dat die Wes-Kaap se begroting ernstig uitgeput word.

Die tydsduur vir goedkeuring van toelae moet verkort word. Implementering van wetgewing in provinsies moet gemonitor word om te verseker dat dienste in al die provinsies toeganklik en van gehalte is om sodoende te verseker dat instroming na bepaalde provinsies beperk word, want dit het `n uitwerking op hul begrotings.

Kindertoelae was n paar jaar gelede tot die ouderdom van 18 en selfs in sekere gevalle tot 21 jaar betaalbaar, sou kinders nog skoolgaan. [Tussenwerpsels.] Ek wil my verstout om te sê dat ons n kleiner persentasie werkloosheid ervaar het - en vir u aandag, ek is nie n witmens nie - en meer skoolgaande kinders gehad het. Ek herhaal, ek wil my verstout om te sê dat ons n kleiner persentasie werkloosheid ervaar het en meer skoolgaande kinders gehad het.

Kindermishandeling en misdaad het onlangs geweldig toegeneem en daar word dus n beroep gedoen om nou reeds te kyk na n verhoging van die ouderdomsgroep vir kindertoelae vanaf 16 tot 18 jaar vir alle bevolkingsgroepe sodat staatstoelaes voorkoming van vroeë skoolverlaters kan bewerkstellig. Noudat die speelveld van kinderondersteuningstoelae gelyk gemaak is, moet beter beplanning rondom toeganklikheid uitgewerk word. Daar moet spesifiek gekyk word na kinders wat aan die hoof van huishoudings staan wat, omdat hulle minderjarig is, geensins vir ondersteuningstoelae kwalifiseer nie.

Verdowingsmiddels is besig om ons jeug heeltemal te vernietig. Dit is duidelik n saak van dringendheid om die voorkoming van hierdie situasie aan te spreek. Wat van 'n twee-en-'n-halfdag werkswinkel van die Regering se kant, in samewerking met kerke, skole en gemeeskapsorganisasies om hierdie probleem aan te spreek? Hierdie moet as n uitroep van gemeenskappe aan die Regering gesien word sodat ons die jeug tot orde kan roep, voordat ons leiers van môre totaal vernietig is. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)

[Hon Chairperson, the wellbeing of all of our country’s citizens is of cardinal importance to the DA. To my dismay I once again had to find that appointments concerning medical reports of applicants at local district surgeons are already fully booked up to November 2004. This state of affairs gives great cause for concern and creates endless inconvenience and suffering for the applicants. Many of these applicants even die before they receive their grants. In certain cases grants are cancelled or overpayments take place without notification. Reapplications create endless problems, like files getting lost because not all offices have been provided with computers yet.

Further implications are that overdue fees that are paid out after months amount to large sums of almost R15 000 at a time. Misuse of these funds takes place on a grand scale. Legislation determines that grants may not be used to make loans with moneylenders, but in fact to help people out of their poverty. Unfortunately people fall even further into poverty because of the large amounts that are paid out after months, because moneylenders eventually had to carry Government’s responsibility for months. More effective legislation around payment systems that can be monitored or controlled properly must be introduced. Corruption in the department should also be eradicated to a great degree.

Regarding foster care and child support grants, social workers are taking far too long to conclude foster care. Drawn-out, time-consuming procedures are being followed and eventually even this traumatic process takes months to be concluded. Social workers’ patience is being tested to the highest degree, and this with often limited resources available to them and the people involved.

In rural areas farms are not sufficiently covered, because areas are too large and a limited number of officials cannot always obtain access to certain farms in order to do justice to the relevant parties.

Last year’s influx of around 48 000 people from other provinces into the Western Cape put a great deal of pressure on the existing budget for welfare, and exhausted officials who had to handle enormous workloads without any extra assistance. Maybe specific solutions should be looked at in this regard to prevent the Western Cape’s budget from being seriously exhausted.

The duration for the approval of grants must be shortened. Implementation of legislation must be monitored to ensure that services in all provinces are accessible and of quality in order to ensure that the influx to certain provinces is limited, because it affects their budgets.

A few years ago child grants were payable up to the age of 18 and even in certain cases up to 21 years, provided the children were still at school. [Interjections.] I want to make so bold as to say that we experienced a smaller percentage of unemployment - and for your attention, I am not a white person - and had more children attending school. I repeat, I want to make so bold as to say that we had a smaller percentage of unemployment and had more children attending school. Child abuse and crime have recently escalated tremendously and an appeal is being made now already to look at an increase in the age group for child grants from 16 years to 18 years for all population groups so that state grants could curb the early school leavers. Now that the playing field of child support grants have been made level, better planning around accessibility should be worked out. Specific attention should be paid to children who are heads of their households, and who, because they are underage, do not qualify for support grants at all.

Drugs are destroying our youth completely. Clearly it is a matter of urgency to address the prevention of this situation. What about a two and a half-day workshop by the Government, in co-operation with churches, schools and community organisations to address this problem? This should be seen as an outcry from communities to the Government so that we can call the youth to order, before our leaders of tomorrow are completely destroyed.] Prevention of drugs should not only become headlines during the month of June, but every minute of every day. One of the critical areas will be to enhance access by the youth to opportunities and poverty relief programmes, especially those that are focused on early childhood development, and home- and community-based care for those infected and affected by HIV/Aids. Registering disabled children and adults for social grants is a critical part of the overall strategy, for improving the lives of people with disabilities. Allow me to congratulate Minister Skweyiya when he said, “Our democracy will only have meaning if it takes care of the most vulnerable, including people with disabilities”. So often we tend to forget the difficulties they encounter day after day. We should lend a hand to ensure that people with disabilities have adequate access to services like social grants and job opportunities, and make sure that the stigma that still exists regarding disabilities is removed. The abuse of the elderly, especially pensioners, at pay points is of great concern. Kan die verskillende departemente miskien vir ons aandui watter projekte of strategieë in plek is om ons bejaardes met meer waardigheid en respek te hanteer en bedien? [Could the various departments possibly give us an indication of what projects or strategies are in place for dealing with and serving our elderly with more dignity and respect?]

What happened to the commission - and I speak under correction - that was appointed in 2000 or 2002 to look at challenges and opportunities facing the Department of Social Development? If we were to look critically at what the Government claims to have achieved, and if we were to face the serious problems that still remain, we would at least be aware that mere word and symbolic gestures are only a tiny step forward. However, I would like to take the opportunity of congratulating our Minister on the progress already made. Sustainable human development requires building the capacity of human beings, and providing opportunities for them to access resources for development.

The Democratic Alliance is committed to policies that provide the people of our country with the best possible health care because, along with the opportunities to work, protection of persons and property and access to quality education and health care are essential to the creation of a healthy society and country. Accordingly, I commend the Minister and the department on their achievements, particularly on increasing the immunisation coverage for all, eliminating death as a result of measles, the progress that has been made towards South Africa being declared polio- free and on the successful campaign against malaria. Well done, Minister!

The Government promised in November last year that 53 000 people would be receiving antiretroviral treatment by March this year. March came and went, and according to a response to a Parliamentary question asked, a total of only 3 667 people were receiving antiretrovirals. The greatest challenge which is facing the public health care sector today is the attraction, training and retention of skilled health care professionals. Should we be lucky enough to enjoy a perfect legislative framework, health care delivery on the ground is impossible without motivated committed and skilled people. One would hope that our Government does not implement the system purely for the sake of delivery, but would look at a unique system that could work for the better distribution of our services so that health care can be accessible to all citizens of our country. I thank you. [Applause]

Dr B GOQWANA (Eastern Cape): Chairperson, hon Ministers, members of the NCOP, delegates and colleagues, as a new old MEC, I want to thank our Minister for and congratulate her on the way in which we have been working for the past five years. It is indeed a privilege and an honour to address you on behalf of the department of health in the Eastern Cape. It is very fitting to scan the road that we have travelled during the past 10 years. Yet, I must be quick to say, though I am going to mention the things that we have achieved during the past 10 years, we have not yet reached our destination. There are definitely still many challenges ahead.

In the Eastern Cape we combined three administrations, which actually led to a situation where our administration was affected in a negative way with a lot of backlogs that we had to look into. However, for the first time in the past 10 years, the department of health in the Eastern Cape managed to get an unqualified audit report, which revealed to us that our financial management is actually very good, and that we managed to live within what we had been given - not that I want to say that everything was right, but what I’m saying is that we managed to stay within what we were given.

We have dealt head-on with the inequities in the province, and this we have achieved by actually building more than 153 clinics in areas where there have never been facilities before. This has changed the situation from where we had one facility per 100 000 people, to a situation where we have one facility per 10 000 people, which is according to the standard of the World Health Organisation. However, I must be quick to say that though we’ve got one facility per 10 000 people, we still have a problem, because most of the clinics are actually concentrated in urban areas. So, we still have a very big challenge in actually making sure that some facilities are moved out to rural areas.

We have been working on building clinics and getting into areas where we were not able to go to before, but according to our statistics it seems as if we are worse off than before. This is not because things are becoming worse, but because people who were not part of our statistics, are now coming forward and becoming part of our statistics. We think some things are definitely going to change after some time.

Probably, the analogy to this is that when a practitioner treats a patient with an amoebic liver abscess. The first week that one gives him or her laser treatment, the amoebic liver abscess becomes big; and as one continues to treat him or her, within a week, it then starts going down. So, if you’re somebody who does not have confidence in what you’re doing, you might think that things are getting worse when they’re actually getting better.

In the Eastern Cape we’ve tried to do away with the racially divided institutions and we’ve managed to put them together. A very good example is the PE complex where we have one complex, where whites and Africans go to the hospital nearest to where they live, and the services are given in a way that would satisfy the population, rather than satisfy certain racial groups. We’ve employed chief executive officers at our institutions. These people are not medical professionals. These people were appointed because they are able to manage those institutions, and that has actually borne some good fruits. We’ve done away with emergency services that were controlled by urban-based local authorities, and we have made it a provincial task to make sure that those ambulances belong to the province. Though it has its teething problems, we are actually doing well.

I’m sure you’re very much aware that Eastern Cape is one of the provinces that has experienced circumcision deaths since 1995, not that it has not happened before, but this ANC-led Government took note and has made sure that it is not going to happen again. It has been haunting us since 1995, but since we have had the Application of Health Standards in Traditional Circumcision Act, Act 6 of 2001, the statistics have started decreasing. It does not mean that we’re happy when one child dies, or when one child loses his manhood, but we are saying that the statistics have definitely decreased.

Still in the Eastern Cape, we’ve managed to control diseases that are related to poor sanitation and lack of water. We’ve managed to control them despite the fact that we still have many backlogs as far as these conditions are concerned. As has been mentioned before, the new Nelson Mandela Academic Hospital has been completed and has started functioning. We are only waiting for it to be officially opened. In Mount Frere there is a big hospital that is about to be completed, and that has been built by this Government. [Applause.] In Tsolo there is a hospital that is being improved. We are actually trying to revamp the old hospital that is there. There is no doubt that this would make the lives of our people, especially in the rural areas, far better than it was before.

Obviously, the more we manage our budget properly, the more it’s becoming clear that there is a bit of underfunding on what we are actually doing. We need to have some norms and standards as to how to fund this while looking at the institutional backlogs that we have in the Eastern Cape.

I must mention that our infant mortality rate in the Eastern Cape is still the highest in the country, but it’s not very difficult to understand why, because if one looks at the fertility in rural areas, it is actually higher. If you look at those rural areas, that’s where most of the kids are looked after by the mother only, where the father is actually working somewhere else, or is not even part of the family. Another factor is that we have extended families, where kids are born elsewhere and sent to the rural areas. These are some of the things that are actually haunting us. There is no doubt that these are the things that we are looking at.

The other challenge that we do have in the Eastern Cape is that we are a labour-reservoir province. By this I mean that when young men and women are contributing to the economy, they go and work in the richer provinces, and when they become inactive, they are sent back. I am being reminded that some of them are sitting here. [Laughter.] When they become sick and inactive they are sent back to the Eastern Cape, and we actually take on that burden of looking after them. Obviously, they would be using the public health facilities. [Laughter.] That’s why we are building so many hospitals in the Eastern Cape, and that’s the reason why I am quite happy with our Minister and the relationship that we’ve had.

However, we still have the problem of staff shortages but, as the Minister has said, there is going to be community service, even for nurses. We think this will go a very long way in assisting us, especially in those rural areas where nobody wants to go.

We need to look at interprovincial inequities. Laws should not just be made without regard to the rural character of our province, as it is the key to actually make sure that people are taken care of.

After revamping our clinics and rebuilding our hospitals, what has become very clear is that the quality of care that is given in those institutions is not up to standard. We have noticed it, and we are devising ways of making sure that it is going to be managed properly.

We still have a very big challenge regarding the stealing of drugs, but we do have strategies to make sure that that is going to be controlled. The fact that we have managed to move thus far, despite the rough road that we’ve travelled, means that even the challenges that I’ve mentioned are not going to be a problem for us. We will make sure that we sort them out. All that is needed is patience and an understanding of the direction into which we are trying to move. Thank you, Chair. [Applause.]

Mr F ADAMS: Hon Chairperson, hon Ministers, MECs, special delegates and hon members of the House, I want to congratulate the Ministers on their reappointments and the Deputy Ministers and MECs on their appointments, and also our chairperson of the select committee. I know that they will do well in their portfolios, and I wish them strength during their terms of office.

Min mense sal met my verskil wanneer ek sê dat goeie gesondheid ‘n mens se grootste bate is. Dis iets wat ons soos ‘n kleinood moet beskerm en vertroetel. Daar is natuurlik ook duisende mense wat nie die voorreg het om goeie gesondheid te geniet nie. Dit is veral vir hulle wat ‘n goeie en beskikbare gesondheidsdiens noodsaaklik is.

Mense vra hoekom ons dan so ‘n groot TB-probleem het. Dit is vandag blykbaar nog nie heeltemal duidelik nie, maar dis waarskynlik te wyte aan ‘n hele paar oorsake. Deel van die oplossing lê by die mense self. Dit blyk dat mense in Suid-Afrika om die een of ander onverklaarbare rede meer laks is om hulle as teringlyers aan te meld. Dit plaas ‘n geweldige las op die gesondheidsdiens, want hoe langer mense versuim om hulle siekte aan te meld, hoe meer mense word besmet. Nog ‘n probleem is dat teringlyers nie die herstelprogram van ses tot agt maande voltooi nie. Mense wat nie die kursus voltooi nie, hoofsaaklik omdat hulle al ná enkele maande beter voel, kan ‘n terugslag beleef en weer van vooraf die siekte versprei.

Dis ‘n onbenydenswaardige taak wat op die skouers van ons gesondheidsdiens rus en dis die plig van al ons mense in die land om meer teringbewus op te tree en hulle by die eerste tekens van moontlike tering by die naaste kliniek aan te meld. Ingeval mense nog huiwer, kan ek net sê dat tering behandelbaar is, dat die behandeling gratis is en dat dit maklik genees kan word indien mense hulle by die voorskrifte hou. As die tekens egter verontagsaam word, word dit soos ‘n veldbrand deur die teringlyer versprei, en gewoonlik onder die mense vir wie hy of sy die meeste omgee.

Ons almal weet dat armoede orals ‘n negatiewe invloed het, veral op die gebied van maatskaplike ontwikkeling. Alkohol maai die meeste onder ons arm mense, waar dit die grootste negatiewe invloed het. Daar is verskeie arm gebiede, insluitende informele nedersettings en plattelandse gebiede, waar veral seisoenwerkers ‘n bestaan probeer maak. Dit gaan nie net om die verbrokkeling van huisgesinne of die nog groter verarming van mense nie, maar veral oor die maatskaplike probleme wat dit skep. Baie van ons mense kry hierdie staatstoelae van die Regering, maar sodra hy of sy dit ontvang, gaan dit aan die smokkelaar of geldlener, en die kinders of familie ly daaronder.

Ek wil die Ministers en LUR’e vra om nie ook hierdie grootste uitdagings wat op antwoorde en oplossings wag te vergeet nie. Ordentlike voeding vir ons mense is noodsaaklik. Arm mense kan dit die minste bekostig om staatstoelaes aan drank en dwelms te bestee. (Translations of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)

[Few people will disagree with me when I say that good health is one’s greatest asset. It is something that which we should protect and pamper like a treasure. There are, of course, thousands of people who do not have the privilege of enjoying good health. It is for those, particularly, that a good and available health care service is necessary.

