MONDAY, 14 JUNE 2004 __

          PROCEEDINGS OF THE NATIONAL COUNCIL OF PROVINCES
                                ____

The Council met at 14:01.

The Deputy Chairperson took the Chair and requested members to observe a moment of silence for prayers or meditation.

ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS - see col 000.

                         APPROPRIATION BILL

                         (Review of policy)

Vote No 4 - Home Affairs:

The MINISTER OF HOME AFFAIRS: Chairperson, hon members, dear friends, we are indeed very thankful for the opportunity to address this House on the occasion of the policy debate on our Budget Vote. This will be the first time that we present a budget to you since our appointment to the leadership of the Ministry of Home Affairs.

Over the past month or so since our appointment, we have taken some time to come up to speed with the challenges facing our department. Through the assistance of our management and staff, we have looked at possible ways of addressing most of these challenges. This year’s budget is based mainly on these possible solutions to these problems.

You may realise that this budget is designed as an intervention budget, as we have identified several key areas that need our urgent attention during this financial year if we are to start the process of turning our department around. The budget went before the National Assembly last Friday and, we hope, as was the case with the National Assembly, that hon members in this House will share our urgency and support us in the need to address some of the known problems we are encountering in the department.

During the debate in the National Assembly we brought to the attention of the House the situation of the !Xun and the Khwe communities of the San region in the Northern Cape. These people were used by the former SA Defence Force as trackers during the apartheid wars and were mostly recruited into the 31 Battalion section of the armed forces. Although some of their families were relocated and settled in South Africa in Schmidtsdrif, identity documents were only issued to those who had joined the SA Defence Force. The rest of the family particulars were recorded on combo cards and kept by the SADF.

We celebrated the passing of our first Budget Vote with members of this community on Friday, after having given them due recognition for the first time as citizens of our country. [Applause]. Eight hundred of them are now proud holders of the new, green bar-coded ID. This has demonstrated our commitment to ensuring that where our department was used as a source to humiliate others in the past, we will find a way of using our services to give back a level of dignity to all South Africans.

Today the Department of Home Affairs continues to exist, and we are still involved in the activities of civil registration and the maintenance of a population register, including the issuing of identity documents. A great difference, however, is the fact that we now have a state whose priorities are based on a completely different premise from those who ruled our country in the 1940s and 1950s when resistance to pass laws intensified.

We have made a call on all South Africans to come forward to be registered and issued with a green bar-coded identity document, which serves as a tool to guarantee their South African-ness, an identity they can be proud of and one that reverses the historical dehumanisation and segregation of our people. Although it was introduced during the dying years of apartheid, over the past 10 years we have used the existence of a single, uniform population register for all South Africans as a means of unifying our country with a common identity and patriotism.

I am quite encouraged by the fact that more South Africans are requiring these IDs as they increasingly realise their importance in their everyday lives. We are happy that these IDs have been used as the key for the majority of people to access Government services in the form of health care, social grants, education, housing and other services.

We made a commitment to the public last week that by April 2005 the Department of Home Affairs would institute a survey aimed at determining the extent of the problem regarding adult South Africans who have never had identity documents. The result of this survey will be useful in the planning cycle of the department and in determining the scope and nature of the ID campaign. Some of the findings of this survey will also help us determine issues of policy regarding the late registration of births and the curbing of abuse of this provision. We will also be able to determine how many South Africans have still not converted to the green bar-coded ID in order to decide whether we should set a deadline for such conversion.

It should be worrying to us that 18 years after the introduction of the new ID, there are South Africans who still carry the old reference book, book of life or dompas. It is important that the department, as a custodian of valuable data on population dynamics, has precise information on the extent of the need for its services experienced particularly by our citizens.

We believe that the finalisation of the Home Affairs National Identity System, Hanis, will play a role in ushering in this new approach to the gathering and dissemination of data. The turnaround objectives of our IT establishment seek to achieve several target outputs over the period of the MTEF and beyond, and they include the full computerisation of our offices within the coming five years; the upgrading of our IT infrastructure to ensure full data connectivity to all our offices capable of handling increased data traffic, including the use of satellite technology for remote areas and mobile units; the upgrading of Hanis into an integrated biometric database for all people served by the department, incorporating our population register, moving control system, refugee database, visa system and our stop lease.

In the long term, if we have a reliable civic registration process, it will become central to the provision of data regarding population trends and that, at least at the level of counting, it will not necessarily look at counting people through a census every five years. We currently have several policies and operational initiatives with Statistics SA in this regard.

We continue to receive many complaints from the public about the spate of fraudulent marriages registered in the records of the department. Our current strategic plan for the MTEF reflects prominently our campaign to assist women who find themselves trapped in this and similar situations.

At a public level there is a need for the department to create the necessary capacity for women to come forward and verify their marital status as reflected in our records. Women who are married in terms of customary unions will also be allowed the opportunity to check whether their marriages are registered or not. We intend for this to become a standing programme of the department. We will seek partnerships with key stakeholders and relevant state institutions in the implementation of this campaign.

Members will recall that in 2002 we launched the accelerated birth registration campaign in Khayelitsha. This was largely a response to the call by the President that close to 3 million children remained outside the social safety net because they were not registered for child support grants as a result of the lack of enabling documents, such as birth certificates and IDs, for both these children and their care-givers. I am happy to report to this House that since the launch of that campaign, the department has been working in partnership with departments of social services at national and provincial levels and that although Cabinet had envisaged that we should reach a target of 3,2 million registered children by the end of 2004, this partnership has already covered children in excess of 4 million and ensured their registration in the safety net. [Applause.]

We see our contribution through this birth registration as a poverty alleviation initiative that allows for many vulnerable children to have access to basic services from the Government. During the month of August, we will initiate and intensify a drive to ensure better linkages between the Department of Home Affairs and hospitals and clinics where children are born in order to provide essential registration of children born in these health facilities.

Our roll-out of mobile units will also serve this campaign specifically in rural areas. All the initiatives that we are raising, or have referred to, are about the need to improve levels of service delivery within the Department of Home Affairs. No other priority can be more urgent for us than this one. We designed our planning processes in such a manner that every other priority should be aimed at attaining this improvement in service delivery levels.

One of the key priority areas in the improvement of service delivery levels is the urgent need to ensure that services offered by the department are conveniently accessible to all citizens who require them. It has been a trend, due to the planning priorities of the previous government, that most of our offices are located in towns and other urban centres. This has meant that our people in rural areas and informal settlements are the ones who travel long distances, wait in long queues and spend money they normally do not have in order to receive services from the department.

I said last week in the National Assembly that it will be necessary for us to commit ourselves before that House, and before this House too, to change things, as it is not acceptable that our offices should remain the greatest source of frustration for the people who come to us for one sort of service or another. In this regard, I have requested the department to conduct an audit of our infrastructure needs, aimed at ensuring that we are able to lessen the inconvenience to our clients when they need to access our services.

In this budget we have allocated R67 million to secure mobile units, and I want to emphasise that because in the National Assembly we made a mistake by reporting that we had allocated R14 million. We now want to put it on record that, in fact, the amount is R67 million that will be used to secure mobile units, which will be ready for utilisation before the end of this financial year. [Applause.]

Due to the fact that our capital works roll-out programme will not be able to build a new office in each one of the rural villages and wards, it will still be necessary that some interim arrangements be made in order to ensure the presence of the department in every corner of the country. In this regard, we will convert containers into service points in some of the most remote areas of our country as a stopgap measure to provide services to our people. These will at least ensure that people do not have to travel long distances only to fill in an application form or for the collection of their IDs and other certificates.

Hon members, as already announced, we will launch a community-volunteer campaign to clean up our offices, some of which are in a serious state of dilapidation, in order to ensure that a more pleasant environment exists in our offices for all our clients. This launch takes place this Friday 19 June 2004. In the spirit of Ilima, we invite hon members to be part of this campaign.

Still on the matter of service delivery, for quite some time there have been concerns about the fact that the department is not adequately capacitated to fulfil its mandate. This has had a serious impact on service delivery levels in the department.

I must share with the House that another key priority for us is the need to acquire the necessary human resources and financial capacity required for us to fulfil our mandate. We have since adopted a new organisational establishment based on a scientific assessment of the necessary human resources capacity required for us to deliver effectively and efficiently. Since the start of this financial year in April, we have filled more than 500 vacancies. It is our intention to fill a further 1 000 posts during this year, including at the level of our front line offices. At the senior management level we have advertised for 19 posts. You must have seen that yesterday. There were six additional vacancies, which appeared in the Sunday papers.

In his state of the nation address, the President emphasised the need for us to finalise the policy framework for immigration in the country within three months. This directive meant that the current impasse regarding the regulations for the Immigration Act needs to be resolved within the deadline provided by the President.

We have since started this process within the committee of Ministers established by Cabinet to deal with this matter. We have agreed that in order to resolve some of the problems within the current regulations, we need to make certain changes to the Act itself. In the short term we are only looking at effecting those amendments that are necessary to finalise the regulations in order to meet the three months’ deadline given by the President in his state of the nation address.

It is our intention, therefore, to seek Cabinet’s approval to introduce the Immigration Amendment Bill to Parliament, and to finalise its processing by the end of August. For us it is urgent that South Africa should have an immigration policy regime that is responsive to the needs of the country in the areas of attracting direct foreign investment, encourages tourism and contributes to economic growth through the attraction of skills.

While it is necessary for us to protect employment opportunities for our own citizens, it will also be important that our immigration policy should not hinder our contribution to the improvement of the socioeconomic conditions of our neighbouring countries. This will be a delicate balancing act indeed.

Understandably, due to our international obligations, specifically to Africa where we have some of the poorest nations of the world, the refugee community within the country has been growing. There is a justified expectation that due to its position as a beacon of hope, South Africa should be able to lend a helping hand to those who have to flee their homes due to wars and human rights issues - conflicts. Therefore, as you know, we also have economic refugees in this country.