People ask why do we have such a big TB problem. It is apparently not all that clear today, but it could probably be attributed to quite a few causes. Part of the solution lies with the people themselves. It would appear that people in South Africa, for some or other inexplicable reason, are more negligent in declaring themselves as sufferers of tuberculosis. This places a tremendous strain on the health care service, because the longer people take to report their illness, the greater number people are infected. Another problem is that tuberculosis patients do not complete the recovery programme of six to eight months. People who do not complete the course, mostly because they feel better after a few months, could suffer a relapse and can spread the illness all over again.

It is the unenviable task that rests on the shoulders of our health care services and it the duty of all our people in the country to be more aware of tuberculosis, and to report to their nearest clinic at the first signs of possible tuberculosis. If people are still hesitant, then may I say that tuberculosis can be treated, that treatment is free and that it is easily cured if people keep to the prescriptions. If the signs are ignored, however, it spreads like wildfire throughout, and usually amongst the people for whom he or she cares the most.

We all know that poverty has a negative influence everywhere, particularly in the area of social development. Alcohol takes a heavy toll amongst our poor people, where it has the greatest negative influence. There are several poor areas including informal settlements and rural areas, where particularly the seasonal workers try to make a living. It is not only about the crumbling of families or the even greater impoverishment of people, but especially about the social problems that it creates. Many of our people receive these social grants from the Government, but as soon as he or she receives it, it goes to the merchant or moneylender, and the children or family suffer because of this.

I want to ask the Ministers and MECs not to forget these greatest challenges that await answers and solutions. Proper feeding of our people is essential. Poor people can least afford to spend their grants on drink and drugs.]

It is clear that the Ministers and MECs have a tough job to do and that they not only need our full support, but also the support of the public to deliver on the people’s contract for a better South Africa for all. I thank you. [Applause.]

Dr B T BUTHELEZI (KwaZulu-Natal): Chairperson, hon Ministers, Deputy Ministers, members of this honourable House, ladies and gentlemen, KwaZulu- Natal welcomes the implementation of the R500 million scarce skills allowance, which is aimed at retaining doctors and other scarce skills health professionals in the public sector, especially if this allowance can become a permanent part of a new salary package for health professionals.

The increment of 22% in the annual salaries of health professionals working in rural areas, as much as 37% more for those in deep rural areas, is a major step in the right direction, although it will not solve all problems overnight. However, certain groups of health workers are excluded from the scarce skills and rural allowances granted to public-sector employees. The department would do well to include more categories of professionals to benefit from these allowances and to clarify the position of professionals who fall in the senior management services group. This is because various provinces interpret the agreement with respect to the SMS group differently. For instance, Gauteng and the Western Cape have indicated that health professionals in the SMS category who perform clinical work will definitely receive scarce skills allowances.

The department, which is the biggest employer of health professionals, should address the new legislation disallowing public-sector health professionals from claiming tax rebates for registration fees, indemnity premiums and other subscriptions through negotiations with the SA Revenue Service and the Finance department.

According to the state of the world’s population report released in October 2003, neglect and underfunding of adolescents’ sexual and reproductive health needs are some of the problems perpetuating the spread of HIV/Aids, other STDs and early pregnancy. The report explores the underlying assumptions about HIV/Aids showing that youths who have lost parents owing to HIV/Aids, are themselves particularly vulnerable to infection. This is of particularly serious concern in KZN where most families are headed by children, and educational programmes, such as LoveLife, need some serious funding. This report also recommends that more money should be channelled into reproductive health programmes.

The department should also consider offering financial support for the national HIV/Aids database, such as the one that is being compiled by the Centre for HIV/Aids Networking at the University of KwaZulu-Natal and the Centre for Health Systems Research and Development at the University of the Free State. Once complete, this database will provide Government and donors with information on HIV/Aids-related activities in South Africa.

As the Minister said in her speech, the department should actively consider recruiting foreign qualified health professionals to fill the vacant posts, especially in rural areas such as those in KwaZulu-Natal. The department should also provide up-to-date information on the new pay progression incentive policy and a uniform performance measurement tool for use by all provinces.

We support the introduction of a new level of health care workers, which was agreed to on 8 January 2004 at the Minmec, with the aim of selecting the first students in September 2004 and enrolling them in 2005. The aims of the mid-level medical worker for South Africa are supported because young people from rural areas who completed matric will be recruited and trained to serve their communities.

We also welcome the efforts by the department to introduce telemedicine in hospitals, because this has proven to be an effective tool in attracting health professionals to rural areas such as Nkonjeni Hospital in KZN, where doctors can access academic teaching from such institutions as the King Edward VIII Hospital and Inkosi Albert Luthuli Central Hospital.

The department is doing a sterling job on the expanded programme on immunisation. Meeting the deadline for the declaration of South Africa being polio-free by 2005 will be an example of this achievement. However, the recent outbreak of polio in neighbouring Botswana should encourage us to be vigilant enough and support health care professionals who are at the forefront of the war on polio in terms of immunisation.

KwaZulu-Natal is proud to have put together a proposal for funding … [Time expired.] [Applause.]

Mr S T BELOT (Free State): Chairperson, Ministers of Health and Social Development, members of the National Council of Provinces, hon members, as we proudly celebrate 10 years of democracy and freedom, I am proud to announce that the Free State Health department has again taken great strides to improve access to quality health services, despite the challenge of rising health costs and increasing demands for health care.

Poverty, the lack of shelter, the lack of safer water, a lack of sanitation, poor nutrition and the lack of education expose our people to ill health. Unhealthy people cannot contribute to the economy. The role of the health system is to provide a better health status for the community, in fairness and with access to health services based on the people’s expectations. Health services are not just about curative services, but also about health promotion, prevention of ill health and rehabilitation.

Many positive advances have been made in health care in the province. I wish to share with this House that our people enjoy better access to health care than ever before. The achievements are as a result of thorough and proper planning by both the national and the provincial health departments. Allow me to share some of the achievements of the Department of Health, and let me remind the members that as we celebrate, the celebration of the 10 years are based on what we said to the people of South Africa 10 years ago. We said in our manifesto that we would promote safe motherhood and play a major role in caring for the nation’s children through programmes of immunisation, nutrition and free health care for children younger than five years. We also said we would introduce measures to make medicines more affordable. We also said we would direct major resources at combating TB, Aids and other sexually transmitted diseases, cancer and other plagues. We also committed that we would facilitate the integration of traditional health practice. After the 1994 elections, the national and the provincial departments did not hesitate to take up these challenges. The policy of primary health care was implemented, free health care for pregnant women and children under five was implemented, and we have seen that the first step towards accessible comprehensive primary health care services was also introduced. Free health care for all was available by July 1996.

The primary school nutrition programme was launched as a presidentially-led programme in 1994, with a total of R321 million spent in our province. The immunisation programme was expanded and changed to be in line with international trends. Immunisation campaigns were conducted annually to prevent mortality and morbidity due to preventable diseases. Through these interventions, we in the Free State province are now at the point of declaring the province polio free. Prevention campaigns to combat HIV/Aids were implemented. A new tuberculosis control programme was introduced. Bacteriological diagnosis of tuberculosis was introduced. The policy on the syndromic management of sexually transmitted infections was introduced and it resulted in lower rates of neonatal syphilis.

The province, in partnership with the Cancer Association of South Africa, implemented a mobile service to screen women for cervical and breast cancer. The province and the Department of Health commenced a process to organise traditional healers in the province.

In 1999, we committed ourselves to speed up the delivery of basic needs. We promised to develop a comprehensive, affordable and accessible national public health system. This will be financed in part by a social health insurance programme. We promised that the Government would improve health care by improving the availability of doctors and nurses, especially in clinics and the rural areas. We committed ourselves to ensuring availability of affordable medicines in line with our national drug policy. We agreed to improve the management of hospitals and clinics with community participation. We said we would act decisively to attack preventable illnesses through, among others, our immunisation programmes and measures to combat TB and develop campaigns against drug, tobacco and alcohol abuse. In partnership with all sectors of society, we said that Government would continue to give absolute priority to HIV/Aids programmes by increased efforts to mobilise popular awareness of the seriousness of the epidemic.

The province has achieved these objectives. The department has increased the number of doctors and health professionals, especially in rural areas by expanding the Cuban doctors’ programme and implementing a one-year community service programme for doctors and dentists, which was extended to 10 professional occupational groups.

The province spent R4,6 million for the first phase of implementing salary parity for primary health care workers employed by local government, to encourage them to stay in small towns and in rural areas. A rural allowance and a scarce skill allowance to recruit and retain health professionals were introduced in July 2003 at a cost of about R18 million. We have improved the availability of medicines by introducing the essential drug list, training primary health care nurses in drug supply management, training pharmacy assistants and outsourcing the distribution of medicines. Hospital management was improved by the implementation of the Provincial Hospital Act, resulting in the appointment of chief executive officers and the establishment of hospital boards. The hospitals were grouped into complexes and those that required focused attention, such as the Mofumahadi, Mmanapo, Mopedi and Katle hospitals in Qwaqwa, successfully underwent organisational performance improvement interventions.

The integrated management of childhood illnesses was implemented. The immunisation coverage increased to 78% last year. Through the implementation of the Dot-system, the new senior positive TB cure rate doubled to more than 70% last year. The department established the alcohol and drug abuse research and prevention centre to combat the abuse of alcohol and drugs. Educators and high school learners were provided with training on the combat of alcohol and drug abuse.

I wish to share with this House that the Free State province has again met all the commitments it made. I need to share just a few of these: we in the province aim to reduce the death of women during pregnancy and childbirth, because these deaths can largely be avoided. The confidential enquiry into maternal deaths and the notification of any death of a woman during pregnancy and childbirth were made compulsory. Treatment guidelines were developed and implemented to deal with the common causes of maternal deaths, as reported in the saving mother’s report. Studies were conducted on the causes of deaths of pregnant women while under anaesthesia. The availability of emergency drugs and blood was improved. Additional equipment has been procured, and medical officers are being trained in the provision of spinal anaesthesia.

The 150 reported maternal deaths in 2003 are higher than the 107 reported in 2002. This is due to better reporting of such deaths, and the impact of the HIV/Aids pandemic. With regard to infrastructure … Thank you, Chairperson. We support the Budget Vote. [Applause.]

Mr M A SULLIMAN: Chairperson, hon Ministers, Deputy Ministers, MECs present here today, the ANC has been concerned for quite some time about the widespread implications of HIV/Aids pandemic. In fact, on the occasion of the 50th National Conference in Mafikeng in 1997, we as an organisation felt compelled to formulate and adopt a strongly worded resolution on the pandemic. We noted, for example, that over 2 million people in South Africa were HIV-positive; that it constituted about 10% of HIV infections in sub- Saharan Africa; that HIV/Aids is linked to the socioeconomic status of our communities, in particular poverty, the lack of decent housing and unemployment, and that secrecy, ignorance and myths about the disease contribute to its spread.

At the time the ANC was also concerned that the Aids epidemic would massively impact on our economy, and would impact socially with more orphans and loss of breadwinners - and on the health services. We resolved then, amongst other things, that the ANC at all levels would support the efforts and programmes of Government for the prevention of the spread of the disease. Particularly in the life skills training programme aimed at schools, the ANC will design and lead a programme on Aids awareness, which includes spreading correct information about the disease, training of counsellors, helping to overcome the stigma associated with the disease, work against the stigmatation and discrimination of people with HIV/Aids in all spheres of life and support the Cabinet decision on notifying partners and family, as well as the anonymous notification of HIV-positive status for statistical and planning purposes.

In 2002, at our 51st Conference, we again passed a resolution, essentially confirming our 1997 resolutions, and adding the need to strengthen and accelerate the implementation of the national Aids strategy, as amplified in the Cabinet statement of 17 April 2002. We emphasised again the need to root out discrimination and stigmatation, but we did not limit it to those who were infected, but incorporated those who were affected, Our resolution took on board the value of psychosocial support, providing essential medical care, providing support to families caring for people living with Aids, as well as orphans and developing effective workplace programmes.

The role of the community was not neglected in that we built in the need to develop community capacity to respond to the pandemic through home-based care initiatives and by strengthening broad antipoverty and community development programmes. The Department of Health, through the Medicines and Related Substances Control Act, has been attempting to bring down the prices of medicines, especially the vital antiretrovirals needed to assist in the control of HIV/Aids. This transformative legislation unfortunately caused large pharmaceutical organisations to fight very expensive legal battles with the department in an attempt to preserve the patent rights to medication and, in turn, to maintain their profits to the detriment of the health of the HIV/Aids sufferers.

The most recent attempts by Government to control the exit price of medicines through regulations in terms of sections 22(g) of the Medicines and Related Substances Act have met with a similar outcry as a parallel importation debate. An amount of R4,4 million was allocated to the new pharmaceutical functions contained in the implementation of the comprehensive HIV/Aids care management and treatment operational plan.

In the meanwhile the research to find a cure to Aids continues to require funding in the race against time for those infected and already dying from the syndrome. The SA Medical Research Council is currently conducting a number of leading vaccine development research programmes together with international partners. An amount of R9,6 million will be set aside to upgrade the building of the medical bureau for occupational diseases. More indirectly there has been a host of challenges from those who believe that the department is not doing anything or taking too long to deliver on Aids drugs, treatment and care. The most dramatic of this has been the intense debate in the media about the root cause of HIV/Aids, with all political parties and interested groups getting on the bandwagon of what to do, where to do it and how fast to do it.

In our robust South Africa political system, even bad press is good because it serves to bring the serious issue of a killer disease to the forefront of people’s minds and forces them to face the pandemic head-on, rather than hidden in the back closets in the privacy of people homes.

The ANC is particularly impressed with the roll-out of the antiretroviral treatment at public facilities because it significantly extends the Government’s HIV/Aids prevention, treatment and care programme. Strategies in the comprehensive progress include mother to child prevention programmes. In view of our own belief in the importance of removing the stigma of HIV/Aids, the ANC applauds the fact that voluntary counselling and testing is available at approximately 2 000 sites across all provinces. Needless to say, the department is to be commended for its increased allocation to the fund to implement the comprehensive HIV/Aids care management and treatment operational plan. In the 2004-2005 Budget an allocation of R300 million will be given to the provinces through a conditional grant and will increase to R600 million in the year 2005-2006 and to R1 billion in 2006-2007.

We believe that as the ruling party we are still on track to ensure that the framework outlined in our conference resolutions are implement by Government. Other Government departments, such as the Department of Public Service and Administration employing about 1,1 million public servants, initiated the impact and action project in January 2000 as a comprehensive plan to manage HIV/Aids in the Public Service and had at least three indabas since then. Similarly, the Department of Transport has had an HIV/Aids programme on the transport sector, discussing issues such as risk behaviour of truckers and the regularity of condom usage, among other things.

The ANC is not prepared to take a back seat in the face of the HIV/Aids pandemic. We believe in everyone getting involved in solving this problem. We support the Minister of Health and the Minister of Social Development in their initiatives to bring relief to the people suffering from this pandemic. I thank you, Chairperson. [Applause.]

Ms S E LUCAS (Northern Cape): Dankie, agb Voorsitter, agb Ministers en Adjunkministers hier teenwoordig, agb LUR’e, lede van die Nasionale Raad van Provinsies, dames en here … [Thank you, hon Chairperson, hon Ministers and Deputy Ministers present hre, hon MECs, members of the National Council of Provinces, ladies and gentlemen …] it is indeed an honour to participate in the debate on social development and to present this House with the developments that are taking place in this critical sector in the Northern Cape province. However, before I begin, I have to acknowledge the role our national Minister and his department are playing in alleviating the burden of poverty in poor and disadvantaged communities.

This Government has, over the past decade, taken steps to bring equity to the social security system to ensure that our officials and other partners serve our people with dignity and respect. The Northern Cape is the largest province and it has a thinly-spread population of 822 000 inhabitants. This scenario makes service delivery extremely costly and challenges Government continuously to strengthen its commitment to bring services to the people.

The economy of the province is largely based on mining and agricultural activities. A large portion of our population depends on Government to provide services such as health care, social services, basic services and other related social services. This has, over the past decade, put a huge strain on the services of government and its budget - which is the smallest of all the nine provinces. Social delivery has, for the past decade, been a priority of this Government, and R20 billion has been spent on this sector since 1994 and up to 2003.

The department of social services and population development has made a policy shift since 1994 in making services more available, as mentioned earlier. To this end, we moved away from just providing curative services to also providing developmental services. Forty district offices and 20 satellite offices were established to realise this aim. Through partnership with Transnet, we were able to establish three more sites, which brings the total to 23 satellite offices. Communities like Delportshoop, Brandvlei and Phuthanang will now have access to services, thanks to the efforts of Transnet and our national Minister.

The department, through other strategic partnerships, has obtained various benefits for the poor and the vulnerable. Eskom has donated food to the needy and, as already mentioned, Transnet donated containers worth R7 million to be used, not only as offices, but also as drop-in centres in the whole of the Sol Plaatjie municipal area. We are also engaged in partnerships with Correctional Services. They are supplying the drop-in centres with vegetables and raised R15 000 for poverty alleviation, which they donated to the department.

The twinning agreement with the Swedish government to exchange best- practice models for residential care is progressing well. These include information management systems, therapeutic and specialised programmes. Over the next five years, we need to address some of the new challenges that have emerged in our society. Some of these relate to income security whilst others relate to the wellbeing of families and the individual in society.

Over the next decade, we will work together with our partners in the social sector in repairing the social sector of our society. Together with the moral regeneration movement, we will promote basic moral values among all our inhabitants in the province. We must remember that moral values are embedded in society by family values. The department will thus focus on rebuilding the family and will ensure that rebuilding the lives of the youth and vulnerable families is a priority.

As part of this commitment, the province will also oversee the establishment of an in-patient treatment facility for substance abuse. We all know that the Northern Cape faces serious challenges in terms of alcohol and substance abuse, and also child abuse and interpersonal violence. The 10-point plan of the department will be the policy paradigm within which all programmes will be implemented. The rebuilding of family, community and social relations can only occur when children are nurtured in a wholesome environment and are taught norms and values by the community and family in which they live.

The family is a place where the rights of the child are given focus and content, after all. Today, the opposite is happening - families are disintegrating. This year we are celebrating the International Year of the Family. A provincial summit will be held to develop a long-term strategy for families in collaboration with the Moral Regeneration Movement, in order to ensure that we embark on specific programmes to achieve our objectives.

This year, also, the department will embark on a roll-out of community- based child protection programmes for which R22 million has been allocated. Family preservation and parental guidance will also be implemented. For the first time we will be embarking on parental guidance programmes, especially reaching out to younger parents. Fifteen more early childhood development centres will be established to add to the already 164 funded centres. The province is also increasing the subsidy to daycare centres, as well as services centres.

In terms of an integrated poverty eradication strategy, we all know that that is dependent on an integrated economic development strategy. We have to ensure that our people become self-sustainable. Poverty alleviation is a short-term strategy. Our poverty eradication strategy is integrated and comprehensive. It allows for the establishment of drop-in centres, food emergency schemes and economic empowerment programmes. Forty-one drop-in centres have been established so far and 25 new ones will be established in this financial year. The establishment of a comprehensive security system must reduce the dependency on noncontributory cash payments. We welcome the fact that the compliance unit has been established in the national department to deal with high levels of fraud. The province will be implementing its own fraud- prevention plan that will see the removal of undeserving beneficiaries from the system. Not only will this result in efficiency gains, but it will also make more money available.

Violence against women and children, older persons and other vulnerable groups is another priority for this government. The department needs to strengthen its intervention capacity, and will appoint probation officers for the implementation of probation services, crime prevention, diversion and home-based supervision programmes for which R9 million has been budgeted. A multipurpose centre for the elderly will be established at the Resthaven Centre in Kimberley. [Applause.]

Mrs J N VILAKAZI: Chairperson, hon Ministers, hon members, may I join other colleagues in congratulating our Ministers. The HIV/Aids pandemic continues to be the defining factor in the Health budget. Whilst one is pleased that, finally, ARV medication is beginning to be rolled out, we would wish such roll-out to take place at a far more urgent rate than it is proceeding at present. We have a huge task in this regard, but failure to act with maximum effect today will increase costs in future, and will result in unnecessary loss of lives.

We need to address the issue of nurses who leave the country in droves to take up more lucrative opportunities in other countries. We cannot continue to train nurses only to have them leave us once they are trained. We need to look at the packages offered to them, and also the decision that requires nurses to complete a year of compulsory community service. Whether this may hasten the departure of some nurses or not, we certainly need them in the community.

We are pleased that new urban hospitals are being built, such as Inkosi Albert Luthuli Hospital in Durban, KwaZulu-Natal. We must, however, express concern around the task of progress made in building more rural hospitals and in equipping those already in existence, which, in many cases, are in a state of poor maintenance. In this regard, we also need to be aware of cross-border use of hospitals. In KwaZulu-Natal, many people from other neighbouring provinces, and even neighbouring states such as Swaziland and Mozambique, use our health facilities. Funds allocated to these provinces need to take this into account.

Engikubona ezibhedlela nasemtholampilo ngakithi, KwaZulu-Natal, ikakhulu ezabelweni, ukuthi umthwalo osemkhulu lapha ngowokwanelisa izidingo zomphakathi. Izibhedlela ezikhona zigcwele ziyaphuphuma, kwazeke phela izifo azizibekile phansi kanti nomaShayabhuqe nawo usemi ngenhla. Odokotela nabahlengikazi bayawela ngesikhulu isivinini kuthi labo abasele basebenze kanzima. Akusimangalisi kakhulu uma sizwa amaphutha enzekayo kwezinye izibhedlela, indlela abasebenza ngayo inengcindezi.

Isabiwomali somnyango sibhekene nesimo lapho kudinga kuvinjwe ukuhamba kodokotela nabahlengikazi. Ezabelweni azande izibhedlela ngoba abantu bahamba amabanga amade kabi uma beya emtholampilo. Kangakanani-ke sekuthiwa abaye esibhedlela, lezi ezitholakala kanzima kubantu abasuka ezabelweni - ngikhuluma ngezabelo ngempela. UMnyango wezeMpilo udinga isabelo esithe xaxa. Egameni le IFP, siyavumelana nesabiwomali esethulwe umnyango njengamanje - uMnyango wezeMpilo.

UMnyango wezokuThuthukiswa koMphakathi usabhekene nobunzima bokunika wonke umntwana odinga imali yesondlo imali. Inkinga enkulu ibhekene nogogo abashiywa nezingane kungekho sicucu esikhombisa ukuzalwa kwayo. Le nkinga yenzeka ngokweswela amahhovisi oMnyango wezaseKhaya eduze noquqaba emakhaya ukuze izitifiketi ezidingwa abezenhlalakahle zitholakale kalula. Sikubikile- ke lokhu kuNgqongqoshe wezaseKhaya. Siyethemba-ke ukuthi isimo sizoya ngokuya siba ngcono.

Kanjalo futhi nemali kadekle isaphuza ukutholakala. Asazi ukuthi uma umuntu esebhalisile kodwa angaholi, kuze kuphele unyaka kwabanye, kusuke kubambeni ngempela. Emakhaya kuba khona inkinga uma izulu lina. Imigwaqo ayihambeki ngenxa yodaka. Kuthi-ke abahola impesheni nemali kadekle bangaholi ngaleso sizathu. Yinkinga-ke le ephathelene nezemigwaqo.

Enye inkinga yalabo abahola lo dekle ukuthi abathandisisi ukuhola ebhange noma eposini. Egameni le-IFP, siyasesekela isabiwomali. [Kwaphela isikhathi.] [Ihlombe.] (Translation of isiZulu paragraphs follows.)

[Hon Chairperson, what I see in hospitals and clinics in my area, KwaZulu- Natal, especially in rural areas, is that there’s still a lot to be done in terms of fulfilling the needs of the community. The existing hospitals are overcrowded, given the fact that diseases are rife, and also the destroyer (HIV/Aids) is not taking a back seat. Doctors and nurses are emigrating at an alarming rate, and those left behind are working very hard. We are not surprised at all if mistakes happen in some of these hospitals because of the pressure doctors and nurses are working under.

The budget faces a situation whereby there is a need to stop the emigration of doctors and nurses. Hospitals should be increased in rural areas because people experience problems when they go to these clinics. How much more if they have to go these hospitals, which are difficult to access, particularly to the people who come from rural areas - I’m talking about the real rural areas. The Department of Health needs to increase the budget. In the name of the IFP, we support this budget the department has presented - the Department of Health.

The Department of Social Services is still facing the difficulty of providing money to all children who need the child support grant. The big problem is with grandmothers who are left with these children without papers that prove children’s births. This problem is caused by the nonexistence of Home Affairs offices nearer to the majority of people in rural areas, so that certificates that are needed by the social services are obtainable more easily. We reported this to the Minister of Home Affairs and we hope the situation will improve.

At the same time, the social grant takes long to be accessed. We do not know what is the hold-up for a person who has already registered, but who is not getting his/her grant for almost a year. There is a problem in rural areas when it is raining; roads are slippery. It is impossible to drive there because of the mud, and as a result people end up not getting their grants. This is the transport department’s problem though. Another problem is that those who get social grants do not like to get paid through the bank or the post office. In the name of IFP, we support the budget.] [Time expired.] [Applause.]]

Ms N MOERANE-MAMASE (Eastern Cape): Hon Chair, hon Ministers, hon Deputy Ministers, hon MECs from different provinces, hon members and senior members of staff, good afternoon.

I rise to support the Social Development budget, but I am going to confine myself to the social grants administration in the Eastern Cape. People align the Eastern Cape with maladministration of social grants, because they see ugly pictures in both the printed and electronic media. I need to give hon members some background information on the actual reasons that led to these problems in the Eastern Cape and the manner in which we disperse funds that are allocated to us.

First of all, the Ministry in the Eastern Cape was historically separated from the Department of Welfare. We were just a vote within them. We were left without any financial and human resources, and this affected the process of grant administration. This was further strengthened by the fact that in 1996 there was a declaration that a social security agency was going to be established. It was declared in 1996 that this was going to take place in the next financial year. This exacerbated the problem, because there were no staff members employed in the Eastern Cape. Because of this, the administration has had problems.

During the past year, R7,3 billion was allocated to us. Out of this, R6,9 billion was allocated for the administration of grants. The rest, which was R400 million, was for administration. We spent all those funds, because we embarked on different campaigns to ensure that there was access to social grants in the Eastern Cape. We were complying with the call by the national Government that there needed to be access to social grants. In accordance with that call we established seven districts, and in 24 towns of the Eastern Cape we established area offices. We further ensured that there was access, even in rural areas. We have about 96 offices in the province to ensure that grants are accessible.

Furthermore, we realised that we were facing enormous problems. Amongst these was the problem of people who did not possess valid identity documents to enable them to access social grants. Hence we ended up with a deficit, because those people were never provided for in terms of the budget of R500 million.

The past year has been an eventful but rewarding one. The most significant process that the Department embarked on was the formulation and implementation of a turn-around strategy for the department to deal with certain recurring service delivery problems. The plan sought to stabilise the department, to turn it around and to support the change process. With that turn-around process we achieved milestones. Amongst those are improvements to the social grant administration itself. We established a social grants task team and through that we ensured that we expanded the social security safety network through the expanded child support grants scheme, in accordance with the targets set by the national department. We ensured that there was management of the payment contractors in order to improve payments at paypoints. We also established a helpdesk at paypoints where the beneficiaries could make enquiries regarding where they should collect their grants. There has been a tremendous improvement with the introduction of these facilities. The beneficiaries now know where they can collect their grants.

We also ensured the implementation of internal controls to prevent fraud and corruption through the establishment of an electronic filing and management system. With that we managed to capture about 1,8 million files. It is easy to access information wherever one is in terms of our offices.

There were clear service delivery outputs that we realised as a department. In March of this financial year we had enrolled about 1,77 million beneficiaries, but unfortunately they now stand at 1,2 million. The reason for this decline is that most of those people, as the MEC of Health has elaborated, have been working in other provinces. Because we are a labour reservoir, people seek work in other provinces, mainly in the Western Cape and Gauteng. When they return they sometimes are not well. All of these people have since passed away. As I address this House, we are left with 1,2 million beneficiaries.

We have problems with regard to some types of grants. Among these are disability grants, care dependency grants, foster care grants and child support grants. We are increasingly inheriting child-headed families because of the scourge of HIV. We have, therefore, increased the child support grant extension campaigns, and we have ensured the introduction of the management information system. We have ensured that all our offices in the six centres use this type of system. We did not end there.

We also ensured that there is customer care. As a result we have ensured that our officers access formal training through the various institutions. We have sent 44 officers to receive formal training at RAU. Hundred and fifty officers were trained to operate the system of grant administration. We also wanted to ensure that other people are able to interpret the legislation and treat our customers with care in line with the Batho Pele principles, so 130 officers were trained and 40 were trained in the registry function which is done electronically.

As we speak, we have been allocated a budget of R8,6 billion in this financial year. The biggest portion of that is for the extension of child support grants for children from 9 to 11 years. R902 million is meant to capture all the children between the ages 9 and 11. With that the Eastern Cape government is trying to ensure that we eradicate illiteracy in our province. We have embarked on a back-to-school campaign and enrolled all those children at schools. We have moved from school to school, talking about these grants to ensure that we eradicate the fraud. We have discovered that some parents exchange children. For example, five parents would “own” one child for the purpose of accessing child grants. We are trying to eradicate all of this. There are a number of challenges besides the administration of the grant system, and we are making significant progress.

Some challenges are due to the unacceptable levels of poverty, HIV and Aids itself, and the new challenge of child-headed households and orphans who need to be taken care of. We need to establish closer partnerships with all sectors of society to work together in a more integrated and co-ordinated manner. We have a lot of challenges in the form of other national departments, such as the Department of Home Affairs. In my own province there is little co-operation from this department, except if, as a department, we coerce them to co-operate. Hopefully the Minister of Social Development is going to encourage them to co-operate in this regard, especially with regard to the provision of the turn-around of identity documents.

There are still people who are in possession of what we call the old Transkei identity documents. We call them double nine double nine. These identity documents encourage fraudulent activities, because people can use them to access grants at various paypoints. We still have this problem that is not of our own making. We do not have access to other Government agencies, such as the SA Revenue Services. We know there are people who are earning money in the form of private companies. There is no way we can get this information. We are faced with these particular challenges. We therefore call on national Government to assist us concerning this matter.

As I have elaborated, as a department we are trying to fight fraud and corruption, especially with regard to the child support grants and disability grants. This is one source that people prey on because of the high levels of unemployment. However, as a department, we are trying to improve customer relations to enhance the dignity of all our people. As a result of that, we have resorted to constructing about 20 paypoints in this financial year to ensure that people are paid under decent circumstances. They should not be exposed to bad weather conditions. We welcome the advent of the social security agency, but we realise that there will be challenges, as we had to face initially, with the separation from the department of health with regard to the distribution of resources. I hope this is not going to adversely affect the provinces.

As a department we have established an inspectorate unit that focuses on the management of risks, fraud and corruption in social security grants administration. Despite all the critical challenges that I have mentioned, we have managed to recover a lot of monies on our own as a department, without the assistance of the private sector or consultants. We are in the process of recovering a lot of monies. We are also venturing into areas that in the past we would never have ventured into. We are now challenging our professionals, such as our doctors and lawyers. We are in the process of recovering a lot of money that has been defrauded by these various professionals.

With these words we support the Budget Vote of the Department of Social Development. Thank you. [Time expired.] [Applause.]

Rev E ADOLPH: Hon Chairperson, Ministers and members of this House, I would like to congratulate the Minister of Health on her reappointment to this very important portfolio. It is evident that the President and his Cabinet have confidence in you, your director and your Ministry for delivering a health service that is so much needed in this country.

As the ID, we welcome and support the provision of affordable medication by reducing prices, but also by delivering a quality service by dispensing medication to the poorest of the poor.

Coming to the issue of affordability, we are concerned about the affordability of anti-retrovirals to the most needy victims of HIV and Aids. We are very mindful of the complexity of the HIV and Aids. It is a difficult disease to combat and to deal with, and therefore needs a comprehensive and holistic plan and approach.

I’d like to challenge each and every South African at this point in time, black or white, it doesn’t matter, to declare war on HIV and Aids by becoming involved. We are all victims of HIV and Aids because the future of our country is at stake. I think you will agree with me that this disease, this pandemic, has killed more people on the African continent than the Second World War. Therefore, it is time for us to take responsibility, as South Africans, in the spirit of Ubuntu.

We care and we share the tribulations of our people. We have to implement the prevention strategy and to promote health. It is time that we stopped blaming Government. You cannot blame Government if you contract HIV and Aids by recklessly involving yourself in sexual intercourse, and that type of thing. It is time that we stopped blaming the Government and went back to basics.