The challenge for us in the immediate term is to ensure that we reduce the amount of red tape and frustration that normally accompany the processing of applications by asylum seekers. The red tape and delays have meant that even those people who do not need protection end up abusing our hospitality. The sooner we shorten the time for processing these applications and deal with the current backlog of applications, the better it will be for our service delivery imperatives as well as for our country’s security.

In this regard, our new organisational establishments make provisions for an increase in the number of refugee status determination officers in order to provide the necessary capacity required for the efficient processing of applications. It is necessary that our policies and operations should strike a balance between providing protection to those who need it and addressing our security concerns.

We have all the intentions of dealing harshly with those who undermine our borders and our security by sneaking illegally into the country. This is because, in a country such as ours, it is not necessary to come in illegally because you can present yourself to any of our embassies and apply for any one of the many temporary residence permits, work permits, study permits or whatever permit, as there are so many and they are never unreasonably denied.

In line with our commitment to provide better service, I have also requested the department to conduct an audit of all the foreign missions where we do not have Home Affairs services around the continent of Africa. At this stage, because of our role in the Nepad, people who come from certain states in Africa should not have to travel around the continent just to get a South African visa in order to visit South Africa.

We are still committed to the upgrading of our ports of entry in order for them to be of a standard and image that sells our country positively to visitors who come here. The programme for the efficient administration of the border posts will, of necessity, be an interdepartmental one, including the other departments that work on the borders. At a Cabinet-cluster level, we have agreed on the integrated approach that has seen the adoption of the border control co-ordinating committee to ensure multi-agency planning and co-ordination.

Similar multi-agency initiatives have also been put in place with regard to the important issue of fighting corruption within the department. We have already decided to upgrade our anticorruption unit into a chief directorate. The work of this unit is already visible, hon members, in the many arrests that the police have effected as a result of the initial investigations within the department. The challenge, however, is to find a more proactive approach to dealing with corruption involving the retraining of staff, screening of our appointments, gathering of intelligence to ensure that we prevent corruption, rather than reacting to it when there is already damage to the integrity of our systems.

It must be stressed, hon members, that most of the good intentions we have might just become a pipe-dream if we do not have the kind of vehicle with the correct mindset to carry this task forward. We noted reports about the levels of morale amongst our staff, and it is encouraging that we have been presented with plans to deal with this problem. For us, these are some of the transformation priorities facing our department. There is a need to make sure that the psychological make-up of our staff is at all times one that is beneficial to these priorities. We will also be addressing seriously the matter of the gender imbalances within our managerial structures.

Lastly, I need to point out that most of the things that we have raised here are urgent, and we will need you, hon members, to give us all the support that we need. At times we will put you under a lot of pressure to pass legislation within very short periods of time, such as the one we are passing in the National Assembly tomorrow, which amends the Electoral Act. We will require your support. It is not our intention to undermine the legislature; however, we require your support to do all this because we have to move with speed and steam ahead to make sure that things do happen.

At the end of the day, our work will be judged on the basis of our contribution to making the lives of ordinary South Africans a little more bearable. That is the challenge that the department is facing. I thank you, hon members. [Applause.]

The DEPUTY CHAIRPERSON OF THE NCOP: Thank you, hon Minister, may I also take this opportunity to thank you. On behalf of this wonderful House, the NCOP, I wish to congratulate you on your appointment as a Minister of Home Affairs. We have all the trust in you, and this House in playing its oversight function will do its best to assist the department. We thank you very much, Minister.

Mrs J MASILO: Deputy Chairperson, hon Minister, Director-General and officials from the Department of Home Affairs, and hon members of this august House, as the acting chairperson of the Select Committee on Social Services may I start by congratulating the Minister and the Deputy Minister in absentia on their new appointments in the Ministry of Home Affairs. Your appointments as Ministers are so appropriate as you head a presidency department such as home affairs; and you are presidents in your own rights

• ANC Women’s League and ANC Youth League respectively. [Applause.] Mmangwana o tshwara thipa ka mo bogaleng. (A real mother is the one who protects her children even in difficult situations.)

I cannot overemphasise the vision your leadership is giving to a department that takes care of the lives of South Africans from cradle to grave, and the people from all over who visit, stay or work in our country. It has become clear, from the budget briefing we received from the department and the concerns addressed in the department’s turn-around strategy and strategic plan, that as a committee we need to fasten our safety belts. In my own experience, the work starts now. This department has from a public perspective, the primary task of providing identification to all South African citizens. The Batho Pele principle must be demonstrated at the Department of Home Affairs. People first and service excellence is the vision of this department.

The intervention by the President in the implementation of immigration regulations is an urgent matter for attention. It has to happen within three months from the date of announcement and the end of August 2004 is the target time.

As for the roll-over this will soon be an experience of the past with the kind of strategic plan and turn-around strategy before us. Indications are clear that the budget approved will be utilised within each financial year of the Medium-Term Expenditure Framework. The strategic posts within the Department of Home Affairs are about to be finalised. This is a very important wheel of delivery in a department beyond appointments, and the culture of Batho Pele needs to be implemented in new appointments, promotions or transfers.

The need to upgrade information technology systems in the department is crucial. The integration of the IT system is important. Officials at the regional offices have to be monitored with ease from Civitas building in the Headquarters in Pretoria. Many papers that are stored as records have to be computerised and accessed with ease from any point in the country. We also recognize that the department, through its strategic plan, is budgeting for a new system of tracking and tracing applications for identity documents. This envisaged system, we believe, will assist in the investigation of various acts of corruption, including fraud and the contravention of the Birth and Death Registration Act as well as the Identification Act.

This department has, certainly from a public perspective, the primary task of providing identification to all South African citizens. To most in the First World and those South Africans to whom the indignity of being a citizen without a country is a suppressed memory, the question of identification may not seem such an important issue. However, to the majority in South Africa, citizenship and identity is a very sensitive issue. It is an issue fraught with humiliation and deprivation of citizenship because a racist government said that millions of its people did not have the right credentials to be citizens. We were treated as foreigners in the country of our birth. We fought many personal and collective battles to retain the right to be identified as South Africans, despite those who legislated that we needed to carry a dompas, the book of life, Nkitse gore ke mang, and Lokwalo la mosepele of the former Bophuthatswana and other Bantustans to gain entry into white neighbourhoods and international countries.

With this kind of history the department is duty-bound to relentlessly pursue a seemingly impossible mission of bringing ID documents to every single South African, even those who choose to live in the remotest and most impassable terrains in our country. We are therefore encouraged that the department has embarked upon and caused a turn-around strategy to address the restoration of the dignity of our people, as well as many administrative, infrastructural and legislative changes needed in its budget. We are further encouraged that the issue of fraudulent marriages which plagues our women who are trapped in marriages without their consent, or who are bribed to marry unscrupulous foreigners, will be addressed. We look forward to legislative and regulatory changes that will protect our poor and vulnerable women.

We are also encouraged that corrupt practices will be eliminated; such cases where an immigration officer based in Pretoria District Office was arrested on 12 May 2004 for allegedly accepting bribes. We are finding, especially at our offices at the ports of entry, that our officials are inundated with illegal propositions from potential immigrants who enter our country. With the most recent discovery of 12 alleged corrupt officials arrested in Bloemfontein, members of this select committee have further proof that the Department of Home Affairs is serious about rooting out corruption.

Already the new premises of the department in Randfontein District Offices serve as an encouragement to us that the pace of erecting new building sites is on an upward and not downward spiral. We are glad that it will no longer serve as a district but as a regional office. Even with these upgrades, an implementation of the Hanis reloaded project, the department will have its plate full in view of the enormous backlogs that still exist in its information technology.

We are happy to support this budget and encourage the department to fulfil all the tasks it has set for itself in the turn-around strategy. Lastly, the local government elections are just around the corner and as a select committee we want to know about the readiness of the department and its municipal electoral preparedness. This issue of ID documents to all South Africans is still an urgent matter. The accessibility to the department and the increase in mobile units planned by the department will come in handy for this operation.

In conclusion, I am delighted to learn that during the debate in the National Assembly on Friday, a number of members of the Khoisan community were part of the proceedings. The number of outstanding ID applications for this community that needs to be processed has to be sped up for them to be able to participate in the local government election. I fully support Budget Vote No 4. Ke a leboga. [I thank you.] [Applause.]

Mr M A SULLIMAN: Deputy Chairperson, let me follow in the footsteps of my colleagues by congratulating the Minister on her appointment in this department, as well as the Deputy who is not currently with us today. I would also like to congratulate the department for the identity documents that were distributed to the Khoe and the Kwe communities in the Northern Cape. I think that if we start in this way, we will go a long way. The ANC has been at the forefront of instigating changes in the policy and vision of all departments, but it was particularly interested in the performance of this department in the delivery of vital documents. The delivery of these documents meant that the ordinary citizens would then be able to have access to a wide range of government services like social grants, health services, housing and other services as well as the delivery of a free and fair electoral process, which was and remains a cornerstone of the work of this department.

It would therefore be fair to say that the vast bulk of services expected from Home Affairs depends, to a large extent, on a highly sophisticated information technology infrastructure. In the ANC’s own assessment of service delivery to the provinces, the offices of the department have been found to have long queues, long waiting periods and even longer and unnecessary return journeys to check whether documents applied for have already arrived. Meanwhile other governments departments that could offer IT support to Home Affairs to alleviate the situation could not do so because invariably where there were networks in the department, these systems were not incompatible with those systems already used by other departments. In addition to the handicap of incompatibility between systems, offices at the ports of entry do not have instant access to mainframes within the department to do verification of documentation. In fact, many of these offices are not even computerized. This also holds true for many rural and peri-urban home affairs offices. Overall, the ANC have found that Home Affairs offices are almost totally paper-based and where they have computers, it is severely lacking in innovative IT systems.

Over and above the general use of information technology to deliver its services, the department has had for many years now a noble idea in the form of a new smart-card system called the Home Affairs National Identification System, or the Hanis project. The idea was conceived in 1993 and received Cabinet approval in 1996 and according to the department, this Hanis system would be linked to a centralised database housing the existences and activities of all South African citizens, thereby bringing us rapidly into the 21st century.

While no one doubts that it is vital that we are able, through a foolproof system such as Hanis, to verify that an individual is indeed whoever he or she claims to be, the only problem is that this system is not yet fully up and running. Millions of rands have already been spent to make sure that this system is implemented, but all is not lost. The new Minister and the Deputy Minister, together with the not-so-new director-general have already identified this IT area as a critical intervention area. They have in their turnaround strategy, and in their strategic plan of 2004-05 and 2006-07, set very clear target dates for each area of the IT upgrades to be implemented. They should be commended under their Hanis reloaded vision for introducing a phased-in approach to implement a new national ID card. Once the information technology is thrust into the 21st century, the next ten years of implementation should be easier to manage.

This need for sophisticated information technology is especially true in our new democracy. With South Africa’s peaceful transition to democracy, the global community now has increasingly looked towards our shores as a tourist mecca, putting additional pressure on Home Affairs to deliver travel documentation on a far larger scale than ever before. In fact, the ports of entry around the country recorded that in 1994 we had 3,8 million visitors and this number dramatically increased to 6,5 million in 2002. Similarly, our new democracy provided sanctuary for over 5 000 asylum seekers and refugees from across the continent of Africa, with this number increasing to over 20 000 in 2002.

At the same time, while Home Affairs provides legal means to enter our country, they also are fighting an increasing tidal wave of illegal immigrants testing our border control and efficacy in tracking and tracing documents issued to legitimate citizens. Indeed, the department seems to be throwing good money after bad when it comes to our attempts to stem the tide of illegal immigrants resulting in the repatriation of 150 000 illegal immigrants per year. Somewhere in the execution of their responsibility and in the processing of service delivery outputs much money is being spent and a foolproof national identification system and electronic document management system will certainly ease this problem as well as the financial burden placed on the department.

The ANC knows that this department is without doubt one that is in the transition phase of transformation and still lags far behind other departments. By its own assessment, the department has acknowledged a number of key areas where drastic changes are needed in order to meet the implementation requirements of the second 10 years of democracy. We are however encouraged that since September 2003, with the arrival of the new DG, the department has already shown an increased focus on ensuring that we can deliver to our people. The ANC is also confident that since the 2004 elections and appointment of the new Minister and Deputy Minister, we will see a dramatic change in the face of Home Affairs.

The ANC has looked at the expenditure trends of this department, especially the expenditure increases in the budget for the Hanis project. In the past we have not been particularly impressed with the track record of underspending. However, we are impressed that the department is now more focused and that its growth in MTEF takes on board the upgrading and development of mainframe information and communication technology. We concur with the National Treasury’s approval of the utilization of the savings realised in December 2003 of R79, 249 million for the turn-around strategy. We encourage the Ministry to continue with its good work in implementing the crucial interventions in the way it has done thus far.

I want to make use of this opportunity to also congratulate the department for the allocation, which was given to the Northern Cape regional office. There is an increased amount and that will assist us a great deal. Minister, you spoke about the R67 million mobile units that are going to be implemented for this financial year. I think another idea perhaps is for us to look at municipalities in our small towns. Can we not utilise those offices as well, in order to assist our people to apply for the ID documents? In conclusion, I want to thank the Minister and the Deputy Minister and we in the ANC support this Budget Vote. Thank you. [Applause.] Ms H LAMOELA: Hon Chairperson, hon Minister, hon members, allow me to extend sincere congratulations to the Minister on her appointment as Minister of Home Affairs. I am indeed looking forward to solutions to so many of our problems with her being there.

Laat my toe om n wyle stil te staan, en namens die DA ons innige medelye uit te spreek teenoor die bedroefde ouers van wyle Saydie Booysen, wie se moeder blykbaar verbind is aan die personeel van Binnelandse Sake, wat Maandagaand in n koeëlreën in haar moeder se arms gesterf het. Ons harte bloei vir die Booysen-familie van Hanover Park, en ons bid hul sterkte toe vir die dae vorentoe. Nóg een te veel onskuldige kind wat die lewe verlaat het. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)

[Allow me to pause for a while and, on behalf of the DA, convey our sincere condolences to the bereaved parents of the late Saydie Booysen, whose mother is apparently linked to the personnel of Home Affairs, who died in a hail of bullets in her mother’s arms on Monday evening. Our hearts bleed for the Booysen family of Hanover Park, and we pray for strength for them in the days ahead. Another innocent child too many who has died.]

Mr Barry Gilder, Director-General of Home Affairs said:

Home Affairs determines whether each of us exists in the Government’s eyes. It registers births, deaths and marriages, and issues identity documents. Its services are fundamental to citizens to exercise their democratic rights.

The Government of South Africa has a duty to ensure the overall welfare of its entire citizenry. Therefore the Department of Home Affairs plays a pivotal role by identifying citizens of the country. The Director-General of Home Affairs has admitted that too many obstacles, such as lack of rural offices, properly trained staff, corruption, dilapidated buildings and offices and inadequate equipment are still hampering the department in fulfilling its lawful duties.

Ek haal aan uit Die Burger van 11 Junie 2004:

Die korrupsie in Binnelandse Sake is so erg dat ek lankal baie amptenare summier sou afgedank het as ek kon. Net Suid-Afrika se goeie arbeidswette het my verhoed.

So het ons agb Minister van Binnelandse Sake Vrydag in haar begrotingsrede wat grootliks aan die regruk van die departement gewy was, gesê.

Die erkenning van die ontsaglike probleem van korrupte amptenare wat toegelaat het dat swendelaars van Nigerië en elders Suid-Afrika se stelsel vir identifikasie besmet, het duidelik tot die strategiese plan van herskepping van die departement bygedra. Een van die sleutelareas van verbetering van dienslewering is dat alle dienste deur die departement gelewer, bereikbaar en gerieflik vir alle burgers van Suid-Afrika - selfs gestremdes - moet wees. Mense het deesdae net nie die fondse of tyd om 80- 100 km ver te reis om geboortes, sterffes of huwelike te registreer, of om identiteitsdokumente af te haal of dokumentasie te voltooi, net om maande later uit te vind dat daar geen rekord van is nie. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)

[I quote from Die Burger of 11 June 2004:

Die korrupsie in Binnelandse Sake is so erg dat ek lankal baie amptenare summier sou afgedank het as ek kon. Net Suid-Afrika se goeie arbeidswette het my verhoed.

This is what our hon Minister of Home Affairs said in her budget speech on Friday, which was mainly devoted to straightening out the department.

The acknowledgement of the enormous problem of corrupt officials, who made it possible for swindlers from Nigeria and elsewhere to taint South Africa’s identification system, clearly contributed to the strategic plan to transform the department. One of the key areas in the improvement of service delivery is that all services rendered by the department should be accessible and convenient to all citizens of South Africa, even the disabled. These days people just don’t have the necessary funds or time to travel 80 - 100 km to register births, deaths or marriages, or to collect identity documents or to complete forms, only to discover months later that no record of that exists.]

As the Department of Home Affairs continues to work within the broad framework of construction and development, we have to address the problem of implementation of limited resources and of the impact of factors and circumstances in order to improve the quality of lives of all South Africans. The department has, for instance, already spent R1 billion on the Hanis project, without any significant results. The huge amount of unclaimed identity documents countrywide is of great concern. What guarantee do we have that each will be delivered to the rightful owners?

In 2002, more than 1,2 million refugees moving around South Africa in a long and perilous journey, were women and children. They often become victims of abuse and are ill-treated on the way. Most refugees and illegal immigrants are hawkers on our streets, do odd jobs to support themselves or depend on relief organisations. Employment of our own citizens should be protected, seeing that we too are battling with a huge unemployment rate. Fraudulent marriages registered at the Department should be investigated, because it is women who eventually find themselves in these situations. The nightmare of having these marriages annulled is unmentionable, besides it being a costly, long, drawn-out affair. The sooner backlogs and internal problems in the Department of Home Affairs are dealt with, the better for our country’s security. Needless to say, that priority should be given to the most competent applicants applying for positions to enable the department to get to the standard of effective and efficient service delivery to our communities.

The morale of some staff in Home Affairs is of great concern. Temporary posts should be finalised into permanent ones to allow staff to perform to the best of their and their department’s ability.

Die uitdaging lê juis in voorkoming en uitwissing van korrupsie, eerder as in die herbouing van beskadigde departementele stelsels. Die spreuk sê mos: “Prevention is better than cure.”

Ons, in die DA, verwelkom en steun die herstelpogings wat deur die departement aangepak gaan word. Ons waardeer dit. Ons sal die herstelpogings dophou en hoop dat dit nie ook maar weer ‘n leë belofte sal wees nie. Ek dank u. [Applous.] (Translation of Afrikaans paragraphs follows.)

[The challenge lies in precisely the prevention and eradication of corruption, rather than in the restructuring of damaged departmental systems. After all, the proverb goes: ``Prevention is better than cure.’’

We in the DA welcome and support the restructuring efforts that will be initiated by the department. We appreciate it. We will keep an eye on watch these restructuring efforts and we hope that this will not just be another empty promise. I thank you. [Applause.]]

Mr K SINCLAIR: Hon Chairperson, the New NP has over the past few years on numerous occasions expressed its grave concern about the state of the Department of Home Affairs. Various reports have confirmed what the New NP has been saying all along, namely that corruption, misadministration and lack of service delivery in this department must be a serious concern.

There is no doubt that the Department of Home Affairs needs a lot of attention and that the responsibility stops right at the new Minister’s door. The NNP wants to add its voice to congratulating the Minister and the new Deputy Minister on their appointment. The people of South Africa are becoming increasingly impatient with this department’s inability to perform its core functions. The previous Minister always blamed everyone else for his department’s problems. We are all politicians. It’s strange that the DA did not today attack the IFP. Maybe it’s because of their election agreement. [Laughter.]