We as a community, as parents, should teach our children to refrain from unhealthy sexual behaviour and teach them the right and healthy way. If one is infected with HIV and Aids, Madam Chair, one should not receive medication only, because as important as medication and anti-retrovirals are, so is a healthy diet that will sustain one’s health. Therefore we call on each and every South African to assist us in our battle against this pandemic.

Furthermore, we want to raise our concern at the restrictions imposed on traditional healers. It is about time that they were also incorporated in the world or formal system of medication, to be recognised for the role they play, the practices and the products they present to our people, in our effort to heal the nation as a whole.

We are also concerned about the medical aid schemes that are just escalating their fees, because our people cannot afford medication anymore. We are very glad and we are grateful to the department for, at least, promising us that there will be a psychiatric hospital in each and every province of the country. To come back to the basics …

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Hon member, I’m afraid your time has expired.

Rev E ADOLPH: Thank you. We support. [Applause.]

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF HEALTH: Madam Chairperson, hon Ministers, Deputy Minister, MECs, hon members, I rise to support the Budget Vote of the Minister of Health. I want to say here that I’m very delighted to join the health team. I want to do my best to support the programmes of the department. Policies are in place, all that is required of us is to accelerate delivery. The vision of the Department of Health is to create a caring and humane society in which all South Africans have access to affordable and good quality health care. This vision can be realised only if all of us roll up our sleeves and get down to work in the spirit of a people’s contract for health care delivery.

Health is a key Ministry in the Government’s commitment to achieving human security, equity and dignity for all. It is a key indicator of success and failure as a nation.

In his state of the nation address in May, President Mbeki outlined the Government’s priorities for this year. Many of these, though not the responsibility of the Department of Health, affect the health of the nation. These include the elimination of poverty and unemployment; the provision of basic services such as water, sanitation and electricity; and the provision of social services and housing.

More than 80% of our people depend on the public health sector. This means that Government has a major responsibility to provide stewardship of the health system and deliver quality health care. When a person is ill, hon members, regardless of their economic status, they hope for the best health care. Much progress has been made to improve the quality of care at all levels of the health system.

As the Minister has indicated, we have built over 1 300 clinics in our effort to bring health care services closer to our people. The expansion of facilities and the free primary health care policy have increased the number of visits per person to our primary health care facilities. This has increased the pressure on our health personnel.

The clinical services in rural areas are provided almost entirely by nurses. Some of the major problems include high vacancy rates, high absenteeism, high turnover of staff, ageing staff and the increasing demands of new policies. Many people do an amazing job with the resources available, but morale is generally not good.

I want to use this opportunity to express appreciation for the work done by our frontline health workers. I will be working closely with the national deputy director-general for human resources, our provincial and local government, as well as civil society to ensure that these issues are addressed, especially in the underserved areas.

Our ability to reach every household depends on community mobilisation. Community health workers, Dots and HIV and Aids community-based care workers provide an invaluable service. We will be paying much attention this year to such issues as stipends, training, supervision and career guidance. We will ensure that the support services required for good clinical care are stepped up.

Issues of management, infrastructure, transport, communication, electricity and roads will be addressed through the social cluster and under the hospital revitalisation programme. Imagine the nature of the work of a nurse who works in a rural clinic where the telephones don’t work, or where there is no electricity and no running water. Imagine how much better such a nurse would feel about her job if she was in a position to send an e-mail to order her supplies or to reach a tele-medicines service.

President Mbeki shared a story once of a village in the Eastern Cape which was transformed almost overnight through the installation of electricity and computers. Suddenly the community nurse could send a digital image of the cases on which she needed help with diagnosis and treatment advice.

Chairperson, we must deal with the issue of the differences in conditions of service and salaries for health care personnel paid between different municipalities and between municipalities and provinces, as well as the differences between the community health workers and the new community development workers. These differences contribute to fragmentation, inefficiency and, above all, inequity.

A nurse employed in a rural local municipality earns much less for the same level of responsibility compared to her counterparts in a metropolitan municipality. A nursing supervisor responsible for five clinics and fifty staff in a city can visit every clinic every morning and still have time to do other things. By contrast, a nursing supervisor responsible for five clinics and only 25 staff in a rural area spends hours travelling over bad roads to visit clinics. This is one of the major reasons provinces have to remain, for now, the major employers of primary health care staff.

Minister Geraldine Fraser-Moleketi’s department is working on a framework for a single Public Service. There will be some tough negotiations to ensure that it is easy for people to move between posts in national, provincial and local government. I look forward to seeing a draft framework in 2005 and legislation in 2006. We intend to show that we care for all our frontline health workers, and particularly for those with the most difficult jobs. As we care better for our health care providers, we know that they will feel better about themselves and will give better care to our people.

The Patients’ Rights Charter, which was launched by the Minister of Health in November 1999, and which clearly outlines the rights of patients and the complaints mechanism, enhances the delivery of quality health care services. In 2001, a national policy on quality was launched and all provinces now have their own policies and have established quality assurance units. The Kimberley hospital complex has won the Premier’s Gold Award for service excellence for two consecutive years. Twenty-three hospitals in the North West province were enrolled into an external accreditation system that uses international norms as a benchmark. I hope to work closely with members of this House, provincial legislatures and municipalities to ensure that these policies result in the delivery of quality health care.

A year ago, hon members, we passed the Mental Health Care Act. The regulations will be published this year. This progressive law takes mental health services out of the rigid custodial care. Suicide, homicide, child and spouse abuse are on the increase. We know that often these problems are precipitated by stress, unemployment, drug and alcohol abuse, and other mental health problems. We will strengthen mental health and social services to ensure that we see visible declines in the next five years. The social cluster of directors-general must develop comprehensive interventions and I pledge to play a leading role in support of activities to address these issues.

On 1 July this year, environmental health care services will become a core function of metropolitan and district municipalities. In addition, primary health care will form the core function of provinces. Provinces may delegate this function to municipalities by agreement and with the necessary resources. This new decision, which clarifies powers and functions, will result in clear role definition and will result in a single health authority for each health district, thus eliminating duplication and fragmentation of service delivery. We are convinced that this decision will strengthen the role of developmental local government in the delivery of basic services and that the health of our citizens will improve as a result.

Tackling these issues, hon members, requires new approaches and new thinking. Social mobilisation is a very important element of our national strategy for accelerating delivery of health care. My first public event as Deputy Minister of Health saw me launch a public-private partnership in Standerton, Mpumalanga, on World Candlelight Memorial Day, to honour and remember the loved ones we have lost to Aids. Organised through the Khomanani programme, this event demonstrated the amount of goodwill in our communities and their willingness to join national campaigns.

Once the National Health Bill comes into effect, we will have a more coherent legal framework for the establishment and functioning of clinic and district health committees and hospital boards. Through these committees, communities will play a direct role in making sure that health care workers are putting people first. We expect the youth to play an active part in these structures to ensure that health services are youth- friendly.

I urge you, members of this House, to get the lists of hospitals and clinics in your constituencies and make a point of visiting them. Ask to review the minutes of meetings of clinic committees and hospital boards. Mobilise communities to take pride in these services, and to protect the personnel and to work with management to ensure that the staff respects the users of the services. It is only by combining our efforts that we will strengthen service delivery.

In conclusion, hon members, I wish to pledge that as a member of the health team, I will work closely with other departments in the social cluster, with provinces and local government, and with our social partners to strengthen the delivery of services to our people, thus restoring their dignity. I will ensure that we strengthen our communication and relationship with the media so that they report the good news and achievements of our department.

I realise, hon members, that in order to fulfil all these difficult tasks, I need to be fit, both physically and mentally. Long hours, travel, hectic schedules, poor diet and lack of exercise all contribute to poor health. I call on you, hon members, to join me as I embark on a fitness campaign. [Applause.] Hon members, pick up your running shoes and let us, together, strive to get physically and mentally fit, fit to govern. [Applause.]

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Surely we’ll join you, Deputy Minister.

Dr B MABASO: Mutshami wa xitulu wena Manana Joyce Kgoali. Ndzi hoyozela na ku rungula hinkwenu ngopfu ngopfu vona vaholobye lavakulu va hina ku nga Dr Skweyiya, wena Dr Manto Msimang -Tshabalala na swandla swa vona. Ndzi sungula hi ku seketela Vote leyi ya Social Development yo tiyisa mindyangu na vana. Un’wana na un’wana loko a twa ndlala miehleketo ya yena yi n’wí komba eJoni ku nga eGauteng. Van’wana va huma kwala nyongeni ya hina kasi van’wana va huma eka matiko lawa hi nga vandzakana na wona. Hinkwavo va ri na ku tshemba ka leswaku va ta kuma mintirho. Hi sweswo ndzi vula leswaku a swi hlamarisi loko vatshami va le Gauteng va kurile hi 20%. Ndza swi twa loko van’wana va hinhlayo ka hina va karhi va vula leswaku hina eGauteng hi teketela vanhu lava kotaka ku tirha kambe hi tlhela hi tatisa hi kuri mi swi tiva leswaku lava va taka eka hina va ta va nga si va na mintirho, va fika la va kombela kunene.

Xindzuti xa MaAfrika, xi ta tiyisiwa hi dyondzo loko vanhu va malembe yo tirha va titirhela. Hi ndlela yoleyo hi ta hlonipheka. Ndlela ya Gauteng ya ku tirha mintirho leyi i ku pfumela leswaku Sepedi ``mphe-mphe e a lapisa motho o gona ke sa gagwe’’. Ku vula ka Xipedi hi leswi hi vulaka swona hi ku xipimo xa hina i kuri un’wana na un’wana a hetelela a kota ku titirhela.

Hi lemuka leswaku vuvabyi bya HIV/Aids ehenhla ka swisiwana swotala leswi hi fanelaka ku swi pfuna byi lo nyanyisa ku hakuta vutomi bya vatswari vo tala byi siya swisiwana swi lo n’walala. U na nsele wena HIV/Aids u endla leswaku hi va na va hlupheka na va vusiwana vo tala, u endla leswaku tifood parcels leti hi ti nyikiwaka hi holobyenkulu ti hetelela ti nga koti ku ringana vanhu hinkwawo, kambe hi le ku ringeteni leswaku ndyangu un’wana na un’wana wa swisiwana swa swisiwana wu kuma tifood parcels leti.

Lexi hi xi lwisaka hi matimba ya hina hinkwawo i vugevenga lebyi byi endliwaka, ku nga ku xanisiwa ka vana hi tinsulavoya. Vugevenga lebyi byi teka vatswari byi endla leswaku vana va sala va pfumala vatswari. Hi famba na swikongomelo swa wena Dr Skweyiya loko u rilela vana, vantshwa na vatsoniwa. Hambileswi hi nga riki department ya mintirho hi ti yimiserile ku ringeta lahaya na lahaya ku aka mintirho hi vutsongo. Hi ta tirhisana na vaaka-tiko hinkwavo, hi tlhela hi tirhisana na van’wabindzu leswaku hi ta kota ku hunguta vusiwana. Hi ti yimiserile ku endla leswi hi ku khomisana na n’wina va national'' xikan'we na hina hi riprovince’’ na va ka masipala. Vakhale va vurile va ku rintiho rin’we a ri nusi hove. Hina hi ri mfumo wa Gauteng hi khomanile na wena Dr Skweyiya, hi le ku andziseni ku komba xichavo eka makhomele ya vanhu etihofisini. Hi le ku dyondziseni vanhu leswaku va fanela ku hlonipha vanhu lava va taka ku ta kombela ku pfuniwa. Minkarhi hinkwayo hi fanela ku lemuka leswaku mintirho ya kala ngopfu-ngopfu eka vaxisati na lavantshwa.

Loko kuri vusiwana byona hi ta yilwa nyimpi ku kondza hi byi hlula eka swisiwana hi leswi hi swi endlaka. Ku aka mindyangu hi laha ku nga ta va na swikolo, swibendhlele, tindhawu ta ku tlanga mintlangu yo hambana hambana na minchongolo. Lava va nga ta pfuna loko department yi ringeta ku va khoma hi lava hi hetelelaka hi endla mano ya kuri va nyikiwa tona tifood parcels''. Eka hinkwawo leswi hi swi endlelaka swisiwana, nwina mi nga na ndlala mi gongondza erifini hi ta va hi karhi hi miehleketa hi ku minyiketa tona tifood parcels’’.

Na yona Public Works'' yi kona laha kusuhi na hina leswaku yi ta pfuna. Loko kuri ku wu nyiketa tigrants’’ eka swisiwana hi ta endla hi ku chivirika ntirho lowu, ha karhi ha wu endla. Loko September'' yi sungula, hi ta va hiri nafastere’’ rin’we leri aka rona hi ngata va hi nyiketa hinkwavo, ku na vana va xikolo leswaku va kuma timfanelo ta yunifomo va tlhela va kota ku kuma grant'' na ku kota ku treatiwa’’ exibedhlele loko a ha ri n’wana lontsongo. Lewi swi ta endleka eka ``fastere’’ rin’we leswaku vana va folela.

Vana i vumundzuku bya South Africa''. Hi ta endla hinkwawo ku va seketela ku suka eka creçhe’’. ``Tilearnerships’’ na tona hi ta ringeta ku tirhisana na tona hi ri karhi hi endla kuri vusiwana byi hela.

Mi nge ndzi hetisa hi ku tatisa marito lama, ndzi ku va masipala hi tshembe vona hikuva hi vona na tivaka muti lowu wu pfumalaka. Mi nge ndzi hetisa ndzi ku, ha swi tiva leswaku vusiwana byi tele tiko hinkwaro kambe hi kombela leswaku na loko hi ri swisiwana hinkwerhu a hi ti vutiseni hi ku: hi xihi xisiwana xa swisiwana kuva xona lexi hi nga xi hlawula leswaku xi nyikiwa grant''? Hi nga phikisani hinkwerhu hi tsutsumela ekagrant’’.

Ndzi hetisa hi ku hi tlangela ngopfu ku vula leswaku youth'' va nga vantshwa a va tsarisi ku hola hi Sekulula card- yi nga Absa card’’. Swo vula kuri swa olova hi card. Sweswo swi ta endla leswaku va kuma ku hola eka ATM handle ka ku hakerisiwa hi bangi. Sweswo swi ta pfuna leswaku vakhegulu ma vakhalabye ku va vona va nga sala layinini. Sweswo swi ta komisa tilayini kuri ti nga lehi hikuva lavantshwa swa va olovela ku tirhisa ti ATM. Hi ndlela yoleyo ndza nkhensa wena Manana Kgoali, ha tlangela na ku khetiwa ka wena leswaku u hi rhangela.[Va phokotela]

Mutshami wa Xitulu, Inkomu buti, inkomu. (Translation of Xitsonga speech follows.)

[Dr B MABASO: Chairperson, Mrs Joyce Kgoali, I praise and greet all of you, especially our Ministers Dr Skweyiya, Dr Manto Msimang-Tshabalala and their deputies. I start by supporting this Vote of Social Development that strengthens families and children. When people are hungry, they feel their minds are telling them to go to Johannesburg. Being in Gauteng, some are local and some are from neighbouring countries, all of them think that they will secure employment. Therefore I say that it is not surprising that the population growth of Gauteng has increased by 20% in total. I do understand when some of our people say that we in Gauteng have absorbed skilled workers. However, I also want you to know that those who come to us are not employed yet, but make applications on arrival. The dignity of the Africans will be strengthened through education, when people of working age start working for themselves. In this way we shall be respected. The reason why Gauteng is successful in job creation is that they believe the Sepedi saying “Mphe-mphe e a lapisa motho, o kgona ke sa gagwe.” [It is better to have your own things than to have to ask others.]

Based on this Sepedi saying, we say that our objective is to make sure that everyone ends up working for himself or herself.

Be aware that HIV/Aids, a disease visited upon scores of the poor that we are supposed to assist, has destroyed the living conditions of many parents, leaving the orphans scattered all over. You are malicious, you HIV/Aids. You cause us to have many destitute people and orphans. You make us run short of the food parcels that are supplied by the Minister, but we are trying to make sure that the family of the poorest of the poor receive these food parcels.

What we are fighting against with all our might, is a crime that is being committed, and that is child abuse by criminals. This crime kills parents, leaving children without any parents. We follow your objective, Dr Skweyiya, when you feel pity for the children, the youth and the disabled. Even though we are not a department that creates jobs, we are prepared to try here and there to create jobs bit by bit. We will work with the whole community and also with business people to alleviate poverty.

We are prepared to join hands with you, the national Government, we being the province and also the municipality. There is an adage that goes: “Two heads are better than one.” We, the Gauteng government, are with you, Dr Skweyiya. We are showing respect by improving our service in offices. We are teaching public servants to respect the public who comes to them for help. We must always know that jobs are scarce, more especially for women and the youth.

We will fight poverty till we win by means of what we are doing. We will build houses. There will be schools, hospitals and places for various sporting codes, including “muchongolo” (Tsonga traditional dance). Those who will not be reached out to, when the department tries to help, are those we decide to give food parcels to. All those things we do for the poor, those who are hungry, and are knocking at the grave; we will be thinking of them by giving them these food parcels.

Even Public Works is here with us to offer assistance. If it is to give social grants to the poor, we shall do that job at full steam; we are busy doing it. By the beginning of September we will have a single window through which we will help all, so that learners can wear uniforms, be able to receive social grants and receive treatment in hospitals while they are still young. This will be done through a single window, rather than having multiple queues at many windows.

Children are South Africa’s future. We will do everything to support them, from the time they are in crèches. We will try to work together with learnerships in order to eradicate poverty.

Let me conclude by saying our trust is in the municipalities, because they are the ones who know poverty-stricken families. Let me conclude by saying we know that there is poverty throughout our country, but we request that, even if we are poor, we do not ask ourselves which family is the poorest of the poor amongst us, so as to be chosen for the grant. We don’t have to compete for the social grant.

I conclude by saying we are happy to announce that youths should apply for the Sekulula Card, meaning “easy card”, which is an ABSA card for their payments to be paid into. This will mean that they receive their grants through the ATM, rather than being charged inside the bank. This will mean that pensioners, both women and men, would be the only ones remaining in queues. By so doing, there won’t be long queues, because the youth are able to use the ATM.

We congratulate you, Madam Kgaoli, for being chosen to be our leader. [Applause.]]

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: I thank you, brother. Thank you.]

Nkskz A N D QIKANI: Mama uSihlalo, aBaphathiswa bonke abakhoyo namalungu ahloniphekileyo onke akhoyo, masiqale samkele uMphathiswa njengoMphathiswa wezeMpilo kule Ndlu. Impilo yethu sonke ixhomekeke kweli sebe uliphetheyo.

Okokuqala, masibulele izicwangciso zakho zikazwelonke nge-HIV/Aids, kuba intsholongwane kaGawulayo yeyona igqiba abantwana bethu, abadala nabancinci.

ISebe lezeMpilo kufuneka liwuqwalasele kakhulu umcimbi wezibhedlele neekliniki ezilalini. Kukho iindawo ekusahanjwa kuzo imigama emide ukuya kufuna uncedo lwezempilo. Bathi bakufika kuzo abantu bafumane kungekho gqirha okanye mayeza, yaye kunqongophele nabongikazi. URhulumente kufuneka abajonge oogqirha abancinci namanesi aphuma ezikholejini. Kufuneka abakhuthaze ngokubanika imirholo emihle ukwenzela ukuba bangathi bephuma esikolweni bafune ukuzivulela iisejari zabo okanye bawele baye kumazwe aphesheya ukuya kufuna amarhiwa aluhlaza.

Makuqwalaselwe ukubonelelwa kwezigulane ngeengubo nokutya okufanelekileyo kwizibhedlele zikaRhulumente kuba abantu basezilalini abanayo le mali yokuya kwizibhedlele zabucala ukuze bafumane uncedo oluphezulu namayeza afanelekileyo.

Oomatshini basezilondri kufuneka bajongwe ngoba oomatshini abaninzi bezi zibhedlele abasebenzi, loo nto itsho luqhwalele uncedo kwizigulane.

Okokugqibela, kukho izigulane zesifo sephepha, i-TB. Siyavumelana nezicwangciso zakho, kodwa Mphathiswa, kukho nto ekufuneka khe iqwalaselwe kwizigulane zesifo sephepha, ezi zamaqabaza, ii-Dots. Ngathi kufuneka khe ujongwe kakuhle umbandela wee-Dots kuba abantu bazo abazithathi ngendlela, kungenjalo umntu utshintsha indawo yokuhlala ze ahlale engazifumani, nto leyo ke embuyisela umva ngokwasempilweni kuba namanesi okubahambela emakhaya anqongophele okanye engenazithuthi zokubandwendwela.

Kukho amayeza amaninzi awasuswayo kuluhlu lwamayeza asezikliniki, kodwa loo mayeza ubani uyawafumana ekhemisti xa ewafuna. Iyeza lokukhohlela, i-cough mixture, ngumizekelo waloo mayeza. Loo nto ilungiselela abantu abanemali kuphela, abasezilalini ke bafa namthanyana. URhulumente bakajonge ukuba ukuba la mayeza ndithetha ngawo ayapheliswa, makapheliswe nasezikhemesti ukuze wonke umntu angalifumani.

Mandibulele, Mphathiswa ngamaphulo ogonyo, ngakumbi eMpuma Koloni, apho ndisuka khona. Ndiyincoma kakhulu loo nto kuba amanani okusweleka kwabantwana atsho ehla kakhulu. Nditetha ngento endiyaziyo kuba ndisuka kweli candelo.

Ukhuseleko lwamanesi ezilalini malujongwe kuba yinto ebangela ukuba angafuni ukuya kuhlala kuzo. Iindlela nazo mazilungiswe kuba zimbi kakhulu. Nditsho kuwe ke Mphathiswa, Gqirha Goqwana. Enkosi. [Kwaqhwatywa.] (Translation of isiXhosa speech follows.)

[Mrs A N D QIKANI: Madam Chairperson, all hon Ministers who are here and hon members present, let us first welcome the Minister of Health who is in the House. Our health depends on the department that you lead. Firstly, let us thank you for your national HIV/Aids plans, because this virus is the greatest killer of our people, both old and young.

The Department of Health should really concentrate on the situation at hospitals and clinics in rural areas. There are areas where people still walk very long distances to get medical help. When they arrive there, there is neither a doctor nor medicine, and there is also a shortage of nurses. The Government should look at the issue of young doctors and nurses who have just graduated from colleges. They must be encouraged by being given attractive salaries so that they could be discouraged from opening their own surgeries just after graduating or from going overseas to look for greener pastures.

Let us look at the issue of supplying patients with blankets and suitable food in Government hospitals, because in rural areas people cannot afford to go to private hospitals for quality medical help and the appropriate medicine. Washing machines for laundry also need to be looked at, as they are never in working order, which creates problems when it comes to assisting the patients.

Lastly, there are TB patients. We are happy with your programme, hon Minister, but there is a problem with the TB patients on Dots treatment. This Dots problem really needs urgent attention because most people do not handle this correctly. These patients sometimes change their residential addresses, as a result of which they do not get their medication, which delays their getting better. There is also a shortage of nurses visiting patients at home, and sometimes those who are there do not have the transport to do so.

There are some medicines which have been removed from the medicine lists at clinics, but which are available at chemists. For example, there are no longer cough mixtures. This is fine for people who are not poor, but for rural people it is unfortunate, since they are poor. The Government must make sure that if these medicines are not supposed to be available at Government hospitals, they should not be available at chemists either.

Let me thank you, hon Minister, for immunisation, especially in the Eastern Cape where I come from. I really applaud this, especially since there has been a significant decline in the death of toddlers. I know what I am talking about, since I worked in this department.

The issue of the safety of nurses in the rural areas should also be looked at because that is one other thing that makes them resist going to live there. The roads are also in a bad condition, and that also needs attention. In saying that, I am talking to you, Minister, Dr Goqwana. Thank you. [Applause.]]

Mr P UYS (Western Cape): Chairperson, hon Ministers, hon Deputy Minister, hon members, I want to congratulate the hon Minister of Health for presenting us with a budget that continues to expand access to equitable, affordable and good quality health services to all our people. The past decade has seen huge progress by Government in bringing health services closer to the people, especially the poor.

In supporting the Budget Vote, I want to assure the Minister that health services in the Western Cape will continue to do its part to promote this progress. Currently, 72% of the Western Cape’s 4 500 000 people depend on state health services. In addition, it is estimated that 90 000 patients from other provinces will receive highly specialised care at Groote Schuur, Tygerberg and Red Cross hospitals. This year our province expects to have 12 million patient contacts at primary health care level.

Voorsitter, net soos ander provinsies, is die Wes-Kaap in ‘n stryd gewikkel met ‘n veelvuldige las van siektes en trauma weens geweld, voertuigongelukke, brandwonde, chroniese siektes soos diabetes en hipertensie en oordraagbare siektes soos tering en MIV en vigs. Ons het die hoogste voorkoms van tering in Suid-Afrika en ‘n lae, maar toenemende voorkoms van MIV en vigs. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)

[Chairperson, like other provinces, the Western Cape is fighting a battle against numerous diseases, trauma owing to violence, motor car accidents, burns, chronic diseases such as diabetes and hypertension, contagious diseases such as tuberculosis and HIV and Aids. We have the highest incidence of tuberculosis in South Africa, and a low, but increasing incidence of HIV and Aids.]

In effectively dealing with the burden presented by these diseases and building on the 10-point plan for the public health care sector mentioned by the Minister, the Western Cape province continues with the implementation of its health care 2010 plan. This plan will provide equal access to quality of health care for all our people. It will also allow us to apply our resources to maximum effort and keep expenditure within budget. The health care 2010 strategy rests on four pillars: services, people, facilities and money.

This year, health in the Western Cape has been allocated a budget of R4,74 billion, and that amounts to just over 25% of the provincial budget. Conditional grants constitute 33% or R1,5 billion of our national budget, with the National Treasury services grant making up R1,076 billion. We are grateful for the funds received. For our part, we are pleased to report that the projected revenue reflects a significant increase over the MTEF period from R98 million in 2000-2001 to a projected R156 million for the 2004-2005 financial year.

Spurred on by goals, we are making our budget allocation go a long way in the provision of quality health services. Some of the highlights of the Western Cape health budget include the following: R1,2 billion has been allocated for district health services, with additional funds for HIV and Aids of almost R58 million in terms of the increased conditional grant. In this regard, I would like to commend the Minister for the major increase in the conditional grant funding for the care, management and treatment of HIV and Aids patients reflected in the national health department’s Budget Vote.

Regarding steps to enhance the experience of patients at community health care centres in the Cape metropole - which is the focus of many complaints

• various measures are being taken to reduce the waiting times to acceptable levels at our facilities. We are also striving to improve the supply of medicines so that patients are not turned away without medication.

Wat die voortsetting van die omvattende bestuur, versorging en behandeling van MIV en vigspasiënte betref: die program vir die voorkoming van moeder- tot-kind-oordrag is ten volle geïmplementeer. Geriewe vir vrywillige berading en toetsing is op 344 terreine beskikbaar. Anti-retrovirale middels is by 19 funksionele sentrums dwarsdeur die provinsie beskikbaar, en teen die einde van hierdie finansiële jaar verwag ons om sowat 6 000 mense by 36 sulke sentrums te kan bedien. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)

[With regard to the continuation of the comprehensive management, care and treatment of HIV and Aids patients: the programme for the prevention of mother-to-child transmission has been fully implemented. Facilities for voluntary counselling and testing are available in 344 fields. Antiretrovirals are available at 19 functional centres throughout the province, and at the end of this financial year we expect to be able to serve about 6 000 people at 36 such centres.] Regarding measures to tackle TB cure rates, this year will see the further introduction of a new four-drug combination treatment which will lead to improved cure rates. In addition, more strenuous efforts will be made to reduce interruption rates.

Streekhospitale wat as die ruggraat van provinsiale gesondheidsdienste beskou word, sal versterk word. [Regional hospitals, which are considered as the backbone of provincial health services, will be strengthened.]

Eight hundred nurses and 100 oral health professionals will be trained in the province this year. I share the Minister’s concern regarding the loss of health professionals and welcome the steps announced in this regard. In particular, I welcome the proactive steps taken with the United Kingdom to regulate the movement of health professionals between our countries.

Die opening van die Wes-Kaapse rehabilitasiesentrum in aanbou op die terrein van die Lentegeur-hospitaal, sal ook vanjaar ‘n hoogtepunt wees. [The opening this year of the Western Cape rehabilitation centre which is being built on the site of the Lentegeur Hospital, will also be a highlight.]

We would also like to thank the Minister and national Government for the funding we have received to upgrade our hospitals. Three major hospital revitalisation projects are progressing very well. Projects for the upgrading of George Hospital at R79 million - it is almost complete - Worcester Hospital at R147 million, and Vredenburg Hospital at R48 million are in full swing. The department is also developing a business case for the building of a new hospital in the Khayelitsha/Mitchells Plain area to the extent of R110 million.

The conclusion for this is that co-operation and mutual support between the different spheres of government and various departments is key to achieving the all-important goal of a better and healthier life for all our people. I would like to thank the hon Minister of Health for the initiatives announced in the budget speech regarding support and communication between the department and provinces, and within Government and the communities that we serve.

In die Wes-Kaap glo ons dat dit noodsaaklik is om gesondheidpersoneel te hou waar hulle benodig word, en om nuwe talent na die departement te lok. Daarom het ons ons verbind tot die opleiding en verbetering van beide die bestuurs- en pasiëntsorgvaardighede van ons pasiënte. Ons verwelkom die groter klem wat die Minister plaas op die behoud van skaars vaardighede in openbare gesondheid, asook onderhandelinge met ander lande om regulering met betrekking tot die beweging van mediese personeel daar te stel. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)

[In the Western Cape we believe that it is essential to keep health staff where they are needed, and to attract new talent to the department. We have therefore committed ourselves to the training and improvement of both management and patient care skills of our patients. We welcome the greater emphasis placed by the Minister on the preservation of scarce skills in public health, as well as negotiations with other countries to establish regulation with regard to the movement of medical staff.]]

As for the Minister’s call to help ensure that the healthy lifestyles campaign is spread far and wide, I want to assure her that in the Western Cape, we will continue to put more effort into effective and practical preventative health programmes. These will be aimed not only at increasing awareness amongst the public, but also at promoting healthy lifestyles.

In conclusion, I wish to assure the Minister of our support from the Western Cape in achieving the objectives of the national health system. The Western Cape is part of the system, and we will play our part. Thank you. [Applause.]

Mr E M SOGONI: Thank you, Chairperson. Comrade Ministers and Comrade Deputy Ministers, congratulations on your appointments; congratulations to our MECs as well! Special delegates and colleagues, I will read the speech, as the programme shows, of the MEC for health of Gauteng, Dr Ramokgopa, who has not been able to attend today due to unforeseen circumstances.

Just before I read the speech, I would like to comment on what hon Lamoela said. Ministers of Health and Social Development, you heard for yourselves that with people such as the hon member Lamoela, you could do whatever you want to do, but they will never see what you are doing. They are just prophets of doom. However, the electorate returned the ANC to rule this country with a bigger majority than 1999, which shows that the people have hope and that they see a difference between 1994 and today. Therefore, hon Lamoela is one of those people whom we can just ignore. Though their leader, when responding to the President’s state of the nation address, said that he would like to work with the Government, we in this House have yet to see that happen.

I now come to the speech, as prepared by Dr Gwen Ramokgopa. The past 10 years have been most challenging for the public health sector. As we begin the second decade of democracy, we are pleased with the progress we have made in turning the challenges that we inherited into opportunities. Today, we can boldly declare that we have placed our health system on the growth path.

I would like to thank the Minister for her leadership and vision during her past term of office. The 10-point plan that she introduced guided our action and ensured that we work in a coherent manner towards achieving the national goal of improving the health of our people.

Our success in building a responsive and affordable health care system in Gauteng was confirmed by the social survey we undertook in 2002. In that survey, 82% of the people who had used our health facilities in the preceding 12 months said they were satisfied with the changes we had made in the clinics and hospitals.

The past 10 years have particularly been beneficial to our children, the people on whose shoulders the future of our country is going to rely. Whereas in the past children used to die from infectious childhood diseases such as measles, today cases of measles are rare and children are no longer dying of this disease. Since 1994 we have carried out a series of mass immunisation campaigns to eliminate polio and measles, with the aim of having our country and our province declared polio-free by 2005. We have increased the immunisation coverage to about 80%, and we are confident that we will be declared polio-free by December next year.

Our clinics have experienced a phenomenal increase in patient visits since

1. The total number of visits per year has grown from one million to 10 million. At the same time, hospital admission has increased to over 720 000 patients per year and the outpatient visits have increased to over four million.