During the past few years the Department of Home Affairs has become synonymous with incompetence and alleged large-scale corruption. The new Minister of Home Affairs has inherited a department that has great challenges. She has only been in her new portfolio a short while, but it is evident that she intends to clean up this department. It seems that there is indeed a new broom.

Every person in South Africa, citizens and noncitizens, come in contact with the Department of Home Affairs. Therefore, it is vital that the new Minister must get her Department in order. It not only places South Africa in a bad light with foreigners, but also hampers service delivery in this country.

The optimal functioning of the department is to provide enabling documents to people, and is crucial for our everyday existence. Enabling documents are also vital to all our people so that they can obtain employment, state grants and participate in the economy. By not providing such documents, the department is contributing to unemployment and poverty. There are too many people who are unable to apply for state grants and their pensions, because they do not have bar-coded identity documents.

The long-awaited Hanis card, on which the government has already spent R1 billion, will play a very important role in reducing fraud. It is shocking that two decades after the introduction of the new identity document there are still South Africans who carry old reference books, books of life and even the dompass.

Daarom is die NNP verheug dat die nuwe Haniskaart binne die volgende drie maande geïmplimenteer gaan word. Ons engiste bekommernis is of die department oor die administratiewe kapasiteit beskik om die terugwerkende byvoeging van identiteitsdokumente op papier na die elektroniese stelsel oor te dra. (Translation of Afrikaans paragraph follows.)

[Therefore the New NP is delighted that the Hanis card will be implemented within the next three months. Our only concern is whether the department has the administrative capacity to transfer the retrospective addition of identity documents on paper to an electronic system.]

There are currently almost 300 vacant posts within the Department of Home Affairs. The majority of senior director posts in the department are filled by people in an acting capacity, and some of them have been employed in an acting position for four to five years. If the Minister doesn’t act now, she will have a department that is crippled due to a lack of qualified and efficient staff.

Die meeste van hierdie probleme is niks nuuts vir ons nie, aangesien dit voortspruit uit mnr Buthelezi se tydperk as Minister van Binnelandse Sake. [Gelag.] Daarom wil die NNP die Minister van Binnelandse Sake sterkte toewens. Sy gaan dit werklik nodig kry. [Most of these problems are not new to us, since they emanate from the period when Mr Buthelezi was Minister of Home Affairs. [Laughter.] That is why the NNP wishes the Minister of Home Affairs well. She will really need it.]

The Department of Home Affairs is such a crucial department that has to run smoothly. There are many challenges facing the Minister of Home Affairs. Does the Minister have the commitment, the willpower, the determination and the ability to deal with these issues? The New NP believes she has.

The NNP supports this Vote. I thank you. [Applause.]

Mr J O TLHAGALE: Hon Chairperson, hon Minister and the hon House, I am impressed by this Budget Vote debate in which the department has come out very clearly, and in no uncertain terms, to sell to us their turn-around strategy. In the briefings and other presentations that I attended their watchword was around this turn-around strategy and on focusing on the way forward. This presentation of a turn-around strategy reminds me of an old biblical story of a young man who went to a far-off country in search of a better life. Unfortunately he came face-to-face with famine and ended up looking after pigs. However, the most wonderful thing about this story is that he came to his senses and changed strategies. He returned home and was received unconditionally by his father. If a man comes and says things went horribly wrong in the far-off country, and that he is sorry, there is no room for further accusations. The UCDP is geared to concentrating on the way forward rather than on past weaknesses.

I notice that R77,6 million is budgeted for capital projects during the current financial year, and that a sizeable slice of that cake would be for capital projects such as Home Affairs offices for North West, my province. I find it comparatively speaking more worthwhile that offices would be relocated to the rural areas to be as near as possible to the majority of our people. This means that this department, in our province, would in future be less dependent on other departments in terms of office accommodation and transport services than was previously the case, and that is commendable.

In the spending of that budget, the department would at the same time be addressing the problem of joblessness and poverty, which are some of the major problems that we as a country must contend with. With these few words, the UCDP supports this Budget Vote. I thank you. [Applause.]

Ms M N MADLALA-MAGUBANE: Thank you, Deputy Chairperson, hon Ministers, hon members, comrades and the House at large, my input will dwell on the service rendered to the citizens, which is Programme 2 of the department. The budget allocation for services to citizens this current financial year is R152,227 million. The amount rolled over to continue work on the Electronic Document Management System is R19,693 million. Spending on the programme accounts for an annual average of 40,9% of the vote for the Medium Term Expenditure Framework, the MTEF.

There is a high level of spending on the filling of crucial vacant posts and the Home Affairs National Identification System, Hanis, including the smart card system. It is a turn-around strategy. Hon Lamoela, the department does not waste money on that system. I would like to emphasise that. Of the total allocation for this programme over the MTEF-period, spending on personnel costs consumes 39,6%, and the Hanis project 38,9%.

There are key challenges and bottlenecks faced by the Department of Home Affairs on service delivery. The process of addressing fraudulent practices in obtaining citizenship is continuing. The Department is undertaking critical interventions in all business processes to develop an integrated action plan for improving systems and processes to provide clients with efficient and effective services in the spirit of Batho Pele. Some of these interventions are transforming service delivery through an expansion of the staff complement and reorganising the department’s physical infrastructure through upgrading and refurbishment.

I would like to mention to this House that one of the major challenges faced by the department is that the department itself is underresourced. All of us in this House know very well that prior to 1994 some people were sidelined, and not all people were South Africans. But immediately after 1994, all people became South African citizens. The vast majority of our people had been left out of the mainstream of citizenship. Some people who were unregistered lived far from centres where they could register themselves. Some of those registered had their details entered wrongly in the system, and they had nowhere to raise their grievances. In fact, they were not given any opportunity to lodge complaints.

The department tried to accommodate such realities by allowing for late registration of births, amendments of dates of birth, names and other relevant details on the population register. I must also mention that there were some loopholes. Noncitizens wanted citizenship fraudulently, and this thing in itself created problems for the department in finding the balance between rectifying the remaining realities created by the apartheid regime and ensuring the integrity of South African citizenship.

There is another problem faced by the department. There are a number of fraudulent marriages registered on the system by foreigners who pay South Africans to marry then on paper, or who bribe Home Affairs officials to marry them on the system so that they can become citizens of this country. I must mention that it is sad, because women become victims of such incidents.

It is encouraging, though, that the department has embarked on a turn- around intervention regarding this critical issue. The department is to look into its overall capacity by capacitating the staff to develop the infrastructure, such as office equipment, an information technology strategy, and conversion of documents and also by capacitating the foreign office function.

I believe that that will stop the phenomenon of fraudulent marriages by non- South Africans to falsely obtain citizenship, and protect South Africans against unscrupulous, fraudulent activities; and that, of course, will safeguard the rights of women, protecting them from dangers emanating from the different marriage systems applicable in this country. It will also safeguard underaged girls from possible abuses inherent in the customary marriages system.

As a person coming from the Gauteng province, I must mention that in Gauteng, a smart province, especially where I am deployed in Ekurhuleni, we do not have huge problems with the department. The department serves clients effectively and efficiently. In the ANC parliamentary constituency offices we work hand-in-hand with regional offices with the aim of rectifying some discrepancies that occurred.

In conclusion, I want to say that we must all work together with the Department of Home Affairs on curbing the corruption in the Home Affairs centres or regions. We need to follow a holistic approach, and let us not point back. We need a quality service for the citizens of our country. I thank you. [Applause.]

Mrs J N VILAKAZI: Hon Chairperson, hon Minister, hon members, I also congratulate the Minister on her new position. The Department of Home Affairs is very important to all citizens, young or old, urban or rural, poor or rich, dead or alive. But, important as it is, it appears to be proving very hard to meet all the requirements and needs of the people it serves.

The misdistribution of Home Affairs offices, chronic understaffing and other constraints within the department, according to my assessment, contributes to the long queues and congestion in these offices, which ultimately result in poor service delivery. Our Minister has just mentioned some of these constraints.

On behalf of the IFP I feel there is a dire need to improve the state of overpopulated Home Affairs offices all over the country, which is worse in the rural areas as a whole. People from these areas travel long distances to Home Affairs offices for just a birth certificate or an identity document, etc. We all know about the legacy of the past. In the apartheid government the vast majority of our people were left out of the mainstream of citizenship. Many people did not bother to travel the long distances to these offices, and those in power also did not encourage people to register.

It is pity, though, that the budget of the Department of Home Affairs does not look that enticing. It definitely won’t be able to cover all the demands of the past and the present made of this department. The backlog is huge and existed for decades before the new Government came into power. Decentralisation of offices, making them easily accessible to all people, particularly in remote areas - as they are the ones who suffer most in order to utilise Home Affairs services - is a priority. People in these areas do not have the money to reach distant offices, as the majority of them are unemployed. The second important resource vital to this department is improvement of staffing.

Mphathisihlalo ohloniphekileyo, mhlonishwa Ngqongqoshe womnyango, uma ngikhuluma ngoMnyango wezaseKhaya, ngikhuluma ngomnyango wasekhaya futhi akukuningi engizokubalula ngoba umnyango odume kakhulu ngalokhu okulandelayo, kwazise phela umholi wami engimhlonipha kakhulu ubewuphethe lo mnyango kusukela ngo 1994, uDkt M G Buthelezi, uNdunankulu kaZulu.