We have paid close attention to improving the quality of care that we provide. We have established a quality assurance directorate to follow up all complaints and ensure improved quality of care, and hospitals have quality teams that ensure adherence to quality standards. We also appointed an outside body, the accreditation committee, to monitor adherence to standards. We are currently finalising our strategic plans in consultation with all stakeholders. These plans will build on the achievements we have made. Most importantly, however, they will result in a fundamental paradigm shift from planning and policy formulation to actual implementation, monitoring and evaluation of programmes that will make a difference in the lives of the poor - women, children, the disabled and the vulnerable.

In the next five years we will streamline our systems and processes to achieve greater service delivery. We want to combat corruption, inefficiency and poor performance, and continue to promote the ethos of care and accountability through our Patients’ Rights Charter and the service pledge.

We will continue to pay special attention to the quality of service at all public hospitals, clinics and other health care facilities. We do not wish any patient to leave any of our facilities unhappy. Together with the communities, we will monitor the quality of service and undertake corrective action where services do not meet acceptable standards. We will expect every unit, every manager and every employee to comply with norms and standards. We will act decisively to improve services and protect patients’ rights. At the centre of all our plans is the desire to ensure that the poor live a better life in our province and our country.

We will focus on training our frontline employees in customer care and reward those who do us proud through our Khanyisa service excellence awards. Our major focus will be on preventing, management and treatment of diseases of poverty, trauma and violence, and chronic diseases of lifestyles, such as hypertension and diabetes. Obesity rates are very high in our province, and this is regarded as one of the risk factors for developing hypertension, diabetes and other lifestyle-related illnesses. Healthy eating practices and exercise, as the Deputy Minister has indicated, will receive most attention in dealing with these risk factors.

In line with the decision of national Government to introduce community health workers, the province will introduce 3 000 well-trained community health workers over the next three years. [Applause.] The programme will be launched at the end of July this year, and will be implemented in phases.

Improving access and care for the poor will remain our top priority in this term. Access is affected by the availability of affordable drugs, and bringing staff and health care facilities closer to the people. In this regard, we support the medicine pricing regulations introduced by the Minister and her endeavours to retain skills in the public sector.

We have also made a firm undertaking to recruit more staff in the coming five years to address increasing pressures on our services and to ensure our capacity to provide quality health care services to all our people.

To ensure that we bring services closer to where people live, we plan to build 10 new clinics. These clinics will be built in Soshanguve and Eersterus in Pretoria, Orange Farm and Eldorado Park in Johannesburg, Randfontein, Atteridgeville, Everton, Orlando, Boikhutsong and Cullinan. Three new clinics will be built in Mamelodi, Zola and the Kathorus area in the coming five years. The construction of the new Pretoria Academic Hospital is nearing completion, and I want to thank the Minister for her support in ensuring that we have this modern facility.

HIV and Aids continue to place a heavy burden on families, communities and the health sector. There is still no cure for the disease and we are called upon to respond to this epidemic in a comprehensive manner, focusing on education, prevention, counselling, testing, care, treatment and management. The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Hon member, your time has expired.

Mr E M SOGONI: Thank you, Chair. [Applause.]

The DEPUTY MINISTER OF SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT: Madam Chairperson, Ministers of Social Development and Health, hon members, MECs for Social Development and Health, leaders and members of civil society, distinguished guests, ladies and gentlemen, I am honoured to take the podium and address this House for the first time in my capacity as Deputy Minister of Social Development and in support of Budget Vote No 19.

In the short period since my appointment, I have had the privilege of interacting with Social Development MECs and have visited some of our provinces to receive a briefing on this sector. I take this opportunity to acknowledge the efforts of our provincial governments. Indeed, your work and the work of this Chamber remains critical to the integration and implementation of a comprehensive social protection system that will ultimately realise the mandate of a better life for all.

We are well aware that for us to speedily address our contract with our people, we must provide for a thorough and concerted departure away from a dependency-based welfare system to people-centred development. This people- centred approach implies that we must build on the solutions that our people have on the ground. I have, in these few months, been struck by the resilient spirit of our people who, despite these challenges, have risen and developed their own projects and programmes that have ensured that their destiny is in their own hands.

Madam Chair, I take this opportunity to recognise the gallant spirit of the cadres who participate in initiatives such as the Bokamoso Life Centre in Winterveld, the Bosasa Youth Centres in Gauteng, and those in the Western Cape and Limpopo which deal with the rehabilitation of children in conflict with the law. Such initiatives, through the utilisation of existing community facilities and capacities, have ensured that community members, in particular young people, are successfully trained in life and business skills with a view to impacting on employing. Such initiatives dovetail neatly with the anticipated outcomes and overall goals of the Expanded Public Works Programme, which requires the active participation and partnership amongst private, public and civil society sectors.

For us to adequately partner with such initiatives that are driven by our people, we must accelerate and deepen the transformation process within the welfare sector so as to meaningfully address the huge socioeconomic ills that face our society. What has become obvious to us is that these sectors of our society cannot be isolated from communities or families. Thus our emphasis is on the restoration of family and communal values. In this, the International Year of the Family and 10 years of freedom, we will accelerate our interventions at the family level, with the emphasis on working closer with local government because this sphere of governance is at the centre of our delivery strategy. In this regard we will, over the next six months, engage various local governments, including local government co-ordinating structures such as Salga, so as to clarify overlapping policy areas, such as the indigent policy, while developing common programmes of action.

We remain focused on our goal of ensuring that all services to the vulnerable are delivered in a manner that is integrated, effective, dignified, and even more importantly in a manner that empowers communities so that they rely less on the state and more on their ingenuity and power. In order to attain this, we must double our efforts to ensure that collaboration and co-operation within and amongst all the spheres of government happens more effectively. In order to adequately do so, we have to pay greater attention to the organisations in civil society sector that continue to work very closely with our people.

In addressing this priority area, we will firstly finalise the sector financing policy by December 2004, to address the challenges of co- ordination, governance, financing and accountability of organisations functioning in the sector.

A study on the nonprofit sector, conducted by the University of the Witwatersrand and the John Hopkins University, revealed that there were just over 100 000 nonprofit organisations functioning in South Africa in

1. The operating expenses of these NPOs totalled R9,3 billion. The bulk of these operating expenses is covered by voluntary and variable contributions, thus signalling that we must address and accelerate financing of this important sector.

In anticipation of the outcomes of the draft financing policy, our department has set aside over R18 million this year to finance the work of the national councils. However, we have to pay urgent attention to the following issues: the manner in which these councils deliver their services, the beneficiaries of the services provided by councils, the manner in which these councils are configured, constituted and capacitated. The answers to the above questions will dictate to us the manner in which we integrate and align the work of the councils to support our people’s contract for a better life, which the President elaborated on in his state of the nation address.

Drug and substance abuse are factors which are at the core of the disintegration of the moral fibre that previously held together our families and communities. The abuse of drugs such as alcohol, dagga, mandrax, cocaine, heroin and crystal methamphetamine, which is locally known as ``tik’’, is beginning to affect the hearts and minds and creativity of our community members, particularly children and young people.

The fact that drugs are being sold to children as young as nine and 14, signals to us that we must begin to mount a total co-ordinated onslaught on the drug peddlers and pushers who are selling drugs to our youngsters. In this regard, I commend the Western Cape provincial government for addressing the epidemic associated with the abuse of crystal methamphetamine amongst the youth through a sustained and integrated campaign involving the Departments of Education, Safety and Security, Social Services and Poverty Alleviation, and the Premier.

I further take this opportunity to commend the Department of Health for efforts to address the effects of and prevention of substance abuse, in particular the fight against fetal alcohol syndrome, recognising the link between women abuse, alcohol abuse and poverty in De Aar where the fetal alcohol syndrome is amongst the highest in the world. Prof Viljoen of the Foundation for Alcohol-Related Research, with the support of the MEC for Health in the Northern Cape, Dr Malusi, established a safe house where care for vulnerable pregnant women is integrated with skills development projects to assist such women to become more self-sufficient. This project is a good example of partnerships that are possible between Government, donor and private sectors to address social problems in an integrated way.

Our fight against substance abuse will require that we place our children at the centre of strategies so as to equip them with the knowledge and courage to say: Nee dankie, ek is fine sonder drugs.'' [No thank you, I am fine without drugs.] To successfully do so, we must ensure the involvement of other stakeholders, including members of this House. To this end, my department, in partnership with the Ministry of Safety and Security, the Central Drug Authority and the United Nations Office on Drugs and Crime, has launched the Ke Moja campaign, which means: No thanks, I am fine without drugs.’’

The success of this campaign will lie in its ability to adapt to local conditions and dialects. If we are to reach those at risk, we must speak in the language that is relevant and understandable to them. To spread the message, we will require the involvement of all media. In this regard, I thank the SABC and print media, who have highlighted the problem of substance abuse in the past three months.

I urge the media to assist Government in also reporting on efforts of Government to address the problems and to take the Ke Moja campaign to all corners of our nation. Such an effort will complement our efforts to review and implement the National Drug Master Plan which we have been tasked with co-ordinating over the past five years. This plan will require that communities be actively involved in its implementation through innovative instruments such as the establishment of provincial and local-level anti- drug forums, which will complement the work of the central drug authority. The challenges will be the integration of such forums into existing community structures so as to ensure co-ordinated action.

The challenge presented by alcohol, drug and substance abuse is a global phenomenon and social ill. In this regard, South Africa has ratified three international conventions, including the 1999 UN Convention Against Illicit Trafficking in Narcotics and Psycho-tropic Substances. In order to further facilitate the implementation of these protocols, we will host a delegation from the International Narcotics Control Board this week with a view to closing our borders and communities to drugs.

The National Drug Master Plan is up for review and renewal in 2004, and in this process we shall refine the operations of the CDA to more effectively implement the Prevention and Treatment of Drug Dependency Act of 1992 as amended in 1999.

In order to advance an integrated approach to combating substance abuse, we will, on the 26th of this month, mark the International Day Against Drug Abuse and Illicit Drug Trafficking. Several activities will be undertaken which once again will require the participation of all within the social development sector, including members of this House. The main event will happen in Kimberley, and I trust that similar activities are being held in all the other provinces.

This month began with the focus on the rights of children through the International Children’s Day. I also take this opportunity to echo the Minister’s appeal to this House to assist with the expedition of the Children’s Bill. During this month of June, which is Youth Month, we must also begin to actively engage young people in their development. To this end, my department forms part of the national youth development machinery, which includes the National Youth Commission, the SA Youth Council, the Umsobomvu Youth Fund and all the departments, as well as other spheres of our government.

Through the national youth development strategy and programmes, such as the youth in service programme, we will seek to elaborate on the social dimensions for youth development during this financial year. Through programmes such as the Voices of the Youth on Social Security and Poverty hearings we intend to host in the provinces as from 26 July 2004, we will elaborate on the key and non-negotiable development requirements and programmes that should be put in place, particularly for the vulnerable youth. Such requirements will require the active engagement of all our sectors, including the private sector, and will also require the cultivation of an active young social development cadre.

The experience of the last decade has shown that our development as a nation requires that we formulate a focus approach on early childhood development sector. In this regard, throughout this financial year our goal is to focus on efforts in this neglected sector within the context of the Expanded Public Works Programme, as the Minister has already stated.

We will, therefore, endeavour to work more closely with the Departments of Education and Health so as to focus on the emotional, spiritual, mental, moral, physical and social development needs of our children, who are indeed our most precious resources. Protecting children from poverty, abuse, neglect and other forms of vulnerability remains a key priority, whilst at the same time enhancing skills development and creation of work.

Our focus on removing our people from vulnerability has seen my department gradually increasing the number of people with disabilities into the social security safety net. We must, however, begin to develop a concerted programme of integration of people with disabilities into the mainstream of our society. To this end, we have, this year, set aside more than R5 million so as to develop a specific and integrated service delivery policy and programme for people with disabilities. These measures will target disabled people who are vulnerable and live in conditions of poverty.

Over the years we have emphasised the need to integrate older persons’ needs into our policies and programmes, including our programmes on HIV and Aids. To this end, we will double our efforts in the implementation of the Madrid Plan of Action with a view to integrating all the needs of older persons, including the requirements for HIV and Aids, awareness programmes amongst the elderly as caregivers, and sexually active members of our community. In order to adequately do so, I must echo the Ministers plea for your assistance in finalising the Older Persons Bill as a matter of urgency.

In conclusion, in the 10 years of our democracy, we have done well to address the terrible social ills that we had inherited from apartheid. We have laid the foundation of transforming welfare services, while focusing on casting a social security net to sustain those who are most vulnerable through making grants more accessible.

Entry into the global economy presents new challenges requiring coherent and integrated efforts across different departments and tiers of government to make poor South Africans economically productive. Equally serious is the challenge to prevent the poor and vulnerable from falling prey to organised crime and traffickers of drugs and human beings across our borders and within our communities.

Our efforts must be complemented by sustainable partnerships, which have to be sector-wide and inclusive of ordinary people and their organisations. I thank you. [Applause.]

Ms K MQULWANA (Western Cape): Thanks Chairperson. Hon Minister Dr Zola Skweyiya, hon Minister of Health, Dr Manto Tshabalala-Msimang, the Deputy Minister of Social Development, MECs for Health from other provinces, hon members, ladies and gentlemen, we are proud to participate in this important budget policy debate.

This happened just as our province, the Western Cape, joined the rest of the country politically. For this reason we thank our people for mandating us to continue pursuing the people’s contract to create work and fight poverty. The main challenge facing us now is translating this political mandate into a reality for the millions of ordinary South Africans.

As a starting point, the department of social services and poverty alleviation has established a number of programmes aimed at improving the lives of our people. As we celebrate the international year of the family, we have placed early childhood development at the centre of community regeneration. Further, as we continue rebuilding our community we have to ensure that we nurture a new South African citizen that is, psychologically, politically and socially developed at a very early age.

According to information recently released by the World Bank, there is growing evidence of how critical the early years are to child development. To give meaning to the early childhood development programme we are consulting with individual experts from institutions of higher learning, the private sector and various individuals in transforming and rationalising the ECD sector in our province. The lack of suitable facilities, shortages of resources and the absence of trained and qualified ECD educators continue to characterise the day to day running of childcare centres around our province. The absence of an adequate, formal ECD programme has led to many children being cared for by informal daycare caregivers.

As we speak, the Ministry has commissioned a study to look at how to formalise this sector and to address social, political and economic imbalances of the past. This will focus on the following terms of reference: Identify all informal and semiformal ECD centres in various communities, assess them and identify the type of support they need to develop into a fully fledged ECD centre; identify training needs and guidelines for the development of skills in early childhood development work; set clear targets to ensure family support and the development of good quality care in the community and create a network capable of supporting and developing the more marginalised child facility, monitor progress and the correct use of developmental resources at funded facilities, while ensuring that many preschools are brought up to standard in preparing children for school readiness.

Last month we launched the child protection month in Danoon, where parents appealed to Government to intensify the campaign at aiming to ensure that the girl-child is safe from abuse. In response to this cry, and in a clear contract with our community, we are developing a programme to address the continuous protection of children in our province.

We gather in this important forum at a time when our province is under the onslaught of a very dangerous drug called tik. According to researchers, German, Japanese and American soldiers used this drug during the war as a catalyst to avoid exhaustion and depression. Because of this substance, the youth in our province are becoming addicted at a very early age. It is for this reason that we are looking at multipronged strategy to fight it. Our province is also involved in rehabilitation programmes such as the Masiphumelele rehabilitation programme. We thank members of the religious and business community and community leaders for their involvement in this programme. We suddenly learnt that our province has the highest number of children in conflict with the law. It is against this background that we are not remaining silent, but continuing to address general problems affecting young people in our province.

We welcome the announcement made by our premier regarding the establishment of the youth commission in order to sensitise Government on the broader needs and aspirations of young people. It is important for me to emphasise that it is only taking place after ten years in our province. It is an unfortunate situation that after ten years, this province is only now announcing the establishment of the youth commission.

Young people encounter horrible experiences on a daily basis. These include HIV/Aids, STDs, gangsterism, substance abuse, a high school dropout rate and unemployment. A number of activities and programmes are in the pipeline to respond to these challenges.

In line with our commitment to the moral regeneration of our society, we will pay special attention to the living conditions of our grannies and grandfathers in our centres for the aged. The principle of ubuntu and Batho Pele will define the behaviour of our caregivers in these institutions to ensure that our elders receive the respect and dignity they deserve.

It is important for me to outline in this forum that one of the challenges facing us in this institution is still a lack of transformation. After ten years in our province there are institutions that are not in line with government policies. So, we are faced with that particular challenge. In order to deal with both the shortages of these facilities in the historically disadvantaged communities, as well as the cultural diversity, the relevant directorate within our department has been commissioned to investigate the possibility of establishing daycare centres using existing facilities in most needed areas. We should also welcome the Older Persons Bill that seeks to protect our senior citizens. Minister Zola Skweyiya recently announced in his budget speech that national Government is faced with the challenge of registering 900 000 children for the child support grant. In our province, the number translates to 93 000. As a result our department will be embarking on a door-to-door campaign to the poorest and the most remote communities in our province. We will be launching that particular programme on the 28th, and I wish to announce that we are doing this jointly with Home Affairs. We are being assisted by Home Affairs in terms of the levy that communities are supposed to pay when they apply for birth certificates and IDs. With the joint programme our communities will be able to do that free of charge.

We are proud to announce that the campaign will cover all the municipality districts of our province. To ensure the success of this campaign the ministry of social service will work very closely with the community involved in identifying social problems confronting our people. As the Western Cape province, we rise to support Vote No 19.

Mr M S GININDA (Mpumalanga): Chairperson, the Minister of Health, the Minister of Social Development, Deputy Ministers, members of the Council of Provinces and ladies and gentlemen, it is a singular honour for me to take part in this debate on the occasion of the Department of Health’s Budget Vote on behalf of the MEC for Social Services for Mpumalanga province, Mr S W Sibisi.

I concur with the Minister of Health when she so eloquently addressed this august House on the progress that we have made during the past decade in our country. The challenges have been enormous, but through sustained interventions we have managed to improve the quality of care that has been rendered to the masses of our people. I support fully the hon Minister’s view on the need for sustainable policies so as to promote equitable, accessible and good quality services.

Mpumalanga, being a rural province, subscribes fully to promoting the interests of the poor and the destitute. The hon Minister focused on the ten-point plan for the public health sector as well on the key priorities on matters that would impact positively on the health status of our people, and I want to re-emphasise that we, as a province, align ourselves with this vision.

In Mpumalanga primary health care remains the key strategy for the department in rendering quality health services. The hospital revitalisation programme which focuses on four main components, namely, organisational development, infrastructure development, health technology management and quality assurance will go a long way in ensuring that our hospitals, over a period of time, become facilities that would make us proud as a nation.

Organisational development empowers hospital management with appropriate delegation and skills to manage their facilities and be held accountable for the resources under their control. Infrastructure development ensures that the physical structure of the hospital is relevant and appropriate to the 21st century norms and standards and the maintenance thereof is strictly adhered to. Health technology management ensures that public hospitals have the latest and most appropriate equipment to render the necessary services to our patients. Quality assurance ensures that public hospitals maintain a quality service that is in line with the level provided in the private sector within the resources available.

The envisaged pricing regulations will make medicines more affordable to communities, and this would be a great relief to many of our people in Mpumalanga. The department is embarking aggressively on private-public partnerships, which have been identified as a key priority by the Minister. This initiative that is aimed at promoting constant and respectful contact with our communities is enthusiastically welcomed.

The province supports the Minister’s commitment to holding izimbizo, in that by doing so we will further entrench the principle of participatory democracy and consultation with the masses of our people. On behalf of the hon MEC, I want to thank the hon Minister and her department for their visionary leadership and commitment to continue making decisive interventions in the promotion of quality health care in the interests of the poor.

The department of social services is faced with critical challenges and the transition to the envisaged agency must not negatively affect the recipients of social grants. It must not cause insecurity to those public servants employed by the Department of Social Development at this point in time. So far the process is run fairly and we are confident that that will be the case up to the end. The improved and improving services rendered by this department are most welcome. The poorest of the poor and the needy people are being taken care of. Thank you all for that. Thank you, Dr Zola Skweyiya, Minister of Social Development. Thank you, Dr Manto Shabalala- Msimang, Minister of Health. Thank you all. We support the two votes. [Applause.]

Mr C SEKOATI (Limpopo): Chairperson, Minister of Health, Minister of Social Development and Welfare, Deputy Ministers present here, hon members of the NCOP, fellow MECs of Health and Social Development, we would firstly like to tell you that we appreciate the rare opportunity given to us by this House to participate in this most important debate. We do so mindful of the fact that our people have renewed our mandate to continue the Reconstruction and Development Programme we adopted 10 years ago.

The primary health care policy adopted by this Government gives us guidance on how we should go about increasing access to health care. To this end, we managed to upgrade 68 dilapidated clinics and were also able to erect 109 new ones. We have ensured that 292 clinics provide 24-hour comprehensive primary health care services, and in the current financial year we aim to raise this figure to 332. We are particularly happy with the results of the increased access to these primary health care facilities. We saw the citizens of Limpopo responding by increasing their primary health care utilisation rate from 1,9 visits per person per year in 1994 to 2,6 visits in 2004. One of our major goals remains that of joining hands with the rest of the Southern African Development Community in eradicating polio by 2005.

The province managed to maintain the malaria incidence at acceptable levels through the spraying of 850 000 units. However, the emergence of drug resistant malaria remains a challenge which we are tackling together with our sister provinces of Mpumalanga and KwaZulu-Natal, and in collaboration of our neighbouring countries of Mozambique and Zimbabwe. While the provision of electricity and water to clinics remains a challenge, some progress has been made. A recent electricity audit resulted in 89 clinics being electrified with funds that have been set aside for this purpose. Water has already been supplied to some 64 clinics with no reliable water supply during the previous financial year.

Our efforts to extend primary health care to areas where we have not yet managed to put up fixed clinics is through mobile clinics. However, this effort has been frustrated by criminal elements which threaten and hijack our vehicles. We are confident that this endeavour will further increase access to primary health care services in our rural areas.

Our emergency medical service’s response is still a challenge, particularly in rural areas. We have increased ambulance stations from 7 to 18, as well as procured 95 new ambulances. Our average response time is still more than one hour. These delays are attributed to poor communication and poor road infrastructure.

We remain committed to the National Five-Year Plan to deal with the scourge of HIV/Aids, sexually transmitted infectious diseases and tuberculosis with the aim of translating the marginal stabilisation of the HIV/Aids infection rate we had in 1999-01 into an actual reduction. We are committed to the implementation of the comprehensive HIV/Aids care management and treatment programme. Preparations to start with the programme are at an advanced stage.

In an effort to improve our human resource capacity, we have awarded bursaries to 1 685 students since 1997 to pursue health related courses - 850 of whom were sent to study medicine. However, because of the rural nature of our province, the majority of them would like to pay back in cash rather than in service. We are, however, trying to put some mechanisms in place to ensure that they come and serve their province.

The introduction of rural and scarce skills allowances will go a long way to assist us in recruiting and returning these health professionals. For the past three years we have repeated our call for improved funding of the health services in our province. The Intergovernmental Fiscal Review reflected that we have been the least funded in the country for the past three financial years, and the MTEF allocation does not necessarily offer any solution to the situation. Notwithstanding our vacancy rate of 46, it should be stressed that these vacancies are mainly due to the absence of highly skilled professionals like doctors and other specialists. Their absence is coupled with a severe shortage of accommodation for those who would like to join us in the province. If the vacancies were to be filled successfully, that might probably double the personnel expenditure. Note must also be taken that health is a labour intensive function, and we will therefore require more funding for personnel.

It is a reality that our welfare services in Limpopo received 25,7% of the total provincial budget, which is 7,7% more than the equitable share formula guide, while health services received 16,4% instead of 19%. The allocation received was 40,7% instead of 41%, and the rest of the department in the province will have to share 17% instead of 22%. Given this scenario, it’s a clear indication that the equitable share formula is not talking to the realities we are facing. We therefore welcome and support the review of this equitable share formula.

It is a well-known fact that Limpopo is a province adversely affected by the influx of immigrants from neighbouring countries and inland migratory labour practices, like our sister province, the Eastern Cape. With regards to the latter, the scenario is that economically active persons spend their career lives in the industrial provinces of Gauteng, and later come back to our province after retirement where they add to the numbers of those qualifying for receiving grants.

This kind of a situation leads to inaccurate budget projections and planning. It is in this connection that we would like to share with this House that in our attempt to reach out to the poor and the vulnerable, we find ourselves experiencing high overexpenditure on our budget. This is precisely due to the fact that year in year out our application intake rate exceeds both national and provincial targets by far. A further budget pressure emanates from the recent court judgment in favour of noncitizens.

It is interesting to note that while our total budget of R6,2 billion for the current financial year represents 25,7% of the total provincial budget, thus exceeding the national equitable share formula of 18%, in real terms it only reflects 92% for social assistance grants, with only 8% remaining for administrative costs and other social development services. The situation results in high levels of risk and corruption in our service due to staff shortages and inadequate infrastructure. It is our considered view that giving the social assistance grants often crowd out our provincial priorities. The shifting of the function to the agency would result in adequate funding for other social welfare services and poverty relief programmes that will subsequently fall under the provincial competence.

We remain confident that we will do all we can to continue exercising appropriate fiscal discipline without necessarily infringing on the rights of the poor and the vulnerable. We would like to take this opportunity to thank the Minister of Social Development for his relentless effort to make sure that no child goes to bed without having had a meal. With the conditional grant of R573 million for a child support grant extension for children aged nine and 10 this current financial year, we will be able to meet, if not exceed, the target in our province.

In spite of the budgetary challenges, we have successfully managed to implement policies and programmes that are focused on alleviating poverty. Amongst others, we have made significant interventions in various areas, such as subsidising 961 crèches with the intention to increasing the numbers during this current financial year. It is worth noting that most of these crèches are in rural areas. The department also supports the network for home-based care of persons infected and affected by HIV/Aids.

We have so far initiated community home-based care projects and drop-in centres to provide children with breakfast, lunch and supper, as well as an uniform for schooling. We anticipate establishing 18 more drop-in centres in this current financial year. The number of foster care placements stands at 11 984 for the past financial year, with an increasing backlog to be addressed. [Time expired.] [Applause.]

Mr R STADHOUER (Northern Cape): Hon Chairperson, maybe I should give one of my minutes to the MEC to conclude. Hon Ministers Dr Manto Tshabalala- Msimang and Dr Skweyiya, hon Deputy Ministers, hon MECs, hon members, allow me to also congratulate the Ministers, the Deputy Ministers and the MECs on their appointments to these positions, strategic to realising the concept of a people’s contract.

As we celebrate 10 years of democracy, it is important to consider the social gains that we have made in order to address the basic needs of our people. Since 1994 millions and millions of rands have been spent on the rendering of quality and excellent health care services to our country, and especially to the poorest of the poor. However, and I speak from the perspective of the Northern Cape, the vastness and the rural nature of the Northern Cape, the increasing demand for specialised services, the cross- border situation and the budgetary constraints that we experience, make service delivery difficult and very costly. Maybe these factors contributed to the overexpenditure you have mentioned, hon Minister. We take note of that and we are busy addressing these issues.

Nevertheless, the concept of a people’s contract to create jobs and eradicate poverty, but also to build a healthy caring nation, is slowly but surely coming into realisation. Therefore, the health budget of the Northern Cape focuses on employment strategies, cost containment measures, the quality of health care, the improvement of communication, the maintenance of health care facilities, a rollout programme for antiretrovirals, and learnerships to expand the volume of healthcare practitioners in our province.

We will maximise our labour component. We will be employing doctors, as well as enrolled and auxiliary nurses during this financial year. In addition, we will strengthen our relationship with NGOs and CBOs to ensure and grant them the opportunity to employ more volunteers in the health arena, like the Dots workers, the VCT and home-based caregivers. Very important, we will engage the social cluster to maximise service delivery in a co-ordinated, effective and efficient manner. It is important for us to investigate our policies towards service delivery areas to eradicate wastage and inefficiencies and, if needed, new policies will be developed. Current cost containment measures implemented in the previous financial year in key solving areas will be maintained at reasonable levels. As I mentioned earlier, the Financial Management Units within the department are being strengthened through the appointment of additional and appropriately qualified personnel at all levels of service delivery. Once again, taking into account the vastness and the ruralness of our province, it is imperative to have sound financial systems in place in order for us to spread our wings and to stretch our rands and cents to do more and to do better for our people. So, before October this year, all managers will be trained or refreshed on general financial management and the implementation of the PFMA.

Our Quality Assurance Unit will ensure that we focus and improve on the quality of health care throughout the province. We hope that the systems put in place to carry out the constitutional mandate of providing proper and safe health care to our people will bear fruit. In fact, we have now fully grasped the proverb that says, ``A journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step’’. In 1994 we took the first step, and now, a decade later, our people have more access to better healthcare services than they have ever enjoyed in this country before.

Together with that, the principles of Batho Pele should be instilled - not only in our provincial hospitals, in our clinics and in our big cities and towns, but should be spread throughout the province as a whole. The national objectives, as set out by the national Minister in her budget speech, support our vision as a department in the Northern Cape, which is to provide excellent, holistic, people-centred and affordable health care to all our people. We welcome the conditional grant to the Northern Cape to fund the HIV and Aids programmes. In July this year, the people of our province will also benefit from this conditional grant by also being able to access the antiretroviral treatment, thus joining the other provinces in South Africa with regards to this rollout. All systems are in place to start with this rollout programme.

Despite our commitment to the people of the Northern Cape, we support all recent legislation and amendments to earlier legislation passed. As the national Minister has stated, we need to strengthen the health care services in rural and underserved areas. This has rightly resulted in interventions like the scarce-skills allowances, as part of the Expanded Community Services System.

The implementation of community services for nurses as from January 2005 was well received and is a very positive step. In the Northern Cape we are pleased to announce that we are already seeing a renewed interest from our staff in moving into the smaller towns and villages of our province. While we continue to support and strengthen the treatment of other communicable diseases, the major part of our work is the thorough implementation of the Comprehensive Plan for the Management, Care and the Treatment of HIV and Aids. The allocation for HIV and Aids has been increased from R11,2 million from the previous financial year, to almost R31,8 million - an increase of almost 180%.

In conclusion, the health department of the Northern Cape will continue to carry out its objectives in line with the national Department of Health’s strategy. We are committed to achieving our vision through a decentralised, accountable, accessible and constantly improving health care system within available resources. I thank you. [Applause.]

Ms N M MADLALA: Chairperson, hon Ministers, hon Deputy Ministers, hon MECs from different provinces, hon members and comrades, when looking at our budget for this 10th year of democracy, it is perhaps appropriate to look back at how far we have come since the ANC first came into power.

One of the most important tasks that the ANC-led Government had with regard to health in 1994, was to ensure that every single South African, regardless of race, colour or creed, had access to essential health care. We had to deal with a racially fragmented health service that did not see fit to care for every sick person, but rather cared for only a few, to the detriment of the majority.

Clearly, a health system that discriminated against people along racial lines had no place in our new democracy. We, therefore, had to reconstruct and transform the health system completely to be in line with our new democratic agenda. Provinces, particularly those that had large stretches of rural areas, found themselves with little or no health facilities, and even less skilled doctors, nurses, pharmacists and other health professionals. Even in urban areas, public health facilities were overcrowded in black townships, and completely underutilised where they were located in white suburbs.

Hospitals were usually the first place people went to for even minor ailments, while clinics and day hospitals played a minor role to divert the pressure away from large hospitals. This influx led to long queues of people that could not even be serviced in a complete day, leaving people to come back again and again.

The majority of our people used public hospitals facilities, yet the private health care sector consumed 60% of health spending. This meant that private health care catered for only 25% of the population. However, it was particularly with regard to the price of medicines that this Government had to wage its biggest battle. All we wanted was that the ordinary person in Polokwane could go to the clinic and pay a reasonable price for the medication that would make her well again.

Instead, large pharmaceutical companies took our Minister to court and argued that we could not do parallel importation of generic medicines in order to bring down the prices of medicines. These companies were protective of profits to the detriment of the health of our people. Even such basics as the training of health care practitioners were done in racially segregated institutions. Largely white-run tertiary institutions were hostile towards black students entering these institutions, and made acceptance criteria deliberately out of reach of black students. Black professionals, therefore, were few and far in between.

So, one could take each aspect of health and would find that, generally, the health needs of the majority of our people were not a priority for the previous regime. Those who ran those health care institutions had extreme difficulty in understanding what we meant when we said we wanted access to health care for all. It, therefore, became a huge responsibility for the new leadership to try and turn around such a system, and bring about change that guaranteed that all of us would become a healthy nation.