Lo mnyango udume ngesabelomali esingalingani nomsebenzi kanye nezidingo zawo. Namhlanje kulesi sabelomali, hhayi, angiboni ukuthi umhlonishwa uNgqongqoshe angakwazi ukuzifeza zonke lezi zidingo. Lo mnyango udume ngamahhovisi agcwala aphuphume kanti futhi awekho emakhaya eduze koquqaba lwabantu oluhlala kulezi zindawo. Kukhona nenkinga yemali yokugibela ukuze baye kulama hhovisi yingakho-ke nje sithola ukuthi omama banenkinga uma kuvulwa izikole izitifiketi zingekho, bayokhandana kula mahhovisi, olayini abade nabasebenzi bancane konke kuba yinkinga yomphakathi.

Ogogo abaningi abakwazi ukuthola isondlo sabantwana ngenxa yezitifiketi ezingekho; abanye ababheka lezi ngane sebekhulile; kwalusuku lokuzalwa kwale ngane abalwazi; impesheni yabo iphelela ekondleni abazukulu ibe ikhona imali yesondlo kahulumeni kodwa kubambe izitifiketi. Angazi mhlonishwa Ngqongqoshe, ngizwile nethembisa ukwandisa amahhovisi nokufaka omahambanendlwana. Kuhle lokhu siyakuncoma kakhulu akwenzeke, siyokushayela elikhulu ihlombe.

Emakhaya sinamahhovisi amakhosi ethu akade akhiwa angaba nalo usizo. Sikuphakamisile lokhu ekomidini lezikhulu zomnyango wakho. Usizi lungancipha kancane, kancane, kancane. Inkinga yamapasi ike yathi hhemu ngesikhathi kulungiselwa ukhetho. Amahhovisi abevulwa nangezimpelasonto kukhona futhi nomahambanendlwana nabantu bawathola amapasi bayovota. Yize- ke abanye abakhohlakele kulo mnyango bese bethola indlela yokwenza imali khona lapho. Abebonakala lama pasi ephuma ngomkhoshosho uyaqamba uyafika umnikazilo akasalitholi - enye yezinkohlakalo ekhona leyo. Enye futhi inkohlakalo ekhona eyemishado engashadanga. Uhlezi nengane yakho kanti isishadiswe nomuntu ongaziwa. Siyathokoza nokho ukuthi abenza lokhu bayabanjwa. Qhubekani zingane zakwethu, sisemuva kwenu. Egameni leNkatha Freedom Party sithi siyothokoza ukubona lo mnyango emakhaya oquqabeni lwabantu, ungabi semadolobheni kuphela. Mphathisihlalo, siyavumelana nesabelomali sakho. Ngiyabonga. [Ihlombe.] (Translation of isiZulu paragraphs follows.)

[Hon Chairperson, hon Minister of the department, when I talk about the Department of Home Affairs, I talk about the home department and there’s not much I can say, because this is the department that is known for the following things - and given the fact that my leader, Dr M G Buthelezi, the Chief of the Zulus whom I respect very much, has been heading this department since 1994.

This department is known for its budget that is not enough to execute its duties and needs. Today, with this budget, I don’t think that the hon Minister will be able to fulfil all these needs. This department is known for its offices which are overcrowded and are not in rural areas near to many people who live in these areas. There is also a problem with busfare in order for these people to get to those offices and that’s why we find that mothers have a problem when schools are opening, because without birth certificates the children cannot go to school. They squeeze themselves into these offices, the queues are long and there are very few staff. All this becomes the community’s problem.

Most grandmothers cannot get child support grants because there are no birth certificates; some of them who look after these children are very old; they don’t even know the date on which the child was born; their pension is used to support their grandchildren, yet there is a child support grant available from the Government, but certificates are holding the process back. I don’t know, hon Minister, I heard you promised to increase offices and provide mobile services. This is good, we commend it and we will applaud it.

In rural areas we have offices that belong to our traditional leaders, which have been built long ago, and these offices could be of great help. We suggested this to your department’s officials. This problem could be minimised gradually. The problem of the identity documents was a bit in control during the preparation for the elections. Offices were opened even on weekends and there were also mobile services, and as a result people got their IDs and went to vote.

Although there were those in this department who were corrupt and who got the opportunity to make money, these IDs were issued illegally, and by the time the owner of the ID came, the ID was nowhere to be found - that is but one of many corrupt activities that was going on. There is also the corrupt activity of fraudulent marriages, where you find your child is married to a total stranger. We are glad though that these culprits are being apprehended.

Go ahead with the good work; we are behind you. In the name of the IFP we are saying that we are happy to see this department in rural areas where a lot of people live and not in urban areas only. We support your budget. I thank you. [Applause.]]

Mor O M THETJENG: Morena Modulasetulo, Mokhuduthamaga wa lefapha la Selegae le bahlomphegi ka kakaretšo. Lefapha la Selegae le bopa karolo ye bohlokwa mo nageng ya bo rena. Le thuša ngwadišong ya badudi ba naga ya Afrika Borwa ka bophara, bao ba tšwago dinageng tša ka ntle ka morago ga go hwetša tumelelo ya go ba badudi ba mo sa ruri. Go abja ditirelo tše di latelago, ngwadišo ya matswalo, manyalo, mahu le dipukwana tša boitsebišo.

Go na le mathata ao a tšwelelago nakong ya kabo ya ditirelo ao a nyakago tharollo ka ponyo ya leihlo. Mohlankedi mogolo wa Lefapha, nakong ya ge a loma kgorwana ya palamente ya selegae tsebe, o ile a laetša mathata ao Lefapha le lebanego le ona, a ba a bontsha le ditsela tšeo di tla latelwago go hlomola mootlwa wo.

Ga ke tseneng le lena mo leetong la go lekola ditirelo tše pedi fela, tšeo di lego hloba boroko setšshabeng kudu dinaga magaeng t ša go swana le Porofensi ya Limpopo.

Mabapi le kabo ya ngwadišo ya matswalo, bontši bja batswadi ba rena ke badudi ba mafelo a magaeng ebile ga ba kgone go bala le go ngwala. Bao ba kgonago go ya maokelong goba dikliniking ba mahlatse kage ba hwetša karatana ya go entiša ngwana. Yona e hlatsela matswalo a ngwana. Ba madimabe ke bao ba palelwago ke go iša bana maokelong goba dikliniking kage bana bao ba tla aloga ba hloka ngwadišo ya Lefapha la Selegae ka bjako.

Mabaka a mangwe ao a šitišago ngwadišo ya bana ke go swana le a latelago, maeto a matelele a go bitša mašeleng a godimo ao ba a hlokago ka baka la bodiidi le go hloka mešomo. Le lengwe ke tshwaro ya makgwakgwa yeo bašomi ba bangwe ba mmuso ba e fago batho ba bo rena ge ba tlile go nyaka thu šo.

Go hloka ga bana mangwalo-tšhupo a matswalo, a ba šitiša go amogela mphiwafela ya bana bao ba hlokago botatago bona. Rena ba Democratic Alliance re kgopela gore manyami a mohuta wo, a lwantšhwe ka mešego fela ke Lefapha. Ge re ka lwantšha lenaba le, ke na le tshepo ya gore re ka se sa ba le bothata nakong ya ge ba tšea dipukwana tša boitsebišo.

Re tloga re leboga boitapišo bjo bo tšerwego ke mmušo le Lefapha nakong ya pele ga dikgetho tša kakaretšo tšeo di sa tšwago go feta. Re duma ge maitapišo a mohuta wo a ka no tšwela pele le ge dikgetho di le kgole kage mathata a sa ntše a le gona. Manyami a magolo ke gore bontši bja batswadi ba rena bao ba dulago dinaga magae ba dira dikgopelo tša dipukwana tša boitsebišo mola ba šetše ba godile. Bontši ga ba tsebe tšatši-ngwaga wo ba belegilwego ka wona ka baka la go se kgone go ngwala le go bala. Ba bangwe ba tseba mengwaga ka go gopola taba ye kgolo yeo e kilego ya direga nageng ya bo bona goba ka go ipapetša le yo mongwe lapeng le lengwe yo a belegweng nakong ye tee le yena. Bjo e ka ba bohlatse bjo bo kaone ge go hlokega tsela ye nngwe ya go hlatsela.

Bošula bjo bogolo ke ge moofisiri a ngwala mengwaga ka go lebelela motswadi ka mahlong. Ka tsela yeo mengwaga ya bona e ya fokotšwa ba bangwe e a oketšwa. Bothata bjo bogolo ke ge mengwaga e fokoditšwe. Ba bangwe ba batswadi ba feta bana ba bona ba mathomo ka mengwaga ye lesome goba ya ka fase mola ba bangwe ba fetwa ke baratho ba bona.

A ke mathata ao re tšwago le ona kua morago ka nako ya puš o ya kgethollo ya National Party Morena Sinclair, bao bjale ba ipetšago New National Party, le ge go sena tše diswa tšeo ba di dirago. Ke kgopela gore Lefapha le lwe le bothata bjo ka tšhoganetšo.

Baofisiri le bona ba tlogele go ema emiša bao ba dirago dikgopelo. O kwa moofisiri a botša motswadi dinyakwa tša go se fele go swana le tše di latelago, lengwalo goba setifikheiti sa go tšwa kerekeng, mola ba sa tsene kereke, goba lengwalo la bohlatse la go tšwa sekolong, mola ba saka ba tsena sekolo, goba lengwalo la go tš wa mošate, mola ba ka se humane thušo pele ga ge ba lefa setsekanyana se itšeng mola ba se na selo kage ba sa šome.

Tše ka moka ke mathata ao a welago badudi ba magaeng bao ba jago nta ba šeba ka lekgai, ba hloka le pudi ya leleme le letala. Ke kgopela gore taba ye re e lekole ka go letefatša dinyakwa kudu go batho ba bagolo bao ba sa kgonego go bala le go ngwala.

Mohlankedi mogolo wa Lefapha o tšweleditše bothata bja go hloka mafelo a go šomela dinaga magaeng. Re dumelelana ebile re lla le yena bothateng bjo lege re ka se ke ra dumela gore e be tšhitišo. Keletšo yaka ke gore, a re šomišeng meago ya setšhaba yeo re nago le yona mebotong ya ga bo rena. Magoši ba šomiša meago ye go swara makgotla a dikgoro le bjalo ka diphaphoši-tšhomelo. Magato a, a tla fokotša maeto a matelele ao batswadi ba rena le bana ba bo rena ba a sepelago e le ge ba tsoma tirelo ya Lefapha.