The challenge, as during the first 10 years, remains there for us to try and implement some of the changes that we have put into our policies and legislation. The budget is the key to try and implement the new policy direction. For example, in programme three, health service delivery, where provincial and local spheres of government benefit, the funding has had to shift from those provinces which were historically advantaged and, therefore, had superior services to those provinces which were barely able to cope with the allocation given to them. Without this drastic shift in allocation, important services such as those for the prevention and control of diseases, hospital services, emergency medical services, human resource development and management, would not be implemented with equity as its cornerstone.

The department’s commitment to support the development of a sustainable network of hospitals is important for those provinces that are physically far removed from scarce skills. The network allows for learnt lessons to be supported, translated and shared by everyone in the network.

Also commendable is the hospital revitalisation programme, according to which 27 hospitals will be either upgraded or completely replaced. To anyone who has been to some of the provincial hospitals, this is clearly long overdue. Other provinces have had no hospitals at all, and people have had to cope with travelling great distances for services that should have been on their doorsteps. In some cases, they even had to go without professional services.

Primary health care is not reaching its full potential in provinces. There has been fluctuating spending patterns in primary health care since 1992, when public health spending on primary health care was 11% and was then increased to 21% in 1996. This fluctuation is attributed to the differing allocations between various municipalities. In the department’s own health sector strategic framework, 1999-04, or its 10-point plan, they undertook to speed up the delivery of an essential comprehensive primary health care package.

This means that there is a commitment to ensure that committees are active participants in their own health care and to increase access to and availability of primary health care services. Since primary health care is one of the key areas of focus for the ANC, we will be watching very carefully to see how the department copes with the variances between provinces and between local municipalities, to deliver primary health care during the second decade of democracy.

One of the ANC’s key areas of delivery in health is to strengthen the distribution of drugs, so that they can reach all of our people, and to ensure access to affordable medicine, including the implementation of generic substitutions and parallel importation.

If one has followed the recent outcry in the media regarding the objections raised by dispensing doctors who are opposed to having to apply for dispensing licences, and who have taken the Minister to task on this matter, as well as the outcry from the pharmacists and manufacturers, distributors, retailers and so forth, who are objecting to the control of a single exit price for medicine, then one can only wonder at the priorities of such people.

Already, we have people whose grave illnesses sometimes go untreated because the medicines are too expensive. This, despite the department’s requirement that all clinics and hospitals follow the essential drug list, which was geared to help control the cost of medicines and to give health professionals clear guidelines as to when to use the drugs. [Applause.] [Time expired.]

The MINISTER OF SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT: Madam Chairperson, in principle there is very little I want to say, except to agree in general with the trend of the discussion that has been going on here on the issues that have been raised by the hon members. I think it is generally what we all think should be happening. It can only happen if we all work together and ensure that not only the Government itself, but basically everybody participates in the process, not only of policy making and implementation, but also interacting and working very closely with our constituency.

However, I wish to raise one issue that concerned me a little, and specifically the statement that had been made by the hon member from the DA, Ms Lamola. She made some remarks about influx control, which leave much to be desired. Influx control is one of the things that made us who come from the Western Cape get into the struggle, and to struggle against the white apartheid regime. It hurts deep into our psyche, into our living, when someone tells us not to move anywhere from where we are. The majority of the people who joined the ANC from 1912 did that mostly because of the pass laws. If there is still South Africans who think in terms of that, then there is something radically wrong, first with the party which he or she comes from, or basically within his or her own thinking. I don’t expect that any member of this august body can really be thinking of influx control. This is a free country, with free movement. You claim to be liberals, and yet you want to stop the natives from coming from the Western Cape. That is not going to work! Thank you. [Applause.] UNGQONGQOSHE WEZEMPILO: Sihlalo, ngisukuma nokubonga ingxoxo yanamhlanje. Ngijabulile ikakhulukazi ukuthi oNgqongqoshe bezifundazwe basinike imibiko yokuthi sesisebenze kanjani ohlelweni lwezempilo. Kwesinye isikhathi ngiye ngicabange ukuthi abanye abantu abezwa kahle kodwa ngethemba ukuthi namhlanje sizizwele ngokwethu.

NgeSonto, laphaya kwami besivalelisa uDkt Nono Simelela osishiyayo, uNk Joanne Collinge - okhona lapha, noMnu Kgopolang Sikobe. Sidanse kwaze kwacishe kwasa sibavalelisa ngendlela ebekekileyo.

Ngaphambi kokuthi ngiphendule angicele ukuthi uma siqeda lapha sonke siye esitezi sesibili siyokwehlisa ngamanzi, sidle nenyamana encane ukuze sijabulele ukuthi ingxoxo yanamhlanje ibalulekile futhi ihambe kahle. (Translation of isiZulu paragraphs follows.)

[The MINISTER OF HEALTH: Chairperson, I stand up to thank you for today’s discussion. I am happy that the provincial ministers of health have given us feedback as to how we have worked with the health programme. I sometimes thought that other people did not understand clearly, but I hope that we all understood today?

On Sunday, at my place, we had a farewell party for Dr Nono Simelane who is leaving us; Ms Joanne Collinge who is present here, and Mr Kgopolang Sikobe. We danced until the early hours of the morning; it was a worthy farewell.

Before I respond, let me request that when we finish here, we all proceed to the second floor to have something to drink, and a meal to celebrate the importance of today’s discussion and its success.]

Thank you very much for the contributions. Ngifisa ukuhalalisela iPhini lami ngesinqumo esilithathile sokugijima nokudla kahle. Kodwa ngimyale ukuthi kufanele abeke imali eceleni yezingubo zokugqoka ngoba njengoba ehlisa umzimba wakhe kufanele athenge nezingubo ezimlinganayo ukuze zingalengi.

Bengithi angiqale ngokusho njalo bese ngibonga kakhulu ukuthi namhlanje kuthiwe ingxoxo yanamhlanje akube eyethu sobabili nozakwethu uDkt Sikweyiya. Sengiyabona futhi nalapha ukuthi onke amagama akhe niwafakile nathi Dkt Z S T, kepha kimina nathi Dkt M kuphela. Igama lami eliphelele nginguMantombazane Edmie Kate Tshabalala-Msimang owazalwa kwaCele. Bengingathokoza-ke uma nami ningase ninginikeze lawo magama ami wonke. Sihlalo, ngicela ungivikele, ngiyathethiswa ngalapha.

USIHLALO WOMKHANDLU KAZWELONKE WEZIFUNDAZWE: Uvikelekile.

UNGQONGQOSHE WEZEMPILO: Ngiyabonga. Ngithi ngiyajabula ukuthi sixoxile namhlanje … (Translation of isiZulu paragraphs follows.)

[I wish to congratulate my deputy for the decision he has made to start jogging and to follow a good diet. However, I have warned her to put money aside for clothing as she is losing weight, and she must buy properly fitting clothes so that her clothes do not hang loosely on her.

I thought it was necessary to start by saying that, and then thanking you for giving opportunities to both Dr Sikweyiya and me. I have also noted that you put all his initials, Dr Z S T, but I am just Dr M. My full names are Mantombazane Edmie Kate Tshabalala-Msimang, nee Cele. I would be happy if you could identify me with those names. [Interjections.] Chairperson, I plead for your protection. I am being shouted at.

The CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: You are protected.

The MINISTER OF HEALTH: Thank you. I am happy that we are having deliberations today …] … because I think it begins to indicate the manner in which we want to deliver services in our country. Regarding the success of the social security system …

… bengingakamtsheli uzakwethu ukuthi bengise-Spain kula masonto amabili edlulile. Ngifike ngaxoxa noNgqongqoshe omusha wezempilo khona ngase ngibona ukuthi mhlawumbe kungaba kuhle, zakwethu, uma singase sithumele ithimba khona liyobhekisisa i-social health insurance yakhona, ikakhulukazi ngoba iyona nto okudala isibalekela. Sihlale sithi siyayizama siyayizama kodwa kungaphumeleleki kahle.

Kodwa-ke siyoyixoxa uma sesiqedile lapha ngoba vele futhi sobabili sisebenzisana nohlelo lokunakekelwa kwabantu emakhaya, ukuvikelwa kokusetshenziswa kwezidakamizwa - uzakwethu omunye ukhulume kabanzi ngalokho - kanti futhi sibambisene nabantu abakhubazekileyo ekutheni singabasiza kanjani ukuze bakwazi ukuziphilela izimpilo zabo njengoba befuna. Kukhona futhi nokunakekelwa kwabantwana nabantu asebekhulile.

Ngizophawula mayelana nezinto ezimbili nje kuphela manje ngoba ngifuna ukuthi sisheshe siye phezulu siyophuza itiye, sidle nenyama. Ngifuna ukuthi kuNkk Vilakazi, cha, dadewethu, ngidumazeke kakhulu ngoba uyazi ukuthi abahlengikazi banezinhlangano zabo okuyiNehawu neDenosa. (Translation of isiZulu paragraphs follows.)

[… I have not informed my colleague that I was in Spain for two weeks, where I had discussions with that country’s new minister of health. I felt that it would be good if we could send a delegation to Spain to look at their social health insurance programme, particularly because it is the only thing that we have been lacking for a long time. We have been trying, but in vain. However, we will discuss it once we have finished here, because both of us are obviously working on the Social Development Programme. One of my colleagues spoke at length about the prevention of drug abuse; and we are working together with physically challenged people to see how we can assist them in living their lives as they wish. There is another programme on childcare and one on the elderly.

I will comment on two issues only, because I want us to finish early so that we could have a meal. I wish to say to Mrs Vilakazi: My sister, I am disappointed. As you are aware, nurses have their own organisations, which are Nehawu and Denosa.] So, I really am surprised that we can stand up here and be prepared to advocate for the rights of the nurses at the expense of the poor people who live in rural areas. I would have thought that we should be encouraging the department to say the nurses must go to the rural areas. I stand here very committed, and I said in the NA that if it means amending the Act, we should amend it, even if there is no new Nurses Act as yet.

I also want to say very clearly that we will not make rural allowances and scarce skills for people sitting in Cape Town, Durban and Pretoria. That is not what we are going to do! This money is meant for us to prioritise and ensure that we address issues of iniquity that we inherited in this country. Gone are the days when people in the rural areas did not receive adequate healthcare. So, I am indeed confirming in this House that these rural allowances are for that. [Applause.]

Of course, I understand that there are some provinces that are already paying senior management from these rural allowances, and I think we should debate this. We should debate this in the Minmec, and we should really find a solution to it, and we must take it back to the Bargaining Council because this is not what this money was meant for. Those provinces that have started doing that must really understand that this money was meant for the rural areas.

I also do thank Dr Buthelezi for commending us for the work that we do, but I just want Dr Buthelezi to understand what these allowances are for. We will not change course in terms of what these allowances are for.

Let me say that I was really enjoying the debate, until the DA spoke. I will not pronounce her name wrongly, because I wouldn’t want anybody to call me Shabalala, when I am Tshabalala. So, I won’t pronounce it, but she knows. You know sometimes they blow hot, sometimes they blow cold, and it is really very difficult to understand the gist of their argument. However, let me pose this question to her: Can she tell me of any developing and developed country that has such a comprehensive programme on HIV/Aids as we have? The whole world is commending us for this. Our own counterparts in South Africa stand up and criticise, but they have nothing to offer, and never had anything to offer! You can go to any developed or any developing country and compare the number of people who are now on anti-retroviral treatment with our number in this country. You will be surprised.

To those who have also debated issues surrounding HIV/Aids, I must again plead with all of us not to call it a roll-out ARV Programme, because it is not. Once you start doing that, we will forget prevention, we will forget care, we will forget all these other important components. We will even forget that we can go to traditional healers. I think we must be very careful how we refer to this programme. If it is difficult to say management support and care and so on, rather just call it comprehensive plan on HIV/Aids, and I would accept that. However, to give it a name which we did not present to Cabinet, I really do object to that.

I just want to say to those who debated the issue of HIV/Aids very briefly: I would like to refer you to the WHO website. I am not going to tell you what it says, but please go and look at the website. I would like to refer to the report by Bill Gates. Please, go and read that report. I would also like to refer you to the recent resolutions of the G8 countries. I would like you to go and get that information and read it out for yourselves because … I not going to say what it says. I am almost tempted to say what it says. … I think all of us must do our own work.

The last thing I want to say is that, as from 2 August 2004, the single exit price of medicines should be printed on the immediate container of the medicines. This price should be lower than the current one, as we are aiming to make medicines more affordable to our people. Some of us who have already been reading newspapers will have noticed that in less than a month the prices of medicines have come down by 16%. Shouldn’t we be celebrating that? I think we should! [Applause.]

What we are doing in our efforts of making medicines more affordable is in line with what other developed countries like Australia, New Zealand, Canada and the UK have done. Why don’t they want us to do the same, even about the doctors who are dispensing? I was surprised. I was in Zimbabwe on Thursday. In Zimbabwe no doctor may dispense until he or she has passed an examination, because they are taking care of their people. Why shouldn’t we do that in South Africa? They will never dispense without passing examination!

What I want to say is that we have ushered in groundbreaking transformation legislation in this regard. It will be helpful therefore if all the role- players - all of us, stakeholders and all - can embark on strategies that will enable our people, our doctors and our pharmacists in particular, to comply with the legislation rather than fight it.

I would like to welcome back Ms Johnson. Angimazi ukuthi muphi manje. Sengathi usehambile. [I don’t know where she is now. It looks like she is not here.] She was here before, and I would like to welcome her back, and I just want to say she must never ever refer to KwaZulu-Natal as a Cinderella province. It has never been that! All that we tried to do was to address issues of iniquity in this country. KwaZulu-Natal was getting more money than Limpopo. The Western Cape was getting more money than Mpumalanga, and Gauteng was getting more money than the Eastern Cape. So, what we sought to do was to ensure that we address those iniquities, to ensure that all our people are treated fairly and receive fair and affordable medicines and healthcare in this country. So, I am also confident that we will be able to turn around the tide of HIV/Aids in this country.

Let me just say to Dr Goqwana and Mr Sekoati that some of the senior officials in my department who come from your provinces, particularly the Eastern Cape, tell me that if they were to go back to the Eastern Cape and Gauteng and KwaZulu-Natal, and in particular leave the national Government, that would mean I must recruit more Cuban doctors. [Laughter.] So, we are happy to have them at the national office because at least they demonstrate that we have got this deal - these people really help us to do so well. Thank you very much. [Applause.]

Debate concluded.

The CHAIRPERSON OF NCOP: Hon Ministers, Deputy Ministers and MECs, let me thank you very much for being with us in this House for more than four hours.

What I want to say to the hon Ministers is that the approach that we are beginning to focus on as the NCOP, is this integrated approach. We can’t have social services without Social Welfare, Health and Home Affairs, because the three go together and will go a long way in addressing the problems that we are faced with. I want to thank you and the hon members very much for having stayed on since this morning at 10 o’clock up until now. Thank you very much. The Council adjourned at 18:30. ____

            ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS

National Assembly and National Council of Provinces

1. Reintroduction of Bills

 (1)    The Minister of Social Development


     On request of the Minister the following Bill, that lapsed  at  the
     end of the  Second  Parliament,  was  reintroduced  by  the  Select
     Committee on Social Services in the National Council  of  Provinces
     on 18 June 2004:


     (i)     Older Persons Bill [B  68  -  2003]  (National  Council  of
          Provinces - sec 76) [Explanatory summary  of  Bill  and  prior
          notice of its introduction published in Government Gazette  No
          25347 of 13 August 2003.]


     The Bill has been  referred  to  the  Select  Committee  on  Social
     Services of the National Council of Provinces.


          NOTE: This Bill was  introduced  by  the  Minister  of  Social
          Development in the National Assembly on 7 November  2003,  but
          he has now requested that it be reintroduced in  the  National
          Council of Provinces of the Third Parliament.


          The Bill was classified as a section  76  bill  by  the  Joint
          Tagging Mechanism (see Announcements, Tablings  and  Committee
          Reports of 17 November 2003).


          As the Bill reintroduced today has not been printed again, the
          information relating to the House of introduction  and  person
          in charge of the Bill, as reflected on the front page  of  the
          Bill, is incorrect. As mentioned above the Bill has  in  fact,
          on  request  of  the  Minister  of  Social  Development,  been
          reintroduced in the  National  Council  of  Provinces  by  the
          Select Committee on Social Services.