Taba ye nngwe ke ya gore, a re beng mahlo a setšhaba mo go tumoleng bobodu mo phaphoši-tšhomelong tša rena re se ka tla ra ba pela yeo e hlokilego mosela ka lebaka la go romeletša. Meetlo ya Batho Pele e fela e hlokomolgwa ke baofisiri ba rena nakong tše dingwe. Ke a leboga Modulasetulo, ke lebogile. (Translation of Sepedi speech follows.)

[Mr O M THETJENG: Hon Chairperson, the Minister of Home Affairs and hon members, the Department of Home Affairs forms an integral part of our country. It helps with the registration of all South African citizens, and foreigners who have permanent citizenship. It provides the following services: registration of of birth, marriages, deaths and issues identity documents.

There are problems that arise when these services are provided, and they need urgent attention. When the director-general warned the Department of Home Affairs, he indicated the problems that the department is faced with and he showed them ways in which to resolve them.

Let me take you on this journey as we inspect only two services that are really bugging the nation, especially in the rural areas, like the Limpopo Province.

With regards to the services relating to the registration of births, most of our parents reside in the rural areas and are illiterate. Those who can afford to go to hospitals or clinics are fortunate as they get immunisation cards for their children. This is proof of the child’s birth. The unfortunate ones are those who cannot afford to take their children to hospital or a clinic, as the children will have been born, and missed out on having their birth registered.

Another reason that prevents the registration of children is issues like long costly trips, which they cannot afford due to poverty and unemployment. The other reason is the poor service by some government employees when people come to them for help.

The lack of birth certificates hinders fatherless children from receiving child grants. We, the DA, plead that the department should fight against such a shameful state of affairs in every way possible. If we can fight this enemy, I believe that we will never encounter problems during applications for identity documents.

We are really grateful for the efforts made by the Government and the department before the recent elections. We wish that this kind of effort would continue, even if the next elections are still far away, as we are still encountering problems. The saddest part is that most of our parents live in the rural areas and apply for identity documents when they are already too old. Most of them do not know their dates of birth, because they are illiterate. Some of them know the years, as they recall major incidents that had happened in their country or community, or by comparing with somebody from another family who was born during the same year. This would be a good form of proof if there are no other means of doing so.

The saddest thing is when the official writes the date of birth according to the parent’s s facial appearance. In this way some people’s years of age are increased or decreased. The major problem is encountered when the age is decreased. Some parents are 10 years older than their first-born children, or less, while others are younger than their younger sisters or brothers.

These are the legacies of the apartheid regime of the NP, Mr Sinclair, those who currently call themselves the NNP, even though there is nothing new in what they do. I appeal to the department to deal with this problem urgently.

The officials must also stop sending people who make applications to and fro. You normally hear the official asking for a list of documents, like a letter or certificate from the church, although they do not attend any church, a testimonial from the school, even though they never attended school, or a letter from the chief, even though they will not be given help until they pay, even if they are not working.

All these are challenges facing the rural people, those who are struggling and are very poor. I would suggest that this problem be tackled by making things easy by demanding fewer documents, especially from those elderly, illiterate people.

The director-general has indicated the lack of working institutions in the rural areas as a problem. We agree and we also sympathise with him in this problem, even though we cannot let it be a stumbling block. My advice is, let us use the public buildings that we already have in our areas. Traditional leaders use these institutions and committee rooms to hold their imbizos. These steps will reduce long trips that our parents, brothers and sisters take in order to get service from the department.

The other matter is that we should assist the Government by uprooting idleness in our places of work. Let us get involved, lest we are disappointed. Our officials overlook slogans like Batho Pele at certain times. Thank you, hon Chairperson, I am grateful.]

Mrs A N D QIKANI: Madam Chair, hon Minister, hon members, I greet you all in the name of Jesus. [Interjections.] Hon Minister, allow me the opportunity to congratulate you on your appointment to the Home Affairs portfolio.

Kuba mnandi kuthi boomama xa ubona kukho oomama abathatha izihlalo ezikhulu ekwakusithiwa zifanele ootata. Ukanti ke mna Mphathiswa, ndinenkolo ethi xa ibanjwe ngumama soze iphuncuke. Apho ndisuka khona, eMpuma Koloni, indlala isagquba ngamandla.Kusenzima ukuba abantu abadala baye ezidolophini ukuya kufuna izazisi zabo, kwaye bathi sebefikile apho ufumanise ukuba uhoyo alukho kwaphela. Ndiyabulela ukuva ke Mphathiswa ukuba ubonelele ngeeofisi ezithuthekayo.

Indlela ezikhutshwa ngayo izazisi bekunga ingayindlela enokwenza ukuba wonke umntu akwazi ukuyifumana ngexesha elifanelekileyo. Kukho abantu abawashiya kudala amakhaya abo bahlala ematyotyombeni. Bekunga ke bangaqwalaselwa kakhulu abo bantu ukwenzela ukuba nabo bazifumane izazisi zabo ukuze nabo baxhamle kumaqithiqithi kaRhulumente. ISebe leMicimbi yezeKhaya maze liyiqwalasele into yokufuna amakhadi abantwana asekliniki xa abantwana befuna isibonelelo sabantwana, kuba abantu basemakhaya abayise so into yokuhamba iikliniki. Kusekho mabazalisikazi basemakhaya. Abantu ke basafuna ukufundiswa ngokubaluleka kokuhamba ikliniki. Umntu usuka athi ngexesha lokuya kwenza isicelo sesibonelelo somntwana asuke athathe umntwana aye kufuna isiqinisekiso sokuzalwa, angakwazi kusifumana ke kuba engenalo ikhadi lasekliniki. (Translation of isiXhosa paragraphs follows.)

[Mrs A N D QIKANI: It is a great pleasure for us women when we see women occupying higher positions that were previously reserved for men only. However, hon Minister, I have a belief that if something is in the hands of a woman, it is in safe hands. Where I come from in the Eastern Cape poverty is still rife. It is still difficult for elderly people to get to town to get their IDs. Even when they do get there, they do not receive the attention that they deserve. I am grateful, hon Minister, to hear that you have provided mobile offices.

I wish the issuing of IDs could be done in such a way that the people can get their IDs on time. There are people who left their homes a long time ago, who are now staying in informal settlements. It would be proper if those people could also be considered and be given their IDs so that they may enjoy basic government services.

The Department of Home Affairs must revisit the practice of asking for children’s clinic cards when parents apply for child grants, because most of the rural people do not take their children to the clinics regularly. For example, there are still traditional midwives. People still need to be educated about the importance of regular clinic visits. When people are applying for children’s grants, they usually take along birth certificates and are denied the grants because they do not have clinic cards.] The other pressing matter facing the Department of Home Affairs is corruption. We are relieved to hear that the hon Minister also considers rooting it out as a priority.

Egameni le-UDM, siyaluxhasa uhlahlo lwabiwo-mali lwakho. Enkosi. [Kwaqhwatywa.] [On behalf of the UDM, we support the budget. Thank you. [Applause.]]

Mr T S SETONA: Hon Chairperson of Committees, hon Minister, hon members, hon Deputy Minister Malusi Gigaba in absentia, fellow comrades and colleagues, if you could, before I begin my speech, allow me just to deal with a few issues. Firstly, we indeed agree that the Department of Home Affairs even after the democratic breakthrough of 27 April 1994, has been upside-down in the past decade. And we all agree that it should be turned around; but maybe there are some areas of difference in terms of how we go about turning this department around.

Just to give some advice to hon Lamoela, who talked about African foreigners flooding into South Africa. I want to advise the hon member to ask the department to provide her with the disaggregated statistics of foreigners in our country at the moment, reflecting which ones are from Africa, which ones are from Europe, which ones are from America and all that stuff. I could conclude that … [Interjections.] … the hon member is suffering from Afro-pessimist syndrome, but at the moment that is not my conclusion.

Hon Vilakazi, I do not agree that the budget does not look enticing, because it is more enticing than it was in the previous decade, and more enticing than the pre-27 April 1994 breakthrough. What is important in any budget is not the figures, it is the vision. We can give you millions and millions of rands, but if you do not have a vision, you cannot use that money. You will come back to Parliament and say: “We have this money, but we could not spend it.” Hon Thetjeng, I agree broadly with some of the issues that you have raised, but not all of them. Furthermore, …

Mr A WATSON: On a point of order Madam Chairperson, is the member delivering a speech or answering on behalf of the Minister? [Interjections.]

The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Continue, hon member.

Mr T S SETONA: May I proceed, hon Chair? Yes, hon Watson must go to the old age home. This is a debate and I am debating, and he cannot prescribe how I should go about my debate. [Laughter.] But, I am saying by and large there is an agreement. Allow me to join those who have congratulated the Minister on her new and prestigious yet challenging position. I am quite confident that the Minister is braced and prepared to steer this department in the right course in the coming period.

The commitment of the ANC to democracy and unity in diversity has stood the test of time in the past decade of democracy. On the occasion of his address to this House last year on 19 September, the hon Deputy President of the Republic, comrade Jacob Zuma, made the following observation, and I quote:

Hon members, our democracy has gone through a lot of trials and tribulation in the first decade. It has passed all the tests - which is another reason for us to celebrate. One of these tests is the investigation of the Deputy President by the National Directorate of Prosecutions. This test has indicated the extent to which our democracy has deepened and, contrary to views of so-called opinion-makers, who are saying the investigation has weakened democracy, how strong and mature our democracy has become. It is only in a mature democracy where the Deputy President of a country would be investigated without any interference or attempt to stop the investigation by government or the Deputy President himself.

This observation holds true for the Department of Home Affairs in the past decade of our democratic rule, because this department was under the leadership of the hon Mangosuthu Buthelezi of the IFP. Given the strategic nature of this department, it wouldn’t be possible for any other political organisation on this continent to give that responsibility to a member of the opposition, except the ANC. It has done that in the spirit of unity and diversity, and that has stood the test of time.

It is therefore fitting, on this occasion of the first budget policy statement of the Department of Home Affairs, to salute the hon Gatsha Buthelezi for distinguishing himself as part of those who will be counted in the roll-call of men and women who contributed to the strengthening and consolidation of our institutional democracy. The turbulent tenure of his leadership in the department will not go unrecorded in the annals of our history for generations to come. As to whether he has passed or failed the test is another debate that does not belong to this House.

For us in the ANC, this budget policy debate, the first in the second decade of our democracy, represents a great cause for celebration by the masses of our people. It is a great cause for celebration because in itself this budget policy debate marks the breaking of ranks with the past and represents the dawn of a great new beginning under the leadership of the ANC.

Hon Minister, with your appointment as the new Minister of Home Affairs and of Comrade Malusi Gigaba, who hails from the ranks of the young lions, as your Deputy Minister, the great storm to reposition this department as the fundamental nucleus and the centre of service delivery to our people has begun.

Our people have been waiting patiently for this great storm to begin because no more should our children, born in their homes far away from hospitals and clinics in the rural areas, be denied access to their basic rights because of a lack of birth certificates. No more should foreigners acquire citizenship through fraudulent and illegal means, and we are saying no more should our sisters be victims of illegal marriages to foreigners who obtained marital certificates fraudulently for monetary gains.

It is precisely for these reasons, among others, that your appointment to lead this department represents the coming of the great storm to rid the Home Affairs of this malice and transform it into a centre of excellence and best practice for service delivery.

The budget has not been critical to the challenges that the Department of Home Affairs faced in the past decade of democracy - I’m directing this to Mama Vilakazi. The problems that underpin this department have been: one, a glaring lack of strategic vision; two, the prevalence of rampant corruption; three, inefficiency; and four, wastefulness and a general decline in standards.

The scourge of corruption in the department must be defeated as a matter of urgency in this decade of democracy. Hon Minister, other members have alluded to the fact that women of our country, young and old, have been the target of systematic corruption in the Department of Home Affairs. There have been reports in the recent past of fraudulent marriages involving foreigners who seek speedy, permanent residence in our country through the fraudulent use of identity documents of our sisters and mothers. In some instances women are paid to marry foreigners, thereby becoming willing partners in the perpetuation of corruption. Cases where single women are lured to apply for work and in turn their identity documents are used to forge marriage certificates have also been reported. We also have cases where departmental officials collude with crime syndicates to obtain citizenship for foreigners. The Department of Home Affairs has proved beyond reasonable doubt its seriousness and commitment to rooting out this scale of corruption. The recent arrest of 12 officials in the Bloemfontein office of the department bears testimony to this seriousness.

We therefore salute the departmental management and our security agencies for their efforts in handing these corrupt officials to the police. Their arrest is a clear sign and commitment on the part of the department that there is no hiding place for rogue elements in the Department of Home Affairs.

As the Minister has already said, it is therefore fitting that we make the following proposals a part of the critical elements that should find robust and rigorous expression in the life of the department and the turn-around strategy in particular: ongoing retraining of departmental staff in line with the new strategic priorities, values and norms - not just training for the sake of training; greater collaboration with and a greater role for our security agencies, including possible security vetting of all officials in the department who perform sensitive functions. We propose that there should be an effort to strengthen relations with and participation in the relevant multilateral bodies in the region and globally, to design and co- ordinate an appropriate multisectoral offensive against organised crime.

Throughout its 92 years of fighting history to better the lives of our people, the ANC has always been guided by the belief that for the revolution to succeed, the masses of our people must be at the centre not as passive recipients, but, more importantly, as architects of their own future. This belief and tradition has been reaffirmed in our election manifesto for the third democratic general election on 14 April 2004, with the slogan: “People’s contract to create work and fight poverty”. This battle cry will indeed be our road map throughout the second decade of democracy. It therefore becomes critical for this “people’s contract” we are talking about to find living expression and locus in the departmental strategic programmes and initiatives.

History has taught us that there is no amount of state force that can annihilate corruption and crime without the mobilisation and participation of the broadest possible mass of our people in this fight. Accordingly, it is within the masses that corrupt criminal elements that take bribes in the Department of Home Affairs reside. They play with us in our communities, they eat in the same restaurants where we eat, they attend the same churches that we attend, they use the same public transport that we use daily, and they buy from the shops we do. And therefore the critical challenge is to raise public awareness about the role of our communities in exposing and identifying these criminal elements.

The time has come to break the culture of silence when we see and live with a clerk in a Government department whose standard of living is not commensurate with his or her income. Together with our communities we must step up the campaign to raise the consciousness of our people to be the ears and eyes of our Government by exposing these rogue elements. These rogue elements must know that they do not deserve to be in our communities, but within the walls of our prisons.

This anticorruption onslaught must be complemented by a conscious effort by the department, through road shows and buy-ins by the institutions of Government at a grass-roots level, such as ward committees, community policing forums and community and faith-based organisations. The community volunteer programme that the Minister has alluded to is a step in the right direction in this regard and we welcome it, hon Minister. Public representatives, through their constituency offices, must also be catalysts in raising the level of consciousness among our communities with respect to this campaign.

Some among us find it opportune and glorious always to be in the company of journalists when overseeing the work of Government departments. While it sounds prestigious for MPs to appear on television screens exposing maladministration and corruption in Government departments, we must be equally cautious not to undermine quality investigation into corruption by making news headlines at the early and sensitive stage of investigation into corrupt cases by competent bodies such as the police.

Clearly, while these challenges place a huge responsibility on the department, Parliament is equally confronted with huge challenges in its monitoring and oversight role. I thank you, hon Chair. [Time expired.] [Applause.] The MINISTER OF HOME AFFAIRS: Thank you, hon Chair and hon members. Firstly, I want to thank all those members who participated in the debate, and I want to thank you for your valuable contribution to this debate. I would just like to make some comments, and perhaps clarify some of the issues of concern that have been raised by hon members. Somebody mentioned the issue of the Batho Pele campaign. Yes, it was the hon Masilo, the chair of the select committee. Hon Masilo, the Batho Pele campaign is a campaign of Government that was started a long time ago, which supposedly should be running in all the departments, amongst members of the Public Service.

Yes, it applies to the Department of Home Affairs as well. And of course we are trying as much as possible in the department through the turn-around strategy and all the other programmes which we have already outlined, and which you yourselves have outlined out of the briefing which you received from the DG and the staff of the Department of Home Affairs. There is a lot of retraining and restructuring which is currently going on in the department and you will realise that one of the major challenges facing us in the department is that of changing the psychological make-up of the staff of the department. We have to change the attitudes of the staff so that they understand, for instance, that the client is always right. It is something that we have to emphasise all the time. So, yes, the Batho Pele campaign remains relevant all the time.

The roll-over issue was raised by the chair, hon Masilo. I hope we all understand that a roll-over, by its nature, is funds committed by the department. We have a roll-over of R180 million which National Treasury has granted us permission to use. Because sometimes the tendency is that even though the funds are committed, if you don’t get permission from the Treasury, because you have not utilised that money, you then are required to send that money back to the coffers of the National Treasury. But in our case we have actually sought the approval of the National Treasury, and we have been granted permission to use that money. The roll-over that we have is the money that we will still spend during this current year. It is not money that has gone down the drain in the department.

Can I just explain the problem of unclaimed IDs, because it is not just a problem of the department, it is also a problem of our own people. We, their public representatives, have to go out and explain to and also mobilise our people to go and collect their IDs. We should also explain to them that they should be more responsible when applying for an ID. I will explain another situation, for instance, which affects us here in the Western Cape. Because our people are very mobile, due to the fact that they are migrants, a person will leave the Eastern Cape, for instance, particularly the former Transkei area, and come and join the family here in the Western Cape, leaving Ingcobo or Cofimvaba, or whichever part of the former Transkei.

That person has already applied for an ID in the Transkei. She leaves the copy of the ID in the Transkei, comes to the Western Cape to join her husband, and at times she lives here. When she arrives here, she applies for another ID. When the time comes for her to go back to the village in the Eastern Cape, the ID comes out here again. Sometimes you find that, precisely because of the problems that we have been experiencing, the same person has an ID in the Eastern Cape, and another uncollected ID in the Western Cape. She will get to the Transkei and apply for the third ID, without even checking whether the first ID she had applied for has arrived or not. So you also have those kinds of problems.

Secondly, other people are simply irresponsible. They apply for IDs but never collect those IDs. So, it also has to do with irresponsible conduct and the behaviour of our own people. So, yes, it is a problem in our department because, indeed, there is a problem regarding the people in the department, a lack of systems, the fact of not doing things the proper way as you, the citizens of our country, would want us to do. But, also, regarding the rights of our citizens, people should understand that those rights are not unlimited.

You cannot be spending the resources of your government by applying for IDs wherever you go. We are hoping that the systems we are introducing, such as the Hanis for instance, are exactly what is going to enable us to pick up that a person has applied for an ID in the Transkei and would therefore not be able to apply for another ID. So, through Hanis we are really hoping that we are going to be able to clean up our population register, because these are some of the things that are stigmatising and bringing into question the integrity of our population register.

The issue of readiness for the elections is a very difficult question, but I will say yes, we will be ready for the elections. Even in 2004 people raised the same question. This time, last year, people were raising questions about the readiness of the department to supply IDs to the citizens of this country in order for them to exercise their constitutional right to vote. Yes, our people were able to vote, because the department had to make sure that it supplied the necessary documents. I am optimistic. I think we will be able to assist our people to get the necessary IDs that they will need at the time when they have to go and register to vote for the 2005 elections.

If the staff members of the department are not ready, they will have to make sure that they are ready, in the same way that we did in 2004. If we were able to do it successfully in 2004, there shouldn’t be any reason that prevents us from doing it in 2005. Long queues are unavoidable. I have mentioned it in my speech that one of our biggest problems is that our offices are situated in towns, small towns and in cities. So, what do you expect? You will find long queues, because people from the informal settlements, townships and small rural villages will stream to this one office in a particular area. Certainly, if we introduce more mobile units, and we have more offices and if we have service points in those rural areas, there shouldn’t be these long queues.

That is one of the reasons why we are saying we need to try as much as possible to decentralise and have as many offices and service points as possible. People still mention that there are many posts in which people work in an acting capacity. Actually, this is not true because there was a time when there were a number of chief director posts in which people were functioning in an acting capacity. But I have just said that, for instance

• you are aware, particularly those of you who are in the select committee
• during this year only, we have filled about 500 vacancies in the department.

You are also aware that 19 vacancies at senior management level have been advertised. You are also aware of the fact that only yesterday, six more management and middle management posts have been advertised. Two of the DDG posts have already been shortlisted. We are in the process of interviewing and appointing. Progress is being made. It is not true that people are functioning in acting capacities.

There was a time when we had an acting DG; we now have a DG. Some of the posts are simply vacant. We don’t have people in acting positions. When mention was made of fraudulent marriages, I heard somebody from the back screaming and saying, ``Nigerians.’’ This is actually a wrong perception. It has a very racial undertone to it. It is very racist, and I think we have to be very careful about making those kinds of statements, because it is not just the Africans from the continent who are abusing our systems. It is not just the Africans from the continent who come into the country and marry these young girls and pay them for that.

People must therefore be very careful about making statements such as, ``It is the Nigerians, Zaïrans, or Congolese”. It has a very racial undertone, and it is wrong. You are making a very wrong assumption. So please be very careful when you are making that kind of statement, because it is not only the Africans. I am not saying that they do not do it, but I am saying it is not only those people who are abusing our systems. I am saying that that is similar to the question of the illegal immigrants. When you talk about illegal immigrants in this country, you are not only talking about Africans from the continent. But when we see people being deported and shown on TV, we always see Africans; we see dark skins. But we actually have illegal immigrants from Pakistan, China, Bulgaria, and Russia. We have a huge population from Europe as well, who are here illegally in this country. So, people must be very careful of making statements, lest they are seen to be racist. [Interjections.] No, no, no, it is not something to laugh about, it is a very serious matter. In this day and age in South Africa, there is no room for that kind of statement. [Applause.] By the way, Africans from the continent have a right to come to South Africa as asylum seekers and be given the status of refugees. But if you talk about illegal immigrants, there are many illegal immigrants including people who are not necessarily Africans from the continent.

Somebody mentioned the use of municipalities in small towns as a proposal. Yes, I think it is something that we are doing, but I also want to caution people about some of the things. We also have to be very careful about talking issues of very serious policy matters, because this is a policy matter. It is about devolution of the powers of Home Affairs. It is a matter, which, at some point perhaps as members of the legislature, we need to engage in, so that when we do it it’s not done in a disorganised and haphazard manner. It is not done because I feel that I’m ready to do it in Limpopo, or that I’m ready to do it in the Free State, or I’m ready to do it in the North West. It should be done because there is a need and there is an agreement that it has to be done. I’m raising this because there has been a pilot project for instance - and Mama Vilakazi will know about this - in KZN, where tribal authorities were used. At some point we would need to sit and discuss, and review that pilot project and see whether it has been useful or not so that we are not seen to be uneven in the manner in which we do things. If you say that the amakhosi in KZN should have access to distribution of IDs, then you have to do the same in the other provinces.

Therefore, a policy decision would have to be taken so that it is not something that is being done in a disorganised fashion. It’s something about which we have to be very sensitive. The other tendency is that in the process, some of the amakhosi want to abuse our people, by asking them to pay a levy that is not necessarily going to Home Affairs, but is one which is designed to pay the inkosi. These are some of the things about which we have to be very careful. I’m just saying that maybe it’s good to discuss and interact more with the tribal authorities about how best to utilise them in the process. But I would be very careful and not be seen to be using the one particular group of amakhosi and not the other.

Lastly, a number of people have mentioned Hanis, and how a lot of money has been budgeted for Hanis and that there hasn’t been positive results. I need to mention that Hanis incorporates several elements. It is an automated finger printing system, but it is also about movement control. And the money that has been budgeted for Hanis has not gone down the drain. Because in the years for which that money has been budgeted, a lot has been done to sort out the problem of our movement control systems. A lot of work has been done to clean up our population register; regardless of the fact that we still have people who are acquiring our passports and IDs fraudulently. But a lot of effort has gone into cleaning up the population register. But also, our automated fingerprinting system is currently being populated. The back record conversion from paperwork to an electronic system will begin in the next three months. Therefore, it’s not like money has really gone down the drain. A lot of work, planning and investigation have gone into all these. By 2005 for instance, the smart card will be introduced. And we are hoping that at the rate of 6 million per year we will be able to produce 6 million smart cards per year.

People who don’t know what’s happening in the department will say a lot of money has been budgeted and nothing has happened. A lot of money has gone into studying and investigations about what’s the best system for South Africa. A lot of money has also gone into other elements of Hanis, because Hanis, as I said, incorporates several elements. There is a lot to it. It’s not just about one thing, but it’s about a whole range of elements.

And the very last is the issue raised by one member about the computerisation of our offices. We must also be very careful when we prepare our speeches on a Budget Vote. We must check the information that we are going to use when we come to House. It is not true that the department is not electronically connected right through, or that it’s not computerised. For example, nationally we have about 265 offices that are computerised. We have 60 border posts that are computerised, and we have 84 foreign offices, all of which are electronically connected. And they are compatible with the rest the departments of Government.

Therefore, what I’m urging people to do is also to do a bit of research when we come to make a presentation to Parliament, so that we are informed about what’s happening in the department we are going to be debating about. That was the last issue I wanted to raise, hon members. Thank you very much for your valuable contributions, hon members, and we have noted all the issues you have raised. We’ve noted all the suggestions made and we will be able to use that information. Thank you very much [Applause.]

USIHLALO WAMAKOMIDI: Ngqongqoshe ohloniphekile, siyile Ndlu siyabonga siyanconcoza ngokuthi namhlanje ube yingxenye yethu. Sizothatha leli thuba sikubongele njengoNgqongqoshe woMnyango wezaseKhaya. Siyazi ukuthi uzokwazi ukuwuhola lo mnyango ngendlela eyiyo ngoba sikubonile ufaka isincomo sokuthi omazisi eNingizimu Afrika abatholakale ngaphandle kokukhokha isenti. Thina-ke sithi: Unwele olude!

Malunga ahloniphekile ale Ndlu, ingxoxo-mpikiswano isiphelile nomsebenzi weNdlu usuphelile ngakho-ke le Ndlu isiyakhothama. Ngiyabonga. (Translation of isiZulu paragraphs follows.)

[The CHAIRPERSON OF COMMITTEES: Hon Minister, as members of this House, we are very grateful to you for being part of us. We would like to take this opportunity to congratulate you as the Minister of Home Affairs. We know that you will lead this department in the right direction since we have seen you making a recommendation that identity documents should be issued without paying even a cent.

Hon members of this House, the debate is concluded and the duty of this House is over, therefore the House is adjourned. Thank you.]

Debate concluded.

The Council adjourned at 15:59. ____ ANNOUNCEMENTS, TABLINGS AND COMMITTEE REPORTS

ANNOUNCEMENTS

National Council of Provinces

1. Referrals to committees of papers tabled

 The following papers have been tabled  and  are  now  referred  to  the
 relevant committees as mentioned below:


 (1)    The following papers are referred to  the  Select  Committee  on
     Public Services:


     (a)     Strategic Plan of the Department of Public Works for  2004-
          2007.


     (b)     Status Report of the South  African  Construction  Industry
          for 2004.


     (c)     Memorandum by the Minister  of  Public  Works  setting  out
          particulars of the Building Programme for  2004-2005  [RP  70-
          2004].


 (2)    The following paper is  referred  to  the  Select  Committee  on
     Education and Recreation:


     Strategic Plan of the Department  of  Science  and  Technology  for
     2004-2007.


 (3)    The following paper is referred to the Select Committee on  Land
     and Environmental Affairs:


     Strategic Plan of the Department of Water Affairs and Forestry  for
     2004-2007.


 (4)    The following paper is  referred  to  the  Select  Committee  on
     Social Services:


     Strategic Plan of the Department of Home Affairs for 2004-2007.
 (5)    The following paper is  referred  to  the  Select  Committee  on
     Labour and Public Enterprises:
     Report and Financial Statements of Eskom  for  the  year  ended  31
     December 2003, including the Report of the Independent Auditors  on
     the Financial Statements for the year ended 31 December 2003.

TABLINGS

National Assembly and National Council of Provinces

1. The Minister for Provincial and Local Government

 Strategic Plan of the Department of Provincial and Local Government for
 2004-2007.

1. The Minister for Safety and Security

 (a)    Strategic Plan of the South African Police Service for 2004-2007
     [RP 78-2004].
 (b)    Strategic Plan of the Independent Complaints  Directorate  (ICD)
     for 2004-2007 [RP 21-2004].

1. The Minister for the Public Service and Administration

 (a)     Strategic  Plan  of  the  Department  of  Public  Service   and
     Administration for 2004-2007.


 (b)    Strategic Plan of South African Management Development Institute
     (SAMDI) for 2004-2007.

1. The Minister of Minerals and Energy

 Strategic Plan of the Department of Minerals and Energy for 2004-2007.

1. The Minister of Sport and Recreation

 Strategic Plan of Sport and Recreation South Africa for 2004-2007.